Mother of 3 and a AH pothead I'm FINE
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I am hopeful. Over the past two weeks he has started to make comments about our oldest child's angry behavior, he has gone so far as to say it is his fault that ds acts like that. Tonight they had a long father sun chat about their respective behaviour. I am going to hang on to that as a positive sign. He read ds a story before bed. When I asked him if he had thought at all about the number for counselling I gave him he says he wants to try it his way first. At least he is saying he wants to try.... Not that he has a strong record of telling the truth... I am going to keep reading and posting. Keep up the replies folks. Already I don't feel so alone.
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It's terrible, isn't it?
You marry someone and promise to be together in good times and bad, for better or for worse. Then, you bring innocent child(ren) into things. They didn't choose to be here, they didn't choose Mommy or Daddy.
I know it is my responsibility to keep them safe, to teach them how to be functional members of society, and to take good care of themselves when they are adults.
I see DS behaving the way he does, I see DH1 using AH's excuses - I can't clean my room, I need to go to the bathroom.
But now, I see AH seeing DS and DH1 and my lord he's making the connection. .... he's seeing they are acting like he does and he is seeing it is not a good thing.
My first counselling session is tomorrow. I know that my mood and behaviour have deteriorated to a place that is not healthy for my children. I have to start at the start. I am going to hope that changes I make in my life will help to encourage him to make changes in his. I am goingn to think hard about my situation.
I just realised that it's been almost 7 years I've been waiting for him to quit. I have seen the light and I know now I can't let it go on like this, but I feel I owe it to myself, my children and the hopes I had for them, the expectations of family life, to take a bit of time with counselling and some major changes at home with the kids and I and see if we can get out of this together. If not, then I have to face the ultimate decision. I have to decide how long I am willing to wait to see an improvement.
You marry someone and promise to be together in good times and bad, for better or for worse. Then, you bring innocent child(ren) into things. They didn't choose to be here, they didn't choose Mommy or Daddy.
I know it is my responsibility to keep them safe, to teach them how to be functional members of society, and to take good care of themselves when they are adults.
I see DS behaving the way he does, I see DH1 using AH's excuses - I can't clean my room, I need to go to the bathroom.
But now, I see AH seeing DS and DH1 and my lord he's making the connection. .... he's seeing they are acting like he does and he is seeing it is not a good thing.
My first counselling session is tomorrow. I know that my mood and behaviour have deteriorated to a place that is not healthy for my children. I have to start at the start. I am going to hope that changes I make in my life will help to encourage him to make changes in his. I am goingn to think hard about my situation.
I just realised that it's been almost 7 years I've been waiting for him to quit. I have seen the light and I know now I can't let it go on like this, but I feel I owe it to myself, my children and the hopes I had for them, the expectations of family life, to take a bit of time with counselling and some major changes at home with the kids and I and see if we can get out of this together. If not, then I have to face the ultimate decision. I have to decide how long I am willing to wait to see an improvement.
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Wait. . ..
Am I making excuses for him?
I'm making excuses to stay around. . .. I guess. . .
Where's the point at which you throw away the marriage? Join the ranks of single parents everywhere?
Up until last night, we were starting to get along. He even said he wants Friday to be date night. He's started telling me about his plans ahead of time, he's starting to see how he's teaching our children to act . . but then again, it was payday, so he's got what he wants again.
Am I making excuses for him?
I'm making excuses to stay around. . .. I guess. . .
Where's the point at which you throw away the marriage? Join the ranks of single parents everywhere?
Up until last night, we were starting to get along. He even said he wants Friday to be date night. He's started telling me about his plans ahead of time, he's starting to see how he's teaching our children to act . . but then again, it was payday, so he's got what he wants again.
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Well I am going to private counselling this afternoon for family treatment. I am leaving work early, since I work in the city, and taking the bus. I scheduled it so that I can make it to my usual spot to meet AH at the usual time to go home. I have not told him I am going.
We live almost an hour outside the city, so it is hard to go to an evening meeting in the city, when we have kids at home who need looking after.
We live almost an hour outside the city, so it is hard to go to an evening meeting in the city, when we have kids at home who need looking after.
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Good for You ! I made the same decision recently and went on my own to see an addiction specialist. Im so glad I did because its helping me get a whole new understanding. I hope that your appointment helps, and I know it had to be hard to make that appointment, and leave work early, all of that to get there. Its courageous !!
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The common suggestion in therapy is that there isn't anything that can be worked on within the relationship as long as they are actively using....and have not started a program of recovery.
As long as some type of mood altering substance is driving the bus...then you are dealing with that alteration and that does not jive with "working things out" in the marriage.
Be careful of manipulation with "date night" and things like that.
Those ploys are used to lure you back into the emotional, romantic "lets just get along and everything will be fine" type of thing.
Look up Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
First Physiological Needs need to be met.
Then Safety
When drugs are present...those needs are not often met for them or for you and the kids.
You can't move up to the next level....which is friendship, family and intimacy until the first 2 needs are met.
This is what counselors go on....
As long as some type of mood altering substance is driving the bus...then you are dealing with that alteration and that does not jive with "working things out" in the marriage.
Be careful of manipulation with "date night" and things like that.
Those ploys are used to lure you back into the emotional, romantic "lets just get along and everything will be fine" type of thing.
Look up Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
First Physiological Needs need to be met.
Then Safety
When drugs are present...those needs are not often met for them or for you and the kids.
You can't move up to the next level....which is friendship, family and intimacy until the first 2 needs are met.
This is what counselors go on....
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Originally Posted by YearForMe 
The common suggestion in therapy is that there isn't anything that can be worked on within the relationship as long as they are actively using....and have not started a program of recovery.
As long as some type of mood altering substance is driving the bus..
Those ploys are used to lure you back into the emotional, romantic "lets just get along and everything will be fine" type of thing.
Look up Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
...
As long as some type of mood altering substance is driving the bus..
Those ploys are used to lure you back into the emotional, romantic "lets just get along and everything will be fine" type of thing.
Look up Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
...
Of course you are right - it's more manipulation. He went out last night, left late and came home really late, or early in the morning maybe, I don't know. I do know he came to bed and brought all his junk food with him, a sure sign of the munchies. The kids pointed out he has a big scratch on his back; I didn't look. I don't want to know.
I didn't say anything about his behaviour, I didn't search the car to see what evidence I could find, I am not responsible. This is not my disease.
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I've been there!!!
Originally Posted by becky1982
When you accept the fact that you cannot control HIS addiction, you let go of the illusion that all the checking, monitoring, questioning, peering into their eyes, etc. will change anything. You take the focus off the addict and put it back where it belongs: on you and your children. This is the beginning of detachment and it will restore you to sanity. As you continue taking care of yourself, what needs to be done next will become clear.
If you like to read, pick up Codependent No More by beattie. It changed my life.
If you like to read, pick up Codependent No More by beattie. It changed my life.
I stayed with him for just a little under 10 years. Our son is 8. I thought I was supermom. And you know what? I was. And I am! I finally knew I had to leave, because my son was learning unhealthy ways of being. That was what sealed the deal for me.
I agree with another person who said to start working on a safety plan for you and your kids. It doesn't mean you have to move out tomorrow, but have a plan in place just in case.
Been there. It's not easy. Hopefully it helps to know you're not alone.
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I read this thread with interest. 421, I see you like in Ontario (I am there too). My 21 yo son is pot addict as well (also now alcohol) and has similar habits. I have no wish to "divorce" my son, even if I could. I can however control my self and work on detaching from his using. I can also be pragmatic. Can you ask him to look at harm reduction strategies? It may be more practical than abstinence in your current situation? Harm reduction may work for certain drugs and for certain people. Harm reduction is usually not possible on very virulent drugs like meth, crack or heroin but many people are able to moderate mj / alcohol. Its worth a try.
Here is some information from CAMH in Toronto which may be worth a read.
Here is some information from CAMH in Toronto which may be worth a read.
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I guess it's like they say, Rome wasn't built in a day.
On the way in to work this morning I was thinking that AH and I were introduced just because we both smoked pot. That was the #1 consideration when our mutual, non-smoking friends, thought they'd hook us up. When I quit smoking and AH didn't I worried that it would mean the end of our marriage. By then though, I was pregnant with our first.
I worry that we have nothing in common. Well, I know we have things in common. Maybe not enough things. . .. we can meet in the middle on music to listen to, we both enjoy singing, we both really enjoy four-wheeling. Since we had kids, I have become automatic child care provider, cook, maid, financial planner. AH is the driver out of necessity since I can't drive. He seems to feel that is a lot of extra responsibility on his shoulders, and uses that as an excuse to justify him going out pretty much every night to hang out with his friends, leaving me at home to do all the things involved with keeping a house going, and taking care of three small children.
I am so completely stressed out. I have a headache within 15 minutes of getting up, and 15 minutes of getting home in the evenings. My children are begging me to read them stories, snuggle with them before bed, play dolls and cars, go swimming. All I can say is "I can't" because I have to make dinner, clean up dinner, clean the kitchen, make the lunches, do the laundry, tidy up, sweep the floors, get clothes ready for the morning . . . all in 3 hours so I can get to bed.
It's funny, all I do is pick things up and put them away. I probably get at the very least 90% of the things I use, and everyone else uses, put away where they belong. sometimes, I forget something. From time to time, I slip up. He ALWAYS notices when I leave something out, and points it out and says "you see, you aren't perfect, you leave things out all the time too".
Now AH on the other hand, gets up from the table the second he is done eating, leaves his dishes on the table; goes out to get high, comes in around midnight, or maybe 1, takes his clothes off and throws them on the floor, makes a snack and leaves the cereal box or chip bags wherever he used them, comes to the bedroom and eats the snack in bed, leaves the dishes on the floor next to the bed, Brings a drink, leaves the cup or can on the headboard; takes out his contacts, leaves the solution bottle with no lid. Half the time he comes through the front door he pushes it behind him, but it doesn't latch and so there it is, open and flies and whatever other bugs are coming in. Pours milk for the kids, leaves the milk on the counter, if he cooks a meal he doesn't clean up the kitchen, he just leaves all the dishes for me to deal with. He doesn't do laundry but he yells at me when there are no clothes in the drawers because I haven't had time to fold them and put them away.
Then, when I've had as much as I can take, and I lose my resolve to stay calm, to not say anything about his behaviour, and say something to him, I get told that I need anger management therapy, and that he doesn't think he's the one with the problem.
This morning, in front of my 4 year old, he yelled "oh yeah, you want to start world war three b*!?"
Today, right now, I can't see the way out, and I am back to feeling down and I can't think about working. I don't want to be at work, I just want to cry.
On the way in to work this morning I was thinking that AH and I were introduced just because we both smoked pot. That was the #1 consideration when our mutual, non-smoking friends, thought they'd hook us up. When I quit smoking and AH didn't I worried that it would mean the end of our marriage. By then though, I was pregnant with our first.
I worry that we have nothing in common. Well, I know we have things in common. Maybe not enough things. . .. we can meet in the middle on music to listen to, we both enjoy singing, we both really enjoy four-wheeling. Since we had kids, I have become automatic child care provider, cook, maid, financial planner. AH is the driver out of necessity since I can't drive. He seems to feel that is a lot of extra responsibility on his shoulders, and uses that as an excuse to justify him going out pretty much every night to hang out with his friends, leaving me at home to do all the things involved with keeping a house going, and taking care of three small children.
I am so completely stressed out. I have a headache within 15 minutes of getting up, and 15 minutes of getting home in the evenings. My children are begging me to read them stories, snuggle with them before bed, play dolls and cars, go swimming. All I can say is "I can't" because I have to make dinner, clean up dinner, clean the kitchen, make the lunches, do the laundry, tidy up, sweep the floors, get clothes ready for the morning . . . all in 3 hours so I can get to bed.
It's funny, all I do is pick things up and put them away. I probably get at the very least 90% of the things I use, and everyone else uses, put away where they belong. sometimes, I forget something. From time to time, I slip up. He ALWAYS notices when I leave something out, and points it out and says "you see, you aren't perfect, you leave things out all the time too".
Now AH on the other hand, gets up from the table the second he is done eating, leaves his dishes on the table; goes out to get high, comes in around midnight, or maybe 1, takes his clothes off and throws them on the floor, makes a snack and leaves the cereal box or chip bags wherever he used them, comes to the bedroom and eats the snack in bed, leaves the dishes on the floor next to the bed, Brings a drink, leaves the cup or can on the headboard; takes out his contacts, leaves the solution bottle with no lid. Half the time he comes through the front door he pushes it behind him, but it doesn't latch and so there it is, open and flies and whatever other bugs are coming in. Pours milk for the kids, leaves the milk on the counter, if he cooks a meal he doesn't clean up the kitchen, he just leaves all the dishes for me to deal with. He doesn't do laundry but he yells at me when there are no clothes in the drawers because I haven't had time to fold them and put them away.
Then, when I've had as much as I can take, and I lose my resolve to stay calm, to not say anything about his behaviour, and say something to him, I get told that I need anger management therapy, and that he doesn't think he's the one with the problem.
This morning, in front of my 4 year old, he yelled "oh yeah, you want to start world war three b*!?"
Today, right now, I can't see the way out, and I am back to feeling down and I can't think about working. I don't want to be at work, I just want to cry.
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421 - He sounds like a carbon copy of my husband. Everything you described is what I have lived with for almost 10 yrs. I'm not telling you to leave, but I can tell you that now that I have been out of that house for 2 months I am SO MUCH CALMER. And I can see more clearly how out of balance it all was. I too used to smoke with him. Sometimes I feel guilt over this. Like... it was okay with me once, and I am the one who changed, so somehow I just have to stay and deal with it. I thought like that for a long time. And it kept me from opening up to my family about the things that were wrong in our family. Thing is, I stopped smoking when I got pregnant and never got back into it. So, I did the right thing (and so did you). It's our husbands who aren't changing and who are responsible for their own behavior.
Do you have a place where you could go with the kids? I think you'll be amazed once you're out of that crazy environment just how much better life can be.
Do you have a place where you could go with the kids? I think you'll be amazed once you're out of that crazy environment just how much better life can be.
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421, Tracking back through, it sounds like while for you it may have been a "hobby," but for hubby, it may have been (and still is) self-medication. You follow the difference? It is a big difference.
Means that with you as the "Designated Grown-up" (someone has to be, right?), and kids involved, there are some very real things you can do, and most likely you will want to.
Here is how I did things around my house -- There can ONLY be one #1 Priority. Learned that back in Army training. The kids are the #1 Priority. ALL else follows and serves that.
Here is what I learned in Alanon -- to ensure the success of the #1 Priority, I had to make ME the next priority. To get Good Kids, I have to make sure they have a Good Hammer-Daddy. Funny part in that is the A (Mrs. Hammer, in our case) does not hit the priority list. And does not need to.
If he wants to get real help, you can point him towards it -- AA, NA, plenty of "A" programs out there. But those problems -- are not YOUR problems.
Take care of the kids, and take care of you.
Means that with you as the "Designated Grown-up" (someone has to be, right?), and kids involved, there are some very real things you can do, and most likely you will want to.
Here is how I did things around my house -- There can ONLY be one #1 Priority. Learned that back in Army training. The kids are the #1 Priority. ALL else follows and serves that.
Here is what I learned in Alanon -- to ensure the success of the #1 Priority, I had to make ME the next priority. To get Good Kids, I have to make sure they have a Good Hammer-Daddy. Funny part in that is the A (Mrs. Hammer, in our case) does not hit the priority list. And does not need to.
If he wants to get real help, you can point him towards it -- AA, NA, plenty of "A" programs out there. But those problems -- are not YOUR problems.
Take care of the kids, and take care of you.
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Originally Posted by chickaree777
421 - Sometimes I feel guilt over this. Like... it was okay with me once, and I am the one who changed, so somehow I just have to stay and deal with it. I thought like that for a long time.....It's our husbands who aren't changing and who are responsible for their own behavior.
Do you have a place where you could go with the kids? I think you'll be amazed once you're out of that crazy environment just how much better life can be.
Do you have a place where you could go with the kids? I think you'll be amazed once you're out of that crazy environment just how much better life can be.
With 2 of my 3 kids starting school next week, I don't want to change addresses now, especially since it's DD1's first year at school. I feel like I wish I had seen the light at the end of last school year, and could have taken some time away with the kids. We live in a small town with no public transportation, and AH is my one and only ride, the only way the kids can get to daycare, the only way I can get to and from work.
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Originally Posted by Hammer
Here is how I did things around my house -- There can ONLY be one #1 Priority. Learned that back in Army training. The kids are the #1 Priority. ALL else follows and serves that.
I don't think that is something anyone here can answer of course, it's just where I am at. I want so much to make a happy house for my kids. I don't think that is what it is right now.
Can I just back off of AH's addiction, leave him to it, and somehow keep things good for my kids? One of the things I have to get my head around is really, although he makes my life miserable by not being around, and being a jerk when he is around, calling me names and yelling, putting me down and criticising, assigning blame for everything that does or does not happen, I think mostly, when he spends time with the kids, they have a good time together.. ..
I am not counting the time he THINKS he is spending time with them by laying on his face on the bed or matress and letting them jump on him, claiming they are playing, but really he is probably just too stoned to move. I am thinking about when he takes them out biking or blading, when he watches movies with them (again because that's what HE wants to do, and it's what HE wants to watch) but the kids enjoy being with their Daddy, and at those times, he is not being a bad influence. . . I guess.
How do I balance running a household, a full time job, and 4 hours of commuting a day, and still make the kids a priority?
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Originally Posted by FourTwentyOne
Okay, so here is the really sticky part. Can I make that possible, while still living where I do? If yes, how? If no, how can I make it possible not to move into the city? I want my kids to grow up with a house, and a yard, on a quiet street where it is safe to let them outside to play. We live there, but I don't drive, and there are no busses, and nothing within walking distance at all. No parks, no stores - lots of farm fields, corn and cows though.
I don't think that is something anyone here can answer of course, it's just where I am at. I want so much to make a happy house for my kids. I don't think that is what it is right now.
I don't think that is something anyone here can answer of course, it's just where I am at. I want so much to make a happy house for my kids. I don't think that is what it is right now.
Can I just back off of AH's addiction, leave him to it, and somehow keep things good for my kids?
How do I balance running a household, a full time job, and 4 hours of commuting a day, and still make the kids a priority?
We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us.
I have found that to be Absolutely true, and from the Alanon side of the house -- it does not matter whether the A is still using or not.
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421, I hear that you are between a rock and a hard place, and I am so sorry about that. I hear ambivalence when I read what you write about your kid's welfare.
On the one hand, you are overburdened with raising 3 small kids, taking the lion's share if no the whole share of keeping the household and finances going, and exhausted from working full time and commuting 4 hours each day. That is further complicated by your not being able to drive and living in a small town where driving is essential.
You see your husband as, at best, a mediocre playmate for your children, and at worst a destructive role model who is teaching them that bad behavior is the norm and acceptable. And you don't find him a responsive, responsible or even caring husband.
It seems that you have a clear understanding of how you want to raise your kids and what is important, especially when you say
It's terrible, isn't it?
You marry someone and promise to be together in good times and bad, for better or for worse. Then, you bring innocent child(ren) into things. They didn't choose to be here, they didn't choose Mommy or Daddy.
I know it is my responsibility to keep them safe, to teach them how to be functional members of society, and to take good care of themselves when they are adults.
I guess the question that comes to my mind is to ask you to mull over what is it that makes a happy home for children.
I want my kids to grow up with a house, and a yard, on a quiet street where it is safe to let them outside to play.
This may an ideal for you, what you would most like for your kids. To have this, however, you may be making many trade-offs with your kids' actual current life experience that lead you all to stay in this unhappy home.
Families can live productively, safely, and happily in a city where you have the freedom to move around with public transportation, and to build a strong support system. If that is what it takes for you to eliminate 4 hours of travel time a day, and to eliminate the need for this toxic man to be the center of you and your kids' lives because he drives and you can't, it might be worth the trade.
I think it's a matter of weighing the relative merits and disadvantages of lots of issues. Maybe planning to move in the New Year, when the second half of school starts, would be better than letting the kids be stuck in this home situation. I don't know, and these are just some thoughts, written in support and empathy. Take what you want and leave the rest.
ShootingStar1
On the one hand, you are overburdened with raising 3 small kids, taking the lion's share if no the whole share of keeping the household and finances going, and exhausted from working full time and commuting 4 hours each day. That is further complicated by your not being able to drive and living in a small town where driving is essential.
You see your husband as, at best, a mediocre playmate for your children, and at worst a destructive role model who is teaching them that bad behavior is the norm and acceptable. And you don't find him a responsive, responsible or even caring husband.
It seems that you have a clear understanding of how you want to raise your kids and what is important, especially when you say
It's terrible, isn't it?
You marry someone and promise to be together in good times and bad, for better or for worse. Then, you bring innocent child(ren) into things. They didn't choose to be here, they didn't choose Mommy or Daddy.
I know it is my responsibility to keep them safe, to teach them how to be functional members of society, and to take good care of themselves when they are adults.
I guess the question that comes to my mind is to ask you to mull over what is it that makes a happy home for children.
I want my kids to grow up with a house, and a yard, on a quiet street where it is safe to let them outside to play.
This may an ideal for you, what you would most like for your kids. To have this, however, you may be making many trade-offs with your kids' actual current life experience that lead you all to stay in this unhappy home.
Families can live productively, safely, and happily in a city where you have the freedom to move around with public transportation, and to build a strong support system. If that is what it takes for you to eliminate 4 hours of travel time a day, and to eliminate the need for this toxic man to be the center of you and your kids' lives because he drives and you can't, it might be worth the trade.
I think it's a matter of weighing the relative merits and disadvantages of lots of issues. Maybe planning to move in the New Year, when the second half of school starts, would be better than letting the kids be stuck in this home situation. I don't know, and these are just some thoughts, written in support and empathy. Take what you want and leave the rest.
ShootingStar1
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421:
I'm wondering if your AH knows that your desire is to have a house and a yard etc.?
If you have shared that here...there is a chance you have shared that with him at some point...and if so....he might be holding you hostage...thinking you would never move to the city.
I'm wondering if your AH knows that your desire is to have a house and a yard etc.?
If you have shared that here...there is a chance you have shared that with him at some point...and if so....he might be holding you hostage...thinking you would never move to the city.
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