Act of revenge, Misguided Prank, Threat to harm self ?
Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NJ
Posts: 20,458
it feels like the loaded handgun and the amount of coke in the house is being swept under the rug and "overlooked" with a pat on the head. Mom and Dad are worried about THEIR actions? How are you going to feel if your son shoots someone who tries to rip him off?
Curmudgeon, Electrical Engineer, Guitar God Wannabe
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Where the mighty arms of Atlas hold the heavens from the Earth
Posts: 3,403
MrsDragon...
Haven't gone through all the posts since last weekend, but I don't believe anything I can say will shift how you're currently receiving all the wisdom and hard lessons learned within this thread. I believe you and your husband are going to have to experience things for yourself. Your convictions and beliefs will be tested in the days and weeks to come.
Take this for what it's worth.
When I look back to the days when I was dealing with an addict not in recovery and how I dealt with her behavior, I was really a coward. And that's because I knew deep in my gut I was in way over my head and my AXGF was incredibly, incredibly sick. Yet I chose not to listen to that, for a lot of reasons. One reason was I didn't want to lose her. Another was I wanted to be compassionate towards her. But, in hindsight, being compassionate was just another means of kidding myself by believing if I showed compassion, she'd smarten up. It was really a way to make myself feel better about things, because my wiring at that time didn't like the idea of not being compassionate towards someone sick.
I believe, in my heart of hearts, my AXGF understood that flaw in my reasoning, and took advantage of it. She knew she could misbehave and somehow I'd rationalize it away. It was only after I stopped enabling her to be irresponsible that she left me.
Everything we do has intended and unintended consequences, and the latter sometimes isn't known for a long time afterwards. As I've said before, if you're delaying making a hard decision regarding your son because you and your husband don't believe you can live with the outcome, you best be prepared for the consequences of inaction.
Best,
ZoSo
Haven't gone through all the posts since last weekend, but I don't believe anything I can say will shift how you're currently receiving all the wisdom and hard lessons learned within this thread. I believe you and your husband are going to have to experience things for yourself. Your convictions and beliefs will be tested in the days and weeks to come.
Take this for what it's worth.
When I look back to the days when I was dealing with an addict not in recovery and how I dealt with her behavior, I was really a coward. And that's because I knew deep in my gut I was in way over my head and my AXGF was incredibly, incredibly sick. Yet I chose not to listen to that, for a lot of reasons. One reason was I didn't want to lose her. Another was I wanted to be compassionate towards her. But, in hindsight, being compassionate was just another means of kidding myself by believing if I showed compassion, she'd smarten up. It was really a way to make myself feel better about things, because my wiring at that time didn't like the idea of not being compassionate towards someone sick.
I believe, in my heart of hearts, my AXGF understood that flaw in my reasoning, and took advantage of it. She knew she could misbehave and somehow I'd rationalize it away. It was only after I stopped enabling her to be irresponsible that she left me.
Everything we do has intended and unintended consequences, and the latter sometimes isn't known for a long time afterwards. As I've said before, if you're delaying making a hard decision regarding your son because you and your husband don't believe you can live with the outcome, you best be prepared for the consequences of inaction.
Best,
ZoSo
Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 2,684
Originally Posted by cynical one 
My spidey sense is tingling. Something about all of this seems too manufactured or contrived. I think I’m going to step off the ride and welcome the next newcomer.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Caucasian;West Coast; Husband sometimes breathes fire; hence his nickname Dragon & mine Mrs. Dragon
Posts: 176
Originally Posted by cynical one
My spidey sense is tingling. Something about all of this seems too manufactured or contrived. I think I’m going to step off the ride and welcome the next newcomer.
If your spider senses are tingling perhaps it's because your realizing their is no playbook for addiction and your at a point where you can't relate to what we are experiencing. Perhaps you can relate to people holding others at gunpoint and then fleeing into the night, or moms tying their kids to their own bodies to prevent the next drug run?
I came here to get other perspectives, and to hopefully pick up information that could help me navigate as we go through this with our son.
Your comments are very demeaning of what we are experiencing, and to be honest that is disappointing after I thought I had found an anonymous place filled with caring people who would listen and not condemn.
I am placing you on ‘ignore’, as well as all those that thanked your post. Further comment made by you will be done not for my benefit , but to only because you want to hear yourself speak.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Caucasian;West Coast; Husband sometimes breathes fire; hence his nickname Dragon & mine Mrs. Dragon
Posts: 176
Following what happened with the swimming pool incident; I think that I should now give more of the backstory on our son, and why I was so concerned his actions might have been a warning he intended to harm himself.
What I said in earlier comments was true; our son never had issues with drugs or alcohol until recently when he suffered some very personal loss. But that loss came about two years ago, around the same time his marriage ended. It was during their separation when he began to unravel, and the substance abuse started. Sure it is possible there was experimentation before; maybe in high school or college, but if so, it never came to light.
What happened with the pool; is an example of how our son never does anything in a small way, and it has been the same with the drugs. When he started two years ago; I’ll just say it was full force, and yes it has involved cocaine induced psychosis. What stopped his run at that time, was fallout from an affair with his best friends wife. They too were friends, and it appears she fell into the trap of trying to save him; thinking she was the only one that understood his pain, the she was only that could reach him. Her husband never found out.
The final end to the run came when we got a call from a different friend of his; who had gone by our sons home unannounced, and found him high, delusional, loaded gun, and suicidal. There is no doubt in my mind that he would not have taken his life that night, if it had not been for receiving that call, and my husband going there, talking him down, and taking the gun from him. (no, we didn’t call the police or EMS). After that we got him into treatment for depression, and where the goal was to have him begin to deal with the underlying issues that were behind his substance abuse.
After he came home; continued follow up treatment, but Im not sure for how long because we did not monitor him. He was once again doing extremely well, or so we thought, until as I stated when I came here to the forum, we found out recently that what we thought was a sign of trouble drinking, turned out really to be he had went back to the cocaine.
Knowing this, the incident with the pool; maybe you can see why our first concern was that it looked more like a threat that he would harm himself; just as he almost did before. (the water pistol, the towel dyed red; and then the water. Like he shot himself and went into the pool).
My husband and I are not novices at this exactly; not anymore. But I don’t think you reach a point where you ever have all the answers as this is something that twists and turns just when you think you have it figured out.
We have learned not to react to things in a dramatic way, we have learned to think things through before we act, or make decisions; because we have to live with our choices regardless of what happens with our son.
We have talked to lots of people, and have lots of information, and I don’t feel that we are doing a bad job handling our end of things; although its obvious many people here would disagree. That’s ok, I came looking for other perspectives. I didn’t come looking for the answer, because it is not something anyone can give us.
The therapist we talked to is aware of the full situation, and opinion is that he did this in response to his father suspending him from work. He took part of it as personal and it hurt him, so while high on coke and maybe drunk too; he struck back by doing something he felt would hurt us personally; making us recall events of the past , and implying he will do it again. But he is not lost in that psychotic state and trapped in depression like he was the first time; so this was not a threat but truly an act of cruelty towards us meant only to cause emotional distress.
What I said in earlier comments was true; our son never had issues with drugs or alcohol until recently when he suffered some very personal loss. But that loss came about two years ago, around the same time his marriage ended. It was during their separation when he began to unravel, and the substance abuse started. Sure it is possible there was experimentation before; maybe in high school or college, but if so, it never came to light.
What happened with the pool; is an example of how our son never does anything in a small way, and it has been the same with the drugs. When he started two years ago; I’ll just say it was full force, and yes it has involved cocaine induced psychosis. What stopped his run at that time, was fallout from an affair with his best friends wife. They too were friends, and it appears she fell into the trap of trying to save him; thinking she was the only one that understood his pain, the she was only that could reach him. Her husband never found out.
The final end to the run came when we got a call from a different friend of his; who had gone by our sons home unannounced, and found him high, delusional, loaded gun, and suicidal. There is no doubt in my mind that he would not have taken his life that night, if it had not been for receiving that call, and my husband going there, talking him down, and taking the gun from him. (no, we didn’t call the police or EMS). After that we got him into treatment for depression, and where the goal was to have him begin to deal with the underlying issues that were behind his substance abuse.
After he came home; continued follow up treatment, but Im not sure for how long because we did not monitor him. He was once again doing extremely well, or so we thought, until as I stated when I came here to the forum, we found out recently that what we thought was a sign of trouble drinking, turned out really to be he had went back to the cocaine.
Knowing this, the incident with the pool; maybe you can see why our first concern was that it looked more like a threat that he would harm himself; just as he almost did before. (the water pistol, the towel dyed red; and then the water. Like he shot himself and went into the pool).
My husband and I are not novices at this exactly; not anymore. But I don’t think you reach a point where you ever have all the answers as this is something that twists and turns just when you think you have it figured out.
We have learned not to react to things in a dramatic way, we have learned to think things through before we act, or make decisions; because we have to live with our choices regardless of what happens with our son.
We have talked to lots of people, and have lots of information, and I don’t feel that we are doing a bad job handling our end of things; although its obvious many people here would disagree. That’s ok, I came looking for other perspectives. I didn’t come looking for the answer, because it is not something anyone can give us.
The therapist we talked to is aware of the full situation, and opinion is that he did this in response to his father suspending him from work. He took part of it as personal and it hurt him, so while high on coke and maybe drunk too; he struck back by doing something he felt would hurt us personally; making us recall events of the past , and implying he will do it again. But he is not lost in that psychotic state and trapped in depression like he was the first time; so this was not a threat but truly an act of cruelty towards us meant only to cause emotional distress.
Iceberg Ahead!
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Out at Sea
Posts: 1,177
The backstory is helpful. The affair with the wife of his unsuspecting and innocent best friend especially. A lot of guilt there to try to kill or numb with addiction, and acting out.
Hang in there.
Hang in there.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Up and onwards... :)
Posts: 274
Ms.dragon - its very brave of you to come on here and share your story with raw honesty. That's how we all eventually find the strength to do (or not do) what we need in order to be true to ourselves. It's best to ignore the few who I've noticed love to make cold and callous digs as a ruse to say they are only "helping". There are many here who share their stories and show true CARE & concern and I appreciate the caution they are advising here as the situation could be serious to you and your husbands overall safety ( and your sons) down the road.
However, when it comes to the backhanded comments (ie: "I'm exiting this conversation... Blah blah blah") i wonder why the heck do you need to post it for everyone to see? Just leave without the fanfare - thanks.
We are all here for one reason ... to make sense out of the senseless in our lives which is addiction. Period.
My AH died of his addiction 4 weeks ago and there is NO "desire" to tell others how to walk their paths to their own recovery. I'm here to share my story ... my thoughts and feelings to get it out, but maybe in the process, perhaps to encourage and lift others up.
I read time after time how people wished they had "listened" to the "tough love" that seems to be rampant with some here but at the end of the day, we all are going to be following our own paths, in OUR OWN TIME, and learn the way of detaching and letting go. It all comes from within us eventually.
Keep posting Mrs.dragon , keep coming back and reading others journeys and in your own time, you will get to where you need to be.
However, when it comes to the backhanded comments (ie: "I'm exiting this conversation... Blah blah blah") i wonder why the heck do you need to post it for everyone to see? Just leave without the fanfare - thanks.
We are all here for one reason ... to make sense out of the senseless in our lives which is addiction. Period.
My AH died of his addiction 4 weeks ago and there is NO "desire" to tell others how to walk their paths to their own recovery. I'm here to share my story ... my thoughts and feelings to get it out, but maybe in the process, perhaps to encourage and lift others up.
I read time after time how people wished they had "listened" to the "tough love" that seems to be rampant with some here but at the end of the day, we all are going to be following our own paths, in OUR OWN TIME, and learn the way of detaching and letting go. It all comes from within us eventually.
Keep posting Mrs.dragon , keep coming back and reading others journeys and in your own time, you will get to where you need to be.
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
I think it is time to close this thread. MrsDragon has shared and received many replies that hopefully will help her. We have reached a point of debate and unkind remarks from both sides so I am closing this thread and invite MrsDragon to share again another time as her life progresses. This particular issue has been worn out.
I hope your life gets better MrsDragon. Thank you to all who contributed here, now lets all move forward in our recovery.
Ann
I hope your life gets better MrsDragon. Thank you to all who contributed here, now lets all move forward in our recovery.
Ann
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