Seeking help for me in the aftermath
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 13,497
Forsakenforgive,
When you first posted, your initial title was about how to get help for you, in the aftermath. I believe that you do need help. This is a great place to learn, and get support. I think what has pushed some buttons here is the statement that you were going to let him come back into your home. I don't think anyone here wants you to abandon a friend, but they don't want to see happen to you what has happened to many of them.
I had this thought, and wanted to mention it to you. Your friend almost died, right, from od'ing? well, a good case against letting him come back is that he may die the next time he does drugs. and if he was there, at your home, the temptation would be there, to do what he did before. It would almost be like handing him a checkbook, and who knows if he will survive the next time.
I don't see anything wrong with being a supportive friend, but he needs to be able to do this on his own, and to focus on his self. He might not be able to have any other relationships for a while, due to he needs to be in meetings, and hanging with others who can help him, because they know how.
You can care, and encourage him, and that is good. but I have heard that many who are trying to get sober/clean cannot be expected to give much to anyone besides them selves. and that is the best thing for them , until they get a whole lot of recovery. I am just saying what I have learned from SR, the last several years.
please protect yourself, and your child, and mom. he might just be rather desperate for a while, I hope he recovers.
maybe it was Divine Providence that brought you here...It was for me.
When you first posted, your initial title was about how to get help for you, in the aftermath. I believe that you do need help. This is a great place to learn, and get support. I think what has pushed some buttons here is the statement that you were going to let him come back into your home. I don't think anyone here wants you to abandon a friend, but they don't want to see happen to you what has happened to many of them.
I had this thought, and wanted to mention it to you. Your friend almost died, right, from od'ing? well, a good case against letting him come back is that he may die the next time he does drugs. and if he was there, at your home, the temptation would be there, to do what he did before. It would almost be like handing him a checkbook, and who knows if he will survive the next time.
I don't see anything wrong with being a supportive friend, but he needs to be able to do this on his own, and to focus on his self. He might not be able to have any other relationships for a while, due to he needs to be in meetings, and hanging with others who can help him, because they know how.
You can care, and encourage him, and that is good. but I have heard that many who are trying to get sober/clean cannot be expected to give much to anyone besides them selves. and that is the best thing for them , until they get a whole lot of recovery. I am just saying what I have learned from SR, the last several years.
please protect yourself, and your child, and mom. he might just be rather desperate for a while, I hope he recovers.
maybe it was Divine Providence that brought you here...It was for me.
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 100
Not understanding the capabilities of an addict in a household with a child is understandable when we've not been exposed to it before or have not had the opportunity to heed the multitude of wise counsel from those that have been there. Sometimes we, or, more importantly, our children by the choices we make, are given a second chance to literally survive. True second chances do not come along often, and when they do come along many times it's at a price that is unimaginable. Ann Jones is the author of some books that are worthy of looking into before rather than after the fact when considering allowing such "friends" to be allowed access to our family and most importantly our children....a few of the books are "Next time she'll be dead", "Women who kill", and "When love goes wrong". In my experience it would be better to gain wisdom from others than to live it out in real life. Wishing you the best.
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: PM me....
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Your primary responsibility is what goes on within the 4 walls of your home with people that share your DNA. You, your child and your mother.
Anything beyond that is an over active sense of responsibility.
Anything beyond that is an over active sense of responsibility.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 462
forsakin. i am not an addict nor have i ever had my life touch by this lifestyle until 6months ago when i met my bf on a dating site. he was sweet and he gave me little bits and pieces of info about his past (which involved some pretty heavy drug use, including acid and meth). he was still taking acid on occasion when i met him but not a regular user. he did start drinking more and more though the longer we went out and i tried to point this out to him to no avail. his idea of being honest was that if i didn't ask him an out and out question then he wasn't lying if he didn't tell me the whole truth. he had a good job, his own home, and seemed like a very well adjusted guy with a pretty ****** background and disfunction family.
long story short, i became concerned that even 3-4times a year of using acid could put my family (i have 2 teenage daughters) and my career at jeopardy (i have a very responsible and non drug tolerance type of job) and his increasing alcohol consumption was not something i wanted my kids to have in their lives, so i came to this site for answers. i did not like what they told me. i did not like that they made this situation sounds so dire and scary. but the thing is, they have been to the depths of hell and back themselves or with a loved one, and many of them have almost been swallowed up in this hell call addiction. they do not want anyone to go through even a little of what they have. they are trying to protect you and your daughter. now you can take their advise and wisdom, or you can not, but they are not attacking you. they are trying to shock you into the reality of the world you are facing. now for me, my situation was far less severe than yours. my bf was taking a non addictive drug, but it was one that i would not have in my life, so i told him straight that i did not want any type of drug or his past in my future. i made a clear boundary of what i would accept, and he got angry with me and we broke up. 2 days later he lost his job. instead of falling back into his abyss he stopped drinking as he now realises that social drinking is not an option for him. its no alcohol or addiction. and to be in my life drugs are just not an option. he has chosen no drugs, but i am still very cautious about this relationship. i am very keen to understand the way addicts behave and what to look out for. i am not convinced he can leave this life behind. i trust what these people say, and use it to help me see what is in front of me with open eyes. they are just wanting to protect you. they are just very passionate about protecting those who come here looking for answers. but if you don't like what they have to say thats fine. find someone who will tell you you are doing a great job, and when this guy relapses and steals everything from you, or your daughter accidentally finds his heroin stash, or a dirty needle, then they will again be here to support you. there won't be any i told you so.'s. they will just be here to help.
but its up to you. listen. learn. or don't. but i wish you luck for i know how difficult it is when you care about someone. let him do this on his own. you are just enabling him and softening his fall by supporting him and going with him. he needs to find strength within to do this for himself and by himself.
goodluck and hope it all works out.
long story short, i became concerned that even 3-4times a year of using acid could put my family (i have 2 teenage daughters) and my career at jeopardy (i have a very responsible and non drug tolerance type of job) and his increasing alcohol consumption was not something i wanted my kids to have in their lives, so i came to this site for answers. i did not like what they told me. i did not like that they made this situation sounds so dire and scary. but the thing is, they have been to the depths of hell and back themselves or with a loved one, and many of them have almost been swallowed up in this hell call addiction. they do not want anyone to go through even a little of what they have. they are trying to protect you and your daughter. now you can take their advise and wisdom, or you can not, but they are not attacking you. they are trying to shock you into the reality of the world you are facing. now for me, my situation was far less severe than yours. my bf was taking a non addictive drug, but it was one that i would not have in my life, so i told him straight that i did not want any type of drug or his past in my future. i made a clear boundary of what i would accept, and he got angry with me and we broke up. 2 days later he lost his job. instead of falling back into his abyss he stopped drinking as he now realises that social drinking is not an option for him. its no alcohol or addiction. and to be in my life drugs are just not an option. he has chosen no drugs, but i am still very cautious about this relationship. i am very keen to understand the way addicts behave and what to look out for. i am not convinced he can leave this life behind. i trust what these people say, and use it to help me see what is in front of me with open eyes. they are just wanting to protect you. they are just very passionate about protecting those who come here looking for answers. but if you don't like what they have to say thats fine. find someone who will tell you you are doing a great job, and when this guy relapses and steals everything from you, or your daughter accidentally finds his heroin stash, or a dirty needle, then they will again be here to support you. there won't be any i told you so.'s. they will just be here to help.
but its up to you. listen. learn. or don't. but i wish you luck for i know how difficult it is when you care about someone. let him do this on his own. you are just enabling him and softening his fall by supporting him and going with him. he needs to find strength within to do this for himself and by himself.
goodluck and hope it all works out.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 528
Originally Posted by dollydo 
A child should never be exposed to addiction of any kind. Bringing an addict into the home is an irresponsible decision. A child can be taken from a home where addiction is present, as the Department Of Human Resources considers it child abuse.
You claim to not be codependent, but truth is you are and to the detriment of not only yourself but your daughter and mother.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 5,924
Originally Posted by forsakenforgive
I do know that there wont be a back and forth for a long time yet, if ever at all. That depends solely on his ability to stick to recovery. If he cannot stick to recovery, then I cannot and will not sit on stand by. Not to diminish the serious reality of addiction, but arent there times in a friendship where one is more needy then the other for a period of time, when they need to help themselves, or just need to vent?
I'm not judging anyone, but simply stating the best way for me to hear anything is to be spoken to as an equal who is willing and eager to learn. Not a child who needs to be berated. I appreciate everyones feedback, including the things I don't want to hear. I just hope people will take it down a notch and just talk. Most of it seems like stifled anger, which is preventing me from wanting to reach out.
I'm not judging anyone, but simply stating the best way for me to hear anything is to be spoken to as an equal who is willing and eager to learn. Not a child who needs to be berated. I appreciate everyones feedback, including the things I don't want to hear. I just hope people will take it down a notch and just talk. Most of it seems like stifled anger, which is preventing me from wanting to reach out.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 18
I understand now, why you all were so harsh. Fear. I appreciate all of your concern. At this moment, I feel angry. I feel this situation is completely hopeless. Where before I knew it would be near impossible for him, a small amount of of hope remained that he would be able to stick to recovery.
That he KNEW the next time he tried to get high, he KNEW he would die. After reading all your posts I feel like there is no hope for him. I am shaken to my core that so many of you feel so strongly that there is no way for him to stick to recovery.
I feel worse then ever. I'm mad at myself for thinking he stood a chance. I want to believe like I did that even though there was little chance for him, I now feel none.
What do I do now? He knows he will die if he gets high again. He KNOWS it. He says he KNOWS it anyway. I feel so confused. The doctors say he will die if he uses again. He's died 3 times before. He nearly died again. This time his heart is damaged and even the smallest amount of drugs will kill him.
I was so ready to stand by him, to see if he could pull through this. I still am even if it means I'll watch him die. I will not enable him, but I feel so much hopelessness. How can I be his friend without hope?
That he KNEW the next time he tried to get high, he KNEW he would die. After reading all your posts I feel like there is no hope for him. I am shaken to my core that so many of you feel so strongly that there is no way for him to stick to recovery.
I feel worse then ever. I'm mad at myself for thinking he stood a chance. I want to believe like I did that even though there was little chance for him, I now feel none.
What do I do now? He knows he will die if he gets high again. He KNOWS it. He says he KNOWS it anyway. I feel so confused. The doctors say he will die if he uses again. He's died 3 times before. He nearly died again. This time his heart is damaged and even the smallest amount of drugs will kill him.
I was so ready to stand by him, to see if he could pull through this. I still am even if it means I'll watch him die. I will not enable him, but I feel so much hopelessness. How can I be his friend without hope?
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Join Date: Jun 2012
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Posts: 282
ForsakeForgive,
my heroin addict ex got so desperate that he started to sell drugs to his minor 16 year old nephew. His own kid nephew whom he was willing to screw over to support his habit. I picked up the phone and called his parole officer and had him back in jail. I wasnt even related to this kid... if I can consider the well being of a minor stranger whom I've met 2 times and have no relationship with ... you cant put way more effort into protecting your mother and child.
I'd like to add to Learn2Live's words: there are no family members in the eyes of a heroin addict.
The heroin addict will steal your grandmother's pearls just to get a fix and then lie about it to your tear-soaked face. The addict will also make sure to help you look for those precious pearls. They are master liars, manipulators, and that kind of dishonesty and downright criminal activity has no place in any kind of relationship... yes, friendship included.
my heroin addict ex got so desperate that he started to sell drugs to his minor 16 year old nephew. His own kid nephew whom he was willing to screw over to support his habit. I picked up the phone and called his parole officer and had him back in jail. I wasnt even related to this kid... if I can consider the well being of a minor stranger whom I've met 2 times and have no relationship with ... you cant put way more effort into protecting your mother and child.
I'd like to add to Learn2Live's words: there are no family members in the eyes of a heroin addict.
The heroin addict will steal your grandmother's pearls just to get a fix and then lie about it to your tear-soaked face. The addict will also make sure to help you look for those precious pearls. They are master liars, manipulators, and that kind of dishonesty and downright criminal activity has no place in any kind of relationship... yes, friendship included.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 5,924
FF, it is not your job to have hope for the addict. You are emotionally enmeshed with this guy, whether you want to admit it or not. You are way too invested in someone else's Recovery. It behooves you to investigate WHY you are this invested in something that has absolutely NOTHING to do with you, all in the name of "friendship."
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 528
Originally Posted by forsakenforgive
I understand now, why you all were so harsh. Fear. I appreciate all of your concern. At this moment, I feel angry. I feel this situation is completely hopeless. Where before I knew it would be near impossible for him, a small amount of of hope remained that he would be able to stick to recovery.
That he KNEW the next time he tried to get high, he KNEW he would die. After reading all your posts I feel like there is no hope for him. I am shaken to my core that so many of you feel so strongly that there is no way for him to stick to recovery.
I feel worse then ever. I'm mad at myself for thinking he stood a chance. I want to believe like I did that even though there was little chance for him, I now feel none.
What do I do now? He knows he will die if he gets high again. He KNOWS it. He says he KNOWS it anyway. I feel so confused. The doctors say he will die if he uses again. He's died 3 times before. He nearly died again. This time his heart is damaged and even the smallest amount of drugs will kill him.
I was so ready to stand by him, to see if he could pull through this. I still am even if it means I'll watch him die. I will not enable him, but I feel so much hopelessness. How can I be his friend without hope?
That he KNEW the next time he tried to get high, he KNEW he would die. After reading all your posts I feel like there is no hope for him. I am shaken to my core that so many of you feel so strongly that there is no way for him to stick to recovery.
I feel worse then ever. I'm mad at myself for thinking he stood a chance. I want to believe like I did that even though there was little chance for him, I now feel none.
What do I do now? He knows he will die if he gets high again. He KNOWS it. He says he KNOWS it anyway. I feel so confused. The doctors say he will die if he uses again. He's died 3 times before. He nearly died again. This time his heart is damaged and even the smallest amount of drugs will kill him.
I was so ready to stand by him, to see if he could pull through this. I still am even if it means I'll watch him die. I will not enable him, but I feel so much hopelessness. How can I be his friend without hope?
My AH whined at me a week ago, "well I guess you opted out of my recovery!" yes because for some reason I have never felt responsible for whether he recovers or not. I don't know why, because I feel responsible for other things, like leaving him o possible homelessness. Maybe I have just been too stressed with the things he opted out of like parenting, working and treating others respectfully.
What I am saying is he used you, and that can be hard to understand, I speak from experience here. Remove the emotional friendship glasses and look at the situation In a logical way and what do you have left? A man who took advantage of a single mom and her aging parent struggling o make ends meet by using their possessions as a means to purchase drugs and their home as a refuge to do drugs in. That's all it is, I promise, and you are not obligated to that in any way, not even the emotional energy to hope FOR him, he must do his own hoping.
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 324
Originally Posted by anvilhead
How can I be his friend without hope?
well you could see he never was your "friend" - he was prowling on line looking for his next victim, came across a nice somewhat vulnerable gal, hit her with some blast furnace charm and had her nice and primed for when he "suddenly" found himself homeless. boom she moves him in....he has to this point neglected a really critical FACT about himself, that he is a long term heroin addict....she thinks they're playing house when in fact he is systematically stealing sentimental valuable possessions in order to fund his habit and then boom, he od's and lands himself in the hospital.
again.
you don't think this has played out before??? you think you are the one that will be special and different and with your love and support he will really KICK....this time??? he already knows the risks of using...it doesn't MATTER. he is making the choice to be hope-less.
again.
well you could see he never was your "friend" - he was prowling on line looking for his next victim, came across a nice somewhat vulnerable gal, hit her with some blast furnace charm and had her nice and primed for when he "suddenly" found himself homeless. boom she moves him in....he has to this point neglected a really critical FACT about himself, that he is a long term heroin addict....she thinks they're playing house when in fact he is systematically stealing sentimental valuable possessions in order to fund his habit and then boom, he od's and lands himself in the hospital.
again.
you don't think this has played out before??? you think you are the one that will be special and different and with your love and support he will really KICK....this time??? he already knows the risks of using...it doesn't MATTER. he is making the choice to be hope-less.
again.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 18
sorry I haven't responded in a few days. I've been taking time to read through topics, new and old, and read the stickies. I've been evaluating my life to see if I've become a co-dependent or if I'm heading that way.
I realize my biggest issue is wanting to know everything. I'm nosey. Its a problem I developed as a defensive mechanism over the years of being weak against my own emotional issues. I've grown very objective and learned to remove my emotions from all situations regardless of the cost in order to learn other people before allowing them into my heart. Obviously I missed something big in this situation and I'm struggling to cope with the overwhelming thoughts of investing my friendship into someone who could turn around and hurt me so much.
I've written him a couple letters regarding the intense feelings I've had. That I can extend forgiveness but that doesn't mean I'll forget or that he still has my trust.
I saw him for the first time in about 2 weeks on Saturday, and it was gut wrenching. The health issues he caused himself with this last relapse are very evident. His heart has so much fluid around it, it cannot pump correctly and is causing all manners of issues. His digestive tract is completely wiped right now and its causing him even more issues. On top of that he had hernias which he neglected to care for and with his heart in such a state, the pain and progression of the hernias has been amplified.
This looks like a rock bottom. He acknowledges without ever being asked or prompted that when or if he relapses again, he will die. His body physically cannot handle drug use in any small amount from this point out. Thats not to say it wont happen or that his addiction wont convince him otherwise.
I haven't stopped my life in any way since before or after we met. Nor has it changed since his relapse. I suppose that isn't 100% correct since I've spent a lot of time evaluating myself and looking at my own needs and those of my daughter.
I don't know what I'm going to do once he is out of rehab. I did however draw a line, a good healthy boundary that I've stated to him in person and in a written letter. When/if I notice anything nearing a relapse or that he isn't putting himself first in his journey with sobriety, I'm out. Though I know it will be a hard decision to make, I've made it before and know I am capable of carrying it out.
Its been a few days of no contact with my friend while he's in rehab. I just spoke with his mom and their discharging him early because of his health issues and problems with his own insurance. He isn't coming here but going to his moms to handle all of these problems. I don't know what will happen to him but i know I'll continue to seek support here for myself.
Thanks everyone, and I hope I'm still welcome to update on my progress as I make it. Whether its 2 steps forward or 1 back.
I realize my biggest issue is wanting to know everything. I'm nosey. Its a problem I developed as a defensive mechanism over the years of being weak against my own emotional issues. I've grown very objective and learned to remove my emotions from all situations regardless of the cost in order to learn other people before allowing them into my heart. Obviously I missed something big in this situation and I'm struggling to cope with the overwhelming thoughts of investing my friendship into someone who could turn around and hurt me so much.
I've written him a couple letters regarding the intense feelings I've had. That I can extend forgiveness but that doesn't mean I'll forget or that he still has my trust.
I saw him for the first time in about 2 weeks on Saturday, and it was gut wrenching. The health issues he caused himself with this last relapse are very evident. His heart has so much fluid around it, it cannot pump correctly and is causing all manners of issues. His digestive tract is completely wiped right now and its causing him even more issues. On top of that he had hernias which he neglected to care for and with his heart in such a state, the pain and progression of the hernias has been amplified.
This looks like a rock bottom. He acknowledges without ever being asked or prompted that when or if he relapses again, he will die. His body physically cannot handle drug use in any small amount from this point out. Thats not to say it wont happen or that his addiction wont convince him otherwise.
I haven't stopped my life in any way since before or after we met. Nor has it changed since his relapse. I suppose that isn't 100% correct since I've spent a lot of time evaluating myself and looking at my own needs and those of my daughter.
I don't know what I'm going to do once he is out of rehab. I did however draw a line, a good healthy boundary that I've stated to him in person and in a written letter. When/if I notice anything nearing a relapse or that he isn't putting himself first in his journey with sobriety, I'm out. Though I know it will be a hard decision to make, I've made it before and know I am capable of carrying it out.
Its been a few days of no contact with my friend while he's in rehab. I just spoke with his mom and their discharging him early because of his health issues and problems with his own insurance. He isn't coming here but going to his moms to handle all of these problems. I don't know what will happen to him but i know I'll continue to seek support here for myself.
Thanks everyone, and I hope I'm still welcome to update on my progress as I make it. Whether its 2 steps forward or 1 back.
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Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Another Earth
Posts: 172
Sadly, what looks like a rock bottom to you may not be to him, health issues or not. My ex has had abnormal ECG readings and then had a stress test where they found abnormalities with his heart, but he chose to never find out the results. His DOC is cocaine. Once he is triggered to use, nothing matters, even the fact that he could drop dead of a heart attack. Not to sound cold, but please don't let your "hope" that this is his bottom further cloud your judgement. I pray you find the strength to make the healthiest choices for you, your child and your Mom.
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 324
Originally Posted by forsakenforgive
He isn't coming here but going to his moms to handle all of these problems. I don't know what will happen to him but i know I'll continue to seek support here for myself.
Keep reading here and keep your eyes open and you'll be hard pressed to come up with a good reason to let him move back in.
Good luck to you.
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