Today....
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Originally Posted by TiredandSpent 
When he actually recovers, he won't be that wonderful non using person who makes you so incredibly happy. That person needed drugs to be that way, even if at that moment he wasn't high.
If he truly recovers he will integrate the good and bad in him (instead of splitting it Jekyll and Hyde like he's doing with the drugs) and he will mature (because maturity stops and regresses at the age he began using) and he will be a different person than he is now.
You aren't going to get just the good parts of him. You are going to get the good and bad and matured parts of him and NOBODY can predict what that will look like.
I dont think he has been showing me a split personality for these last 9 months. I think Ive been seeing a combination of the good and the bad.
Obviously, I think that this relapse will affect him, I think ongoing treatment will affect him; I think being reconnected with his dad will affect him. I expect his personality and outlook to change somewhat. But I dont think the core of who he is will change significantly.
There's another phenomenon that is very common, especially among people who just dated and didn't know each other well before the recovery of the addict--they become sober and recovered, and they don't want their partner any more. They don't want a codie. They understand how sick codie behavior is, and they don't want to deal with it.
You cannot put your life and your self work on hold waiting for him to recover and make you incredibly happy. The chances of that happening are very slim.
If he truly recovers he will integrate the good and bad in him (instead of splitting it Jekyll and Hyde like he's doing with the drugs) and he will mature (because maturity stops and regresses at the age he began using) and he will be a different person than he is now.
You aren't going to get just the good parts of him. You are going to get the good and bad and matured parts of him and NOBODY can predict what that will look like.
I dont think he has been showing me a split personality for these last 9 months. I think Ive been seeing a combination of the good and the bad.
Obviously, I think that this relapse will affect him, I think ongoing treatment will affect him; I think being reconnected with his dad will affect him. I expect his personality and outlook to change somewhat. But I dont think the core of who he is will change significantly.
There's another phenomenon that is very common, especially among people who just dated and didn't know each other well before the recovery of the addict--they become sober and recovered, and they don't want their partner any more. They don't want a codie. They understand how sick codie behavior is, and they don't want to deal with it.
You cannot put your life and your self work on hold waiting for him to recover and make you incredibly happy. The chances of that happening are very slim.
Obviously I dont have a crystal ball; in that regard I must just take it one day at a time......
And your right, my worrying over him, focusing on him so intensly, the codependance - is a threat to our relationship. Its the nagging wife syndrome in a way; who wants to be on either end of that? I surely dont.
So I am working on me. I actually think Im doing pretty well. Someone even said yesterday, look at all youve been through in one swoop - you find out your BF is using drugs again, you find him dying on the floor, you discover you were cheated on .... thats a lot. You even said it was more than you had been through.... in how many years? .....and Ive not even had 3 weeks to absorb it all.
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[QUOTE=cynical one;3239031][SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR]
It's really simple and quite lovely if you think about it. One addict helping another addict. And, what do they get in return…nothing. No pay, no fame, no glory. It's the 12th step: "Having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to addicts, and to practice these principles in all our affairs".Compare addiction to a war, both are a fight for freedom and life. Who would you want to learn combat from, someone who once read about a war, or someone who has been down in the trenches? This is why it's important and why it works.
I can see where this works if the addict is way down the road in recovery, but it seems really dangerous if they are not. Seems like they might fuel each others addiction and cause a relapse. BF doesnt have anyone like this that I know of; not unless the DR qualifies or ends up suggesting he get into some group, etc. But BF isnt too keen on the 12 steps and the rehab he went to was not oriented in that. Im sure it had some other method; your probably aware of whats out there in regards to that; but I dont really know.
Now to impress you <insert eye rolling here> I'm going to throw some out of context Latin at you: actus non facit reum nisi mens sit rea "the act does not make a person guilty unless the mind is also guilty". You're giving the drugs way too much power. Cheating reflects more on his character than the use of drugs.
Trust, once broken is something that is earned back. Look for continual trustworthy decisions and behaviors.
Early on in our relationship, BF explained that indeed he had been with a lot of women especially when he had lots of $ to burn; seems like women were always willing and available; hanging out at the dealers. It was common to go for the drug and party with the girl. The two seemed to go hand in hand. sort of like the ritual of the needle; the girl was part of the ritual. It still reflects on his moral character but in my thoughts it is in some way tied to the seduction of the drug. Obviously Im not at peace about this subject yet
But you would have to know his dad; I get the impression that he likes to take care of things. He can afford it
Dad is enabling, he knows he's enabling, he has been doing this addiction thing for what like 15 years. Most likely he has already done and tried everything you are going to attempt. He's at the point where he doesn't want to be emotionally invested any further, so he just throws money at the problem to make himself feel better and feed his own ego.I'm not saying he's a bad guy by any means, it's just how I think he feels he is dealing with it.
That really sounds a lot like his dad; I still think he is pretty emotionally connected to his son however. But just at a loss as to what to do. When I talked to him, I told him that his doing things for me; ie. paying things for me - made me feel uncomfortable, but he just kinda smiled and shook his head and said he wanted to do it. What are you going to do- may be wrong but I will let a little of his enabling spill over to me. lol
I didn’t understand why anyone would want to inject the drug; why not just snort it; why use a needle – that’s like yuck; and the disturbing part was his explanation that the high from injecting was the most incredible thing he had ever felt. But you had to do it with just the right amount; or basically it would kill you. And this he seemed to find intoxicating along with using the drug. Pushing it to the max without dying. That is why he said he quit; because he knew he was going to die.
Pushing it to the max without dying. Yup. A few years back there was some heroin on the streets that was mixed with Fentanyl (a narcotic that is about 100x stronger than morphine). It was sold in baggies with a skull and crossbones on it and went by the name of "Death".There was a rash of deaths from overdoses in many major cities. A normies thought process would be 'OMG why would anyone do that'. A heroin addicts thought process would be 'who has it, where can I get it, I want more' knowing that they could very likely end up with a toe tag.
It is really disturbing that something can be so powerful that you are oblivious to the risks....someone told me he has a death wish...someone told me that if he was doing this he was in it hard-core. I dont know if either is true because I dont know about this stuff; I did find out that when he bought the drugs that he OD on - he supposedly purchased an ounce.
He shared part of it of course, but what he brought home - and was discovered was just a trace, so for a while I was curious if this was a large quantity. Couldnt find that on goolge though - lol
Thank you for the links - I started looking at some of them they are really informative. You have a good blog listing going on there. I have thought about doing a blog - just to allow some of my thoughts to escape without debate
Thanks and Hugs
Kel
It's really simple and quite lovely if you think about it. One addict helping another addict. And, what do they get in return…nothing. No pay, no fame, no glory. It's the 12th step: "Having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to addicts, and to practice these principles in all our affairs".Compare addiction to a war, both are a fight for freedom and life. Who would you want to learn combat from, someone who once read about a war, or someone who has been down in the trenches? This is why it's important and why it works.
I can see where this works if the addict is way down the road in recovery, but it seems really dangerous if they are not. Seems like they might fuel each others addiction and cause a relapse. BF doesnt have anyone like this that I know of; not unless the DR qualifies or ends up suggesting he get into some group, etc. But BF isnt too keen on the 12 steps and the rehab he went to was not oriented in that. Im sure it had some other method; your probably aware of whats out there in regards to that; but I dont really know.
Now to impress you <insert eye rolling here> I'm going to throw some out of context Latin at you: actus non facit reum nisi mens sit rea "the act does not make a person guilty unless the mind is also guilty". You're giving the drugs way too much power. Cheating reflects more on his character than the use of drugs.
Trust, once broken is something that is earned back. Look for continual trustworthy decisions and behaviors.
Early on in our relationship, BF explained that indeed he had been with a lot of women especially when he had lots of $ to burn; seems like women were always willing and available; hanging out at the dealers. It was common to go for the drug and party with the girl. The two seemed to go hand in hand. sort of like the ritual of the needle; the girl was part of the ritual. It still reflects on his moral character but in my thoughts it is in some way tied to the seduction of the drug. Obviously Im not at peace about this subject yet
But you would have to know his dad; I get the impression that he likes to take care of things. He can afford it
Dad is enabling, he knows he's enabling, he has been doing this addiction thing for what like 15 years. Most likely he has already done and tried everything you are going to attempt. He's at the point where he doesn't want to be emotionally invested any further, so he just throws money at the problem to make himself feel better and feed his own ego.I'm not saying he's a bad guy by any means, it's just how I think he feels he is dealing with it.
That really sounds a lot like his dad; I still think he is pretty emotionally connected to his son however. But just at a loss as to what to do. When I talked to him, I told him that his doing things for me; ie. paying things for me - made me feel uncomfortable, but he just kinda smiled and shook his head and said he wanted to do it. What are you going to do- may be wrong but I will let a little of his enabling spill over to me. lol
I didn’t understand why anyone would want to inject the drug; why not just snort it; why use a needle – that’s like yuck; and the disturbing part was his explanation that the high from injecting was the most incredible thing he had ever felt. But you had to do it with just the right amount; or basically it would kill you. And this he seemed to find intoxicating along with using the drug. Pushing it to the max without dying. That is why he said he quit; because he knew he was going to die.
Pushing it to the max without dying. Yup. A few years back there was some heroin on the streets that was mixed with Fentanyl (a narcotic that is about 100x stronger than morphine). It was sold in baggies with a skull and crossbones on it and went by the name of "Death".There was a rash of deaths from overdoses in many major cities. A normies thought process would be 'OMG why would anyone do that'. A heroin addicts thought process would be 'who has it, where can I get it, I want more' knowing that they could very likely end up with a toe tag.
It is really disturbing that something can be so powerful that you are oblivious to the risks....someone told me he has a death wish...someone told me that if he was doing this he was in it hard-core. I dont know if either is true because I dont know about this stuff; I did find out that when he bought the drugs that he OD on - he supposedly purchased an ounce.
He shared part of it of course, but what he brought home - and was discovered was just a trace, so for a while I was curious if this was a large quantity. Couldnt find that on goolge though - lol
Thank you for the links - I started looking at some of them they are really informative. You have a good blog listing going on there. I have thought about doing a blog - just to allow some of my thoughts to escape without debate
Thanks and Hugs
Kel
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Originally Posted by KelleyF
I acknowledging the wolf; but I am not afraid of the wolf
Besides aren't wolves being forced into extinction?
It's such a shame because ...in wilderness is the preservation of the world
Besides aren't wolves being forced into extinction?
It's such a shame because ...in wilderness is the preservation of the world
Addiction is the wolf, sheep's clothing is the veneer of charm and normalcy you fell in love with. You were defending yourself that his problems were a wolf in sheep's clothing and thus you didn't know.
When it's pointed out that you now know, what are you going to do about it, you start spouting nonsense to divert from the question.
It's a shame wolves/addiction is being forced into extinction? This is your response? No, the wolf in this discussion is not being forced into extinction; we all wish it were. But if it were, you'd think it a shame? Isn't that what you are hoping for when you say your fiance is 'recovering'? That the wolf is forced into extinction?
"In wilderness is the preservation of the world"? What on earth does this mean? The world can be saved through addiction?
Dear, you are not thinking, you are reacting and feeling and you aren't making sense. And it's a shame because you are at a critical point in your about to make decisions that will change the course of your life.
This is why you need to go to al or nar anon meetings, why you need a sponsor. A sponsor will help you go through your thought processes and call BS where BS needs to be called and support the healthy thought processes and support healthy action and boundaries.
But all that aside, I'm interested in you. We know lots about your fiance, his job, his romantic past, his family, his hopes and fears, what kind of car he drives, but know nothing about you. I assume you work, you say you are going to school and it's a struggle. But other than that, you've said very little about yourself. What do you do, what are you studying? Do you live near family, have a good relationship with them, siblings? You spent Christmas eve with him and sounds like most of Christmas day, did you see your family?
Of course don't write anything you aren't comfortable in sharing, but there has to be more to you than your relationship with your fiance's addiction. As some of the previous posters have said before, you matter too.
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Kelley, this quote of yours:
"I can see where this works if the addict is way down the road in recovery, but it seems really dangerous if they are not. Seems like they might fuel each others addiction and cause a relapse. BF doesnt have anyone like this that I know of; not unless the DR qualifies or ends up suggesting he get into some group, etc. But BF isnt too keen on the 12 steps and the rehab he went to was not oriented in that. Im sure it had some other method; your probably aware of whats out there in regards to that; but I dont really know."
exemplifies your naivete your and your "unknowingness" (ignorance) around issues of addiction and recovery. it is actually quite okay and to your advantage to live in a world where you do not need to know these things...you are innocent of the ways of addiction and recovery, but when it comes to wanting to be, deciding to be, being stubborn about being, and actually even insulting/reacting/talking back to/refusing/and getting "smart" with people who have had to live in this world...your quote becomes alarming
furthermore, your "LOL" and dilly dallying, dalliance around a life threatening addiction is scary. but hey, it makes for good blog material right?
"I can see where this works if the addict is way down the road in recovery, but it seems really dangerous if they are not. Seems like they might fuel each others addiction and cause a relapse. BF doesnt have anyone like this that I know of; not unless the DR qualifies or ends up suggesting he get into some group, etc. But BF isnt too keen on the 12 steps and the rehab he went to was not oriented in that. Im sure it had some other method; your probably aware of whats out there in regards to that; but I dont really know."
exemplifies your naivete your and your "unknowingness" (ignorance) around issues of addiction and recovery. it is actually quite okay and to your advantage to live in a world where you do not need to know these things...you are innocent of the ways of addiction and recovery, but when it comes to wanting to be, deciding to be, being stubborn about being, and actually even insulting/reacting/talking back to/refusing/and getting "smart" with people who have had to live in this world...your quote becomes alarming
furthermore, your "LOL" and dilly dallying, dalliance around a life threatening addiction is scary. but hey, it makes for good blog material right?
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Kelly, it is your choice on how you want to live your live. I just want to share one little bit of experience. I left my AW of 36 years 9 months ago. I am 58 yo, a former member of the Marine Corps and have been involved in martial arts for a good part of my life.
I am SCARED TO DEATH of that wolf. That wolf (my wife's addiction) lead me into the middle of hell and then did it's best to keep me there. It took me 15 years of pain and misery and fear to find my way out.
However, it is your choice. I wish you the best in your future.
Your friend,
I acknowledging the wolf; but I am not afraid of the wolf
However, it is your choice. I wish you the best in your future.
Your friend,
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Kelly, you said:
If you apply that to yourself, you might understand some of the responses you've elicted here. I think some of us are disturbed that you are so oblivious to the risks of something so powerful and damaging as your apparent codependency.
Codependency destroys lives as surely as cocaine. At least with cocaine you have moments of good times interspersed with the misery. You don't get that with codependency.
Originally Posted by KelleyF
It is really disturbing that something can be so powerful that you are oblivious to the risks...
Codependency destroys lives as surely as cocaine. At least with cocaine you have moments of good times interspersed with the misery. You don't get that with codependency.
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I acknowledging the wolf; but I am not afraid of the wolf
Besides aren't wolves being forced into extinction?
It's such a shame because ...in wilderness is the preservation of the world
I love you all for being here for me, but ....
Sometimes I think you guys take yourselves WAY too seriously.
And you analyze things WAY too much.
This statement: In Wilderness is the Preservation of the World"
It has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with addiction or recovery. (at least to me)
It is just a quote by one of my fav's: Henry David Thoreau
This statement: Besides arent wolves being forced into extinction.
Well, I guess I said that because Ive been reading about treatment for cocaine addiction, and one of the steps was called "Extinction"
This statement: A wolf in sheeps clothing
When I made this comment it was in response to someone telling me that I really didnt love my BF, that I was only attracted to him because he represented a 'bad boy' that I could save.
And so I was trying to explain, that he never appeared to be the 'bad boy' and he never appeared to "need saving" (at least to me)
therefore, I didnt think their conclusion was true.
This statement: I acknowledge the wolf; but I am not afraid ofthe wolf
*where the wolf = my boyfriends drug addiction NOT my own co-dependancy issues*
At this moment in time; in all honesty - I am not afraid of what the 'wolf' is going to do to me. But I am afraid of what I will do to myself based on my reactions and responses to it. *My codependancy issues*
-OR-
My boyfriends addiction is NOT going to do anything to me that I DONT LET HAPPEN. This is my life; and I have to take responsiblity for myself.
Besides aren't wolves being forced into extinction?
It's such a shame because ...in wilderness is the preservation of the world
I love you all for being here for me, but ....
Sometimes I think you guys take yourselves WAY too seriously.
And you analyze things WAY too much.
This statement: In Wilderness is the Preservation of the World"
It has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with addiction or recovery. (at least to me)
It is just a quote by one of my fav's: Henry David Thoreau
This statement: Besides arent wolves being forced into extinction.
Well, I guess I said that because Ive been reading about treatment for cocaine addiction, and one of the steps was called "Extinction"
This statement: A wolf in sheeps clothing
When I made this comment it was in response to someone telling me that I really didnt love my BF, that I was only attracted to him because he represented a 'bad boy' that I could save.
And so I was trying to explain, that he never appeared to be the 'bad boy' and he never appeared to "need saving" (at least to me)
therefore, I didnt think their conclusion was true.
This statement: I acknowledge the wolf; but I am not afraid ofthe wolf
*where the wolf = my boyfriends drug addiction NOT my own co-dependancy issues*
At this moment in time; in all honesty - I am not afraid of what the 'wolf' is going to do to me. But I am afraid of what I will do to myself based on my reactions and responses to it. *My codependancy issues*
-OR-
My boyfriends addiction is NOT going to do anything to me that I DONT LET HAPPEN. This is my life; and I have to take responsiblity for myself.
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Originally Posted by m1k3
Kelly, it is your choice on how you want to live your live. I just want to share one little bit of experience. I left my AW of 36 years 9 months ago. I am 58 yo, a former member of the Marine Corps and have been involved in martial arts for a good part of my life.
I am SCARED TO DEATH of that wolf. That wolf (my wife's addiction) lead me into the middle of hell and then did it's best to keep me there. It took me 15 years of pain and misery and fear to find my way out.
However, it is your choice. I wish you the best in your future.
Your friend,
I am SCARED TO DEATH of that wolf. That wolf (my wife's addiction) lead me into the middle of hell and then did it's best to keep me there. It took me 15 years of pain and misery and fear to find my way out.
However, it is your choice. I wish you the best in your future.
Your friend,
Im not ashamed to be ignorant on this subject; I am trying to learn.
Ive had a he!!ish 3 weeks; and if I insert some LOL here and there...its because I need a break for my own sanity. ME - THIS IS ABOUT ME
There is a process in discovery and learning; this is my attempt at a crash course to learn and make my own decisions based on scientiic evidence, and infomation I obtain from others.....I am taking this seriously, or I wouldnt be on this site; I wouldnt be reading books, or using google to look up weird terms that I can even spell.
Big hug and thanks; I know your trying to keep me from exeriencing pain like you have felt and that is very generous of you.
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Originally Posted by m1k3
Kelly, it is your choice on how you want to live your live. I just want to share one little bit of experience. I left my AW of 36 years 9 months ago. I am 58 yo, a former member of the Marine Corps and have been involved in martial arts for a good part of my life.
I am SCARED TO DEATH of that wolf. That wolf (my wife's addiction) lead me into the middle of hell and then did it's best to keep me there. It took me 15 years of pain and misery and fear to find my way out.
However, it is your choice. I wish you the best in your future.
Your friend,
I am SCARED TO DEATH of that wolf. That wolf (my wife's addiction) lead me into the middle of hell and then did it's best to keep me there. It took me 15 years of pain and misery and fear to find my way out.
However, it is your choice. I wish you the best in your future.
Your friend,
Im not ashamed to be ignorant on this subject; I am trying to learn.
Ive had a he!!ish 3 weeks; and if I insert some LOL here and there...its because I need a break for my own sanity. ME - THIS IS ABOUT ME
There is a process in discovery and learning; this is my attempt at a crash course to learn and make my own decisions based on scientiic evidence, and infomation I obtain from others.....I am taking this seriously, or I wouldnt be on this site; I wouldnt be reading books, or using google to look up weird terms that I can even spell.
Big hug and thanks; I know your trying to keep me from exeriencing pain like you have felt and that is very generous of you.
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Originally Posted by TiredandSpent
This was enabling. Did you tamper with evidence at the scene of a crime? What exactly did you do to 'deal' with the drugs that were there? And you cleaned up his place so his parents wouldn't know the truth?
This is you trying to be in control. This was you interferring, this was you making it worse. This was YOUR sickness in action.
If you were to be arrested for tampering with evidence at the scene of the crime, would you consider yourself a victim of the consequences of HIS addiction? Or would you see it for what it really is, a consequences of YOUR addiction?
This is you trying to be in control. This was you interferring, this was you making it worse. This was YOUR sickness in action.
If you were to be arrested for tampering with evidence at the scene of the crime, would you consider yourself a victim of the consequences of HIS addiction? Or would you see it for what it really is, a consequences of YOUR addiction?
Trying to protect him from the consequences of his actions.
I dont know if was a scene of a crime however; or that I tampered with evidence. But yes, classic codependancy; wasnt thinking about me -just him. No I wouldnt have blamed him if Id been arrested. It was my choice; Im not much into playing the victim; never have been.
What I did with them was pretty stupid actually now that I look back on it.
And as far as cleaning up his place, that wasnt to protect him. That was because it just wasnt right for his parents to see the place that way. It would have been cruel; they had already been through enough.
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Originally Posted by lesliej
where is your family? where is your community? who, in your world, knows about this?
Originally Posted by Bucyn
Wow, this looks like some seriously desperate denial tap dancing.
But all that aside, I'm interested in you. We know lots about your fiance, his job, his romantic past, his family, his hopes and fears, what kind of car he drives, but know nothing about you. I assume you work, you say you are going to school and it's a struggle. But other than that, you've said very little about yourself. What do you do, what are you studying? Do you live near family, have a good relationship with them, siblings? You spent Christmas eve with him and sounds like most of Christmas day, did you see your family?
Of course don't write anything you aren't comfortable in sharing, but there has to be more to you than your relationship with your fiance's addiction. As some of the previous posters have said before, you matter too.
But all that aside, I'm interested in you. We know lots about your fiance, his job, his romantic past, his family, his hopes and fears, what kind of car he drives, but know nothing about you. I assume you work, you say you are going to school and it's a struggle. But other than that, you've said very little about yourself. What do you do, what are you studying? Do you live near family, have a good relationship with them, siblings? You spent Christmas eve with him and sounds like most of Christmas day, did you see your family?
Of course don't write anything you aren't comfortable in sharing, but there has to be more to you than your relationship with your fiance's addiction. As some of the previous posters have said before, you matter too.
Fair enough.
Im 28, never been married. Ive had boyfriends on/off since high school; only a couple serious ones. One I almost married, but we really had different goals in life and decided against it. I dont regret it. I cant say I was damaged by any of my relationships. I got hurt; fell down; got back up. Some of them Im still friends with. Im not afraid to be alone though; before RABF I was just dating casually. Guys seem to think Im cute; and I get asked out a lot. I just say that because Im not desperate for attention or anything. Im not thinking about having kids anytime soon; no rush to get married. Ive always thought it was important to be able to take care of yourself because you never know what will happen in life.
Obviously, I dont do drugs, I dont drink except maybe wine with dinner etc. I do however love sugar. That is my weakness. So because of that I have to make up for it by keeping up with a good exercise program.
I belelive in God; used to go to church all the time; havent been in quite a while now however. Havent looked for a church where Im living
My family - no drug use; no alcohol use; my parents were married 57 years; my mom passed away from cancer several years ago. My dad lives a couple hours away; I have one brother - he lives close to my dad. My brother is a lot older than me; like 12 years - so each of us basically grew up as an only child. Im not real fond of him; he's a bit selfish and greedy and has always tried to 'take' off my parents. Those are his issues not mine; I just dont see him often. My grandparents are all gone. I have a couple of cousins that I talk to - none live close by however.
I actually spent Thanksgiving with my dad; RABF went with me; and for Christmas he was dad was going to be at my brothers. I spent the real Christmas Eve and Christmas Day at hospital with RABF and his family. He was in the ICU
We went ahead and had our belated Christmas Eve/ Christmas just recently - and it was beautiful. Im so glad we didnt skip it. And this weekend, we are having our New Years Eve and New Years Day.
I live where I do - because of school. I have 2 semesters left to get my MBA.
I work full time; well usually -have flex time - but its a good job. I get by ok financially; dont have a ton to save - after the shoes....but you know how it is for girls.
I have friends froom school that Ive know for a while now; a couple really good girlfriends and one really good guy friend. They have all spent time with the RABF, and they liked him fine; now they say he is not good enough for me.
one of them said I would have been better off if he had died. But they show glimpses of understanding now and again. I love em'
I am friendly to just about everyone; but deep friendships take time for me; I dont trust easily. It has to be earned. Once its given, I take it seriously. For those people; I will put up with small misdeeds; but when Ive had enough; Ive had enough, and generally I dont look back.
I have a couple of friends at work; only one that I "trust" - she knows what happened. She has been supportive. Took me a while to tell her about it all; like 2 weeks. She was shocked - she has met RABF too. He takes me to lunch usually at least once a week; and now and then a whole group would come with us. She tells me to hang in there; it will get better. Says she has family members with problems and it can be managed/overcome.
Geez...feel like Im posting on one of thsoe dating sites.....lol
I typically have a sense of humor, and laugh at myself.
Im usually happy.
Ive had bad things happen to me; like my moms cancer. It knocked me down, but I got back up. Ive had disappointments in life; but the common thread seems to be that I may get knocked down but I get back up.
I set goals; I usually obtain them; otherwise I stop - eat chocolate, and press on.
I like animals, Im allergic to mold; I do have one fear - bats.
I really did have to get rabies shots one time. I dont care what Martha Stewart says - Im not putting a bat house in the yard; EVER.
Hugs to you all.
Kel
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 445
<<Everyone>>
Ive just been reading some of the forums today; For those of you that have been talking with <Kittenkaboodle>> who gave it to you pretty good for being hard on her...And then said she was leaving the forum...
Yesterday I have to admit I had similiar feelings about some of the feedback I had been getting. *I was accused of lots of stuff...told I was ignorant, emotionally unstable, stubborn headed, rude and insensitive and several people even wanted more info so they could further analyze me.
...which I didn't hear any bad comments; so I must either be ok, or so crazy no one wants to touch it ... Lol
But I'm not upset - because I know that most of you have been where I am; actually i think most of you have seen much worse than me at this point.
But the point is your each trying in your own way; with your own experiences; and knowledge to help confused souls like myself who come asking for it.
I had no place else to go; I had no informed people to talk to; what your doing here is a good thing.*
Just wanted to tell you that.
Ive just been reading some of the forums today; For those of you that have been talking with <Kittenkaboodle>> who gave it to you pretty good for being hard on her...And then said she was leaving the forum...
Yesterday I have to admit I had similiar feelings about some of the feedback I had been getting. *I was accused of lots of stuff...told I was ignorant, emotionally unstable, stubborn headed, rude and insensitive and several people even wanted more info so they could further analyze me.
...which I didn't hear any bad comments; so I must either be ok, or so crazy no one wants to touch it ... Lol
But I'm not upset - because I know that most of you have been where I am; actually i think most of you have seen much worse than me at this point.
But the point is your each trying in your own way; with your own experiences; and knowledge to help confused souls like myself who come asking for it.
I had no place else to go; I had no informed people to talk to; what your doing here is a good thing.*
Just wanted to tell you that.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,384
Kelley, I can't imagine the shock that you must have had from finding your BF after his accidental overdose. My mom intentionally attempted an overdose last year. It was a suicide attempt. I felt a lot of anger toward her for trying to off herself. I also felt fear that she was going to attempt it again. I didn't find my mom like that. I got a call from her nurse aide that she was unresponsive, and was being taken to the hospital.
My parents are both addicts/alcoholics, and so is my RABF. So, I have a lot of experience. I work really hard to take care of myself mentally and physically. It is not easy, but I try to put those things first. I focus on eating regular meals and getting plenty of sleep. I also like to read about Zen and Christianity. I work with a psychiatrist. In fact, I called her right after my mom's suicide attempt. I also exercise regularly and watch comedy movies. SR has been a lot of help to me. I come here regularly and re-read the stickies and read people's posts. It keeps reminding me to focus on myself first. I also volunteer, which has been a great feeling.
My parents are both addicts/alcoholics, and so is my RABF. So, I have a lot of experience. I work really hard to take care of myself mentally and physically. It is not easy, but I try to put those things first. I focus on eating regular meals and getting plenty of sleep. I also like to read about Zen and Christianity. I work with a psychiatrist. In fact, I called her right after my mom's suicide attempt. I also exercise regularly and watch comedy movies. SR has been a lot of help to me. I come here regularly and re-read the stickies and read people's posts. It keeps reminding me to focus on myself first. I also volunteer, which has been a great feeling.
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
actually i think most of you have seen much worse than me at this point
Get away from the addiction
and
to WORK ON OURSELVES to stop ENABLING and EXCUSING the A's behavior, which is a part of ENABLING.
see up til then i didn't GET it. when he said it had been a 20 year battle, i thought oh pshaw, you just ain't trying hard enough. until i became that slobbering creature about to crap my pants hardly able to wait til the dope was IN the pipe. i have a good job, i look like an aging soccer mom, i'm bright sensible responsible....but that crap tried to take it all away.
took 4.5 years to finally get done. both of us. against all odds. i saw enough of the dark side to KNOW....i will always and forever have to guard against thinking using again would be ok. we are exactly ONE bad decision away. ONE. there are no guarantees. i have an exit strategy in place JUST IN CASE he picks up again. cuz i can't go there. i will be one of those running for the hills. i adore this man, we have a very good life together, we have 27 years and 1 month left on our mortgage...i'd still run out the door screaming if need be. i can never let the desire for US overtake the need to protect ME.
took 4.5 years to finally get done. both of us. against all odds. i saw enough of the dark side to KNOW....i will always and forever have to guard against thinking using again would be ok. we are exactly ONE bad decision away. ONE. there are no guarantees. i have an exit strategy in place JUST IN CASE he picks up again. cuz i can't go there. i will be one of those running for the hills. i adore this man, we have a very good life together, we have 27 years and 1 month left on our mortgage...i'd still run out the door screaming if need be. i can never let the desire for US overtake the need to protect ME.
See Kelley, those of us who have experienced not only addiction but also Co Dependency and know both sides of the coin, and yes some of us that have been responding to you, and to Kittenkaboodle are what is called 'double winners.'
We are trying to show you both sides so you can make a 'solid decision based on reality and not fantasy.'
KB is posting again on some threads, and I hope and pray that you will continue to:
stay here,
post here,
and start sharing YOUR Strength and Hope.
Remember, we are open 24/7, lol
Love and hugs,
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 445
Originally Posted by anvilhead
kelley, it's HARSH dealing with addiction....from either side. nobody comes away unscathed. for those who have never really experienced addiction, it seems like such a solvable issue....my god, just QUIT. i will help you.
with hank and i, he revealed to me his thing with crack after we'd been together a few months....i'd been in a drinking relapse for YEARS and we'd done some coke together, no big deal to me, as i'd done lots of coke back in the day and it was never a PROBLEM. it never GOT me. so my brilliant suggestion was well we'd just do it together. makes sense, right? he'd be home with me instead out there doing god knows what with god knows who. what could possibly go wrong??? i could handle it.
wrong. within three months of occasional/weekend use, i clearly remember the day when i knew what HE meant when he said it was the first thought on his mind upon waking and the last thought on his brain when he went to sleep. I was ADDICTED to crack. dammitohell.
see up til then i didn't GET it. when he said it had been a 20 year battle, i thought oh pshaw, you just ain't trying hard enough. until i became that slobbering creature about to crap my pants hardly able to wait til the dope was IN the pipe. i have a good job, i look like an aging soccer mom, i'm bright sensible responsible....but that crap tried to take it all away.
took 4.5 years to finally get done. both of us. against all odds. i saw enough of the dark side to KNOW....i will always and forever have to guard against thinking using again would be ok. we are exactly ONE bad decision away. ONE. there are no guarantees. i have an exit strategy in place JUST IN CASE he picks up again. cuz i can't go there. i will be one of those running for the hills. i adore this man, we have a very good life together, we have 27 years and 1 month left on our mortgage...i'd still run out the door screaming if need be. i can never let the desire for US overtake the need to protect ME.
that is the "harsh" reality....at some point, if addiction is not arrested, we have to bail to save ourselves.
with hank and i, he revealed to me his thing with crack after we'd been together a few months....i'd been in a drinking relapse for YEARS and we'd done some coke together, no big deal to me, as i'd done lots of coke back in the day and it was never a PROBLEM. it never GOT me. so my brilliant suggestion was well we'd just do it together. makes sense, right? he'd be home with me instead out there doing god knows what with god knows who. what could possibly go wrong??? i could handle it.
wrong. within three months of occasional/weekend use, i clearly remember the day when i knew what HE meant when he said it was the first thought on his mind upon waking and the last thought on his brain when he went to sleep. I was ADDICTED to crack. dammitohell.
see up til then i didn't GET it. when he said it had been a 20 year battle, i thought oh pshaw, you just ain't trying hard enough. until i became that slobbering creature about to crap my pants hardly able to wait til the dope was IN the pipe. i have a good job, i look like an aging soccer mom, i'm bright sensible responsible....but that crap tried to take it all away.
took 4.5 years to finally get done. both of us. against all odds. i saw enough of the dark side to KNOW....i will always and forever have to guard against thinking using again would be ok. we are exactly ONE bad decision away. ONE. there are no guarantees. i have an exit strategy in place JUST IN CASE he picks up again. cuz i can't go there. i will be one of those running for the hills. i adore this man, we have a very good life together, we have 27 years and 1 month left on our mortgage...i'd still run out the door screaming if need be. i can never let the desire for US overtake the need to protect ME.
that is the "harsh" reality....at some point, if addiction is not arrested, we have to bail to save ourselves.
Thank you for sharing that with me. I appreciate your posts so much because the way you explain things seems to have a way of reaching me.
And your exactly right that was my view of RABF addiction - "WOW, awful, so glad you quit" Even he tried to make me see it wasnt over; but I didnt get it.
Makes me feel incredibly stupid; makes me angry at my myself though; not him
And as far as my codependancy - until I came to SR I had no concept of it.
Last couple weeks Ive been bombarded with information; information on his addiction and on my codependancy. At the stage Im in, some of it makes sense, and some of it doesnt; at least not yet.
I guess I focus a lot on understanding his addiction and what it has done to him and how it has affected him physiologically. I know that is codependant behavior. And I get harsh words when I ask questions reagarding his addiction. But my main problem is that when I look at him, his behavior, his actions, etc. He seems fine. Its hard to fit than into him being a full blown cocaine addict.
But that is just like you saying 'to the world you looked like a soccer mom.
In my mind, Ive been going back and analyzing his behavior since we first met. I think this is because people keep telling me things and I dont see it relation to him. Its the question - was I blind?
Im hoping its just a phase that I need to get through.
But Ive also accepted that this is his problem and I cant do anything about it.
And I actually feel relieved because I also have come to the conclusion that HE does know exactly what he is doing. And his actions show me that he is serious about getting the help he needs to stay clean.
So that just really leaves worry. And I admit I have trouble with that.
But a person cant live a happy life; worrying all the time. I learned some of these lessons from when my mom had cancer. There is no certainty of tomorrow - you make the most of each day. If you worry too much; you waste that day. I dont want to offend anyone making that comparison; thats just my personal experience.
So basically since he is doing the work he needs to do; I just have to trust him
to take care of it. But like you said, I need to keep in my mind that I need an escape plan if doesnt work. (A Physical and emotional escape plan). In case the situation changes to one that is making me unhappy, or putting me in harms way.
I just have to accept that.
Continue with my life, my goals, taking care of myself, along with enjoying the relationship that we have together right now.
~~~
OMG - I think Im getting it ....at least a bit.
Did what I say just make sense? Im sure Im missing some big component , but am I way off base?
And then I get confused because people say
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 445
Originally Posted by bluebelle
Kelley, I can't imagine the shock that you must have had from finding your BF after his accidental overdose. My mom intentionally attempted an overdose last year. It was a suicide attempt. I felt a lot of anger toward her for trying to off herself. I also felt fear that she was going to attempt it again. I didn't find my mom like that. I got a call from her nurse aide that she was unresponsive, and was being taken to the hospital.
My parents are both addicts/alcoholics, and so is my RABF. So, I have a lot of experience. I work really hard to take care of myself mentally and physically. It is not easy, but I try to put those things first. I focus on eating regular meals and getting plenty of sleep. I also like to read about Zen and Christianity. I work with a psychiatrist. In fact, I called her right after my mom's suicide attempt. I also exercise regularly and watch comedy movies. SR has been a lot of help to me. I come here regularly and re-read the stickies and read people's posts. It keeps reminding me to focus on myself first. I also volunteer, which has been a great feeling.
My parents are both addicts/alcoholics, and so is my RABF. So, I have a lot of experience. I work really hard to take care of myself mentally and physically. It is not easy, but I try to put those things first. I focus on eating regular meals and getting plenty of sleep. I also like to read about Zen and Christianity. I work with a psychiatrist. In fact, I called her right after my mom's suicide attempt. I also exercise regularly and watch comedy movies. SR has been a lot of help to me. I come here regularly and re-read the stickies and read people's posts. It keeps reminding me to focus on myself first. I also volunteer, which has been a great feeling.
Reagardless if you found her or not; that is an awful thing to experience; especially with your mom. And despite her troubles; she is still Your Mom.
It sounds like you are very strong; and have found a way to seperate yourself from their addictions.
All the things you mentioned about taking care of yourself; that all makes sense.
I normally exercise every day, but since the RABF incident I had just let that go; I also let go of so many other things that were MY things. Even returning phone calls or checking my email. I realized all this early this week; because Ive started to come out of my fog a bit. Now Im playing catch up. Started exercising again. Began to slow down on the junk food, started reading the CoDependant No More book, finally returned some of those calls, etc.
Made me feel more centered again. Just have to keep it up.
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,384
Originally Posted by KelleyF
Now Im playing catch up. Started exercising again. Began to slow down on the junk food, started reading the CoDependant No More book, finally returned some of those calls, etc.
Made me feel more centered again. Just have to keep it up.
Made me feel more centered again. Just have to keep it up.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,384
Originally Posted by KelleyF
So basically since he is doing the work he needs to do; I just have to trust him
to take care of it.
to take care of it.
I see this as a similar experience to me with my mom. I trust that there is a plan for her life. I know that it is out of my control, and I didn't cause it and I can't control it. I also don't trust her. I don't trust that she won't try to kill herself again. I don't trust that she won't get herself in some kind of mess that she will want rescued from. The only control I have is over my reaction. I can choose not to get involved in her drama. I can choose to have boundaries regarding her behavior toward me.
I think it is fine that you are stepping back and watching his actions. I would just be very careful in trusting his words. With addicts, actions are much more important than words. He may say he wants to be clean, but watch to see if he chooses to go through the recovery work.
Take care.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 445
Hi Bluebelle.
Thanks so much for your insight. It helps having so many people share their experiences.
I am feeling much better; not stressing over the A's issues....
He does have to have some tests run this week rekated to his heart, so I am worried about that; dont want him to have a broken heart.
And yes Im going to go with him. He actually has to go into the hospital and be put under sedation, and they said it would take like 5 hours for the whole thing. His dad is flying in too. So I basically get to spend the day with his dad. (That should be fun; I like his dad but he rather intimidates me; I dont knwo why though - he is friendly and all)
**All Prayers are welcome regarding this**
I cant not trust him; Ive given up on that one.
I actually believe his past behavior has proven to me that he is trustworthy. I spent a lot of time analyzing this over past weeks.
His words and his actions have always matched up since Ive known him. His dad and others; could say different, but I really cant.
Oddly enough, the day of the OD, he called me after "the argument at work" and told me about it. Said he was going to be late for our dinner plans because he had ot go downtown and file some papers because he missed the courier.
Even that was verified by his boss/friend that he had the argument with.
Thats one reason I never doubted his version of why he relapsed. (And when I say that; dont ge tme wrong; he isnt blaming anyone for making him relapse, but says internally he was triggered by events)
He admits he needs help with those triggers and his response to certain emotions, and that is why he is seeing the psychiatrist.
I am going to be observant of his actions; but even his dad told me that if he starts using again; I probably wont be able to tell it - least not right away.
So I determined that I cant be with him and not trust him. I cant double check what he says to me, or look in pockets, or drawers, or search his car.
Thats not a relationship....and that would make me crazy again.
So I may likely get hurt; Im giving him that power because I gave him my heart. Someone wrote one day about the dark, evil, eyes of an addict... BF dad told me about looking into his eyes and it was like they were dead.
I really do not want to experience this; it will be devestating, but Ive accepted it.
Hugs !
Kel
Thanks so much for your insight. It helps having so many people share their experiences.
I am feeling much better; not stressing over the A's issues....
He does have to have some tests run this week rekated to his heart, so I am worried about that; dont want him to have a broken heart.
And yes Im going to go with him. He actually has to go into the hospital and be put under sedation, and they said it would take like 5 hours for the whole thing. His dad is flying in too. So I basically get to spend the day with his dad. (That should be fun; I like his dad but he rather intimidates me; I dont knwo why though - he is friendly and all)
**All Prayers are welcome regarding this**
Originally Posted by bluebelle
I'm not sure that you need to trust him, as much as trust the process. He may or may not go back to the addiction, and have another disaster relapse. That is something you have no control over. However, I wouldn't necessarily suggest that you "trust him." He past behavior has not shown that he is trustworthy.
I actually believe his past behavior has proven to me that he is trustworthy. I spent a lot of time analyzing this over past weeks.
His words and his actions have always matched up since Ive known him. His dad and others; could say different, but I really cant.
Oddly enough, the day of the OD, he called me after "the argument at work" and told me about it. Said he was going to be late for our dinner plans because he had ot go downtown and file some papers because he missed the courier.
Even that was verified by his boss/friend that he had the argument with.
Thats one reason I never doubted his version of why he relapsed. (And when I say that; dont ge tme wrong; he isnt blaming anyone for making him relapse, but says internally he was triggered by events)
He admits he needs help with those triggers and his response to certain emotions, and that is why he is seeing the psychiatrist.
I am going to be observant of his actions; but even his dad told me that if he starts using again; I probably wont be able to tell it - least not right away.
So I determined that I cant be with him and not trust him. I cant double check what he says to me, or look in pockets, or drawers, or search his car.
Thats not a relationship....and that would make me crazy again.
So I may likely get hurt; Im giving him that power because I gave him my heart. Someone wrote one day about the dark, evil, eyes of an addict... BF dad told me about looking into his eyes and it was like they were dead.
I really do not want to experience this; it will be devestating, but Ive accepted it.
Hugs !
Kel
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