KelleyF

Where to start... NF and I met shortly after he moved into my apt complex about 9 months ago. He was always quiet and really polite and I admit I pursued him. Finally he accepted a dinner invitation and we had a great time. After that I insisted he reciprocate and at that point he told me that he wasnt looking for a relationship, that he had issues he was working on ... So I insisted we could just be friends.. I truly thought may e he needed one...and slowly the story came out...he had an advanced degree, worked for his dads company, had a marriage fall apart after his 2 yr old son died of cancer, reverted back to his college day friend - cocaine and ended up in rehab at o e point, then after a while slipped back and when confronted by his dad- chose to quit his job. To skip all the details he ended up broke, living to do drugs until he almost died. Somehow with no professional help he scraped up enough money to move to a different state and stop cold turkey... Which he said was bad. Jumping ahead...6 weeks clean he moves in across the way and we meet
So for a long time we were just friends and we had so much fun together and it was all great. He was always telling me he didn't sleep....and one night we fell asleep on the couch while watching a movie and he slept all night. That
was the first time I really felt like he needed me. If that makes sense. During this time he got a good job with this small company sort of 2 person office...and he was really happy. The guy he worked with really befriended him and they became good friends. Our friendship turned to more and everything was great ... And then after an argument at work ... He skipped out on dinner plans with me...ended up downtown...at a bar...went home with a skank and did drugs...brought the drugs home ...did more... And when I finally went to check on him the next morning... He was on the floor passed out barely breathing. He overdosed. I called for help, and waited at the hospital with his
friend from work and his wife (older couple) (so nice) and the dr comes out and tells us his heart stopped twice, and he is unconcious and they can't stabilize him. So that's when this friend calls NF's dad - who hadn't spoke to him in 1.5 hrs and had no idea where he was. His dad and stepmom fly out ...long story short... NF recovered although he still has some underlying heart issues now...and while his dad tried to get him into rehab, he refused. His dad also somehow got him kicked out of his apartment. I think it was because he first thought it wasn't good enough for him and second didn't want Jim going back to where he had done drugs. I really disliked his dad at first, but I can see now that he is trying to help him. There was a lot that happened between them in the past, and NF has got to work it out with his dad. NF is feeling very emotional, almost unstable. He's tried to push everyone away including me...he told me that he doesn't want this kind of life for me...that it's never going to end... That it's always going to be this way... And he can't be with anyone. I overheard him telling his dad something similar and his dad told him that it sounded like a really lonely life.... He is out of hospital now and staying in the guest suite at his friend from work...it's a big house. Right now NF parents are staying there too. He has agreed to go to private counseling in liu of rehab etc. I think this is really good - he's got issues unrelated to the drugs + the drug dependence. My friends that know all this...say to walk away. It's too crazy...I've never done drugs, and don't even drink unless it's a glass of wine at dinner. But I love him. And he is a good man. Before we got serious he made me go to a local support group meeting (even though he doesn't believe in support groups) because he wanted me to hear and see well, basically what I was getting into if he slipped up. But then it didn't seem real, he wasn't like those people, and he wasn't going to slip up...but now he has...

Ann

Kelley, I am sorry your are struggling with this, but just read your post again and see the red flags. He is an active addict who admittedly is not ready for a relationship. His own recovery is "his own" recovery, and neither you nor his father can do it for him. If love could save an addict, not one of us would be here. It has to come from them. It is futile to try to push, beg, threaten, bribe or insist them into recovery. Their recovery is not ours to own, but we may pay a big price for trying.

Sometimes it's good to look at the situation with clarity, then ask yourself if this is how you want to live your life? For a year? For 5 years? For 20 years?

The idea of finding a support group for you is a good idea. Al-anon, Nar-anon and CoDA are three similar fellowships that have helped many of us here find our balance again and learn to live healthier lives. Maybe give them a try, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Hugs

KelleyF

Thank you for your comments Ann.*

I sort of came looking for answers about him, but I'm realizing maybe I need to look more into finding answers about myself to really determine if my feelings for him are based more on my needing to "help" him, or "rescue" him instead of genuine love towards who he is; but having said that he is More than just a person who is " addicted"

There are a lot of sad co-dependent stories on here. Just like when I went to the family support group months ago.*

I know I really do need to be grounded in reality regarding his situation and what could happen to me if I don't get out now
But I'm sort of an eternal optimist so it's hard*

I went to pay my rent today; and the lady in the office said it had been paid up for the next six months. I thought it was a mistake but no, it was either NF's dad or his friend because she said it was "that man who's son od'd - and added such a shame - I think he died" * I didn't bother to correct her.

I want to call NF and ask; but maybe he doesn't even know about it. *I promised myself I would give Myself some distance from him and after reading More on here I think it's the right thing to do; but honestly I just want to talk to him.*

*

Ann

Kelley, each of our loved ones are more than "an addict", they are our sons, our brothers, our sisters and daughters, our friends and our spouses, they have names and they have feelings and a soul buried somewhere under the addiction.

Your friend is a person, worthy of love and respect, no matter what his choices.

Each one of us has to find our own "balance" with our addicted loved ones. For some, no contact is the only way that works, for others, contact but keeping a safe distance helps, some have regular contact meeting for coffee or a meal ...we each have to decide what is best for us. For me, my son has been lost in his addiction for many years now. Should he contact me tomorrow, I would proceed with caution because if he is still using, I cannot get drawn back into a situation that dragged me down with him years ago. If he is clean, I would need time to trust his sobriety enough to renew our relationship. I love my son dearly, but I cannot live in his addiction and my recovery at the same time.

So give thought and proceed with caution, whatever you choose to do. It is entirely up to you to find the path that is healthy for you, and whatever you choose we are walking with you here.

Hugs

outtolunch

He has baggage, a lot of baggage. He knows this and now you do too.
Assuming he's been clean and sober all along, an argument at work set him off on a deadly tail spin and will likely do so again.

What you know of him is what he has told you.

Sounds like maybe you need to be needed more than he needs a GF in his life, right now. He's likely years away from being able to cope with life as is without falling off the wagon. And if ( a big if) he's going to do it, he will do so himself for himself.

It's very challenging to be in a relationship with someone who has serious problems and not allow his lack of stability to undermine your own value. By this I mean, it often becomes a "if you cared about me enough, then you would just stop" sort of thing. In other words, it becomes personal.

TiredandSpent

Is it important to you that he needs you?

He says he doesn't want a relationship, can you respect that? If not, why not?

I wouldn't ask him about the rent, since you know it was his father who paid and they have issues. But I would call the father and say thank you. That was so nice of him.

I know how confusing it all is and how sad and desperate, but his IS just like all the others you've heard about and you are like many of us. It's a club none of us want to be in. Lots of hugs for you while you figure it out.

Kindeyes

There is nothing pretty about addiction. All of the stories are sad because it IS sad. Addiction is a very cunning and baffling disease.

My son is an addict. If he ever chooses recovery and advises a woman that he needs to concentrate on himself, I would pray that she would accept that and respect it.

There is nothing that will trip up an addict in early recovery faster than an unaware codependent. And there is nothing that will charm an unaware codependent like an active addict.

My son is much more than "just an addict". He is my son. He is loved. But in active addiction, he is someone I don't know very well. And I miss him.

Welcome to SR. There is a lot of great information in this forum. I hope you stick around and read, post, ask questions and learn about codependence and addiction. As much as the stories are different......they are also all the same. I have compassion for anyone who has a child, parent, brother, sister, wife or husband, SO, (etc) who is addicted. I have learned not to judge others. I don't know their story. Your friend's mother and father obviously love him. You don't know their side of the story relating to their sons addiction. They are suffering.

gentle hugs
ke

KelleyF

Thank you everyone for your replies, although I have to be honest - they have made me cry even more.

It probably sounds crazy to a lot of you that it's so difficult for me and why I can't just walk away - i know a lot of you are dealing with children and husbands and wives - and relationships that are much more rooted.

Looking back maybe I did make a mistake pursuing him, he was wise enough to understand that his problems are serious and he was kind and thoughtful enough to not want to bring an innocent person into the mix and maybe disappoint them or cause pain.

He asked me to go to one of those meetings - to show me reality of the situation - of what far reaching effects one persons drug use can have on others

I thought because he realized he had a problem, he had been to rehab in the past and learned skills to cope, because he detoxed himself, moved and distanced himself from "that" life - that he just needed time and he would be fine.

I never saw him using, I never saw drugs, he went to work everyday, he seemed happy, his behavior never seemed strange, it all seemed normal. I wasn't giving more to him than I was getting back.
The only thing I asked him was to promise to be honest with me -

I never understood and I still don't; what benefit there is to him or anyone suffering with addiction or recovery to be alone, or to distance themselves from family or friends. It has something to do with feeling out of control, or not being perfectly well or strong ... Not being able to make promises because he is afraid of the addiction... But why does he think that ... How long until that goes away? I don't want someone to take care of me all the time, and I don't want to take care of someone all the time, I just want a partnership
where you help each other... Does that make me codependent?

outtolunch

An argument triggered him- the bar, the skank and drugs and he could not stop till he passed out and nearly DOA. That's addiction and he's an addict doing what addicts do.

It's never going to go away.

I don't think a partnership is possible with someone in active addiction because addiction demands he protect and sustain it at all costs. I also don't think a partnership is possible with someone in early recovery which is often nothing more than a pause.

No such thing as helping someone through recovery because recovery is 100% an inside job. If loving and caring for someone was able to snap them out of addiction, none of us would be here. We are not that powerful.

bluebelle

You said that you want a partnership. He is an active addict and cannot offer you a partnership. He has told you that he can't be in a relationship, and I think you need to listen to him.

It's not the argument at work that made him use. It's not that you can do anything to protect him from using. He is an addict, and that is what he does.

As you have seen, moving away from addiction does not cure it.

As other people have noted, if love was enough to cure addiction, then our loved ones wouldn't be addicts. He is going to have to do all the work to become clean and it is not possible for you to make it easier for him.

You mentioned that you are not used to this because you haven't spent time with addicts/alcoholics. I have spent a lifetime with them. The lesson that I have learned the most is that you can't figure them out. You can't psychoanalyze them to find their problem and fix it.

Have you read Codependent No More? You are at the right website. I've been on here for awhile, and have really been helped by the information that I have read here. It has helped me gain some peace in my life.

ColetteTocca

This man has endured an absolutely catastrophic loss through the death of his toddler and then the disintegration of his marriage. Even if he is able to get a miraculous handle on sobriety, I see a long tough road ahead for him before he is able to really participate fully and equally in a healthy relationship.

TiredandSpent

You thought he was wise and kind and looking out for you. But he wasn't. He was giving you fair warning, he was setting up the disclaimer, he was showing you the fine print.

And he will forever be able to say, "You knew what you were getting yourself into. I TOLD you I didn't want a relationship, I TOLD you it would be bad. If I hurt you, it's your own fault. You knew and you signed up anyway."

If you continue with him, you will hear that.

He gave himself permission to mistreat you because he told you in advance.

If he REALLY was kind and thoughtful and wanted to spare you the pain, HE WOULD NOT HAVE STARTED A RELATIONSHIP WITH YOU AT ALL. He would have held you off, he would have kept you at arms length.

TiredandSpent

He's not alone. When he wants companionship, he finds it without any problem whatsoever. After all, how long did it take him to find that 'skank' at the bar to spend the evening with. (And that 'skank' could have been the child of any one of us here--she's no worse than he is; she is his equal, and as beloved by her family as he is by his, just something to think about--she didn't lead him astray with her wanton ways. He went looking for her.).

So he has people around when he wants them: his own type, people who understand and approve of him as he is, user, addict, liar, etc... People who don't make him feel ashamed. You won't often see these people in his life. But they are there, and there is an unlimited supply of them. Don't worry about him being alone.

The people he wants to isolate himself from are the non-users, the ones with their lives more or less in order, the ones who expect things of him such as honesty ("The only thing I asked him was to promise to be honest with me"), sobriety, reliability, responsible management of his emotions, whatever...

That would be people like you and his father. Or his boss. Or his ex-wife.

No, sadly it has something to do with being with his own kind, other users. Not having to explain himself, not having to feel ashamed of doing what he wants most to do in the world, not having keep up a facade of normalcy.

How do you know he's thinking that? Even if he's told you he wants to be alone because he's out of control or not perfectly well or afraid of the addiction, how do you know it's true and not just a sad, romantic tale that he's using to deflect blame from himself and elicit sympathy from you?

It lasts until he beats his addiction, and a long while afterwards after he rebuilds his life. A long, long time.

KelleyF

Hello everyone - thank you for your continued enlightenment. This site is somewhat painful to read but I'm starting to realize it's all info that I need to hear.
It will take some time to think about it all and get perspective
(something I should have done months ago)

There are some things I need to clarify though...

My boyfriend NF lost his 2 yr old to cancer 6 years ago
About a year after that he got divorced. They went to counseling over their son and their relationship at that time

NF had a sporadic use of drugs starting in college which he said was just occasional at parties etc
He moved to NY and had a high pressure job and he said on occasion he would use coke - he says at that time it wasn't a "problem"
He married, moved back home to CA went to work for his dad, and started a family. He said drugs were not part of his life then

He said when his son was ill and he was working -he started using again from the stress, the demands of his time etc
He said it became a regular use but to the outside world it was undetected. His work was fine, all his relationships were fine ( except for the divorce which he says was unrelated to his use)

But over time it got worse, and it's been about 3.5 years since he went to rehab

He said he was off drugs for over a year, and then the coke use started again
It got really bad, it affected his work, his family relationships, his dad finally gave him an ultimatum about work ...rehab or leave...so he left.
He didn't talk to his dad or any family again until he was in the hospital recently

You are all correct in what you said about his dad and step-mom - they have lived a nightmare. Seeing them at the hospital was unbearable. The look on his dads face when he walked out of the icu was something i will never forget
I talked to them some....they seem to verify everything NF had tod me about his past; except NF gave me more details - so I think he was honest

For everyone telling me I should have respected his telling me that he wasn't ready for a relationship and that i should have left the poor boy alone....
I see now that maybe you were right, he needed time to think and reflect
But having said that he became my best friend during the first few months and we talked and shared feelings, and he became someone I liked, respected, and ultimately fell in love with.

I was afraid in the beginning that being in a relationship would be too much pressure on him, and cause him stress that might trigger using- but he assured me that his wanting to avoid a commitment was really about his feeling like he wasn't stable in recovery and he couldn't make promises for a future. But to me the future cannot be promised by anyone; and I wasn't looking for a quick marriage proposal, or have a desire to start a family any time soon. Now the only thing I question is if I hadn't been there would he have focused more on his issues and his recovery - maybe my being there allowed him to ignore or supress negtive feelings ?

And now it's not just me he's pushing away....he offered to leave his job because he disappointed his friend/boss, he told his dad to give up on him and just let him go, and he told me that he knew he would hurt me and now he did and how sorry he was, and that I deserved better etc

But you guys are right in regard to the addiction ... He knows he can't stop it once it starts... He said to me that it wouldn't have mattered if we were married , if we had kids at home in their beds, he still would have cheated on me and did the drugs. And your right it is sad....

KelleyF

Your right about this....that's exactly what he's said to me !!

itsanewday2011

Hi Kelley, I wish I could share my whole story. All I can say is I know what it is like to fall in love with an addict that currently isn't using and think that "all will be okay". I can't tell you what the road ahead may lead to, and whether it will be a clean and sober life for him or a rocky one, but only you know the path that is best for you.

For me, I wish I would have listened to my inner voice in the beginning when I met my now ex husband. I didn't, and after 7 years of a rocky marriage, I am single again (and blessed with a beautiful 3 year old child) but will forever be intertwined with the history and use of my ex.

You sound very strong, and I am sure you will find the right path for you.

Hugs...

KelleyF

Your right - he went looking and he had no trouble finding what he wanted; this will sound dumb....but I wouldn't know where to find drugs if I wanted them...I'd most likely get arrested in the attempt.
So how did I end up in this situation ?
I understand why an active addict isolates, and although I haven't experienced it, hearing the stories, I know why family let's them go...they have no choice sometimes, but addicts at some point when they try to recover need people to give them a chance...a job, housing, family, friends if they don't have that how can they re-integrate into non drug patterns?

outtolunch

Everything is based on what he said. People rewrite their histories all the time and do so from their own perspective. You have no way of really knowing what happened because you were not there.

That he blames drug use on job stress is telling and a load of BS. All jobs are stressful. Imagine being a pilot with the responsibility for hundreds of passengers and mega $billion aircraft. Imagine what it must be like to be a police officer or fire fighter or a health care professional. What if they all chose drugs and skanks to cope with the stress?

Learning how to cope with life as is and do so without drugs will be a lifetime challenge for him. Withdrawing from life is not the same thing as coping with life.

It's very common for we codependents to fall in love with the hopeful fantasy of what could be, if only..... and somehow we are going to be the one that supports and sees them through to the other side. When you get right down to it, it reads like a cheesy romantic novel because it ignore the brutal reality of addiction.

bluebelle

He has had plenty of chances to get clean, but he has chosen to continue to use drugs.

When someone tells you that you deserve better, believe them. He has been honest with you that he would have used the drugs no matter what--family, kids, whatever. That tells you what it is like for a drug addict--their one true love is the drug. However, he is also giving himself an "out" for his behavior. He told you he would hurt you. He warned you not to have a relationship with him. So, he has taken the responsibility of his actions off of himself and onto the drugs and you.

All of this--using the drugs, going to the bar, picking up the woman--was all his choice. Nobody forced him to do any of those things.

I've heard this same kind of talk from my addicted step-daughter. It is a lot of excuses. He hasn't chosen to take responsibility for himself, so how can you take responsibility for him? I know you are upset by his behavior. He continues to hurt himself and those around him.

TiredandSpent

It's not your job to integrate them into non-drug patterns, it's their job. THEY find the job that doesn't care or check if they have or had abuse problems, the job tha doesn't care about spotty work history, or arrests. Such jobs exist (IHOP is famous for hiring convicts as cooks). Of course these jobs are usually not well paying or glamorous, but they are a 'chance'.

Most apartments can be rented without anyone inquiring about history provided you have the deposit and pay rent on time. If they are in the shabbier parts of town, so be it. It's a chance.

Friends are easy to find, most alanon, naranon, and other recovery support groups will supply a person with all the friends they need.

Families are almost always amenable to reunion once they see their loved one is employed, sober, stable, housed, reliable, remorseful and willing to make amends. Of course, to get the chance at reuniting with his family, the addict should have demonstrated by performance that the chance given him/her is safe.

Its not your responsibility to rehabilitate your boyfriend. It's HIS. He has to find his chances, make his opportunities. He will benefit most from doing it himself, he'll be most proud of himself if he does it himself, he'll be most likely to value his recovery if he does it himself.

Be careful about stealing that from him to make yourself feel useful and worthy. You both lose when that happens.