hope213

kelly, welcome to S.R. we r here to share our stories with you & let u know that recovery is a hard battle for the addict. some never get clean. my son is my addict & he is a very hard working,good man when he is clean.he has been on drugs since he was 21& drinking heavy since 17. he can not seem to want to stop bad enough. you can go to meetings & hear stories face to face of other addicts. get into recovery for you. you can not get him clean. he has to do it. you can not love him clean. we would not be here if that worked. keep coming back & let us know how u r. prayers,

KelleyF

Hi everyone - thank you for being here. I realized that I really dont have anyone I can talk to about my ...alright I will say it ABF. I dont really have family, and my friends while sympathetic seem to all agree I should walk away.

I spent time with him today and with his dad/stepmom....I cant talk about it now Im just too spent. I wont sleep if I think about it anymore.

But I need to ask some questions if that is ok.

Someone said an "unaware codependant" was the worst for an addict. Ive been reading the stickies on being a co-dependant ....but what does the "unaware" mean?

Someone said and I now totally agree - that when he first told me that he wasnt ready for a relationship....and that he would hurt me....and made me go to that meeting...it was all really to have a disclaimer saying - I warned you, I told you what to expect and its not my fault . You have to take the responsibility.

Well that sounds totally like him because in his work that is what he does...maybe I shouldnt say it on here ...but he is an attorney. He makes deals, he writes contracts, he knows how to manipulate, debate, and make you think it was all your idea.

But what I want to know is do you think that he did this on purpose? That he doesnt really care if he hurts me, as long as he has an out - its ok?
That doesnt seem like him. And I want to talk to him about it, but should I?

And for now my last question - everyone tells me he is an active addict. But see I think of him as a recovering addict. I have a pretty good picture of where he was at in the addiction before he walked away from that life & moved states & detoxed alone & put himself into seclusion for 6 weeks.....All before he moved into my apartment complex.... And I still think he was clean all the months we were together 8+ months. So to me its a relapse...a bad once since he almost died, but still....dont those 8+ months count ?
cant he just pick up and carry on being an inactive addict and in recovery?

Im trying to learn ....its all very complicated.

Much love and thanks to you all

lesliej

dear Kelley
of course it is okay to ask questions, and I understand your questions...why you are asking them. I think that you will get varying answers, re: don't the 8 months count? if people took the time to discuss their "answer" you would find a lot of differing responses.

I guess what I want to say is that asking questions about addiction can become a full time job...a long long road...an endless source of new questions, hairline differences between words, one view and then an opposite view.

I was in the middle of writing a thesis the first time my exABF relapsed. I was so in love I was battleaxe side swiped. My community took turns calling me, talking me through the pain and question of the moment and begging me to stay on task and keep my thesis that I had worked so hard for.

I was so so fortunate to have that circle that circled the wagons and protected me from the insanity of confusion that was about to destroy my graduate work.

I always say I could have written two thesis at the time. And I do have a collection of hundreds of pages that I have written.

There is not any right answer.
You will only find peace when you finally let go of the questions.
I am still asking them...I understand, just saying...

Hanna

It is such a blessing that you were there and that you found him and got him to the hospital.

I think if you truly care about this man, you will take about 3 steps back now. You met him when he was 6 weeks clean, and that was just 9 months ago. He repeatedly told you he wasn't ready for a relationship, that he needed to work on himself and his life. You ignored that and convinced yourself he needed you. After nearly dying he again asked you to back off, and you seem to be convincing yourself that he's saying that out of care and concern for you, rather than his very real need to focus on himself and try to get better.

What everyone here is telling you is true true true, but what is also true is that you have ignored his wishes from day one and continue to try and make his situation about you and it just isn't. Your need and desire for a romantic relationship just can't come ahead of someone else's life threatening addiction.

Al-Anon or Nar-Anon meetings will help you grasp things better, but meanwhile please consider giving this man you say you love room and space to breathe and believe him when he says he is not equipped at this moment in his life to be in a relationship. When he says it, he means it; it's not some kind of secret code.

Again, it's a blessing you were there to find him.

outtolunch

That's a battle cry for we codependents. So many of us rationalize it's our obligation to put someone with such intentions on emotional and financial life support. We rationalize it is our duty to support them.

Having read thousands of back stories from addicts on these forums, the overwhelming majority who got and stayed clean did so without the benefit of rehab and doting supporters. The common thread of it all struck me as a life and death matter and the addict chose life and changed their life.

Recovery is an inside job and this includes recovery from codependency which is ego, a belief in our own fantasies that we are powerful enough to fix other people so that they become who we need/want.

KelleyF

I have been staying clear of my ABF since he left the hospital. His dad and stepmom have been here and it was best for them to have this time with him.

Yesterday I came home from work and he was at my apartment; he has a key and before all this he was at my place more than his anyway. But still is surprised me given all thats happened.

I really didnt know how to react to him being here because last time I saw him in the hospital; he was very emotional and pushing me away.

But yesterday he wasnt like that. He said he was feeling better; that he missed me, was worried about me, realized that we had missed our planned Christmas (because he was unconscious in the hospital) and wanted to know if we could still have it. Realized we had missed our planned New Years etc....all the gooey push my buttons stuff basically.

and then I guess he could sense a change in me (because of all my confusion, because of all the new thoughts running through my head based on what Ive learned here at SR about addiction and recovery) and he took it that I was "mad at him" and/or that I "didnt believe in him anymore"

And when I tried to explain I just got upset and cried and told him I was just afraid. of course, he insisted it was going to be fine, that he was going to fix things and I just needed to trust him.

The good news: he does seem to realize he needs some additional help. Professional help. I just dont know at this point if he has decided these things on his own, or based on his dads influence. ...And that worries me because most of you say another person cannot coax an addict into treatment or it wont be successful.

But regardless, he says that he is going to live at his boss/friends for the next few months. They have a large house and a guest suite that is basically like its own apartment with kitchen and its own entrance.
I think the idea is to give him some stability because its not a money issue, etc.
....but then again this means people are helping him, and so many of you say no, you cant help ...


He also has scheduled an appointment with a therapist/psychologist for tomorrow!

He asked me if I would go with him; not in to see the dr, but just with him to the office. I said I would even though I have to leave work early to do it.
Probably Im going to be told I should have told him no, he needs to walk in there alone; and I shouldnt change my schedule for him.... but regardless Im doing it.

This is something that he talked about for months, but was unwilling to do. He says he realizes that he was triggered and that when he had the split second to handle his feelings with or without drugs ..... he chose the drugs and once he made that decision it was done. So he says he wants help with that.
He is sticking to his story that he has been clean all these months and it was a one-time binge, based on being triggered by an argument with his boss/friend (whom is sort of like his dad) and thoughts he had been having towards his dad lately due to the holidays.

I know there is more that he needs help with, but if that is what he see's and that will get him into treatment - its ok I think; maybe the rest will surface.

There are two other things that he said his dad asked him to do; but he seemed resistant and I dont know if he will do them.

One is to agree to regular drug testing for the next 3 months
and the other is to sign a medical power of attorney giving his dad and his friend joint responsibility for the next 3 months.

I can understand the drug testing...and I already know that his not wanting to do this is probably a red flag that he thinks he will use and will get caught up by the test. But he said he just cant stand the thought of submitting to it

and the other part about the medical power of attorney basically treats him like he is a minor child or one mentally incapable of making decisions .

any thoughts?

also, today he was going to see the cardiologist; Im just praying he didnt do permanent damage to his heart.

KelleyF

I have a question don't know if anyone will know. My ABF told the dr at the hospital that he bought a gram for his "party" But he couldn't remember how much he took. I know HE didn't use all of it,And maybe it all didnt go home with him, but what was brought home and was found after he passed out was just specks of white .. So it was all gone.

Like I said before I know nothing about drugs but I was told this was an extreme amount for one night.

I was also told that If someone had used for a long time the level they took could be quite high, but then if they were off it and tried to use the same amount- most likely their body wouldn't be able to handle the amount and probably that is why he OD.

Does that support his statement that he hadn't used in months?

KelleyF

Well when you put it like that....

Heartbroken0608

Do you find it odd that he's going to live with the boss/friend who he claims triggered this relapse? Guess it doesn't matter much but I thought that was interesting.

KelleyF

I didn't really think about it like that. They have always got along really well; I'd been to their house several times myself. But apparently, my ABF and him had a problem over something at work - that the friend said he felt guilty about because he over-reacted; it was not related to ABF personal behavior, it was over a client situation.
But yeah it's an odd relationship; he is older and in the same line of work as ABF dad, and he knows his situation, has had some of his own problems with drugs like 20-25 yrs ago I think; so he is kinda like a mentor.

When my ABF woke up in the hospital - was fully coherent; it was this friend that calmed him down and answered all his questions because he DID NOT want to see any of us.

KelleyF

So this is how sad I am..... I had to refer to my notes ....I have notes on my boyfriends addiction.

It wasnt a gram - it was an ounce.

Apparently someone said a person usually only uses about a gram; I told you I know nothing about drugs. I don't even know how it's measured.

I think I'm starting to drive myself insane
I think I could be an unaware codependent

Who keeps notes on their boyfriends drug use- and try's to determine if "that" quantity was a lot !!!!!

lesliej

if it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck...
dear, I think you are now quite aware that you are a codependent...you did the wee checklist right? welcome to the club...now, what direction do you want to go?

that direction will be determined by who you focus on. your focus is pretty much entirely on him right now, you are hooked, lined and sinkered
and the way he showed up in your apartment and started to push gooey buttons and make promises, while instantaneously resisting parameters...well, there you have it

my diagnosis? full blown addict/codependent relationship
this is not a judgement. as an addict or as a codependent this is just "what we do"

so now it's going to be whether or not you start focusing on yourself. I had a circle of people around me, constantly reminding me to refocus. I mean it! it takes a lot of self education, it takes support and caring community, and you are going to need it.

but the good news is this!! in the process you will become more self aware! you will grow! you will become more spiritually fit! your heart will expand! YES these are amazing promises! and these promises come true THEY DO with or without the addict doing a thing!!! it is all up to you! growth, love, spirit, community, awareness, peace, serenity!

and all it takes is the first step into awareness, and I think you're about to make it...
are you really an "unaware codependent" or are you a "codependent"?

peace, healing, prayers to you. to YOU!

tjp613

My addict-son brought me to SR so I have experienced addiction from that point of view. But I have often wondered ...how and when IS it appropriate for a recovering addict to begin a relationship again?? Are they to be considered tainted goods forever and ever? And if they are honest about their drug use, whenever it had occurred, does this always mean they are deflecting responsibility if the relationship fails?

KelleyF

I can tell you what I feel; at this point.

When I met him and he told me about his past; parts of it stuck to me and made me feel sympathetic towards him; like his chid having cancer and dying. How could that not? In a way although I know it was wrong I let him off the hook for his decision to use drugs to deal with all that. I felt like his dependence on drugs became sort of like a snowball effect that he didn't plan on; admittedly I still feel that way.
Everyone says addicts spruce u their past and make it sound better; if he did this - then it Really makes me fear for the memories he must have; because he made his existence for a while sound horrible with no good points

But he told me his version - it was enough to give me fair warning; a disclaimer - I can never say I didn't know the risks to me personally; whatever comes next
But I don't think of him as damaged goods - we are all damaged in some way. He is still responsible for HIS actions towards me.
What I'm grasping with is how he figures all this in his mind. Does he think he now had a lesser responsibility because he can blame it on his past, his issues of recovery, or cheating is ok because he was triggered and she got drugs for him and he couldn't help himself ?

lesliej

you will never really know someone else's truth entirely
and if you want to know the twists and turns and smoke and mirrors of an addicts truth...well, good luck
you will probably NEVER know. (that was one of the hardest things I ever heard and now I get it)
you will only know what he tells you...do you want to continue hearing what he has told you so far
take everything at face value...the behaviors

like Anvil said...look at what JUST happened. that is the truth of this moment
not what is buried in his head or heart. not what he says.
look at what just HAPPENED that is the truth

lesliej

maybe you need to focus on YOUR TRUTH

KelleyF

Anvilhead,

Is an ounce a lot?

KelleyF

Leslie,

Oh yes I looked at the checklist and a lot of it applied to me.
Ive been reviewing my actions and my feelings since this happened & my focus has been on him...if it wasnt for this SR site all my focus would still be on him with NO thought of myself. Im not fully there yet - as you guys can see from all my questions and thoughts and worries that I keep posting . Probably having you guys wanting to bop me in the head !!! But in my head now is more of a big picture of this situation and I just need time to process it.
Thank you for your help; I really do appreciate it.

KelleyF

When all this happened; my ABF being in the hospital and his health just became my focus. Obviously until he told HIS version of what happened, I had no idea there was a woman involved. He told me HIS version in private - and refered back to the "I told you I would hurt you" It had nothing to do with her, it was just the drugs....Im sorry....and just walk away because you dont need to be with me". etc.

How do I feel? The thought of it makes me sick. I feel betrayed. I feel hurt,
I feel angry, I feel sad, I feel scared, I feel confused. I feel like he is part of a whole world that I know nothing about, one that is dangerous and dark and illegal, and for some reason smelly too ! Its not ok

I feel like if the drugs were not involved I would have taken back my apartment key, I would have told him goodbye ....but also knowing me and my tendancy for forgiveness....I feel that I would have eventually given him another chance, but not until he spent weeks begging and pleading and proving his love.

But with my ABF Im really pushing all those feelings aside and saying HE wasnt in his right mind and HE didnt mean to do it and SHE enticed him and HE regrets it and I can feel HIS sincerity and everything was great before this....just let it go and forgive him.

and with that twisted sentiment.....I will be escorting him to his first appoitnment with the psychologist / therapist today.

And I have to say...I keep thinking about this quote by anvilhead:

i fail to see why a grown man who was able to get himself to the bar and find a female connection with a lotta cocaine suddenly needs an escort to go to the DOCTOR???

This I am going to be thinking about while I am sitting there in the waiting room.

lesliej

if you can feel his sincerity than why are you not listening to him say "walk away"?

telling a full fledged codependent to "walk away" ends up just being a trigger of temptation to stay...and its working because you're "escorting" him a week after the "skank"

as they say in meetings...keep coming back, we'll be here.