bamboo38

Hi guys, I feel like I pretty much know the answer to this, but I will post for my own sanity. I posted here for the first time in September, about my engagement and the on-again, off-again, etc. roller coaster ride since I met this man. His drug is crack, and while he attends meetings regularly, talks the talk, reads the books, listens to the CDs, and has been trying to stay clean for more than two decades, in the two years I've known him there have been at least a dozen uses, probably more. We got engaged during a "good phase." When the good times are good, there are none better. No one is better. He can be loving and kind and sweet and funny and smart. And yes, I'm in therapy. But anyway.

In recent weeks it has been upsetting. We argue a lot, mostly when it comes down to trust, because I am trying to build that but when things seem sketchy I feel like I will never know the definitive truth. We don't live together, and several times we have had arguments and then he "teaches me a lesson" by not communicating for a day or two. I assume he is using during that time, but when he surfaces he assures me it was all part of an unsuccessful plan to send a message. And so it goes. Did I say I was in therapy?

I thought I was totally done with him this past week. I also go to al-anon meetings, and this was maybe my 6th or 7th this week, and I was feeling strong. But after a couple days of not speaking -- one where he was off the grid, and a couple after that that I told him I didn't want any part of this anymore -- he emerged again, remorseful, promising change, calling a new doctor, begging for another chance, and SWEARING there was no crack use.

I let him come over last night, and I handed him a urine test I bought from CVS. In the past he has said he would welcome the chance to prove himself, so when I whipped this baby out, he jumped at the chance. Bring it! And he took it, and in 5 minutes it came up positive for cocaine.

He was incredulous, said it was completely wrong, there was no POSSIBLE way. NO WAY. I didn't want to over-react, innocent until proven guilty and all that, and let some more time pass. Then he said, oh wait, he remembered a long time ago, while living in a sober house, he came up positive after taking a workout supplement. He takes something now called Jack3D and is insisting that this is what caused the false positive on the "****** CVS plastic test."

The test comes with a secondary lab option, so I am shipping it today.

So what's my question today? Any advice for how to handle the results? The "******" test was PLAIN AS DAY, no wiggle room or unclear lines. I've seen my share of iffy pregnancy tests, this was bold and definitive. So it's in the mail, but, jeez. Maybe it will come through the secondary test as negative? Jeez.

Thanks for letting me vent. I know you guys don't have the ultimate answer, but maybe someone has experienced this particular flavor of crazy.

FT

This is how you want to live the next 50 years?

outtolunch

Well lets see now....heroin/pain pill addicts usually claim it must have been the poppy seed bagel they ate that morning that tiggered the false positive. In other words, denial of the resutls is a text book addict response.

Sounds like he has been faking recovery for a long, long time. That's his problem to solve or not.

Can you accept him as is/where is- periodic MIA and all ? If not, do you want to spend the rest of your life wishing and hoping he will change and all that?

You did not cause this.
You cannot control this.
You cannot cure this.

MsPINKAcres

Oh my dear - I hate you are in the middle of this much pain and sorrow - I can only imagine how heartbreaking this must be for you ~

This would be my suggestion for you - Imagine that this situation is your daughter, mother, sister or very dearest girlfriend ~ take away the what if's, the could be's or the might be's

Look at the cold hard facts -

is this what type of life, relationship and future you would want for your daughter?
Your mother, Your very best girlfriend?

if so then you know you answer -

BUT if not - then my friend - why don't YOU deserve something better also.

PINK HUGS & thoughts & prayers for guidance, courage and wisdom for you,
Rita

Hanna

If it turned out to be true that it was caused by a supplement would that solve the underlying issues for you?

I've never really lived with a boyfriend before, but I let my last one come and stay in my home. I am so grateful that I did, because if I had not he could easily have concealed his drug and alcohol problems. I also might not have really grasped the absolute chaos it could bring to my daily life. Within 3 weeks I was a basket case - never comfortable in my own home, not sleeping through the night out of constant worry and always wondering what was going to happen next.

Have you tried imagining what it would be like to live with him and share finances? With him going off the rails 12 times every 2 years? If you've been reading around the forum you probably already have a good idea

Hugs and Prayers. Glad you are here and I hope you keep posting.

outtolunch

I just read the back story here.....crack and a lifetime of weed and alcohol abuse.....This guy is not remotely into recovery. Take the past and multiply by ten for what you don't know and that's the reality of his addiction, a progressive condition.

bamboo38

I so appreciate all of this. I need to hear it, and read it over and over and over. Keep 'em coming. ;o)

The answer of course is that no, I don't want to live this way. I don't see spending the rest of my life this way. I'm still learning a lesson, for whatever reason.

It is very much an addiction of my own, I guess.

lesliej

I swear your story is SO completely familiar that it is downright EERIE!!

The difference is that I did live with my ex ABF.
One of the last times he used we were fighting horribly in the mid-morning because I had locked him out the night before. (which was how I had handled him staying our & using a couple of times...no coming home at 2 in the morning on crack). We were fighting so badly that I had my sponsor come over.

I had already told him that I wouldn't go a step farther with him without a test.
She just happened to have one!!! (She had them because her daughter has her own struggles.) My sponsor is also a professional CD counselor for twenty years!! (She and I are both in recovery.) He continued to lie right up to and after his "drug test" and insisted it be "mailed in".

What my sponsor told me is that the denial gets so insane that addicts even lie to themselves about their use. The stress of facing the reality and consequences...whatever the reason...they just keep lying! To parents, children, spouses, drug counselors...

the truth MAY start to emerge after immersion in recovery. I don't know if I will ever be able to really believe my ex again, which is why I'm not even saying that if he gets a year clean maybe we can try again...I just don't know if I will be able or willing...

living with deceit and lies is crazy making. I fully understand all of the beautiful qualities of the people we love...but when the active addict is in the mix it produces a crazy splitted-ness that can become highly contagious. I do not want to be crazy in my love relationship. I can't control the use that contributes to the crazy making, so even though I love the man I had to detach from the addict. He needs to go focus on himself for the long road and hard work ahead...

seriously, if you read my posts it is crazy...twenty years of struggle, two years with me in and out in and out at least 12 times...

lesliej

my ex ABF hob nobs with the figure heads of the recovery community (in Minnesota of all places!!!) he can quote the book and the page number.
he uses "principles of al anon" (his interpretation) to blame me.
He could seriously lead a treatment center and is a paper away from a masters in psych.

all of the lingo and recovery speak make it even more manipulative...his denial is THICK

bamboo38

Yup, yup, yup! There's no verbal argument I can "win." And while he was so supportive of my starting al-anon, now it becomes a weapon when I ask about his work -- he throws it back upon me, that I am the one who needs the work. (Yes, I need work, but it's a convenient diversion.)

I'm sorry you've been through this too. CRAZY MAKING IS RIGHT!!

Hanna

I noticed you are also tied up with the argument/debate. I was to for a bit. My short-lived BF was totally floored when I stopped trying to debate the issue with him and just kept repeating, "It's over. Blame me if you like, I don't really care." So was I, actually. It's like I'd just realized that I didn't need anyone's permission to end something that was rapidly destroying my sanity.

He kept telling me that I didn't know how to be loved and was just making up excuses because I didn't want to be in a relationship. For a little while, I felt I needed him to understand. Then I just gave up and said, "You know what, I am a grown woman and I don't need an excuse to end a relationship that I don't want to be in." I'd had it and no longer cared if he saw what he was doing to himself or not.

lesliej

Yes Hanna,
Still letting go of the last threads of attachment.
Just yesterday I received a list of the Al Anon promises, which he said were some of the "loveliest aspirations of recovery". I agree that they are. I also feel like somehow he wants to inform me of how I am not working a perfect al anon program.

This is because in his active addiction he always twists things around to deflect/project/blame/excuse/deceive/manipulate...

I will never be perfect so he will always have something to use!!!

I could go completely no contact, and will.
up to this point it has been almost no contact, and the little that comes through...a couple of emails, just seems to confirm my decision...in a kind of gentle and hopeful way...I would like to know some of his reflections and that he is on the way to "recovery" again.

It feels good to be letting go...almost absolutely.
I will always have been in relationship with this beautiful man that I wanted to marry.
I get to decide how I want to let it go, and it is with love and compassion...but it IS letting go. And letting go feels great.

It has been five weeks and the freedom wells up within me where the grief has been cleansing and making space. what a process...the future looks good...so less painful...so much less an insane struggle.

Thlayli

Instant screens are iffy. We use them in my office pretty much daily AND we have to watch them give the sample. If we have questions we send the samples to the lab. Just recently I had a client whose instant read clearly showed us that he had been using oxys again. He swore he hadn't. The lab confirmed that the sample was indeed clean (the instant cup was wrong). I've also seen the instant cups say clean and the lab results say otherwise.

That said...it's not your responsibilty to monitor him. Someone mentioned the 3 Cs. I wouldn't "handle" the results because I (hope I) would not know any results. That's an attempt to control on some level, which you can't do.

Even with lab tests and repeated confirmations addicts will try and try to give excuses why the tests are wrong. It's the nature of the beast (addiction). We always hear "I can't believe it's dirty. I haven't used in over (a month, 2 months, a year, etc)!"

dollydo

Liar, Liar, pants on fire!

What kind of life do you want for yourself...one with an a man that will be an addict all his life...as, there is no cure for this disease. He has been using for a LONG time, his chance of recovering for life are less than 10%, to me this is quite a committment on your part.

It is your life, do what is best for you.

Impurrfect

(((bamboo))) - I finally called it quits with XABF#3 when I realized that EVEN if he had 3 years clean (from crack, which was both our DOC's), I would still not trust him. So what, if he's clean today - what about tomorrow? Am I going to come home and find everything I own sold/traded for crack? I'm in recovery from crack - going on 5 years. I made a lifestyle change, I built up the trust of the people I love, and I LOVE being in recovery.

My ex? He died in a crack house because smoking crack was more important than going to the dr. for pneumonia. It could have been me, but it wasn't.

I'm not saying "never trust a crackhead" because I was one, and I've worked hard at rebuilding trust. Will I ever trust another RA? I honestly don't know, even though I AM one. It would take YEARS of recovery, and solid actions. I never saw that with my ex, so maybe I'm jaded.

Working every day, paying bills, and getting through rough times without using mean a lot to me. I just don't see that you are getting that out of your relationship.

Hugs and prayers,

Amy

bamboo38

Wow. Thanks everyone for your input, and I'm sorry so many of you are so familiar with the drill. Also, I appreciate that your responses were so candid and not sugar-coated. That's exactly what I needed.

At some point during the day, maybe when the reality of the more sensitive drug test hit, because it couldn't have just been guilt... he told me he had used on Saturday night and Sunday. After all that... I mean, I knew, and you all knew... but I needed him to say it.

I ended it. I want it to stick this time. I need it to stick. I am going to read these posts over and over and over. I want it to stick this time.

Thank you, all.

lesliej

it's been five weeks for me...I have been moving through the grieving process...and sorting away the shame. it feels cleaner and more free everyday. I haven't cried over him in awhile, finished crying over shame too.

it helps to know he is in a safe place for now, SLE for as long as he stays in recovery or hides using, one or the other, it's his life. I hope for him.
I live for me. I am glad I started the process before all the massive holiday triggers.

I was really terrified to go into the grief.
it's been okay. love the support here, very very helpful
reading about others experiences is like a window into my own life, without the personal heartache of the situation it is so much easier to see, to know what I need, want to do.

I hope the best for you, will be here as you move through whatever you decide.
My favorite line here so far: "If you can't say no then yes is meaningless." I think it was so powerful because I had wanted to say "I Do." that "yes" was becoming very meaningless in the face of deceit.

Peace & Freedom of Spirit to You

lesliej

posted twice, whoops

phillyds

I have posted two threads about something very familiar. My ABF did live with me and left for days. He would do it after an argument about his drug use or when I just knew that something was wrong with our relationship. One time he did say that he left because he wanted me to miss him and change MY behavior. That made me angry because I was not the one who was wrong and needed to be taught a lesson. That brings me to your post. Why is he teaching you a lesson? What do you feel you are doing so wrong that he needs to punish you by not having contact? He has done things that are wrong to you but how much do you punish him? I used to ask myself that. How can you hurt me so badly but stay away for days (which turned into weeks) and not miss me but I can't "breathe" without you?

Ultimately, he is using drugs and seeing another woman. Not saying that yours is but when I searched for the answers I never thought about which answer I would accept. What would I be comfortable with. If I found out that the problem was not drugs but another woman would I feel better? If I found out it was drugs and not another woman would I feel better? He disappears for days and you have a suspicion that something is wrong. What I learned is that it does not matter what the answer is, it still hurts either way and I am forced to decide whether to accept it or not. There has been no contact for 10 days, he called 2 days but I did not answer. I feel weak and lonely and it is not getting better by the day but trust me I can trade this in for not being lonely, some good times then the crap all over again or keep moving and realize that he is who he is, it hurts me and is not worth losing my sanity.

Keep reading. I am not positive that I will never fall again. I take it day by day and remind myself why I had to end it after all of these years. Accepting him back lets him know that I will accept his drug use, disappearing, and other women.

JoySeeker

My ex said everything in the book. I even caught him shooting heroin (last straw and left never looking back) and he'd STILL deny he was using.

It's what they do.