still stuck
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 3,335
i guess i am afraid.
Without fear there can be no courage. ~Gandolf
The only thing we have to fear is fear itself. ~Winston Churchill
You, my friend, are a victim of disorganized thinking. You are under the unfortunate impression that just because you run away you have no courage; you're confusing courage with wisdom. ~ The wizard of oz to the cowardly lion
Nothing in life is to be feared. It is only to be understood. ~Marie Curie
To fear is one thing. To let fear grab you by the tail and swing you around is another. ~Katherine Paterson, Jacob Have I Loved
Who is more foolish, the child afraid of the dark or the man afraid of the light? ~Maurice Freehill
Those who fear life are already three parts dead. ~Bertrand Russell
Anything I've ever done that ultimately was worthwhile... initially scared me to death. ~Betty Bender
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i think there is something to all of this. and many people here have said i am addicted to her and perhaps i see it a little now.
i've been looking thru my past and tryingto see patterns. while i have no pattern of dating toxic people, i do see a pattern beyond that.
i mentioned about smoking pot in my past. that was my doc. what i realize is that between relationships i smoke weed and focus energy on collecting. then when i get in a relationship, i jsut stop smoking witout a problem. then back to smoking a month or so after the relationship ends. i was smoking last year before allthis began. and once i knew she was out on the streets missing, i stopped- overnight. all my energy went ot finding her. the part year i didnt smoke. now i dont have her adn i am not going to smoke so i am dealing with having nothing to grasp for the first time in a long time. i am trying to not let collecting distract me either, as that becomes a substitute. i am glad i realize that.
part of what made me see this is that my alo said she has smoked pot again to help curb what she is going through geting off the heroin and on the methadone. i cant say that i agree with it, but if it works and she doesnt stay on it than thats fine. hopefully she wont make that a new doc.
i am trying to see if she became a doc for me
i've been looking thru my past and tryingto see patterns. while i have no pattern of dating toxic people, i do see a pattern beyond that.
i mentioned about smoking pot in my past. that was my doc. what i realize is that between relationships i smoke weed and focus energy on collecting. then when i get in a relationship, i jsut stop smoking witout a problem. then back to smoking a month or so after the relationship ends. i was smoking last year before allthis began. and once i knew she was out on the streets missing, i stopped- overnight. all my energy went ot finding her. the part year i didnt smoke. now i dont have her adn i am not going to smoke so i am dealing with having nothing to grasp for the first time in a long time. i am trying to not let collecting distract me either, as that becomes a substitute. i am glad i realize that.
part of what made me see this is that my alo said she has smoked pot again to help curb what she is going through geting off the heroin and on the methadone. i cant say that i agree with it, but if it works and she doesnt stay on it than thats fine. hopefully she wont make that a new doc.
i am trying to see if she became a doc for me
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 774
honestly no. i know it might seem obvious to others, but for me it is confusing because i have had a relationship with her and really care for her, but i canot yet see the line between love the i feel for her or something that is working ona different level in me
i am also dealing with the enabling i did. i don't know if it was right or wrong to try help her her from doing what she was doing. all during it, she would say how grateful she was for me trying to help, but now i wonder if she will end up resenting that like others have said.
i am also dealing with the enabling i did. i don't know if it was right or wrong to try help her her from doing what she was doing. all during it, she would say how grateful she was for me trying to help, but now i wonder if she will end up resenting that like others have said.
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* Anxiety---------------check
* Restlessness
* Irritability
* Insomnia
* Headaches
* Poor concentration
* Depression-----------check
* Social isolation-------check
Physical Withdrawal Symptoms
* Sweating
* Racing heart
* Palpitations
* Muscle tension
* Tightness in the chest
* Difficulty breathing
* Tremor
* Nausea, vomiting, or diarrhea
* Restlessness
* Irritability
* Insomnia
* Headaches
* Poor concentration
* Depression-----------check
* Social isolation-------check
Physical Withdrawal Symptoms
* Sweating
* Racing heart
* Palpitations
* Muscle tension
* Tightness in the chest
* Difficulty breathing
* Tremor
* Nausea, vomiting, or diarrhea
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,307
Anvil posted this for me in one of my threads and I am re-posting:
The Case of Obsessive Relational Progression
So how do you know if you have developed an unhealthy attachment to another person? By examining the Obsessive Love Wheel (OLW), which is designed to illustrate an overall process called Obsessive Relational Progression (ORP) [the specific attachment style of people Who Confuse Love with Obsession] it may be possible to recognize if you have a problem. There are four phases of ORP and each one carries unique behaviors. As demonstrated through the wheel, once an unhealthy attachment to another starts, the person who Confuses Love with Obsession begins to lose emotional control.
It is called a "wheel" because it is always turning, round and round as the relationship continues. Sometimes the wheel turns quickly, other times slowly, but it is always turning and always painful. While examining the wheel, look for any patterns of behavior in your relationship(s) and ask yourself: "Do either I or the person I am involved with behave this way?"
OBSESSIVE LOVE WHEEL
OBSESSIVE LOVE WHEEL ©
As Part of Obsessive Relational Progression
PHASE ONE THE ATTRACTION PHASE:
The initial phase of ORP is characterized by an instantaneous and overwhelming attraction to another person. It is at this point the relationally dependent person becomes "hooked" on a romantic interest, usually resulting from the slightest bit of attention from the person they are attracted to. Phase One ORP behaviors can include:
• An instant attraction to romantic interest, usually occurring within the first few minutes of meeting.
• An immediate urge to rush into a relationship regardless of compatibility.
• Becoming "hooked on the look" of another, focusing on the person's physical characteristics while ignoring personality differences.
• Unrealistic fantasies about a relationship with a love interest, assigning "magical" qualities to an object of affection.
• The beginnings of obsessive, controlling behaviors begin to manifest.
PHASE TWO THE ANXIOUS PHASE:
This phase in considered a relational turning point, which usually occurs after a commitment has been made between both parties. Sometimes however, the relationally dependent person will enter into this phase without the presence of a commitment. This happens when the afflicted person creates the illusion of intimacy, regardless of the other person's true feelings. The second phase of ORP behaviors can include:
• Unfounded thoughts of infidelity on the part of a partner and demanding accountability for normal daily activities.
• An overwhelming fear of abandonment, including baseless thoughts of a partner walking out on the relationship in favor of another person.
• The need to constantly be in contact with a love interest via phone, email or in person.
• Strong feelings of mistrust begin to emerge, causing depression, resentment and relational tension.
• The continuation and escalation of obsessive, controlling behaviors.
PHASE THREE THE OBSESSIVE PHASE:
This particular phase represents the rapid escalation of this unhealthy attachment style. It is at this point that obsessive, controlling behaviors reach critical mass, ultimately overwhelming the RD person's life. It is also at this point that the person being controlled begins to pull back and ultimately, severs the relationship. In short, Phase Three is characterized by a total loss of control on the part of the RD person, resulting from extreme anxiety. Usually, the following characteristics are apparent during the third phase of ORP.
• The onset of "tunnel vision," meaning that the relationally dependent person cannot stop thinking about a love interest and required his or her constant attention.
• Neurotic, compulsive behaviors, including rapid telephone calls to love interest's place of residence or workplace.
• Unfounded accusations of "cheating" due to extreme anxiety.
• "Drive-bys" around a love interest's home or place of employment, with the goal of assuring that the person is at where "he or she is supposed to be."
• Physical or electronic monitoring activities, following a love interest's whereabouts throughout the course of a day to discover daily activities.
• Extreme control tactics, including questioning a love interest's commitment to the relationship (guilt trips) with the goal of manipulating a love interest into providing more attention.
PHASE FOUR DESTRUCTIVE PHASE:
This is the final phase of Obsessive Relational Progression. It represents the destruction of the relationship, due to phase three behaviors, which have caused a love interest to understandably flee. For a variety of reasons, this is considered the most dangerous of the four phases, because the RD person suddenly plummets into a deep depression due to the collapse of the relationship. Here are some of the more common behaviors that are exhibited during phase four of ORP:
• Overwhelming feelings of depression (feeling "empty" inside).
• A sudden loss of self-esteem, due to the collapse of the relationship.
• Extreme feelings of self-blame and at times, self-hatred.
• Anger, rage and a desire to seek revenge against a love interest for breaking off the relationship.
• Denial that the relationship has ended and attempting to "win a loved one back" by making promises to "change".
• The use of drugs, alcohol, food or sex to "medicate" the emotional pain.
SUMMARY
If your behaviors mirrored the various phases or the Obsessive Love Wheel, then it may be time to learn more. Obsessive Relational Progression is a problem that does not get better on its own and does not get better over time. Sadly for many people, the only way they can get off their frenzied wheel is by jumping onto a new one.
The Case of Obsessive Relational Progression
So how do you know if you have developed an unhealthy attachment to another person? By examining the Obsessive Love Wheel (OLW), which is designed to illustrate an overall process called Obsessive Relational Progression (ORP) [the specific attachment style of people Who Confuse Love with Obsession] it may be possible to recognize if you have a problem. There are four phases of ORP and each one carries unique behaviors. As demonstrated through the wheel, once an unhealthy attachment to another starts, the person who Confuses Love with Obsession begins to lose emotional control.
It is called a "wheel" because it is always turning, round and round as the relationship continues. Sometimes the wheel turns quickly, other times slowly, but it is always turning and always painful. While examining the wheel, look for any patterns of behavior in your relationship(s) and ask yourself: "Do either I or the person I am involved with behave this way?"
OBSESSIVE LOVE WHEEL
OBSESSIVE LOVE WHEEL ©
As Part of Obsessive Relational Progression
PHASE ONE THE ATTRACTION PHASE:
The initial phase of ORP is characterized by an instantaneous and overwhelming attraction to another person. It is at this point the relationally dependent person becomes "hooked" on a romantic interest, usually resulting from the slightest bit of attention from the person they are attracted to. Phase One ORP behaviors can include:
• An instant attraction to romantic interest, usually occurring within the first few minutes of meeting.
• An immediate urge to rush into a relationship regardless of compatibility.
• Becoming "hooked on the look" of another, focusing on the person's physical characteristics while ignoring personality differences.
• Unrealistic fantasies about a relationship with a love interest, assigning "magical" qualities to an object of affection.
• The beginnings of obsessive, controlling behaviors begin to manifest.
PHASE TWO THE ANXIOUS PHASE:
This phase in considered a relational turning point, which usually occurs after a commitment has been made between both parties. Sometimes however, the relationally dependent person will enter into this phase without the presence of a commitment. This happens when the afflicted person creates the illusion of intimacy, regardless of the other person's true feelings. The second phase of ORP behaviors can include:
• Unfounded thoughts of infidelity on the part of a partner and demanding accountability for normal daily activities.
• An overwhelming fear of abandonment, including baseless thoughts of a partner walking out on the relationship in favor of another person.
• The need to constantly be in contact with a love interest via phone, email or in person.
• Strong feelings of mistrust begin to emerge, causing depression, resentment and relational tension.
• The continuation and escalation of obsessive, controlling behaviors.
PHASE THREE THE OBSESSIVE PHASE:
This particular phase represents the rapid escalation of this unhealthy attachment style. It is at this point that obsessive, controlling behaviors reach critical mass, ultimately overwhelming the RD person's life. It is also at this point that the person being controlled begins to pull back and ultimately, severs the relationship. In short, Phase Three is characterized by a total loss of control on the part of the RD person, resulting from extreme anxiety. Usually, the following characteristics are apparent during the third phase of ORP.
• The onset of "tunnel vision," meaning that the relationally dependent person cannot stop thinking about a love interest and required his or her constant attention.
• Neurotic, compulsive behaviors, including rapid telephone calls to love interest's place of residence or workplace.
• Unfounded accusations of "cheating" due to extreme anxiety.
• "Drive-bys" around a love interest's home or place of employment, with the goal of assuring that the person is at where "he or she is supposed to be."
• Physical or electronic monitoring activities, following a love interest's whereabouts throughout the course of a day to discover daily activities.
• Extreme control tactics, including questioning a love interest's commitment to the relationship (guilt trips) with the goal of manipulating a love interest into providing more attention.
PHASE FOUR DESTRUCTIVE PHASE:
This is the final phase of Obsessive Relational Progression. It represents the destruction of the relationship, due to phase three behaviors, which have caused a love interest to understandably flee. For a variety of reasons, this is considered the most dangerous of the four phases, because the RD person suddenly plummets into a deep depression due to the collapse of the relationship. Here are some of the more common behaviors that are exhibited during phase four of ORP:
• Overwhelming feelings of depression (feeling "empty" inside).
• A sudden loss of self-esteem, due to the collapse of the relationship.
• Extreme feelings of self-blame and at times, self-hatred.
• Anger, rage and a desire to seek revenge against a love interest for breaking off the relationship.
• Denial that the relationship has ended and attempting to "win a loved one back" by making promises to "change".
• The use of drugs, alcohol, food or sex to "medicate" the emotional pain.
SUMMARY
If your behaviors mirrored the various phases or the Obsessive Love Wheel, then it may be time to learn more. Obsessive Relational Progression is a problem that does not get better on its own and does not get better over time. Sadly for many people, the only way they can get off their frenzied wheel is by jumping onto a new one.
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,307
good thread about people addiction
Hey Steve... check out this thread... you might find it helpful????
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-quacking.html
I will bump it, too.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-quacking.html
I will bump it, too.
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,307
"As long as we believe that someone else has the power to make us happy then we are setting ourselves up to be victims"
Codependence: The Dance of Wounded Souls by Robert Burney
One of the biggest problems with relationships in this society is that the context we approach them from is too small. We were taught that getting the relationship is the goal.
It starts in early childhood with Fairy Tales where the Prince and the Princess live happily-ever-after. It continues in movies and books where "boy meets girl" "boy loses girl" "boy gets girl back" - the music swells and the happy couple ride off into the sunset. The songs that say "I can't smile without you" "I can't live without you" "You are my everything" describe the type of love we learned about growing up - toxic love - an addiction with the other person as our drug of choice, as our Higher Power.
Any time we set another human being up to be our Higher Power we are going to experience failure in whatever we are trying to accomplish. We will end up feeling victimized by the other person or by our self - and even when we feel victimized by the other person we blame our self for the choices we made. We are set up to fail to get our needs met in Romantic Relationships because of the belief system we were taught in childhood and the messages we got from our society growing up.
There is no goal to reach that will bring us to happily-ever after. We are not incomplete until we find out soul mate. We are not halves that cannot be whole without a relationship.
True Love is not a painful obsession. It is not taking a hostage or being a hostage. It is not all-consuming, isolating, or constricting. Believing we can't be whole or happy without a relationship is unhealthy and leads us to accept deprivation and abuse, and to engage in manipulation, dishonesty, and power struggles. The type of love we learned about growing up is an addiction, a form of toxic love.
Here is a short list of the characteristics of Love vs. toxic love (compiled with the help of the work of Melody Beattie & Terence Gorski.)
1. Love - Development of self first priority.
Toxic love - Obsession with relationship.
2. Love - Room to grow, expand; desire for other to grow.
Toxic love - Security, comfort in sameness; intensity of need seen as proof of love (may really be fear, insecurity, loneliness)
3. Love - Separate interests; other friends; maintain other meaningful relationships.
Toxic love - Total involvement; limited social life; neglect old friends, interests.
4. Love - Encouragement of each other's expanding; secure in own worth.
Toxic love - Preoccupation with other's behavior; fear of other changing.
5. Love - Appropriate Trust (i.e. trusting partner to behave according to fundamental nature.)
Toxic love - Jealousy; possessiveness; fear of competition; protects "supply."
6. Love - Compromise, negotiation or taking turns at leading. Problem solving together.
Toxic love - Power plays for control; blaming; passive or aggressive manipulation.
7. Love - Embracing of each other's individuality.
Toxic love - Trying to change other to own image.
8. Love - Relationship deals with all aspects of reality.
Toxic love - Relationship is based on delusion and avoidance of the unpleasant.
9. Love - Self-care by both partners; emotional state not dependent on other's mood.
Toxic love - Expectation that one partner will fix and rescue the other.
10. Love - Loving detachment (healthy concern about partner, while letting go.)
Toxic love - Fusion (being obsessed with each other's problems and feelings.)
11. Love - Sex is free choice growing out of caring & friendship.
Toxic love - Pressure around sex due to insecurity, fear & need for immediate gratification.
12. Love - Ability to enjoy being alone.
Toxic love - Unable to endure separation; clinging.
13. Love - Cycle of comfort and contentment.
Toxic love - Cycle of pain and despair.
Love is not supposed to be painful. There is pain involved in any relationship but if it is painful most of the time then something is not working.
There is nothing wrong with wanting a relationship - it is natural and healthy. There is nothing wrong with wanting a relationship that will last forever - expecting it to last forever is what is dysfunctional. Expectations set us up to be a victim - and cause to abandon ourselves in search of our goal.
If we can start seeing relationships not as the goal but as opportunities for growth then we can start having more functional relationships. A relationship that ends is not a failure or a punishment - it is a lesson.
As long as our definition of a successful relationship is one that lasts forever - we are set up to fail. As long as we believe that we have to have the other in our life to be happy, we are really just an addict trying to protect our supply - using another person as our drug of choice. That is not True Love - nor is it Loving.
for more go to: http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...dependent.html
Codependence: The Dance of Wounded Souls by Robert Burney
One of the biggest problems with relationships in this society is that the context we approach them from is too small. We were taught that getting the relationship is the goal.
It starts in early childhood with Fairy Tales where the Prince and the Princess live happily-ever-after. It continues in movies and books where "boy meets girl" "boy loses girl" "boy gets girl back" - the music swells and the happy couple ride off into the sunset. The songs that say "I can't smile without you" "I can't live without you" "You are my everything" describe the type of love we learned about growing up - toxic love - an addiction with the other person as our drug of choice, as our Higher Power.
Any time we set another human being up to be our Higher Power we are going to experience failure in whatever we are trying to accomplish. We will end up feeling victimized by the other person or by our self - and even when we feel victimized by the other person we blame our self for the choices we made. We are set up to fail to get our needs met in Romantic Relationships because of the belief system we were taught in childhood and the messages we got from our society growing up.
There is no goal to reach that will bring us to happily-ever after. We are not incomplete until we find out soul mate. We are not halves that cannot be whole without a relationship.
True Love is not a painful obsession. It is not taking a hostage or being a hostage. It is not all-consuming, isolating, or constricting. Believing we can't be whole or happy without a relationship is unhealthy and leads us to accept deprivation and abuse, and to engage in manipulation, dishonesty, and power struggles. The type of love we learned about growing up is an addiction, a form of toxic love.
Here is a short list of the characteristics of Love vs. toxic love (compiled with the help of the work of Melody Beattie & Terence Gorski.)
1. Love - Development of self first priority.
Toxic love - Obsession with relationship.
2. Love - Room to grow, expand; desire for other to grow.
Toxic love - Security, comfort in sameness; intensity of need seen as proof of love (may really be fear, insecurity, loneliness)
3. Love - Separate interests; other friends; maintain other meaningful relationships.
Toxic love - Total involvement; limited social life; neglect old friends, interests.
4. Love - Encouragement of each other's expanding; secure in own worth.
Toxic love - Preoccupation with other's behavior; fear of other changing.
5. Love - Appropriate Trust (i.e. trusting partner to behave according to fundamental nature.)
Toxic love - Jealousy; possessiveness; fear of competition; protects "supply."
6. Love - Compromise, negotiation or taking turns at leading. Problem solving together.
Toxic love - Power plays for control; blaming; passive or aggressive manipulation.
7. Love - Embracing of each other's individuality.
Toxic love - Trying to change other to own image.
8. Love - Relationship deals with all aspects of reality.
Toxic love - Relationship is based on delusion and avoidance of the unpleasant.
9. Love - Self-care by both partners; emotional state not dependent on other's mood.
Toxic love - Expectation that one partner will fix and rescue the other.
10. Love - Loving detachment (healthy concern about partner, while letting go.)
Toxic love - Fusion (being obsessed with each other's problems and feelings.)
11. Love - Sex is free choice growing out of caring & friendship.
Toxic love - Pressure around sex due to insecurity, fear & need for immediate gratification.
12. Love - Ability to enjoy being alone.
Toxic love - Unable to endure separation; clinging.
13. Love - Cycle of comfort and contentment.
Toxic love - Cycle of pain and despair.
Love is not supposed to be painful. There is pain involved in any relationship but if it is painful most of the time then something is not working.
There is nothing wrong with wanting a relationship - it is natural and healthy. There is nothing wrong with wanting a relationship that will last forever - expecting it to last forever is what is dysfunctional. Expectations set us up to be a victim - and cause to abandon ourselves in search of our goal.
If we can start seeing relationships not as the goal but as opportunities for growth then we can start having more functional relationships. A relationship that ends is not a failure or a punishment - it is a lesson.
As long as our definition of a successful relationship is one that lasts forever - we are set up to fail. As long as we believe that we have to have the other in our life to be happy, we are really just an addict trying to protect our supply - using another person as our drug of choice. That is not True Love - nor is it Loving.
for more go to: http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...dependent.html
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: the moon, milky way
Posts: 1,250
The person being a drug idea has always felt odd to me. I specialize in attachment disorders of kids so there is a reason why we feel a huge sense of loss... because breaking any connection will cause a sense of loss, even an unhealthy one. Young kids who are abused still love the abuser. It is a survival thing.
Another way to look at it is in a healthy child even, if you take a toy away from a toddler and that toddler will feel the loss. The child really did develop 'feelings' for that toy even if the toy was inanimate. Adults really aren't that different except that we put our lives on hold, put up with poor treatment and give too much of ourselves to our human 'dolls'.
I have been in healthy relationships so I know the difference between when someone is there for you and someone is not. When I sorted out in my head who I was and what I wanted from this man, I realized I was NOT getting it or ever going to get it at this point. Breaking any connection was going to be painful. I had to let go of my doll!!
But he may as well be that because at this point I am getting zero back.
Crumbs vs a 50/50 reciprocal relationship is really what is at heart for ya Steve. How you have been surviving on crumbs for this long is one for the science books but she is your doll. She hasn't given back to you. Nor will she. That is a seperate issue from does she love or not. So what if she does, my cat loves me in his way but if I fall down and no one can feed him he will probably eat my face.
What is LOVE to you Steve? That is the bottom line for any of us. What we will and will not put up with and at what cost.
Another way to look at it is in a healthy child even, if you take a toy away from a toddler and that toddler will feel the loss. The child really did develop 'feelings' for that toy even if the toy was inanimate. Adults really aren't that different except that we put our lives on hold, put up with poor treatment and give too much of ourselves to our human 'dolls'.
I have been in healthy relationships so I know the difference between when someone is there for you and someone is not. When I sorted out in my head who I was and what I wanted from this man, I realized I was NOT getting it or ever going to get it at this point. Breaking any connection was going to be painful. I had to let go of my doll!!
But he may as well be that because at this point I am getting zero back. Crumbs vs a 50/50 reciprocal relationship is really what is at heart for ya Steve. How you have been surviving on crumbs for this long is one for the science books but she is your doll. She hasn't given back to you. Nor will she. That is a seperate issue from does she love or not. So what if she does, my cat loves me in his way but if I fall down and no one can feed him he will probably eat my face.
What is LOVE to you Steve? That is the bottom line for any of us. What we will and will not put up with and at what cost.
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Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 3,335
How you have been surviving on crumbs for this long is one for the science books but she is your doll.
And his 'blankie' hasn't ever broken a promise or lied or used him or cheated or treated him like garbage. It just lays there. And occasionally I take it away to wash it.
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Location: the moon, milky way
Posts: 1,250
My sister would hide my blankie when I was a small child. I wailed until my mom turned the house over to find it. While my sister stood in the background snickering.
I remember feeling just besides myself that my love object was torn away from me. Interestingly that feeling wasn't that much different then when the RABF trotted off to rehab. Go figure.
OH and look at that pic in your profile Kitty Kitty, that is the expression of a killer
I remember feeling just besides myself that my love object was torn away from me. Interestingly that feeling wasn't that much different then when the RABF trotted off to rehab. Go figure.
OH and look at that pic in your profile Kitty Kitty, that is the expression of a killer
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 774
maybe blankie and equating this as five year old is not appropriate, as i am not pissed about not having an innanimate object to hold hold while i fall asleep.
maybe i was getting only crumbs, but unlike a blanket, my "doll" did engage me, how was work? what did you do at work today? how about i make this or that for dinner?
on the other hand- true my "doll" lied, stole etc etc.
i will not question about my relationship being unhealthy, but it is far from the same thing as a kid not getting his blanket.
as for the crumbs, i get what you mean about me surviving off so few crumbs, but i am sure others have survived longer on less.
maybe i was getting only crumbs, but unlike a blanket, my "doll" did engage me, how was work? what did you do at work today? how about i make this or that for dinner?
on the other hand- true my "doll" lied, stole etc etc.
i will not question about my relationship being unhealthy, but it is far from the same thing as a kid not getting his blanket.
as for the crumbs, i get what you mean about me surviving off so few crumbs, but i am sure others have survived longer on less.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,896
I don't think it has anything to do with blankies or dolls or anything like that. It has to do with the fact that you refuse to accept the fact that the two of you are not going to be together. She is not interested in you in that way, regardless of what she says. She moved away from you and reduced communication with you. Good God, do you need a house to fall on you?? She is not interested. You have served your purpose and she has, for all intents and purposes, moved on. You may hear from her occasionally, but it will only be to see if you're still out there on the string in case she might need something. Don't be there. Change your phone number.
Sorry to be so blunt, but Good God! Wake up and smell the freaking coffee!!
Sorry to be so blunt, but Good God! Wake up and smell the freaking coffee!!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 774
suki-
maybe a rancher, not one of those giant mansions. yes, she moved away and yes she has cut most communication. normally i would take that for waht it is. i wrote somewhere, maybe not here, that i wasn't sure if her cutting the communication back was due to her moving on or as part of her recovery. she took the opportunuity to get a fre oplace to stay while on methadone. and you may be very well correct that she doesnt need me so she's done with me and is keeping the bait dangling. that is what i wasnt sure of becasue its only been a couple weeks. i guess by the time i figure it out, it wont matter to me any way or i'll just be angry by then.
so yes, she may have basically moved on, and that is what i was fearing. not necessarilly for lossing her, but to have been so taken and naive and all that stuff.
maybe a rancher, not one of those giant mansions. yes, she moved away and yes she has cut most communication. normally i would take that for waht it is. i wrote somewhere, maybe not here, that i wasn't sure if her cutting the communication back was due to her moving on or as part of her recovery. she took the opportunuity to get a fre oplace to stay while on methadone. and you may be very well correct that she doesnt need me so she's done with me and is keeping the bait dangling. that is what i wasnt sure of becasue its only been a couple weeks. i guess by the time i figure it out, it wont matter to me any way or i'll just be angry by then.
so yes, she may have basically moved on, and that is what i was fearing. not necessarilly for lossing her, but to have been so taken and naive and all that stuff.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,896
Steve, she isn't even keeping the bait dangling. YOU ARE. She isn't communicating with you because she doesn't want to. You have no idea if she's still using or not. You know nothing because she hasn't communicated with you. Go ahead and get mad! You should. You have been used. I know this sounds so mean, but you really need to see the words I think many people have felt needed to be said. So, I'll say them because I'm not always known for my tact anyway. 
You are not allowing yourself to see what it clearly visible to most of the rest of us. Where she is concerned, you make yourself believe the best even when it is obvious that she is just not interested in ending up with the two of you as a couple. I have my doubts that she's really working on recovery, but, just like you, I don't know that for sure. But the fact that she's pretty much cut off communication and moved away says a lot, and not that she's working on recovery.
You are not allowing yourself to see what it clearly visible to most of the rest of us. Where she is concerned, you make yourself believe the best even when it is obvious that she is just not interested in ending up with the two of you as a couple. I have my doubts that she's really working on recovery, but, just like you, I don't know that for sure. But the fact that she's pretty much cut off communication and moved away says a lot, and not that she's working on recovery.
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i guess all i wanted to know was weather or not her cutting bach communication was a sign of her moving on or part of her working on herself. i jsut wanted to try to figure out which direction to go. i am ok, with this all ending. as days and weeks pass, i'll get back to normal and be ok. deep deep down inside i know we dont work.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,896
Go the direction that is best for YOU. Don't let someone else call the shots for YOUR life. You only get one of those, so don't waste it on something that you know in your heart will never be. You deserve better, but you're letting better pass by because you are clinging onto something that you THINK you want.
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Join Date: Feb 2009
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suki-
the problem is that its not so obvious to me. the moving is because she got a free place to stay. as far as i know talking to the roommate, she is only allowed to stay while on methadone. and in therapy. she's told me about the therapy and says she really likes it. could she be working toward a future together, i guess it can go either way.
but yes, i am clinging on to something that i want to be, i am clinging to the person i believe she can be.
i beleive too much too easily. so i allow myself to believe that somoen can love you but need space for themself. recovery from addiction is one thing, but she has many other things she needs to address, so i can undertstand her wanting or needing space or to not be in something.
iguess overall, with distance,i may be ableto see this was all toxic and i'll try to only look for healthy next round. i guees with that, i dont wantto give up on her, if she warrants it.
i guessthere is nothing i can do about the situatiuon with her anyway. so i need to just get back to living my life. nothing i can do tonight, but go hoem from work and chill.
i just haveto let things be. i'm sure i'll hear from her one day and bythen, who knows...
the problem is that its not so obvious to me. the moving is because she got a free place to stay. as far as i know talking to the roommate, she is only allowed to stay while on methadone. and in therapy. she's told me about the therapy and says she really likes it. could she be working toward a future together, i guess it can go either way.
but yes, i am clinging on to something that i want to be, i am clinging to the person i believe she can be.
i beleive too much too easily. so i allow myself to believe that somoen can love you but need space for themself. recovery from addiction is one thing, but she has many other things she needs to address, so i can undertstand her wanting or needing space or to not be in something.
iguess overall, with distance,i may be ableto see this was all toxic and i'll try to only look for healthy next round. i guees with that, i dont wantto give up on her, if she warrants it.
i guessthere is nothing i can do about the situatiuon with her anyway. so i need to just get back to living my life. nothing i can do tonight, but go hoem from work and chill.
i just haveto let things be. i'm sure i'll hear from her one day and bythen, who knows...
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