Differences between Alanon and Thearapy
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Differences between Alanon and Thearapy
My brain is still a little jello=like so forgive me if I already wrote about this! I have been in Alanon for about 15 mo. previously had had lots of therapy (family and single) in the years of the building addictions in my home (kids). I feel like right now, alanon is helping the most as it was all my old ideas and general thinking structure that needed the most work..still does.
I went to a lecture given by an therapist who specializes in addiction treatment for the whole family. He fully supports all 12 step programs and requires his clients to participate.BUT..there is one main difference and I know this has happened with a couple of friends of mine in the program that are also in counseling.
Alanon does not advise or even kinda lean toward suggesting that people leave active alcoholics/addicts (I think that holds alot of appeal for many people).However in therapy they absolutely advise that you give YOUR recovery one year and if the partner does not begin their own active recovery in that time..you leave.He said it is too hard and almost impossible to remain detached for longer than that without getting sucked back in.That is also what my friends therpists have told them and it does conflict a little with some alanon philosophy.
Of course it's up to the individual to choose whatever they want though I kinda lean toward the therapists position.
Just wondering if anyone else had thoughts...
I went to a lecture given by an therapist who specializes in addiction treatment for the whole family. He fully supports all 12 step programs and requires his clients to participate.BUT..there is one main difference and I know this has happened with a couple of friends of mine in the program that are also in counseling.
Alanon does not advise or even kinda lean toward suggesting that people leave active alcoholics/addicts (I think that holds alot of appeal for many people).However in therapy they absolutely advise that you give YOUR recovery one year and if the partner does not begin their own active recovery in that time..you leave.He said it is too hard and almost impossible to remain detached for longer than that without getting sucked back in.That is also what my friends therpists have told them and it does conflict a little with some alanon philosophy.
Of course it's up to the individual to choose whatever they want though I kinda lean toward the therapists position.
Just wondering if anyone else had thoughts...
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Keepinon, I found this to be true as well. I respect each and everyone at the alanon meetings,however I did notice that they do lean towards living with addicts rather than not. I admire each person for that as I know it truly is difficult, but my personal decision was to not live with it any longer. I couldnt relate to other people who still live with the addict. again, that is a personal decision and I respect them. I didnt find many to talk to that share my thoughts and what Im going through,so sadly I stopped attending.
I have reached out to find other groups such as families members who are going through seperation or divorce or dont live with the addict due to addiction and so far have not found any.
right now Im stuck in limbo.
any suggestions would be appreciated, thanks for the post though keepinon
I have reached out to find other groups such as families members who are going through seperation or divorce or dont live with the addict due to addiction and so far have not found any.
right now Im stuck in limbo.
any suggestions would be appreciated, thanks for the post though keepinon
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What i found interesting was that altough people ther were living with spouses who were active..for loooong periods..they were VERY quick to jump on the parents of young addicts, like myself and in no uncertain terms tell us we were enabling (which I was!), but they view the spousal/partner relationship differently.I would say most of the under 40 crowd does not live with active users, but over that ther are alot of "old timers" who stayed. Just kind of intersting..this is not to incite anything, just seeing if others have opinions.
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Also, just a side note, if you are dealing with a substance abuser, Al-Anon tends not to be the best choice for help. Nar-Anon can be much more effective. In fact, some Al-Anon groups will be quick to ask you to leave if you don't have an Alcoholic as friend or family. The principles are the same, but the support you receive and the specifics of living with an Alcoholic vs. Narcs is entirely different.
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I personally do not believe that therapists, psychologists, and/or psychiatrists will come right out and tell a client to leave the spouse or S.O., at least not the ones I know.
Having attended AA, Al-Anon and worked with DV victims for many years, the on going recovery comes as the client is presented with ALL the options and gets to work their own "Pro/Con" list for each option. In this way the decision is TOTALLY and completely the Clients, and gives no room for later down the line the client 'blaming' (he/she/they, etc) that "he/she/they told me to do it."
Therapy and Al-Anon are about recovery for one's self. Al-Anon and Naranon use the 12 steps for us to do that. By diligently working the 12 steps and then starting to LIVE the 12 steps is where our own boundaries FOR US come from and what we will do if those boundaries are crossed.
Will I tell someone to run if they are in danger? You bet I will. Will they hear me? Probably not.
When it is an adult child that is the A will I tell them to kick them out? Yes I will. Why? Because I have seen it work, over and over and over again, including in my own life.
Many of us on here have passed on ESH regarding separating finances, building a safety stash, keeping a bag packed in the vehicle with important papers and a few days clothes, getting the pro bono first hour from an attorney or two. To me this is adding 'options' to what they can do in the present for THEMSELVES.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
Having attended AA, Al-Anon and worked with DV victims for many years, the on going recovery comes as the client is presented with ALL the options and gets to work their own "Pro/Con" list for each option. In this way the decision is TOTALLY and completely the Clients, and gives no room for later down the line the client 'blaming' (he/she/they, etc) that "he/she/they told me to do it."
Therapy and Al-Anon are about recovery for one's self. Al-Anon and Naranon use the 12 steps for us to do that. By diligently working the 12 steps and then starting to LIVE the 12 steps is where our own boundaries FOR US come from and what we will do if those boundaries are crossed.
Will I tell someone to run if they are in danger? You bet I will. Will they hear me? Probably not.
When it is an adult child that is the A will I tell them to kick them out? Yes I will. Why? Because I have seen it work, over and over and over again, including in my own life.
Many of us on here have passed on ESH regarding separating finances, building a safety stash, keeping a bag packed in the vehicle with important papers and a few days clothes, getting the pro bono first hour from an attorney or two. To me this is adding 'options' to what they can do in the present for THEMSELVES.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
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Join Date: Dec 2010
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I asked my EXAB to leave about 5 years ago. I was with him for 8 years. I had enough. 2 months later he robbed a bank and went to prison. I am glad I ended it when I did. And even though I have my struggles now, I would not take it back, for anything. I dont know how someone could not suggest leaving...but I understand why some stay.
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In my area and it's a fairly medium sized city in the state, not huge like Atlanta but not small either and there is no Naranon. Only Alanon.
I wonder if the reasons why there is a difference is because Alanon was founded by Lois W. and she decided to stick by her man. In the BB I can not stand to read the chapters that are "To the Wives" it is so insulting to read and I try to think that it is a product of an age of the 30's. But to my grandmother's credit she left her alcoholic in the 40's after trying for years and it was an era when people really did not divorce and it has caused much stigma for my mother and grandmother. So maybe in all the therapy and alanon there is a middle ground that each person has to do what is right for themselves and their situation. I think the principles are such that one can tool a recovery that is individualized to the needs of the person. Not everything in recovery is 100% applicable to myself or my family and would be horrible advice to run with so listen with a discerning ear to what rings true and what you can feasibly do with the stage of recovery you are at and your family is at in this journey.
I wonder if the reasons why there is a difference is because Alanon was founded by Lois W. and she decided to stick by her man. In the BB I can not stand to read the chapters that are "To the Wives" it is so insulting to read and I try to think that it is a product of an age of the 30's. But to my grandmother's credit she left her alcoholic in the 40's after trying for years and it was an era when people really did not divorce and it has caused much stigma for my mother and grandmother. So maybe in all the therapy and alanon there is a middle ground that each person has to do what is right for themselves and their situation. I think the principles are such that one can tool a recovery that is individualized to the needs of the person. Not everything in recovery is 100% applicable to myself or my family and would be horrible advice to run with so listen with a discerning ear to what rings true and what you can feasibly do with the stage of recovery you are at and your family is at in this journey.
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This is a very interesting thread. By the time I got to Alanon years ago (because of addicted husband) the situation was to the point where I had to leave for my safety. At that time, I found the little blue book of daily meditations very frustrating because it still seemed to be all about the alcoholic (like, don't stay angry because that can have a deleterious effect on the alcoholic).
It is my understanding Alanon was not started by spouses of ACTIVE alcoholics - only those spouses who were over in the meeting with Bill W. I think that is huge. That means that the craziness of active addiction was not there. What if the alcoholic relapsed? Did the wife quit coming to Alanon? How did the group as a whole treat that subject? Also, I think at that time that alcohol was pretty much all that was available to get addicted to - even up until 20 years ago. But now, how many people do I know who JUST drink alcohol who are under the age of 40? I do not know of any. So I think as the years go we will not be running into members of AA or Alanon who insist that alcoholism be the only substance that can be talked about at the meetings.
It is my understanding Alanon was not started by spouses of ACTIVE alcoholics - only those spouses who were over in the meeting with Bill W. I think that is huge. That means that the craziness of active addiction was not there. What if the alcoholic relapsed? Did the wife quit coming to Alanon? How did the group as a whole treat that subject? Also, I think at that time that alcohol was pretty much all that was available to get addicted to - even up until 20 years ago. But now, how many people do I know who JUST drink alcohol who are under the age of 40? I do not know of any. So I think as the years go we will not be running into members of AA or Alanon who insist that alcoholism be the only substance that can be talked about at the meetings.
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My alanon meeting are FULL of spouses,exes and Parents of drug addicts because we have no naranon..I've only had one stickler remind us to keep the focus on alcohol..everyone else is like..bring what you've got..we are all here for the same reason.Addiction is the same..some will kill ya quicker, but the principles are the same..and my daughter whose DOC was heroin also considers herself an alcoholic (thank God!)
The therapist that did the talk said that he reccomends not staying with an actively using spouse for more than one year of your recovery.He is pretty well respected around here. My friend also told me that her therapist suggested exactly the same thing.Of course they can listen or not..but they said it was at conflict with the alanon message. i found it interesting.
i made my decision over a year ago..I will not live with an active addict..too much choas and destruction for me. Food for thought..
The therapist that did the talk said that he reccomends not staying with an actively using spouse for more than one year of your recovery.He is pretty well respected around here. My friend also told me that her therapist suggested exactly the same thing.Of course they can listen or not..but they said it was at conflict with the alanon message. i found it interesting.
i made my decision over a year ago..I will not live with an active addict..too much choas and destruction for me. Food for thought..
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I think its healthier for the partner/parent not to be living with active addiction,but every situation is different. There are many many people who cant move out. Not that I can afford it,but he made that choice and I will pay for it for many years to come. however it was a blessing in disguise cause at the time I didnt have any clue what to do and get out of living with it. I just couldnt abandon our marriage but I knew in my head I wanted to as the drama and tormoil truly put me in a dark dark hole that I thought I would never get out of. I still dont know how I will.
my therapist agreed for me that is was best we seperated but she already knew that was the case.
my therapist agreed for me that is was best we seperated but she already knew that was the case.
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It is my understanding Alanon was not started by spouses of ACTIVE alcoholics - only those spouses who were over in the meeting with Bill W. I think that is huge.
In later years after Bill's demise Lois would talk about the almost 'knock down drag out' fights they had AFTER he was in recovery. She talked about her reactions (sometimes throwing things) and her feelings and how hard it was for her to 'change her actions and reactions' but also said over and over how much better their life together was after he found recovery.
Al-Anon was started by the spouses of Alcoholics, usually the wives, who sat in an adjoining room, while the meetings sometimes went on for several hours. Elsa Chamberlain, wife of Chuck C was one of the 'original' members of Al-Anon on the west coast as was Lois W on the east coast.
Lois always said it was 'her choice' to stay with Bill and in later years added that it was probably because of the era she was raised in and 'divorce' was 'just not done.' She and Elsa both were adamant that it was an 'individual's choice' on whether to stay or go.
Chuck C had a nickname in California. He was called "The Water Walker" and yes he did live the 12 steps. Elsa used to joke, that she had to have Al-Anon because of all the years he was sober but was not "The Water Walker". She chose to stay through the early years of recovery but many was the time she shared just how difficult it was.
Hope that clarifies a bit.
J M H O from my own personal talks with both Great Ladies.
Love and hugs,
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Thanks Laurie for clarifying that.
I know for myself as a recovering RA, I go to both NA and AA. I also go to individual counseling and a group support for nurses. There is a huge difference in my what my therapist thinks about recovery and what AA thinks about recovery. My therapist has given me diverse materials on Women in Sobriety, books on the Dance of Anger, Melody B,'s book about codependency and another book about women that wanted a different approach due to past abuse where as AA and here I don't want to start an war about AA but AA tends to want to beat out ego whereas with someone that has been abused has had ego beat out and is in serious pain and I can see why AA may not work for everyone in such circumstances. Anyway I found some middle ground with some Eastern thinking, some alternative healing methods and AA and NA along with the support of SR and it's helped me tremendously. I take a bit from everyplace to find what I need. I know in AA that they call that cherry picking your recovery but it works for me to search every means available for my recovery.
I know for myself as a recovering RA, I go to both NA and AA. I also go to individual counseling and a group support for nurses. There is a huge difference in my what my therapist thinks about recovery and what AA thinks about recovery. My therapist has given me diverse materials on Women in Sobriety, books on the Dance of Anger, Melody B,'s book about codependency and another book about women that wanted a different approach due to past abuse where as AA and here I don't want to start an war about AA but AA tends to want to beat out ego whereas with someone that has been abused has had ego beat out and is in serious pain and I can see why AA may not work for everyone in such circumstances. Anyway I found some middle ground with some Eastern thinking, some alternative healing methods and AA and NA along with the support of SR and it's helped me tremendously. I take a bit from everyplace to find what I need. I know in AA that they call that cherry picking your recovery but it works for me to search every means available for my recovery.
Last edited by meditation; 12-09-2010 at 05:47 PM. Reason: fixing infernal typos
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AA tends to want to beat out ego
I guess it is all in the way one looks at it. Maybe, because I got to AA after literally dying in the ER and having the ER Doc start to write my TOD on my chart, I was just plain fearful, scared, and not confident that I could do this (stay sober).
J M H O
Love and hugs,
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Went to my meeting tonight and expressed my gratitude that they are so supportive of taking in people with differing addiction issues. I know some groups are hard core, and I am really glad i have a great place to go. Also that my meeting are recovery focused and not bitch sessions or church socials..i am really lucky!
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NA has been extremely good about substances but they also believe Alcohol is a drug. I tend to gravitate more to NA because of the feel good atmosphere. AA has some good long term sobriety but it does sound like the Alanon thing, the group I attend has many many addicts and alcoholic and andas mixed, there are some purebred alcoholics only. A couple of times they get bent out of shape if someone mentions something other than alcohol but usually so many people come with not only cross addictions but come with mental health issues that just about anything goes.
Yes there is much to be greatful about and it feel so much better to be in gratitude than resentful. It took a bit to get to that point for me but blessings are there to be found.
Yes there is much to be greatful about and it feel so much better to be in gratitude than resentful. It took a bit to get to that point for me but blessings are there to be found.
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I think this is a great topic!
I have been advised that both Alanon and individual therapy can be helpful. So I am doing both.
There are no nacanon meetings in my area so I think that alanon is open to everyone that suffers from a loved one that has addiction issues. But my son has admitted to also being an alcoholic.
My therapist wants me to go to alanon. I think I get more from alanon than from my therapist. But that may change over time.
At my meeting there are people who have left their alcoholic husbands and those that haved stayed with them. There are parents that have kicked their kids out and those that have not. There are children of alcoholics, siblings.... Whoever your qualifier, the meetings focus on us not our qualifer. I personally could not live any longer with my son in my home (that was after 3 years of working on his recover at home). So my husband and I gave him a choice, go get well, or you are cut off from us. But that was our choice and his choice as to how to handle it. And at the moment he is in recovery. I don't know how long that will last, I hope and pray forever, but if it doesn't I want to be prepared.
I think that every meeting is different, depending on who is at the meeting and how it is run. I personally advise checking out more alanon meetings until you find one that fits for you.
As for the therapist, the same advise. They are also all different and you need to find the one that works for you at the moment. I can't seem to find the perfect therapist for me, I don't know if there is one. But I do keep looking.
I have been advised that both Alanon and individual therapy can be helpful. So I am doing both.
There are no nacanon meetings in my area so I think that alanon is open to everyone that suffers from a loved one that has addiction issues. But my son has admitted to also being an alcoholic.
My therapist wants me to go to alanon. I think I get more from alanon than from my therapist. But that may change over time.
At my meeting there are people who have left their alcoholic husbands and those that haved stayed with them. There are parents that have kicked their kids out and those that have not. There are children of alcoholics, siblings.... Whoever your qualifier, the meetings focus on us not our qualifer. I personally could not live any longer with my son in my home (that was after 3 years of working on his recover at home). So my husband and I gave him a choice, go get well, or you are cut off from us. But that was our choice and his choice as to how to handle it. And at the moment he is in recovery. I don't know how long that will last, I hope and pray forever, but if it doesn't I want to be prepared.
I think that every meeting is different, depending on who is at the meeting and how it is run. I personally advise checking out more alanon meetings until you find one that fits for you.
As for the therapist, the same advise. They are also all different and you need to find the one that works for you at the moment. I can't seem to find the perfect therapist for me, I don't know if there is one. But I do keep looking.
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