endangered

Hi all! An update on my situation. AH (who "may" be in recovery...it's debateable due to continued use of pot) injured himself 6 weeks ago, a hairline fracture to the tibia and torn cartlidge in the knee. Initially he saw an ER doc who prescribed oxy (his doc), then a specialist (who prescribed some more) and today he saw the dr. again and they prescribed him more yet. I have a real problem with him taking them when half the time ditches the crutches and walks (pretty well I might add) without them. The only time he actually seems in pain is when he takes the brace off and accidentally rotates the knee in a wrong direction and that seems brief.

He told me when he went for his last check up that they didn't write any and that he wasn't going to ask for them so idk if he asked or what. I found out when I stopped to pick up family prescriptions (both he, I, and one of our children have several that we take regularly so I always just ask about all 3 of us) anyway the tech came back and said my husband had already pick his up today. I must have looked perplexed because he looked at the screen and said "Oh, that was pain medication, let me check his regular medications". So....he hasn't mentioned them so far and I suspect I will get a lie if I ask but maybe I should ask. It seems within the realm of possiblity that he still legitimately needs them and if so you would think he would be honest about it and want me to keep and dispense them for him like he did initally at the ER??? Don't you think? Am I just 'lying' to myself or am I over reacting to a real need for pain meds. He went into rehab in March so all this is still pretty new.

BTW he has NOT been nice lately and I am wonder whether that is because he is taking his drug or because he doesn't have it? If time is a revealer then I sure wish I had a time machine so I could see into the future lol.

ladyamalthea

I wish I had advice for you, but it seems that this is gonna be tough no matter what you do. If you ask and he has been hiding it, how likely is that discussion to amount to anything productive? Then again, if you don't ask, will you keep playing the guessing game?

What kind of boundaries do you have in place? Sounds like maybe it's time to revisit them...

liesagain

AH (who "may" be in recovery...it's debateable due to continued use of pot)
Nothin to debate Pot is a drug as is alcohol so if hes smoking Pot he is Not in recovery

It seems that his keeping the pain medication a secret is a CLEAR indication that something is not quite right. An addict in Recovery who has a legitimate need for pain meds will be accountable (like he was when he had meds from er)

When they go for refills and keep the meds secret they are not practicing recovery

outtolunch

Nothing to debate here. The writing is on the wall.

Past behaviors tend to be the most reliable predictions of the future, unless one has made enormous changes.

What changes could you make within yourself that could change the outcome of your story?

tam

you really need to prepare yourself and start off by setting boundaries. I know personally it will take a toll on you trying to figure it all out and you will be chasing your tail, in the end will be the same answer. he is using and abusing pain meds. my ah became so disabled (devastating pain) he couldnt do anything physically just from a minor neck injury, yet after he left I bombarded the basement door with a long piece of wood (mind you it was heavy I hardly could move it) and lodged it between the door and the washing/dryer and he was able to break through it and move the washer/dryer!!
please please read posts here and stay many steps ahead and be prepared. Im sorry your going through this I know its extremely difficult. I found this forum so helpful as it truly guided me in the right direction for ME as I was in very very bad shape from his addiction and I also go to alanon meetings and they are helpful as well with support.

NightandDay

it only takes about 2 seconds for someone with an addictive personality/gene (or probably anyone for that matter) to become addicted to painkillers, especially oxy.

it makes you really irritable when you don't have it, and sometimes even when you do. it's a nasty drug, the way it worms itself into your body and doesn't let go. . . and if he likes weed for pain management/escapism, he is pbly LOVING his oxy's. . . thinking how great that the doctor prescribed them because that means he actually has to take them! he "needs" them.

plenty of people are able to recover from traumatic injuries with physical therapy and non-narcotic pain relievers. if your husband can walk around seemingly fine, then he's okay. what, besides taking the painkillers, is your husband doing to help heal his injury? exercise? physical therapy?

my bf just got out of rehab for painkiller addiction, which kicked into high gear when he fractured his tibial plateau and got a bunch of screws put in his knee. that was 2 YEARS ago and he has been taking the pks ever since. . . because he LOVED them, not because he needed them. give me a break, very few people NEED that crap to get through the day because of their physical pain is so unbearable. most people get an injury and get hooked because they're awesome! all your problems seem far away when you take them; you feel at ease and euphoric. and they're highly addictive. . . and the doctors will keep writing the scripts -- especially the "specialists."

you asked "am i fooling myself?" i think it's clear the answer is, sadly, yes. painkillers are opiates and give an incredible high. if your husband likes weed & alcohol & getting f*cked up, i'm sure he loves his painkillers and the fact that he thinks he is "sanctioned" to take them.

you really can't take them for more than a few days straight without becoming addicted and irritable and totally into them. that's just the way they are.



lies, irritability, smoking weed . . .

Nerdgirl

Not that this is a pissing match but....

I broke my leg into more pieces than a jigsaw puzzle, required surgery for repair (screws & titanium) and I was given Demerol in the hospital for one week (hated it) then Tylenol 3 at home for one week and that was it. My threshold for pain is not great either, but I got by on ibuprofen when things were rough - lots and lots of ibuprofen.

Point is that it sounds like he's milking this for all he can get, probably because he's not in recovery. Are you fooling yourself? Someone who had their head in the sand wouldn't even ask that question, so I don't think that you are fooling yourself. You know exactly what's happening here.

Freedom1990

The thing is, regardless of you having a problem with it, he's going to do what he's going to do.

I'd probably not be using crutches either if I was loaded on oxycontin.

Since he's going to do what he's going to do, including smoking pot, which does not constitute recovery, what can you do to make your life better?

Chino

I was on morphine for 8 days after a nasty injury and surgery, every four hours. When my surgeon came into my room on that 8th day, we said the same thing at the same time, "it's probably time to get off this stuff."

I didn't have one problem.

I've had 8 surgeries total on both knees and not every torn cartilage felt the same. For me at least, the pain seemed to depend more on what part of the cartilage, which one and the severity. I cannot heal a torn cartilage. The best I had to hope for was that it wore away evenly, from the bone grinding it down. Bone on bone pain is unbelievable.

I can't tell you how many times I cried while trying to walk, but one lortab pre or post op and I was ready to dance.

endangered, after my daughter was in a wreck, I doled out her meds for about two weeks. I quit doing it because it felt like we were all back in grade school days. It's her body and her addiction to own, not mine.

coffeedrinker

i'm sorry you're in such a situation. it's awful and it can take over your every waking hour.

i agree with everything said by the other posters (except maybe that it takes a few days for addiction - but i do think it's pretty instantaneous with an already-addicted person) and urge you to now think about boundaries - what they are and which ones you wish to establish, and detaching - letting go of your desire to control and know everything that's going on. it's hard, hard stuff, but when you consider the alternative - which, for me, brought me to a nicotine addiction, brought me to my knees, and stole a year of my life - there is no comparison.

please keep visiting us here!

endangered

so, in casual conversation i broughtit up and he lied & told me dr. told him to take asprin or ibuprophen for pain. He keeps them on his person at all times so I will just watch his attitude. Right now he is singing in the shower and playing the 4 yr old's banjo. The day before he got the meds (and most other days) he is a hateful, cursing, irritated individual who bit#** s about everything so it shouldn't be too hard to tell when he runs out then I will know if he is at least taking them as directed or if he is abusing.

On a brighter note, I found a potential sponsor at alanon last night. Finally! I have been watching and listening for a good fit for months. I'm going to start 'preparing' for the worst and get my ducks in a row as far as custody. I really hate that I had to use what little money I had saved up to pay the bills this month (with him not working things are more than tight). Doubt I can start over as he has 4 more weeks on crutches then arthoscopic (sp) surgery on his knee. I think he is excited about that as it will mean stronger pain meds again (he was dropped back to hydros this time).

Any ideas on what I need to do to prepare for the stong possibility that I will have to send him packing?

thanks guys!

coffeedrinker

well, first of all, i commend you for not sticking your head in the sand.

the best thing i did when coming to terms with the decision to end my marriage, was the stuff between my ears.
i stayed in indecision and stuck in fear of divorce for about two years.

when i finally started moving forward, i had a consultation with an attorney - someone whom a fellow program person recommended, a smart woman who understood what i was going through. at the end of that consultation, after we had put numbers on paper (income vs. monthly bills), she looked across her desk and said, "you can do this. i'm not telling you what to do, but....you can do this". it was definitely a defining moment. after that, it was just one foot in front of the other.

write a budget w/out him in the picture, circle up your support network, and once you do make that decision, never look back.

NightandDay

hey guys, just wanted to clarify my statement about getting addicted in a few days.

i'm certainly not a doctor, but i have had a lot of people in my life (not just the bf) deal with pk and opiate addiction. i've taken them myself too, started with a car accident and then sometimes recreationally.

what i meant was that if you are abusing the prescription, it really will only take a few days. if you take more and more to get high, you get irritable and constipated and just so icky feeling REALLY quickly. i assume chino didn't have as much of an issue since the doctor was regulating the dosage and decreasing it or increasing it accordingly.

anyway, it has been my experience that the crappy body feelings and mental need for more set in very quickly. i just think someone who has a history of addiction is probably going to abuse a pain med and get into it in a short amount of time. i haven't ever seen an example of the opposite.

and when a doctor is prescribing this stuff to an addict, it gets very tricky. they think they found a loop hole, they believe they need it, they believe they are in so much physical pain they have to have it... it's a complicated mess and the bottom line is if they care and are serious about their sobriety, they will find another way to deal with the pain that doesn't involve narcotics. if not, then sobriety is clearly not a priority.

Chino

There are recovering addicts who are on maintenance methadone and it might end up being for life depending on their diagnosis.

In the addiction forum, there was a clean and sober recovering addict who took a hard line stand about this, too. Until he ended up needing meds. There are some procedures and injuries that require painkillers or people will suffer devastating health consequences. My RAD started going into shock one time because of untreated pain.

Regardless, I get the point and was addressing the blanket statements. An active addict will take full advantage of the situation. A clean and sober addict not committed to recovery will relapse if they end up needing pain meds.

endangered, I'm not trying to hijack your thread or ignore your concerns. I think it's great that you're aware and didn't turn a blind eye. I also think it's great that you may have found a sponsor

You're allowing him the dignity to own his disease, and you're putting yourself and children first. I'll pray that the Creator blesses you with all you need, and that you're husband soon finds his way to recovery.

ElegantlyWasted

I'll third that... Mj maintenance is not recovery. Most people at his stage do just fine with 500 mg of non opiate ibuprofen (which is prescription). Seems as if he's chasing the dragon any which way he can IMHO. There is some great stuff on boundaries, self preservation etc. In F&F that will help. The big thing is consistent concrete boundaries, and protecting yourself first.

NightandDay

right! so we agree. we aren't talking about a person on methadone maintenance or someone who needs pks to not suffer life threatening consequences here. . . .

and i don't think it is hijacking the thread to discuss this, is it? the question was "am i fooling myself?" and i think we were all trying to add our 2 cents as to the answer being yes.

i in particular was trying to provide clarity regarding endangered's wondering if there was a real need for these pain meds. maybe i did it in too roundabout of a way, sorry for that. but it seems that her husband is not such serious shape that he will have a seizure or anything other than mild discomfort if he doesn't take the hydro or oxy. . .

also, sorry i may have been colored too much by my personal experience with painkillers. but that is all i know and i sure don't know everything. in my experience though, my friends and my bf have all been very excited to get painkillers and especially with bad injuries, they have milked the sh*t out of them to get more from the doctors and specialists. i get frustrated when people wonder if they are not giving enough credit to the severity of the injury. . . maybe that's very cynical, i don't know.

it's so hard because we want to believe that the addict we love is not fooling us. and when the doctor's prescription is involved, that complicates it even further. we wonder if we are wrong to be suspicious & worried.

i'll stop if i'm not being helpful here and/or hijacking.

Chino

I've been frustrated when I've tried to figure out or determine others pain

An addict develops extra opiate receptors. If they're active or newly clean, all the receptors are screaming louder than normal when they're in pain, because their brains aren't producing any natural endorphins. Treating the pain involves treating the addiction, as much as people hate to see that. An active addict will run with that.

I don't know others pain or what they should be able to get by with. It's taken psychiatrists and their knowledge of brain chemistry to determine that with my RAD. I've only known mine as a non opiate addict, with a normally functioning endorphin system. It's one of the reasons I won't ever monitor others meds again. I'll just always keep an eye on behavior and what I need to do for me.

Angelic17

Endangered, My sister was severely addicted to opiates. She has been clean and in NA for the past 10 years. She goes to hospitals and prisons and shares her stories and helps other struggling addicts. She fell off of a ladder while working, and hurt her back really bad. When she got to the hospital she told the E.R. doctor that she is a recovering addict, and get not have any opiates at all. She cried and suffered in pain for a few weeks. The doctors gave her Toradol, and some other non narcotic drug. Your husband is using his injury to feed his addiction. I'm sorry. I know how it is. I have been on both sides of the fence. I did the opiates and have 5 yrs clean. Then my son did the opiates, and the trust issues were bad news. It's really hard to trust an addict. I'm sorry for your situation. It's really difficult when we love an addict.

tam

ask him to try non opiate pain meds and see what response ya get...my ah would say those meds arent for devastating level 10 pain and only quack drs.prescribe them. if I said well I know level 10 pain as I had 10 surgeries and cancer 2 times (was on liquid morphine and oxy), he would say "I know you had pain but this is real pain"..??!!! that answer always blew me away! thats when I knew he had an addiction when he wasnt interested in trying any other med and I know first hand what oxy's do your body..I hated taking them but had no choice for awhile, it tears up your stomach, gives you massive headaches and mentally it really screws you up, and the mood swings were awful and scary to me..guess they like
endangered..my husband would sing in the shower, dance at work or be short tempered or passing out or up all night

endangered

Thanks everyone for listening and responding. He had a job interview today for a dream job. Hoping he gets it, loves it, and gets clean. Regardless of that I have chosen not to confront him with the knowledge I have of his pills. Obviously, if he wants to hide them and keep them a secret then it is a problem. Although I haven't completely thrown in the towel, I am 'planning' for the future. I will be seeing an attorney soon so that I can be sure I am doing what I need to do to protect myself and my family.

At this point I plan to do just what everyone says and go by his actions and behaviors. Unfortunately, I am afraid I know how that will go as he throws tantrums practically everyday, sometimes more than once a day. He uses every filthy curse word known to man, stalks about, makes everyone nervous and unhappy. This is usually set off by some small something that most folks wouldn't bother to get nearly so worked up about. When I first came here someone said "sober up a jerk and you still have a jerk". He isn't sober....but I've known him for 25 years and I'm afraid I will finally have to admit that he is a jerk.

I have always been for the underdog, the misunderstood, mistreated. Guess I thought I could make him happy and he wouldn't be so moody. Through the years, kids, trials, etc. he has just gotten worse (I'm sure the pills are to blame for some of it but regardless we just can't live like this anymore). I'm going to choose the best time I can and talk to him about his 'behavior' rather than his addiction. Lay it on the line and tell him that high or sober we can't live that way and see what happens. Sadly, when you know someone as well as I know him, you can usually foresee the outcome.

Anyway, I finally found a good book to lead me in working the steps. I knew the steps, just didn't have the instruction manual lol. Going to focus more on me and the kids and just work the program. Time will tell what he will do but for right now I just can't be very optimistic about it.