Two Questions
ThatLittleGirl
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Texas
Posts: 273
Two Questions
OK...so I'm working on step one... The letting go is hard for me...I want to do this right but I find myself stumbling left and right and it's frustrating. I tend to be a visual learner...so examples are always helpful to me for fitting the puzzle piece together in my brain:-) Anyway, I have two questions I can't "put away" so to speak, so I'm enlisting some feedback...maybe I'm not seeing it right...probably not... So here goes:
1. Why do I have such an undying need for my husband to admit some of his lies? Last night I engaged a conversation where I put out a scenario where I'm positive he lied...still, he lied.... It drives me crazy! Part of it is I want to know whether he's truly interested in recovery or whether he's just practicing abstinence. I feel like if he's truly interested in getting right with himself he will stop the lying...when he continues to lie to me, I feel like he's still doing the same old thing he always has. If that's the case, I'm a pull the band-aid off kinda person, I'll ask him to leave the house. But if he's serious (he just began suboxone treatment for his addiction), I want the opportunity to finish my steps to see how I feel before pulling the trigger one way or the other... I don't know...am I just fooling myself?
2. His family...I have a huge resentment towards them. They are such enablers; they fall off the spectrum when it comes to sinking their heads in the sand and denying his problem. I could go into detail after detail after detail to support this, but suffice it to say I blame them for enabling his drug habit early on in his youth (his older brother is an active addict as well). His father comes to stay with us occassionally (due to the cancer treatment he is receiving) and tonight he is arriving. My AH has never been completely honest about his issue, and I'm not sure they completely grasp the gravity of it. Should I say anything or keep my mouth shut? I have been keeping my mouth shut because I feel like if they want my opinion about it they'll ask...but I also don't know what AH is feeding them. Now that FIL has cancer, I'm not sure I want to put that pressure on his shoulders, but it's so stressful having him here walking around the house oblivious while my world is chaos and stress and I have to pretend everything is just "peachy"....ugh. Does this make sense?
Please show me the light:-) I am sure I'm missing the important pieces of the puzzle...
1. Why do I have such an undying need for my husband to admit some of his lies? Last night I engaged a conversation where I put out a scenario where I'm positive he lied...still, he lied.... It drives me crazy! Part of it is I want to know whether he's truly interested in recovery or whether he's just practicing abstinence. I feel like if he's truly interested in getting right with himself he will stop the lying...when he continues to lie to me, I feel like he's still doing the same old thing he always has. If that's the case, I'm a pull the band-aid off kinda person, I'll ask him to leave the house. But if he's serious (he just began suboxone treatment for his addiction), I want the opportunity to finish my steps to see how I feel before pulling the trigger one way or the other... I don't know...am I just fooling myself?
2. His family...I have a huge resentment towards them. They are such enablers; they fall off the spectrum when it comes to sinking their heads in the sand and denying his problem. I could go into detail after detail after detail to support this, but suffice it to say I blame them for enabling his drug habit early on in his youth (his older brother is an active addict as well). His father comes to stay with us occassionally (due to the cancer treatment he is receiving) and tonight he is arriving. My AH has never been completely honest about his issue, and I'm not sure they completely grasp the gravity of it. Should I say anything or keep my mouth shut? I have been keeping my mouth shut because I feel like if they want my opinion about it they'll ask...but I also don't know what AH is feeding them. Now that FIL has cancer, I'm not sure I want to put that pressure on his shoulders, but it's so stressful having him here walking around the house oblivious while my world is chaos and stress and I have to pretend everything is just "peachy"....ugh. Does this make sense?
Please show me the light:-) I am sure I'm missing the important pieces of the puzzle...
Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 3,335
Step one for codependents (taken from Melody Beatty's book) is:
Here's a link to some helpful stories you may want to read:
Step One : Codependents' Guide to the Twelve Steps
"WE ADMITTED WE WERE POWERLESS OVER OTHERS —
THAT OUR LIVES HAD BECOME UNMANAGEABLE."
— Step One of CoDA
The first time I heard this Step, I didn't get it. I didn't understand. It felt dark, scary, and untrue.
Powerless over others? My life — unmanageable?
I thought I was in complete control of myself and others. I thought there was no circumstance too overwhelming, no feeling so great that I couldn't handle it by sheer force of willpower. I thought being in control was expected of me. It was my job. That's how I got through life!
And I thought my life looked so much more manageable than the lives of those around me — until I started looking within. That's when I found the undercurrent of fear, anger, pain, loneliness, emptiness, and unmet needs that had controlled me most of my life.
That's when I took my eyes off the other person long enough to take a look at the state of affairs in my life.
That's when I began to find a life and come alive.
"I didn't know about power and powerlessness," said Mary, talking about the First Step. "Being a victim and being in control was how I was in power. If I was powerless, then someone else was in control."
Now we are learning a better way to own our power than being victims and being controlling. It begins by admitting and accepting the truth about ourselves and our relationships.
We are powerless over others. When we try to exert power where we have none, our lives at some level may become unmanageable. Let's take a look at some ways unmanageability can present itself in our lives, and where our ideas about controlling others — or allowing them to control us — began.
THAT OUR LIVES HAD BECOME UNMANAGEABLE."
— Step One of CoDA
The first time I heard this Step, I didn't get it. I didn't understand. It felt dark, scary, and untrue.
Powerless over others? My life — unmanageable?
I thought I was in complete control of myself and others. I thought there was no circumstance too overwhelming, no feeling so great that I couldn't handle it by sheer force of willpower. I thought being in control was expected of me. It was my job. That's how I got through life!
And I thought my life looked so much more manageable than the lives of those around me — until I started looking within. That's when I found the undercurrent of fear, anger, pain, loneliness, emptiness, and unmet needs that had controlled me most of my life.
That's when I took my eyes off the other person long enough to take a look at the state of affairs in my life.
That's when I began to find a life and come alive.
"I didn't know about power and powerlessness," said Mary, talking about the First Step. "Being a victim and being in control was how I was in power. If I was powerless, then someone else was in control."
Now we are learning a better way to own our power than being victims and being controlling. It begins by admitting and accepting the truth about ourselves and our relationships.
We are powerless over others. When we try to exert power where we have none, our lives at some level may become unmanageable. Let's take a look at some ways unmanageability can present itself in our lives, and where our ideas about controlling others — or allowing them to control us — began.
Here's a link to some helpful stories you may want to read:
Step One : Codependents' Guide to the Twelve Steps
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Chicago area
Posts: 4,269
I am not a stepper but do have tremendeous respect for the work.
Step one is all about the ego, your ego, your need to control other people.
An undying need for him to admit anything is your attempt to control him. That he admits or not does not change the outcome.
Want to know whether he's truly interested in recovery or whether he's just practicing abstinence is also an attempt to control his recovery.
It's humbling to accept and embrace that we have no power over other people, what they think or do.
It's a full time job to take responsibility for ourselves.
Step one is all about the ego, your ego, your need to control other people.
An undying need for him to admit anything is your attempt to control him. That he admits or not does not change the outcome.
Want to know whether he's truly interested in recovery or whether he's just practicing abstinence is also an attempt to control his recovery.
It's humbling to accept and embrace that we have no power over other people, what they think or do.
It's a full time job to take responsibility for ourselves.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Chatsworth CA
Posts: 44
I have the same problem with my addict boyfriend. He will not admit his lies, especially when it is completely obvious he is lying and hiding stuff. I understand the anger, frustration and just plain hurtfulness you are feeling.
The 12 Steps for me is still a process I am trying to embrace. I understand the meaning and message, but absorbing it emotionally and accepting the steps is something completely different. I think that is why they say you have to work the steps – kind of like working-out. We all know what a sit-up is but it is not until you start DOING sit ups, then we actually feel the stomach muscles that haven’t been used in a long time. I do understand I cannot “control” him, I cannot control the bad choices he is making, I cannot control his behavior, attitude or thought process, but it is still hurtful when he lies and somehow believes he is pulling one over on me. I am not stupid and don’t like being treated like I am stupid.
For now just repeat to yourself - ALL ACTIVE USING ADDICTS LIE. He is in his addiction, he is not himself and it sucks!!!!!
For me it’s my addict boyfriend manipulation with the lie, not admitting or denying his lies, instead taking the focus on him and twisting everything said and putting it on me. He focuses on the few times I lied to him in the past; like somehow that justifies his lies. It is truly sick and twisted.
• Stay Strong and Focused
• Work your steps, one day at a time
• And ALWAYS remember you are a beautiful, kind, loving, intelligent woman. You are special and NO ONE can take that away from you.
The 12 Steps for me is still a process I am trying to embrace. I understand the meaning and message, but absorbing it emotionally and accepting the steps is something completely different. I think that is why they say you have to work the steps – kind of like working-out. We all know what a sit-up is but it is not until you start DOING sit ups, then we actually feel the stomach muscles that haven’t been used in a long time. I do understand I cannot “control” him, I cannot control the bad choices he is making, I cannot control his behavior, attitude or thought process, but it is still hurtful when he lies and somehow believes he is pulling one over on me. I am not stupid and don’t like being treated like I am stupid.
For now just repeat to yourself - ALL ACTIVE USING ADDICTS LIE. He is in his addiction, he is not himself and it sucks!!!!!
For me it’s my addict boyfriend manipulation with the lie, not admitting or denying his lies, instead taking the focus on him and twisting everything said and putting it on me. He focuses on the few times I lied to him in the past; like somehow that justifies his lies. It is truly sick and twisted.
• Stay Strong and Focused
• Work your steps, one day at a time
• And ALWAYS remember you are a beautiful, kind, loving, intelligent woman. You are special and NO ONE can take that away from you.
ThatLittleGirl
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Texas
Posts: 273
It was just a bad day today...three steps forward...two back.
Instead of getting stuck on needing/wanting him to tell the truth and admit his lies…turn the focus towards yourself and work on your on truth and your own lies…especially the ones you tell yourself. - Thank you...I really needed to hear this.
In addition, instead of getting stuck on how his parents choose to behave, look at your own behaviors, how you too enabled, how you allowed, how you contributed, how you danced the dance. - This too!!!
Step one is all about the ego, your ego, your need to control other people.
An undying need for him to admit anything is your attempt to control him. That he admits or not does not change the outcome.
Want to know whether he's truly interested in recovery or whether he's just practicing abstinence is also an attempt to control his recovery. - Thank you...things I needed to hear...
Step one is going to be the hardest for me...Letting go...I think because I feel like I have to let go of him... He's so offish to me...then his dad arrives and he's so kind to him... I realize, there's nothing left between me and AH... I need to "know" that...I acknowledge it in my head, but I need to really "know" that so I can move on... It's so freaking hard to do...make your heart listen to your mind...
Instead of getting stuck on needing/wanting him to tell the truth and admit his lies…turn the focus towards yourself and work on your on truth and your own lies…especially the ones you tell yourself. - Thank you...I really needed to hear this.
In addition, instead of getting stuck on how his parents choose to behave, look at your own behaviors, how you too enabled, how you allowed, how you contributed, how you danced the dance. - This too!!!
Step one is all about the ego, your ego, your need to control other people.
An undying need for him to admit anything is your attempt to control him. That he admits or not does not change the outcome.
Want to know whether he's truly interested in recovery or whether he's just practicing abstinence is also an attempt to control his recovery. - Thank you...things I needed to hear...
Step one is going to be the hardest for me...Letting go...I think because I feel like I have to let go of him... He's so offish to me...then his dad arrives and he's so kind to him... I realize, there's nothing left between me and AH... I need to "know" that...I acknowledge it in my head, but I need to really "know" that so I can move on... It's so freaking hard to do...make your heart listen to your mind...
Restoring myself to sanity
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Georgia
Posts: 1,018
Something that really helped me with step one was the serenity prayer.. "God, Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference.
When it comes down to it we are indeed powerless over other people. You cannot change the fact that your addict is an addict and that he does what addicts do and that is lie and manipulate other people. You can however change You and how you react to your addict when he does things that drives you crazy.
I used to try to catch my AH in lies, I think I did this to prove some how to myself and to him that I was right and he was wrong.. that was just crazy behavior on my part.. I did not need to prove to myself anything and as for my AH, he could have cared less if I was right or wrong, all he cared about was getting high.
I can relate to this one because this is a huge issue for me with my inlaws.. I finally came to the conclusion that it is not my place to make them see the light when it comes to my AH's addiction. Either they are going to get it or they are not.. it's their journey not mine. I learned to set boundaries with my inlaws and now I only tell them things when they ask questions and that is hardly ever.
When it comes down to it we are indeed powerless over other people. You cannot change the fact that your addict is an addict and that he does what addicts do and that is lie and manipulate other people. You can however change You and how you react to your addict when he does things that drives you crazy.
I used to try to catch my AH in lies, I think I did this to prove some how to myself and to him that I was right and he was wrong.. that was just crazy behavior on my part.. I did not need to prove to myself anything and as for my AH, he could have cared less if I was right or wrong, all he cared about was getting high.
His family...I have a huge resentment towards them. They are such enablers; they fall off the spectrum when it comes to sinking their heads in the sand and denying his problem.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: To the North
Posts: 1,086
Before I knew my XAH's issues were his and addiction combined, here is a story I got - this is related to question 1. The reason I am telling you is that for years I would have beat myself (and him) silly trying to get him to see reason and admit the truth... by the time I heard this one I was stepping back.
We were sitting on the front porch and he tells me about a trip he is going to take with some friends. For once, I actually have something I might need to do in that time-frame and I won't be able to commit to taking care of things at home. I tell him so, that he should have talked to me first. He then tells me "I am talking to you about it first". Oh, I say, I'm sorry, I thought you were telling me plans were set. Oh no, he tells me, just an idea, of course he can go at a later time if that's better for me. I tell him that it would be better.
At that moment the neighbor across the street comes out the front door and proceeds to walk across to us and tells my XAH he has his plane ticket and is all set to go on the dates they discussed! I am disgusted and go inside. The phone is blinking, telling me there is a voice-message. I listen to the message - another friend of my XAH confirming he too has his plane tickets for the dates discussed. My XAH then walks in the door and I relay the phone message to him and proceed to tell him he lied to me, he did NOT talk to me first about his plans obviously.
Do you know what he said to me?????
I am not a liar, I did talk to you first!!!!!
He would NEVER admit to me that he made all these plans first despite the two confirmations. He would NEVER admit to me that he did not talk to me first. He just wouldn't. I had 2 choices at that point. Continue to argue the point and get him to admit his lies (which he never would), or let it go. The first would have made me crazy, the second didn't....
We were sitting on the front porch and he tells me about a trip he is going to take with some friends. For once, I actually have something I might need to do in that time-frame and I won't be able to commit to taking care of things at home. I tell him so, that he should have talked to me first. He then tells me "I am talking to you about it first". Oh, I say, I'm sorry, I thought you were telling me plans were set. Oh no, he tells me, just an idea, of course he can go at a later time if that's better for me. I tell him that it would be better.
At that moment the neighbor across the street comes out the front door and proceeds to walk across to us and tells my XAH he has his plane ticket and is all set to go on the dates they discussed! I am disgusted and go inside. The phone is blinking, telling me there is a voice-message. I listen to the message - another friend of my XAH confirming he too has his plane tickets for the dates discussed. My XAH then walks in the door and I relay the phone message to him and proceed to tell him he lied to me, he did NOT talk to me first about his plans obviously.
Do you know what he said to me?????
I am not a liar, I did talk to you first!!!!!
He would NEVER admit to me that he made all these plans first despite the two confirmations. He would NEVER admit to me that he did not talk to me first. He just wouldn't. I had 2 choices at that point. Continue to argue the point and get him to admit his lies (which he never would), or let it go. The first would have made me crazy, the second didn't....
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