IPT

I think in some ways it helps me to know more what the XAGF is, or was going thru. I have this grand vision of her just partying away and feeling good while I am here feeling hurt, used, and uncared about.

One person posted in one of my threads that she was in recovery and pointed out that life in active addiciton is miserable. I also read about people talking about depression and that to them just getting out of bed was almost insurmountable. My XAGF told me things like "you think I am just having fun, it is not fun for me", or "I just wreak everything, what's the point", "I don;t see the purpose of living. I wish for death everyday".

I have expereince with none of this. I don't understand how making a phone call, or getting someplace on time could be so difficult. I just assumed it's because she is just having fun or didn't care about my needs. She shared the true depth of her emotions very sparingly. I know that she was a person hurting very much inside, but I forgot that. I remember only the good things, or cling to the fantasy I created.

I am not sure what I will get out of it, but would any of you who have been in active addiction care to comment on some of the things you thought about, felt, or did at the time?

chairmanma084

getting high is fun, at first. then it becomes harder and harder to maintain the habit. then addiction sets in and gets harder and harder to get out of. so you end up miserable, desperate and very tired.

i know that when i was seeking and going to get high, i didn't think of anything else...not fun, not the people i was hurting by lying to them. it was just pure selfishness and self-security. it's a blanket you wrap yourself up in and try to hide from the world and its stresses....

for me anyway

IPT

Thanks chairmanma - she had said that "smoking pushes the pain away, at least temporarily".

chairmanma084

yea. i used oxycontin to just forget about my crappy job, my floundering education, all the things in life that stressed me out. i now know i had/have a bad anxiety problem.

it's self-medicating at its finest.

teke

i was one of those miserable ones. i really didn't know about addiction when i first tried it but i soon realized how strong the craving for more was. before long, drugs was all i could think about. day in and day out, morning, noon and night, obsessed with drugs and more drugs. everything i did or thought about doing, centered around my addiction, when there is no more and no way to get more, then comes the crash. totally depressed. unless you've been there, i would think it almost impossible for anybody to truly understand.

maybe it would help if somehow you could ask your hp to help you to focus more on you and maybe just except what is, for now.

Freedom1990

I was so uncomfortable in my own skin that getting loaded was the only relief I could get.

I felt like the biggest failure in the world.

IPT

She has echoed that same sentiment in one way or another many times. I can't speak for others obviously, but I think that non-addict codies just don't understand the depths of it. She of course was ashamed of herself, her actions, and was terribly insecure so did not share often. I wish she would have though because I think I could have been more empathetic. I would have been less quick to lash out and take it personally.

At the core of it I think that is in part why I am struggling so much. I am taking it way to personally. Understaninding and reading things like you have posted help me seperate myself and worth from it and accept it for what it is.

for your honesty and posting (everyone).

leelee5675

IPT, you hit the nail on the head when you said we non-addict codies just don't understand the depth of it.

I am struggling to try and understand how my once loving daugher could have developed into a theiving, lying person who could treat me with such disrespect. I am learning so much from hearing explanations from addicts themselves, instead of trying to unravel somthing I will never understand. The one consistent thing I have heard here and elsewhere (including from my daughter), is that self-esteem is at the core of it.

I have been reading your posts over the past week and can tell the difference in your attitude over the past 2 days. You seem to be coming to grips with some things. I almost cried when I read your first post about your pain. People say that the problem with posting and emailing is that no emotion and verbal inflections are there. The emotion in your post jumped out at me like a jack-in-the-box. The pain was so real.

Hang in there. You are making progress, I can tell. Aren't we luck to have this place?

laurie6781

I drank and used drugs for 24 years, 22 of those years was true addiction.

King Alcohol and Drugs was my MASTER. I stayed NUMB as much as possible. The longer it went on the more I used so I wouldn't have to FEEL. It becomes a CATCH 22. I would get high and black out and do stupid hateful things. Then when I came down I would try to figure out what I did and the shame and self hate would set in, so ......................... I would get numb again. Finally got to the point I just stayed numb. I M H O an addict is incapable of loving anyone else since they don't love themselves, at least that was the way it was in my case. I was a SLAVE to my addiction, and my drugs and alcohol came before any thing else.

I lived my H*LL right here on earth for 22 years. I am sober and clean now for many years, but I have never forgotten what it was like. And then in my first years in recovery from addiction, I found out I was also a codie, sheesh, in recovery I was always wanting to 'fix' others. So, sponsor sent me to Al-Anon.

It's been a long road, sometimes very bumpy road, but well worth the effort.

IPT as to your XAGF sharing more with you, NO WAY JOSE. I know there was no way I could explain it to any one else, when I wasn't ready to look at my addiction and how I was feeling, I just wanted to stay numb. I would suspect she is the same. Most addicts I know are that way. It is only when one is well into recovery that one is able to start to put into words what the heck was going on all that time.

Best you work on you, figure out what inside you makes/made you want to 'fix it.'

I have found as we change our insides, we draw to us and are attracted to emotionally and mentally healthier folks.

J M H O

Love and hugs,

LiveURLife

okay #1 what is a codie?

as an ex-addict myself, my self essteem was at its worst when i was on something.. but it wasnt only that.. i had negitive thoughts all the time.. i didnt know how to turn them in to positive ones... it seems like the more i did drugs the more i would forget things.. common sense things... life things... i think back now and i still cant tell you what i was thinking when i was on anyhting.. i wanted to be that NUMB.. i didnt want to feel life... i didnt want anytihing to do with it.. but i am still here and i know now that life is great...

she wont tell you how she feels she will lie to you and tell you things that will ethier make you feel bad for her or make you feel bad about yourself...its not you... its her addicted brain doing that.. and its sad that a once normal person cant see that anymore... try not to feel crappy becuz of what she is sayng to you.. try to look at possitive things.. such as.. at least she is alive... and as long as she is alive there is hope...

okay now i am rambleing.. im sorry... but to answer your question... a full blown addict can not answer what they were thinking becuz 9 out of 10 they werent thinking of anything but their selves and what ever they are on... after that they may seem nice but that is becuz they are high... the next day they dont remember what ahppend the day before but they do rremeber they need to get high.... does that make sence?
do you get what i am trying to say?

outtolunch

Her addiction has absolutely nothing to do with you.

And you know the 3 C's. You did not cause it. You cannot control it (or her). And you cannot cure it (or her).

IPT

leelee - thanks, and yes, SR is a Godsend. Yes, self esteem, she has none. Such a beautiful person on the outside, and I truly believe a caring person on the inside. She could rule the world if she could only believe and accept that as the truth. Unfortunately life has dealt her a weak hand and placed her in an environment that is unfortunate (though she is old enough now to walk away….hard to do when your family is all you have, even if they are bad for you and you know it). She believes and has said it many times that she is “good for nothing”. It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy and it kills me to look at her from outside eyes and know how much she is shortchanging herself. Until she realize that though it just doesn’t matter. Course my friends probably said the same about me being in this relationship so long!

As for me, thanks, I am better. This has been a 4 year roller coaster ride with the break ups and gaps getting longer and longer as I recovered and stopped the chasing and over-reacting. Now I am sorting out the details and trying to come to peace with what I did and why. I am focusing on myself, but I am trying to walk away with empathy towards her, not hatred and disgust. Understanding more about the dark place she is in is helping me be able to do that.

Laurie – thanks for sharing . She had said that too, “How can I love you when I don’t even love myself or take good care of myself”. Why did I want to fix it? In retrospect probably many reasons. I am a healthcare provider and that is what I do, by profession and nature. I am also a strong willed and successful person and I like to motivate people to challenge and improve themselves. She verbalized her unhappiness and a desire to get better and I tried to help her. Truth is she wasn’t committed or ready for that and I was unaware of what I have since learned here on SR. I was using methods that probably hindered and enabled more than anything else. On a deeper level, I think that her rejections and poor treatment of me made me question my self-worth, challenged my own self esteem. I was fighting to validate my importance. I was not willing to fail (at getting her better…which I know now is not up to me and has nothing to do with me, but it was a force behind my acceptance of poor treatment). I also was fighting to get the reward…the fulfillment of the fantasy that I had created within my head.

Cynical – I no longer allow that treatment. That’s why we haven’t spoken in weeks….. Oh what a wonderful world it would be if people could just change suddenly and we didn’t have to let go of our hopes and dreams for them and ourselves.

IPT

Sadly, she has told me many times that she "wishes for death every day", but that she is just "too much of a wimp to kill myself". I have spoke with my therapist about this several times and he acknowledged that she is a prime candidate for suicide. That was my fear, that we would work it out, have a family, and then after 10-20 years she would just not be able to put up the faced any longer and take her life..


Yes, I do

LiveURLife

most people that commit suicide do not talk about wanting to kill their selves... especialy with the person they love... i have had these thoughts before... every addict does.. its a way of looking for help.. a way of saying i need help.. i want help.. but cant do it myself... and i dont want to take the time to do it.. next time you go see your thyapist try to take her with you.. just to support you.. and have her get in on the conversation.. i bet she sarts thinking about getting help..

laurie6781

I too am/was one. In recovery I took my 'codie' side and turned it into into an asset. I did private home care of the terminally ill and/or the totally incapacitated for many years, until my own health issues made me unabel to work. I got many referrals from Hospice here, and I really enjoyed my work. I helped my clients, I made their 'quality of life' as best as I could and I kept their families informed and was there for their families. That I could do.

Unfortunately, when dealing with one in the throes of addiction, there is really nothing we can do, this is one problem they have to seek help for on their own, and be willing to go to any lengths to find recovery. If our love, care, and concern could cure them, there would be no need for this site.

J M H O

Love and hugs,

Done_With_It

That is not everyone's experience.

Just think it is important to remember that she is still her own person, all addicts have similar things in common but we are all different with our own experiences.

I did remember the living hell I was in day in and day out. At first meth was amazing to me, was exactly what was missing and what I needed. Then it brought me to my knees and I was planning and thinking suicide all the time. I wanted to quit so bad, but just couldn't.
Worst possible way to ever live.
I will never go back to that hell on earth.

It is bad, but be careful not to baby here cuz she is feeling so bad, you can baby her to death. I got the courage to quit because I hated my life, not cause people were being sympathetic and understanding, people were not happy with me...

JME

IPT

In fact a year or two ago things were falling apart and I told her no way am I doing this again unless we get counseling. She agreed, we went three times and she basically said “my family needs me more than he does so that is my priority”. That was it, he said you have different goals and I can’t help you with that. I went back to see him because he knew “us” and about her. I generally get along fine except in relationships so it was important he knew the dynamics of where I was.

Anyway, as for her getting help, I wish. After the Easter incident when I told her I was done (and didn’t see her for 2 months) she started counseling again (the one before “wasn’t really helping”….uh, maybe because she was going late all the time and skipping appointments). I think she was hurting that she messed up and I finally really did walk away, she lost me in a way she hadn’t before. I was always easily pulled back in until that final straw. She had to face the truth, consequences of her behavior and I guess it was painful enough that she took action. They changed her meds which she said helped (dx with PTSD and depression). Not sure how long she actually went, but since she quit her job some 6 months ago she said she “couldn’t afford to go anymore”. I reminded her NA is free….she is just not ready to do what has to be done to change her life.

Worse yet is she has few friends, if any. She hangs out with her family with major co-dependence issues. Mom is unhealthy, manipulative, previous suicide attempts, until very recently smoked pot with her and her brother (she quit for a while, not sure if that is still in effect), brother is an addict who’s been thru rehab and now “just smokes weed”. It is the ultimate enabling environment. I was truly one of the few if not the only healthy person in her life. Now to protect myself I will need to completely shut the door on her. Breaks my heart because I remember after Easter her pleading with me not to push her out of my life, that she didn’t want to lose me. It hurts me to watch her make mistake after mistake. Makes me feel responsible but I told her many, many times this would happen. I cannot feel guilty for taking care of myself…no matter how much it hurts her. I have communicated to her up, down, inside and out. She had ample chances to take corrective action and I would have stood beside her. She choses not to do that.

SCRedhead

Please DO NOT THINK IF SOMEONE TALKS ABOUT SUICIDE, they are not serious. In my experience, many people who talk about it--do it! I agree this can be (and probably is) a cry for help, but it is a very serious cry. Very serious indeed!

IPT, I really believe your attitude is wonderful. You can be there to help if and when she ever wants to get sober. Until then, don't beat yourself up and cause yourself pain that really doesn't help anyone. Hang in there!

IPT

SCredhead - hopefully she gets the help she needs some day. I am afraid that even if she starts that process I will not be able to be there for her. It would be a L O N G road and there has been too much bad betwwen us. I tried many, many times only to be hurt and let down. For my own wellbeing somehow I will need to stay totally seperate from her and her life. I think in some ways it would kill me to see her get better and become that person I always wanted knowing I couldn't be with her. From what I have heard it is often after a loss like this that people do decide to take action.

Today is a difficult day again as I struggle with the rejection of her not even calling me to give me the closure that I need. It leaves my mind to wander and that tinly little bit of anticipation that she "might call today" lingers painfully.

Abundance

IPT ... if she called today - what would you say?