JMFburns

It’s a vicious cycle for me and I wanted to get some of the thoughts out of my brain in an effort to make some sense out of it.

I feel like I am climbing up a hill, ready to strike out down the other side to my life or slip back down the way I struggled up, to my son’s insanity. I’m closer to going over, I feel really close to the top this time, I hope I make it.

I just struggle with getting drawn back into loving my son, wanting to help my son, feeling sorry for him, seeing him as my little boy, worrying about how he will survive, thinking I can convince him to do the right thing, etc.

I’ve been keeping a log for the past 12 days of our interactions. Whether he calls me and leaves a message, I talk to him, or I see him. It is an eye opener for me of the crazy crap he tells me and the amount of money I’ve given him.

I walked away from him this morning and did not answer the many phone calls that followed. It’s my work phone (he does not have my home phone number) so I can not shut it off and my company will not change the number (I asked.) But I do have it set to roll directly to voicemail, unfortunately it rings ½ a ring first so I can get all panicky.

I wish I could stay mad and hateful, it’s empowering and makes it so much easier to say “NO”. I have made progress – not where I want to be – but whoa, a whole lot different than I was a year and a half a go when he first lost a place to live. It sure isn’t easy, but I’m still trying.

Thanks,
Joan

suki44883

Hang in there! I know how difficult it is because I'm pretty much in the same spot, as you know. We can do this. Yes, it is hard and sometimes it rips the very heart out of us. But we can do it. Both our kids are adults and they have to find their own way. We want to remember them when they were little and needed us to take care of them, but that's just not the way it is now. They're adults and we do them no favors when we try to do everything for them now. I've started seeing a therapist...had my first appointment yesterday, and it helped. I'm going to keep going every week if I can. Maybe you would benefit with some counselling, too? Just think about it. It would be nice to feel empowered without having to feel angry. (((HUGS)))

JMFburns

Thanks Anvil
Thanks Suki

I am seeing a therapist through Hazelden - thought somebody familar w/addiction would provide more insight. She has been helpful.

There are a few things that have happend over the last month that have pushed me harder to letting go - I mentioned them - caught my son in a couple big lies (that he maintains to this day are not lies) and turned 49 years old - I DO NOT want to keep doing this for the rest of my life. I DO NOT want to keep this up til I turn 50 - if I haven't gotten my crap together by then I'm running away by myself.

What am I doing for me: seeing a therapist, attending NarAnon and AlAnon, posting here (even when I think I'm not where I should be,) calling people and reaching out to my coworkers at that are supportive.

suki44883

I'm glad to hear that you are taking steps to take care of YOU. Funny you mention age...I was thinking that same thing when things came to a head in our situation. Unfortunately, I've already hit 50, but I was thinking more in my daughter's age terms. She's almost 20 and I was imagining 10 years from now when she's almost 30 and things still being the same. Anyway...KUDOS to you for looking out for yourself! (((HUGS)))

greeteachday

((((Joan)))) Sounds like you are doing lots of good things for you...And Anvil has an excellent point...Time to throw a little fun in the mix too. In our own time and in our own way, we come to the point where we find peace. I truly don't think you will slide back down...There are lots of hands helping you to get to the peak and start striking out on the other side.

outtolunch

It sounds like you are relying on strong negative emotions to say no. Addicts lie. Addicts manipulate. Addicts steal. Addiction = chaos.

Most of us have a tendency to get mad when people don't do what we think they should be doing. We get mad when the addict does what addicts do, especially after all we have done for them. Reality is, what we have done for them is enabled them to sustain another day of addiction. And we do it again and again.

Would you considering letting go of the emotions and say no, with love in your heart? So long as he has you helping him out, he has no reason to even consider the alternatives.

winnie12

Oh darlin can i relate to what you say. When i'm angry its sooooo easy to detach. When i'm worried or when he is loving to me its hard. I'm getting better at it but still dont know if i'll ever completely conquer this.

This is something (no offense to anyone without kids or men) that i think only Mom's can understand. It is in the core of our nature to love and nuture our children - we are given this drive to protect them by HP when they are born. To just turn off that switch when they get older just feels impossible sometimes.

What i try to do is to compartmentalize things. I love my son - nothing ever changes that. I am not responsible for his problems. So even though we're walking up that mountain - he has to carry his own load. His consequences he deals with and i dont give much sympathy for. My load up that mountain is the pain that i carry because i love him and i have to carry that one alone. So even if he crosses my boundaries like lying or using in my home I dont take that onto my load - that's still his load and he has to carry and live with those consequences alone.

I have an 11 yo daughter so yes we listen to Hannah Montanna - she has a new song that i absolutely love (i'm guessing her daddy wrote it) and that is how i feel with all of this:

I can almost see it
That dream I am dreaming
But there's a voice inside my head saying
"You'll never reach it"

Every step I'm taking
Every move I make feels
Lost with no direction
My faith is shaking

But I gotta keep trying
Gotta keep my head held high

There's always gonna be another mountain
I'm always gonna wanna make it move
Always gonna be a uphill battle
Sometimes I'm gonna have to lose

Ain't about how fast I get there
Ain't about what's waiting on the other side
It's the climb

The struggles I'm facing
The chances I'm taking
Sometimes might knock me down
But no, I'm not breaking

I may not know it
But these are the moments that
I'm gonna remember most, yeah
Just gotta keep going

And I, I got to be strong
Just keep pushing on

CHORUS

Keep on moving, keep climbing
Keep the faith, baby
It's all about, it's all about the climb
Keep the faith, keep your faith, whoa

outtolunch

Parents will risk their own survival to protect their children. Addiction pushes this to the limit and eventually compels us to decide to either survive or spiral down, with them.

JMFburns

Out To Lunch,

Wow, I don't think I can say "no" with love in my heart. If I am feeling love towards my son I cave and give him whatever he wants plus. I know this is flawed and not the way I should be doing it but . . . it's my reality.

Or maybe I'm not all the way to "it's either me or him." Like I mentioned, I'm so close I can feel it, taste it, want it sooo bad . . . I think if I got to "picking myself over either of my kids" you all could see the shining beacon from wherever you live. I'd be 6 ft. tall and shining for all the world to see.

BigSis

For me, after doing this for five years, I have finally gotten a really SOLID belief that there is no such thing as coincidence.... really.

Each opportunity for sobriety for my kid has come about because of something that appears "bad" or "terrible", but has ended up being.... opportunistic. It helps me see things in a different light, and helps me stay out of rescue mode.

The more Alanon meetings, especially book study and tradition study meetings, the more I go to, the stronger I get. Hang in there, baby.

((hugs))

TrainWreckAgain

JMF,

I have an friend who is in recovery (and has been for about 5 years). She became addicted in her late teens. In her early 20's, her parents kicked her out, changed the locks, and left her to fend for themselves. For 2 years she lived on the streets, pushing a shopping cart around with all her belongings.

For her, she hit bottom when she was arrested and facing serious jail time. She had the chance to go to a treatment program instead.

She has told me on several occasions that the single greatest act of love show to her by her parents was to kick her out and cut her off. She says that ultimately, it saved her life.

Today she has a very strong and healthy relationship with her parents.

I share this story, in part, because it helped me see that by stopping my codependent / enabling behavior, and allowing my AGF to experience the full consequences of her addiction, that I was actually showing her just how much I loved her.

We all have different paths and experiences. Kicking my AGF out of the house was the hardest thing I have ever done. And I am convinced it was done out of love. Love for her. And love for me.

HTH

Spiritual Seeker

keep moving in the right direction...you know you can jump off the merry-go-round

winnie12

JMF - Anvil hit this one on the head and i think this is a great thread because you really got to the heart of the issue.

I remember a year ago when i first started learning to say No - with no explanations, no backing down, and no discussions. What I said to my son at that point is "I Love you enough to let you hate me." My decisions for my children are not dependant upon what they want from me or what they think of me but what is best for them. For me that change came because of the most difficult of choices - do i turn him into the police and have him arrested or do i risk him being in the outside world and dying. Being arrested was best - and even though at the time he hated me, believe it or not he now admits to me that he wouldnt be alive today if i didnt do that. Going through that tough lesson made the little daily tests much easier for me.

My children do come first for me - that's okay but that doesnt mean i do what they want all the time. Sometimes in order to be a good parent and teach them valuable lessons i have to stop and take care of myself first. Detaching from a child is different than detaching from a significant other - the feelings dont just go away in time but it is possible to detach from their problems. So I dont look at it as detaching from the person but from the addiction and the consequences.

JMFburns

Thanks for all the great replies with your experience and your thoughts.

At first when I read the replies, or others threads, I say "Yes, but . . ." trying to justify that my/our situation is different (he claims he isn't using, he is screwed up in the head, etc.) so that's why it's ok to keep doing what I'm doing. But then I stop "STOP" and think for a minute . . .

Whether my son is actively using or not, he doesn't appear to be doing much of anything to help himself out of where he's at. He didn't make a court date - so now has a warrant. He has missed appointments with psychiatrists and psychologists - yet he claims he needs help. He asks me every day for money - he says he can't work because his mind is too screwed up. He told me this week he would look into a recovery program only if I would guarantee him a place to live when he was done - not "I'm willing to do whatever it takes to make my life better."

When I first joined SR I read someones post that talked about what the addict says versus what they should be saying (sorry, I don't remember who posted this.) I wrote it down and have kept it handy.

What an addict thinks: What can I do to not have to change? What could I say to make this person take me back and make everything the same as it was with no change on my part?
What an addict should be thinking: I'm getting on my own road to recovery. I'm sorry for how I've hurt you. Hopefully you'll talk to me again when I'm on the other side of this disease.

Anvil, this really struck me
giving into another's demands is a lot of things but not LOVE.....peace at any price, fear of rejection, desire to please but not LOVE.

Joan

Spiritual Seeker

Usually we can depend on Anvil to tell us what we need to hear, what an incredible talent with words and thought.

laurie6781

Sweetie it really is time for NO CONTACT. You know that. When you answer your phone at work and you hear his voice ........................................ HANG UP. No "Hi", "Bye" or anything.

We've talked about this ................................. only you can get off his Roller Coaster. It's HARD. VERY HARD. But ............................... it get's easier once you start.

I am starting to wonder if 'deep down' you still feel like you can 'fix him' and that if you don't then you are a 'bad mom.' I know you are going to a therapist in addition to Al-Anon, maybe it's time to work with your therapist on WHY you cannot let go of this young man.

Letting go, does not mean you love him any less, it just means you are no longer going to enable him into his grave.

You know my story. You know my folks CUT OFF ALL CONTACT and stuck by it. My mom said it was the hardest thing she ever had to do in her life, but she refused to be locked up in a padded cell because of her daughter. YES I was literally driving her INSANE.

You know it took me 2 1/2 more years, and 1 and 1/2 of those living on the streets by MY OWN MEANS.

I also say to this day, that with all my folks did for me, with all that they gave me, this one act, this VERY SPECIAL ACT, this ACT THAT WAS SO HARD FOR THEM, was .................................................. THE VERY BEST THING THEY EVER DID FOR ME.

I know of many others, sober and clean today, contributing citizens of society today, whose parent(s) did the same thing to them. Those same peeps are VERY GRATEFUL TODAY for what their parent(s) did.

Joan, I can encourage you. Anvil can encourage you. All of us can encourage you ............................ however .................................. you are the one that has to do the footwork, and the footwork starts with NO.

J M H O

Love and hugs,

Impurrfect

(((Joan))) - you know my story, too...a lot like Laurie's. If dad had given me money, I'd still be smoking crack.

I just wanted to add one thing. I've been going through some other stuff, since I went through that armed robbery at work, last year. I could easily say my mind is "not right". I've been fighting with workman's comp, who basically doesn't care. The point is, I want help, so I'm getting it. I'm not depending on my dad or any other family member. Heck, right now I can't even depend on my job or my insurance, as I am fighting for my rights there, too.

If I had not learned, thanks to my family, that I was able to find recovery on my own, I would probably be feeling pretty helpless right now. We have to be let go, to flounder on our own in recovery, or we will be "crippled" for life..thinking we're helpless and hopeless. It's only by finding out what we CAN do, on our own, that we get stronger.

I know this is hard on you, but I can assure you, if you continue to give him money, this will go on until one of you dies, unless you learn how to say "no" or he gets locked up. He will not find recovery, or help, if he doesn't have to.

Hugs and prayers!

Amy