Sometimes I wonder which is harder....
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 126
Sometimes I wonder which is harder....
the addict or the newly recovering addict?
I'm really struggling with my RAH husband right now. When he was using I knew what to expect from him. He lied, he manipulated, and I got good at ignoring it and sort of living like I wasn't married to him. He was never really moody or angry or plain mean. I know the drugs were masking stuff, but he was actually sort of easy to live with. I can't believe I just said that, but basically when his addiction became out of control he was working on a project at work that required 14 hour days 6 days a week with an hour commute both ways so I really only saw him a few minutes each day and on Sunday he was so tired he slept most of the day. He has been clean since the first week of December (medically assisted detox, naltrexone implant and now shots, rehab, AA/NA 3x a week, therapy 2x a week). When he went to rehab I was very proud of him, but I guess I had some unrealistic expectations of the person he use to be coming back when he got out. I now know that it isn't that simple! I know we have a hard road ahead, but I'm just at my wits end. We argue more than we ever have in the 14 years we've been together and I never know what his mood will be or what will set him off. The moodiness is enough to drive me away!
Plus, he is still lying when it is pointless to do so. It is almost like his brain off drugs doesn't know how to not lie. When he was using his lies were outlandish and were to cover up his drug use. Now, he lies just to lie. A few examples: we have a dog with chronic ear infections and he has always been the one to care for them. Since rehab the ears have flared up because I'm not as good at getting our 110 pound lab to sit still for me to do a good job. About a week ago I asked him if he could take that duty back over. I knew the medicine was almost out and there was another tube stashed away. He told me he was doing it everyday, but when the used tube didn't go empty and the new one wasn't opened I asked him and he basically told me he wasn't really doing it because he didn't feel he needed to. Even though everyday he said he had done it. Another time he called me while he was at work and said that a friend who landscapes was at our house cutting the lawn. He didn't say he was coming over he specifically told me the guy was there and had put the dogs in the house. I got home and the lawn wasn't cut, the dogs were outside and nothing looked like anyone had been there. He later told me he just told me that. He gets bonuses deposited into my checking account with his paycheck and he told me one bonus was going to be $1400 split over 2 pay periods (he doesn't have any access to the money anymore). On Friday nothing was deposited along with his paycheck. The pay stub came in the mail yesterday and it didn't show the other $700. When I said something he said he never told me it was $1400, he told me it was $700 and I made the rest up. It isn't like he is lying because he secretly got a check (his company doesn't issue checks it ALL gets direct deposited). He'll lie about getting gas for the grill, taking the trash out, etc. It is pure craziness and it is driving me crazy. It reminds me of Pavlo's dogs!
When I bring it up to him he gets super defensive and turns it all around on me. I've known him since he was 5 years old and growing up and dating he was one of the most honest, trustworthy people I had ever known. That was probably one of the biggest things that took our relationship from just friends to love. The addiction has really taken that away from him. I was prepared for the moodiness and the depression once he got clean, but I was totally not prepared for the lying to continue.
When he went to rehab I told him that I would stick it out. I'm hopeful that with time we can rebuild our relationship, but this is so stinking hard. When he hit rock bottom I was certain I was going to a divorce lawyer. When I saw that he wanted to change for himself I felt I needed to see it through with him. I said for better or worse and him making an effort to get/stay clean made me want to respect my vows. When he left I told him that the only reason I was staying was because of his effort, but one relapse and me and our son would be gone. I just wasn't expecting the lying and it is tearing us further apart!
I'm really struggling with my RAH husband right now. When he was using I knew what to expect from him. He lied, he manipulated, and I got good at ignoring it and sort of living like I wasn't married to him. He was never really moody or angry or plain mean. I know the drugs were masking stuff, but he was actually sort of easy to live with. I can't believe I just said that, but basically when his addiction became out of control he was working on a project at work that required 14 hour days 6 days a week with an hour commute both ways so I really only saw him a few minutes each day and on Sunday he was so tired he slept most of the day. He has been clean since the first week of December (medically assisted detox, naltrexone implant and now shots, rehab, AA/NA 3x a week, therapy 2x a week). When he went to rehab I was very proud of him, but I guess I had some unrealistic expectations of the person he use to be coming back when he got out. I now know that it isn't that simple! I know we have a hard road ahead, but I'm just at my wits end. We argue more than we ever have in the 14 years we've been together and I never know what his mood will be or what will set him off. The moodiness is enough to drive me away!
Plus, he is still lying when it is pointless to do so. It is almost like his brain off drugs doesn't know how to not lie. When he was using his lies were outlandish and were to cover up his drug use. Now, he lies just to lie. A few examples: we have a dog with chronic ear infections and he has always been the one to care for them. Since rehab the ears have flared up because I'm not as good at getting our 110 pound lab to sit still for me to do a good job. About a week ago I asked him if he could take that duty back over. I knew the medicine was almost out and there was another tube stashed away. He told me he was doing it everyday, but when the used tube didn't go empty and the new one wasn't opened I asked him and he basically told me he wasn't really doing it because he didn't feel he needed to. Even though everyday he said he had done it. Another time he called me while he was at work and said that a friend who landscapes was at our house cutting the lawn. He didn't say he was coming over he specifically told me the guy was there and had put the dogs in the house. I got home and the lawn wasn't cut, the dogs were outside and nothing looked like anyone had been there. He later told me he just told me that. He gets bonuses deposited into my checking account with his paycheck and he told me one bonus was going to be $1400 split over 2 pay periods (he doesn't have any access to the money anymore). On Friday nothing was deposited along with his paycheck. The pay stub came in the mail yesterday and it didn't show the other $700. When I said something he said he never told me it was $1400, he told me it was $700 and I made the rest up. It isn't like he is lying because he secretly got a check (his company doesn't issue checks it ALL gets direct deposited). He'll lie about getting gas for the grill, taking the trash out, etc. It is pure craziness and it is driving me crazy. It reminds me of Pavlo's dogs!
When I bring it up to him he gets super defensive and turns it all around on me. I've known him since he was 5 years old and growing up and dating he was one of the most honest, trustworthy people I had ever known. That was probably one of the biggest things that took our relationship from just friends to love. The addiction has really taken that away from him. I was prepared for the moodiness and the depression once he got clean, but I was totally not prepared for the lying to continue.
When he went to rehab I told him that I would stick it out. I'm hopeful that with time we can rebuild our relationship, but this is so stinking hard. When he hit rock bottom I was certain I was going to a divorce lawyer. When I saw that he wanted to change for himself I felt I needed to see it through with him. I said for better or worse and him making an effort to get/stay clean made me want to respect my vows. When he left I told him that the only reason I was staying was because of his effort, but one relapse and me and our son would be gone. I just wasn't expecting the lying and it is tearing us further apart!
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 126
I hope this doesn't come across as selfish or ungrateful. Believe me I am so grateful that he is clean - I just needed to vent that addiction is a hard, hard road and even when the drugs are taken out of the equation things don't go back to normal. It is such a process!
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,307
Same thing with my guy.... he calls it "taking the path of least resistance". But it really never turns out to be that way.
Lying becomes second nature ..... in addiction.
I wish I knew what the answer is. Sometimes I just felt like the best thing to do was just not ask him anything or just plain not believe anything it says - period.
I will say; however, that with time it has gotten better.
It's good that you have your boundaries in place, as far as the addiction....... and that he knows what they are. It's also great that he is doing so much in the way of recovery!
Are you also doing recovery?
Lying becomes second nature ..... in addiction.
I wish I knew what the answer is. Sometimes I just felt like the best thing to do was just not ask him anything or just plain not believe anything it says - period.
I will say; however, that with time it has gotten better.
It's good that you have your boundaries in place, as far as the addiction....... and that he knows what they are. It's also great that he is doing so much in the way of recovery!
Are you also doing recovery?
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 126
I see a therapist and went to my first Alanon meeting last week. I have strep throat right now and hoping to make it a meeting tomorrow night.
It is sad though because I want to trust him. It is hard enough to build that trust again after all that he is done, but the continued lying makes me wonder why am I bothering? And, yeah I have these addiction boundaries, but it seems like there now needs to be a lying boundary. I have a 14 month old that was deeply wanted (we did invitrofertilization to have him) and I always imagined such a great life for him. We need to lead by example...how do we raise an upstanding person when his father thinks it is totally acceptable to lie?
It is sad though because I want to trust him. It is hard enough to build that trust again after all that he is done, but the continued lying makes me wonder why am I bothering? And, yeah I have these addiction boundaries, but it seems like there now needs to be a lying boundary. I have a 14 month old that was deeply wanted (we did invitrofertilization to have him) and I always imagined such a great life for him. We need to lead by example...how do we raise an upstanding person when his father thinks it is totally acceptable to lie?
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,307
It is truly challenging.
I have a friend who grew up with a pathological liar as a mother. Her father was a Methodist Pastor.
They were taught to just "accept it"..... and her father never cast blame - just knew it was who she was. How this man didn't totally lose it from time to time (that my friend doesn't know about, at least) - is beyond me.
I think of my friend and especially her father - to give me a little bit of serenity with making sense of the lying.
I also think of how I have heard (from my guy's childhoold friends) - about how even as a child he was an exaggerator. And they accept him for who he is ......
I tried the lying deal breaker.... saying that it was right up there with relapsing... well - that was a joke. I didn't stand by it...and in the end it hurt me more than it did him because I set up a boundary I didn't follow through with. I am actually the one who lost respect - yet he is the one lying!!!
Craziness - for sure!
When my guy says how offended and upset he is when one of the boys tell a lie to him (like.... saying they took a shower, but didn't) - I have to do some major exhales and then calmly suggest that he not "go there". Not until he has this lying thing down himself!
Good job on working on yourself.... hope your throat gets better.
I have a friend who grew up with a pathological liar as a mother. Her father was a Methodist Pastor.
They were taught to just "accept it"..... and her father never cast blame - just knew it was who she was. How this man didn't totally lose it from time to time (that my friend doesn't know about, at least) - is beyond me.
I think of my friend and especially her father - to give me a little bit of serenity with making sense of the lying.
I also think of how I have heard (from my guy's childhoold friends) - about how even as a child he was an exaggerator. And they accept him for who he is ......
I tried the lying deal breaker.... saying that it was right up there with relapsing... well - that was a joke. I didn't stand by it...and in the end it hurt me more than it did him because I set up a boundary I didn't follow through with. I am actually the one who lost respect - yet he is the one lying!!!
Craziness - for sure!
When my guy says how offended and upset he is when one of the boys tell a lie to him (like.... saying they took a shower, but didn't) - I have to do some major exhales and then calmly suggest that he not "go there". Not until he has this lying thing down himself!
Good job on working on yourself.... hope your throat gets better.
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Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
I can tell you from my own personal experience that early recovery was much worse than my years of practicing my affliction. By early recovery I mean the first 2 or 3 years.
You see while in active addiction I lived in LA LA LAND. Yep, a false reality. I blamed, I lied, I used to cover ALL my emotions.
Now, I took away my friend and master. After coming back to life in the ER, going to a Recovery House for 3 months I was a real MESS. I had to learn how to 'tell the truth.' I had to learn how to deal with RAW EMOTIONS that I had buried for years and years. I had to face denial head on and it was rough. There is no MAGIC BULLET in recovery, and some get better sooner than others, and ........................................ I have to say that some get only so far.
There was a fellow at the North Hollywood AA Group that during his drinking years was a bank robber. He continued to rob banks in sobriety for almost 8 years before he turned himself in, did his time, came back to the group and remained sober, living a quiety life, "walking the way he was talking."
So I M H O yep when 'reality' sets in on the newly recovering addict, it is a "NEW" type of h*ll.
The trust will come as his ACTIONS and ATTITUDES show he is changing. Until then, you have every right to be distrustful. It took me a bit over 3 years before my family and friends started trusting me a little bit again. Then that trust grew and I grew and my actions continued to show my on going growth.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
You see while in active addiction I lived in LA LA LAND. Yep, a false reality. I blamed, I lied, I used to cover ALL my emotions.
Now, I took away my friend and master. After coming back to life in the ER, going to a Recovery House for 3 months I was a real MESS. I had to learn how to 'tell the truth.' I had to learn how to deal with RAW EMOTIONS that I had buried for years and years. I had to face denial head on and it was rough. There is no MAGIC BULLET in recovery, and some get better sooner than others, and ........................................ I have to say that some get only so far.
There was a fellow at the North Hollywood AA Group that during his drinking years was a bank robber. He continued to rob banks in sobriety for almost 8 years before he turned himself in, did his time, came back to the group and remained sober, living a quiety life, "walking the way he was talking."
So I M H O yep when 'reality' sets in on the newly recovering addict, it is a "NEW" type of h*ll.
It is sad though because I want to trust him.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 126
Laurie - thank you! It is nice to hear from people that have been in similar situations as my husband.
On our 5 year anniversary in April he asked me why I'm not showing him respect. I asked how was I being disrespectful to him? He said by not trusting him. I pointed out that respect and trust weren't the same thing and I wouldn't be able to gain an ounce of trust if he couldn't stop lying. Each time he lies it makes that distrust grow or lose the faith that I'll gain it back. I told him I respect him as a person, but it was hard to maintain respect when he is showing me disrespect by lying. I told him that trust needed to be earned and respect would come with that. He did disagree with that, but I thought a light bulb went off after that conversation. He ended it by saying that he understood what I meant and would make an effort to not tell these ridiculous lies. I guess it didn't really change things though.
On our 5 year anniversary in April he asked me why I'm not showing him respect. I asked how was I being disrespectful to him? He said by not trusting him. I pointed out that respect and trust weren't the same thing and I wouldn't be able to gain an ounce of trust if he couldn't stop lying. Each time he lies it makes that distrust grow or lose the faith that I'll gain it back. I told him I respect him as a person, but it was hard to maintain respect when he is showing me disrespect by lying. I told him that trust needed to be earned and respect would come with that. He did disagree with that, but I thought a light bulb went off after that conversation. He ended it by saying that he understood what I meant and would make an effort to not tell these ridiculous lies. I guess it didn't really change things though.
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 98
Hey AAH,
I know what you mean about lying. It eats ya up inside. That's how I've been feeling in my situation....for the love of GOD...just the truth! Not that it matters, not that it changes them or the situation...it's just the fact of having honestly and peace of mind between each other. Then you can decided what you do from there. Even if he's lying about minor things like you mentioned...it doesn't matter. Then...you begin to wonder if everything they tell you is a lie...and that is just flat out heartbreaking. Hang in there....lots of hugs and God Bless....Here when ya need someone to listen
I know what you mean about lying. It eats ya up inside. That's how I've been feeling in my situation....for the love of GOD...just the truth! Not that it matters, not that it changes them or the situation...it's just the fact of having honestly and peace of mind between each other. Then you can decided what you do from there. Even if he's lying about minor things like you mentioned...it doesn't matter. Then...you begin to wonder if everything they tell you is a lie...and that is just flat out heartbreaking. Hang in there....lots of hugs and God Bless....Here when ya need someone to listen
Member
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 98
Awww Abundance....lol....don't mean to laugh at your situation cause I know it's NOT funny at all. But sometimes if we don't laugh we cry and make ourselves sick and who needs that. My guy gets on my about lying all the time. I have lied about a couple dumb things and I'm not oking it but just didn't feel like going through a whole arguement or him packing his stuff over something dumb like for example: he hates me biting my nails but I do it anyway and he yells at me to stop. We were driving home one day and I'm staring at my nails and getting ready and he tells me don't even think about it and I told him....awww, I was just looking at how much improvement they need and I was smiling and laughing about it. I was lying (I was ready to chew away) but that's nothing relationship damagingl...it's dumb and I was just goofying around. So he goes into the if you would lie about that then you'll lie about anything...I told him...and you don't lie about dumb things like that (thinking in my head he's lied about stuff....worse stuff) and he looks me straight in the face and says I don't lie....Famous last words...huh.
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,691
I was only around my husband for 6 months before he got sober from a 20 year history of crack addiction. So, for me, as difficult as those 6 months were (and I didn't even know what the problem was for much of that time) sobriety has been extremely difficult. He's coming up on 4 years now and it has been a very painful journey for me. I thought that our love and common cause would see us through. Counselling, SR, Alanon, and Naranon are what helped me to grow and change through it all. It has been a crash course for me in learning how to take care of myself, maintain boundaries, and forgiveness. During the last four years we had to deal with a mental health issue coming to light (bipolar) which contributed to his addiction in the first place but had never been diagnosed, changing old coping patterns, and learning what honesty and compassion for others means.
To this day - I really don't know how he has done even what he's done and I don't know how I've done it. I just have zero tolerance for any crap anymore and I'm sorry it took me so long to learn that. Until I stuck to my bottom lines then things really didn't get better around here.
I remember when I first came to this site everyone told me to run....I didn't. I had no idea that sobriety would be this tough. I think that Laurie is right about the first several years. It's difficult to learn a whole new way of living and there is a lot to work out.
I've felt ungrateful many times as I've struggled with a sober addict when so many people just wish that they'd get clean. I wish the show "intervention" would address the long term aspects of recovery. It ain't for sissies - that's for sure.
To this day - I really don't know how he has done even what he's done and I don't know how I've done it. I just have zero tolerance for any crap anymore and I'm sorry it took me so long to learn that. Until I stuck to my bottom lines then things really didn't get better around here.
I remember when I first came to this site everyone told me to run....I didn't. I had no idea that sobriety would be this tough. I think that Laurie is right about the first several years. It's difficult to learn a whole new way of living and there is a lot to work out.
I've felt ungrateful many times as I've struggled with a sober addict when so many people just wish that they'd get clean. I wish the show "intervention" would address the long term aspects of recovery. It ain't for sissies - that's for sure.
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Reality......
Posts: 735
Laurie said it best. An addict needs to learn how to tell the truth....
The whole addiction is a process. They didnt start out the way they ended and that is why in recovery it is so important for them because that is basically what they are doing is RELEARNING everything ALL over again.
Learning to have HEALTHY relationships with not only themselves but with others as well. Ya they may be able to put down in ONE day and BE DONE but EVERYTHING else is a process.
Just like we who are not addicts are learning how to live without/with addiction in our lives. Everything in life is all about LEARNING and GROWING.
The whole addiction is a process. They didnt start out the way they ended and that is why in recovery it is so important for them because that is basically what they are doing is RELEARNING everything ALL over again.
Learning to have HEALTHY relationships with not only themselves but with others as well. Ya they may be able to put down in ONE day and BE DONE but EVERYTHING else is a process.
Just like we who are not addicts are learning how to live without/with addiction in our lives. Everything in life is all about LEARNING and GROWING.
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Reality......
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Originally Posted by Hope87 
That's how I've been feeling in my situation....for the love of GOD...just the truth!
But why? But why? Why is telling the truth so hard? I used to ask myself that over and over. CRAZY MAKING.
ADDICTS are NOT CAPABLE of telling the truth.
Just like someone who has no legs is NOT capable of walking......
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: buffalo ny
Posts: 167
Don't expect him to tell the truth. Stop setting yourself up to fail.
It takes a long time to rebuild trust; it has its own time table. And believe it or not, he has to learn to trust you. My RAH was always worried I would boot him out, while I was worried he would relapse.
This isn't just about him getting better. It's about you, too. And MAN that was hard for me to accept because I liked being the poor, devoted wife who's bad addict husband ruined her financially. Poor me. But you know what? I have some stuff too that I need to take care of, for me, and for my marriage. Hang in there.
It takes a long time to rebuild trust; it has its own time table. And believe it or not, he has to learn to trust you. My RAH was always worried I would boot him out, while I was worried he would relapse.
This isn't just about him getting better. It's about you, too. And MAN that was hard for me to accept because I liked being the poor, devoted wife who's bad addict husband ruined her financially. Poor me. But you know what? I have some stuff too that I need to take care of, for me, and for my marriage. Hang in there.
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 74
that's why in order for real RECOVERY to happen, it HAS to be more than just quitting the drugs. the drugs are really just a symptom, a band aid.......taking the cherry off the top of the triple scoop banana split with whip cream and chocolate sauce doesn't make it HEALTH FOOD.
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