Trying_in_Texas

Hi Ladies (and perhaps a Gentleman or two!). Hope all is well, as always.

Short story... had an ex who was an addict... if you're really interested, you can probably find some pretty pathetic posts pre-February 2007 from me regarding the same! Broke it off when the legal trouble started on his part... one thing I know I can't handle. Began dating another guy... he was completely "socially acceptable", shall I say, but our relationship had the passion of a footrest... eventually ended up seeing ex-ABF after breaking it off with Mr. Socially Acceptable... which led to dancing with ex-ABF (we are at a concert, so that wasn't as strange as it sounds)...which of course led to admitting undying-and-perpetual-love for ex-ABF... conveniently about a year and a half after I broke it off and a month before he went to court-ordered rehab for said legal troubles for 90-plus days.

Court-ordered rehab is more than halfway through... I believe... and now of course my brain is starting to ramble. Say what you will (really, it's fine :0) but I think this is it for him and the drugs. I really do. But as a result of the drugs... of course life issues arise. I've been living on my own since I was 15... and I suppose his plan is to move in with his parents when he gets back (at almost 28 years old)... no job to speak of... parents and family have plenty of financial support and always have (don't get me started on that!) so I doubt he's ever sat down and paid bills in his life, at least for all of his own expenses... so here's what I'm faced with.

Despite the fact that I've been doing quite well with the "no expectations" thing in the present, I have a "list"... I know, bad sign. But I still do. It is a list of things he would have to do before I would want to start a life with him... most recently brought to a head by the idea of marriage, which he's presented ever since we "reconnected" (we were together for over three years, so it's not insane if not for the fact that he is currently semi-incarcerated!).

So here's the list...

1. He needs to get a job. Being part of his family is not a job, IMO.

2. He needs to get his own place and take care of it... that includes paying bills, keeping it clean, not causing it to light on fire... etc.

3. He needs to be responsible for his stuff and take care of it... vehicle, health insurance, generaly "Big Boy" stuff.

That's really all I've got. But I know it's not appropriate for me to demand these "expectations" from him.. trouble is, I'm not sure that changing the phrasing... i.e., "I won't accept a relationship with a person who lives with his 'rents" really changes the meaning of any of it. Should I just sit down with him and have one conversation about it? My mom's been sober for four years, and this is what she suggested. She said to get out my expectations, not hide them - but of course, she's an "interested party".

I wish I could talk to my old sponsor about this, but she's actually the one who hooked me up with Mr. Socially Acceptable, so it's all weird with us. I literally don't have the time to make the ONE Alanon meeting within 100 miles of us because of a work commitment that night I can't get out of, either.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

rozied

Dear Trying, You said if anyone was interested to go back and read your old posts regarding this boyfriend. Well I did and here is a portion of one of your own posts about him:
" I too have been having suspicions that ABF was using again... he didn't even admit it to me, and I decided this weekend to break it off. His constant "trouble" is really making me concerned about my own safety and my career as well... if he needs to abuse substances so very bad, then it is also possible that he could throw me under the bus, you know? And there are lots of people who wouldn't want a person whose significant other is a drug user dealing with their confidential, personal financial and legal information... and I respect that.
I guess bottom line was I loved him, but I couldn't risk all of the things I had worked for for this relationship, because this relationship can't pay me or feed me or all of the other things that I would need if I couldn't work... but I still feel like my heart has been ripped out. "
You wrote this March 07
I think the best thing you can do is to go back and read all your own posts about this guy, then you can decide for yourself if you want to risk it. It is not easy dealing with the emotional pain of leaving someone we love but it can be done. Its all up to you.

Love,
Diane

hope213

first off you can not make him do anything. if i were you i would take it slow & easy. set boundries but let him make his choices & give him plenty of time to find himself. i hope he stays clean. making changes is the other side of being clean. i hope this is his time.

funkzter

Hi girl,

I, too, tend to have a "list" for when Rain's come back but the number one is that he doesn't relapse. It's actually probably my only condition for him to stay with us as the rest usually follows if he is clean.
Of course my family is more couscious: my dad especially tell me that i should ask for him to get a job + money before allowing him to get back home. Easier said than done: we have a baby together and i honnestly won't be able to pull off our relationship more. But, who knows, one year in rehab is a long time. By the end of it, i might have 100 pages of "to do and not to do".
But you it's sooner...so i guess you need to think quicker than me ;P
In your case though, with the long break in between and the fact that you just started again, i advise you to take it slow and see how it goes.
Take care & keep posted!
xox
Carine

justanothrdrunk

You forgot:
1. stay sober
2. treat you and others with respect

Trying_in_Texas

Wow... kind of surprised by the response from "family and friends" here.

That's cool though... I've expected worse. I guess I should have clarified that I am willing to take the risk in this situation. So it's not a "what if"... it's a "when"... perhaps I am a hopeless and naive soul, but I do believe people can get better. I actually know it, as my mother is about to have her four-year sobriety birthday.

Ann

My thoughts lean toward giving this time, taking things very slowly and letting him sort out his future plans for work and living arrangements by himself.

Pressuring anyone with a list of expectations doesn`t allow them to make good decisions all by themselves. He may want to do the things on your list, and might feel better about them if he is the one directing the process.

He is early recovery, new out of rehab and ready to try recovery out in the real world. Let him and keep your focus on your own recovery. Just because you can`t make meetings, doesn`t mean you can`t work on building a strong foundation of recovery for yourself.

Sometimes it`s good to not direct the play of life, sometimes it`s good to just sit back and let the scenes unfold and then decide if you want to stay in the theatre.

Hugs

Momsrainbow

AH will be out of prison (mfg. meth) in less than 100 days. Seems like many have lists for when they come home.

No list here. Parole board has a list. He knows what he should and should not do. Decisions are his and his alone.

I have a list for ME.......what I will not accept and what I will not do. This my be selfish on my part-but that is how it will work.

hello-kitty

Hi. You can't control another adult by telling them what they can and cannot do. But what you can do is make a list personal boundaries - what you find acceptable in your life and what you will do if your personal boundaries are violated.

For example:

Respect is important to me. Therefore I will not accept behavior towards me that is disrespectful. If I feel someone has disrespected me I will ask them to leave my house.

I will not accept drug use around me. Therefore if I suspect someone close to me is using drugs, I will ask them to leave my house. If they refuse I will call the police.

Being self-supportive is important to me. Therefore I will not allow freeloaders to lay around my house. People who live with me must contribute financially or they must find somewhere else to live.

I am not a maid. Therefore I will not clean up after others. If someone leaves a mess in my house, I expect them to clean it up without asking. If they do not clean up after themselves, I will tell them to find somewhere else to live. They have 1 week before I change the locks. If they try to get in again after I asked them to leave, I will call the police and report a trespasser...

And

I have the right to change my personal boundaries at any time. They are mine. If someone doesn't like it, they have the right to leave and not come back.

Cupicake

I'm not here to stop you from doing anything. We all have to make our choices.
One thing I learned here is that you can not, will not ever be able to control anothers actions or manipulate their behaviors to suit us. You made a list, which I'm sure grows by the minute. I know mine did when my exhusband was getting out of rehab. My list consisted of "You need to's" and "You have to's" instead of what it really should have been which is "I need to" and "I have to".
Only you know what you can and can not live with. But the key is really actually "knowing it" and being protective of your boundaries because of it.

laurie6781

Having been on both sides of the fence, sounds like 'your list' is a way of trying one more time to 'control' and 'fix' and get him to 'fit into your world.'

And since it will be just after completing a 90 day rehab, it's not bloody likely to happen in all honesty.

The fog will be barely lifting, and he will have a lot of work to do on himself.

You say you don't have expectations, but I have to say, your 'list' says you do.

Instead of a 'list.' Sit back and watch. Continue to work on you, and watch his actions.

You will save yourself a whole bunch of emotional pain.

J M H O

Love and hugs,

Trying_in_Texas

Thanks for all the responses... "supportive" as I would have seen it and otherwise.

Ex-ABF has actually answered the question, which was a more appropriate one for him anyhow... he has his own expectations for himself that are beyond even mine and he's actually working very hard, in a realistic fashion, to reach those. So I'll get back to my business, and he can work on his.

As always, I try to remember that no one knows our own situations here and our own hearts but us... and I really do appreciate all of your time in responding to me. It is always a hard road to contemplate being involved with an addict, by choice or otherwise. And as always, I wish you all the serenity and peace I'm usually chasing after!

Have a good week!

SlvrMag

My first thought was, should one REALLY have to tell an adult all these things?

Trying_in_Texas

SlvrMag... you wouldn't think so, but (and no offense, since I see your happy news in your footer) - in my experience, most addicts don't necessarily act like adults msot of the time. My mother is a recovering addict too, and she did not do any of those listed things either - just wasn't quite as apparent since my dad was there to do them for her. I know there are functional addicts out there, but I've never been close to one! All mine are very non-functional!

Anyhow, things have gotten much better since this post. I am truly handling my own "stuff" right now and he is handling his, and I don't really need anyone else to justify my decisions these days, which is nice. I enjoy being able to run all of this by those with more experience than me, in here and in meetings, but when it comes down to it I have to make up my own mind. So I'm enjoying the relief I have in being alone right now and look forward to the future!

lightseeker

Boundaries only work if you have consequences that you are willing to stick with. Expectations are premeditated resentments so I know that I do better when I set my boundaries vs. telling someone else what I expect of them. You can't tell him what to do but you can decide what circumstances you will live with - or not. If you tell him what is necessary to be in a relationship with you and he doesn't choose to do that it's up to you to change the situation.

It sounds like you have some concerns about his doing the things that you want in a relationship....(all reasonable in my opinion). Decided whether or not you will be in a relationship with him if he does not do what you need. It's a slippery slope and Melody Beattie's stuff helps me to keep things more clear.

Hope that things work out for you! Hugs.

winnie12

In your defense some of us are "list people" it helps us determine what is important to us and helps to organize our own thoughts/feelings. My sister did the same thing when she became engaged with a very immature man that she loved deeply - her list was similar to yours. He didnt complete all these "adult" items on her list and she called it off - it was extremely hard for her but she stuck to her values. So my questions are (1) are you willing to stop seeing him if he doesnt comply with your list; and (2) since you didnt list his addiction are you willing to accept his addiction as part of your life? I was told in alanon meetings that you either have to move on from the addict or accept the addict's behavior because you cannot change them - some people do feel the relationship is important enough to put up the lifestyle. neither is the right answer it just has to be what you can live with. If you do feel you can live with it now I highly suggest attending some meetings and finding out what that may mean for you. You're not married yet so make sure you're sure before taking that step. Personally I have found that marriage should benefit your life not make it more difficult - but that's just the opinion of someone whose been around the block with more than one addict.

Trying_in_Texas

My problem is, I guess when it comes down to it sometimes it seems to me that boundaries and expectations are exactly the same thing, though - just phrased differently.

For example - let's say that the thing is J doesn't want to be with D if he continues to be an active addict. She can say, "I expect you not to do drugs if you want to be with me" or she can say "I have created a boundary that I will not spend time with you if you are using drugs." I understand that maybe the subtleties of it are that you aren't telling somewhat what to do, but rather making a decision for yourself... but the bottom line in either situation is that if D uses drugs then J is out. It seems to me to be the same thing, just a different way of phrasing it and perhaps thinking about it.

Maybe it's more healthy to view it as though you have a choice... as opposed to someone taking away your choices by using. But I really believe that whether its an "expectation" or a "boundary", you're still going to find some resentment present if someone you are trying to have a relationship with does something that you've either expected them not to do or have chosen not to participate in/be around/be a part of/watch...