where is normal?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Chatham, Ontario
Posts: 5
where is normal?
I have been dealing with alcoholism and addiction for a long time ( more than 15 years). I can't seem to accept the 12 step program. Why do I have to admit that I am powerless? I really feel that I have done nothing wrong and don't deserve the crap that has been heaped on me. We have taken over 100K out out of our retirement and in a small town have been the brunt of jokes and talk for far too long. I want to feel better and want to love my huband but, now that he is in rehab again, he thinks that he does not have to do anything with his family to recover. I told him that if he wants to go to a lonely apartment and lick his arrogant and selfish wounds than he should not do anything but if he expects his family to be there when he is done then he has alot of amends to make...Am I wrong?
remember to breathe
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: philadelphia pa
Posts: 1,280
i think the 12 steps should be used by everyone, it would be a better world. but different strokes for different folks.
and as far as making amends....i think thats step 7.
admitting you are powerless doesn't mean you are powerless with everything, you are powerless over the addiction, the obessions,or that one thing that drives you crazy.
i remember when I first looked at the steps, I was still very angry that "I' had to do anything, after all i didn't have the drug problem. over time i read the steps in a different way, like an opening of my eyes (oh gosh that sounds dramatic) but true, it was an aha moment for me.
good luck in your search for serenity.
and as far as making amends....i think thats step 7.
admitting you are powerless doesn't mean you are powerless with everything, you are powerless over the addiction, the obessions,or that one thing that drives you crazy.
i remember when I first looked at the steps, I was still very angry that "I' had to do anything, after all i didn't have the drug problem. over time i read the steps in a different way, like an opening of my eyes (oh gosh that sounds dramatic) but true, it was an aha moment for me.
good luck in your search for serenity.
Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Burnsville, MN
Posts: 966
whennormal,
Welcome to SR.
I know I felt anger and resentment for having to attend Al-Anon or Nar-Anon, for having to work a program, etc. But now I wouldn't do it any other way . . . these are the things that keep me sane, help me to be strong, offer me support, goods ideas, words of wisdom and love.
Keep reading, keep posting and check out Al-Anon or Nar-Anon meetings in your area to keep you and your family strong.
Welcome to SR.
I know I felt anger and resentment for having to attend Al-Anon or Nar-Anon, for having to work a program, etc. But now I wouldn't do it any other way . . . these are the things that keep me sane, help me to be strong, offer me support, goods ideas, words of wisdom and love.
Keep reading, keep posting and check out Al-Anon or Nar-Anon meetings in your area to keep you and your family strong.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Earth School
Posts: 137
Step 1 - "We are powerless over alcohol...no matter who drinks it"
Originally Posted by whennormal 
I have been dealing with alcoholism and addiction for a long time (more than 15 years). Why do I have to admit that I am powerless?
Originally Posted by whennormal
I really feel that I have done nothing wrong and don't deserve the crap that has been heaped on me.
Is that wrong? No. Yet, you chose to stay with this man for whatever reason and with that, comes his disease. If he had cancer or TB or dementia or, or, or...., would you be saying this? Most people can handle it being any other disease except alcoholism. It is no different. Since you choose to be with this man, then I suggest you learn everything you can about the disease and get some help for yourself too. Alanon or therapy is a good place to start 
Originally Posted by whennormal
I told him that if he wants to go to a lonely apartment and lick his arrogant and selfish wounds than he should not do anything but if he expects his family to be there when he is done then he has alot of amends to make...Am I wrong?
I wish you well on this journey. It's not fun for him or any member of the family. It is a family disease. Alcoholism affects alot more than just the person.
Be well ........
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,126
Well......hummmmmmmmm
"...Why do I have to admit that I am powerless?..." --- Like scorpiogirl said, you may not be powerless over everything in the world, but you are powerless over the A in your life.....thaza fact, jack.... (o:
"...I really feel that I have done nothing wrong and don't deserve the crap that has been heaped on me..." --- I used to feel exactly like that, until I realized that I was doing a lot of the 'heaping.' Just by being/staying with my A, I was endorsing his/her stuff, and enabling him/her along the way.....and somewhere along that way, I got lost..... )o:
"...he thinks that he does not have to do anything with his family to recover..." --- Well, technically, he doesn't HAVE to do anything, with or without his family. Alcoholism/Addiction being a 'family' disease, everybody needs to realize that they all need to recover for themselves (or not) (we all have our own recovery programs/steps, whether they be alanon or naranon or or or), and they're usually different recoveries.....but in the end they do seem to meld into a happy healthy family.....somewhere on that 'happy road of destiny' [whoops, forgot I was in the F&F of 'Substance' Abusers.....but in truth, I seem them all on that path..... (o: ].
"...if he expects his family to be there when he is done then he has alot of amends to make...Am I wrong?..." --- at this one I gotta let out a big, "Whoa, hold up there nellie." As a previous poster noted, amends are far down the list of steps [numbers 8 (where we make a list and become willing....) and 9 (where we actually make the amends). and, NOBODY gets to tell anybody what their amends should be and to whom they should be made. I've made amends to some folks (all the while thinking that I'd hear back from them regarding things they'd done to me.....hah, definitely not a good motive for making an amends). When I got them all straightened out, and done with better motives.....I felt soooooo much better.....and for me, that's what and for whom amends are for......ME (o:
You may want to take a good look at alanon/naranon.....The way I see them, there are two major things I've learned through them....: 1) If I choose to stay with my A, I have learned healthy ways for me to do so.....ways where I still feel good about myself; and 2) If I choose to leave my A, I can do so in a healthy way.....hurting as few folks as possible. ..... There are lots of other good things in alanon/naranon, but these are the main things that helped me the most......perhaps they can help you also....?
NoelleR
P.S. Where is normal? Isn't Normal in Illinois, or Indiana, or Kentucky.....? Yup, yup, yup.....lol
"...Why do I have to admit that I am powerless?..." --- Like scorpiogirl said, you may not be powerless over everything in the world, but you are powerless over the A in your life.....thaza fact, jack.... (o:
"...I really feel that I have done nothing wrong and don't deserve the crap that has been heaped on me..." --- I used to feel exactly like that, until I realized that I was doing a lot of the 'heaping.' Just by being/staying with my A, I was endorsing his/her stuff, and enabling him/her along the way.....and somewhere along that way, I got lost..... )o:
"...he thinks that he does not have to do anything with his family to recover..." --- Well, technically, he doesn't HAVE to do anything, with or without his family. Alcoholism/Addiction being a 'family' disease, everybody needs to realize that they all need to recover for themselves (or not) (we all have our own recovery programs/steps, whether they be alanon or naranon or or or), and they're usually different recoveries.....but in the end they do seem to meld into a happy healthy family.....somewhere on that 'happy road of destiny' [whoops, forgot I was in the F&F of 'Substance' Abusers.....but in truth, I seem them all on that path..... (o: ].
"...if he expects his family to be there when he is done then he has alot of amends to make...Am I wrong?..." --- at this one I gotta let out a big, "Whoa, hold up there nellie." As a previous poster noted, amends are far down the list of steps [numbers 8 (where we make a list and become willing....) and 9 (where we actually make the amends). and, NOBODY gets to tell anybody what their amends should be and to whom they should be made. I've made amends to some folks (all the while thinking that I'd hear back from them regarding things they'd done to me.....hah, definitely not a good motive for making an amends). When I got them all straightened out, and done with better motives.....I felt soooooo much better.....and for me, that's what and for whom amends are for......ME (o:
You may want to take a good look at alanon/naranon.....The way I see them, there are two major things I've learned through them....: 1) If I choose to stay with my A, I have learned healthy ways for me to do so.....ways where I still feel good about myself; and 2) If I choose to leave my A, I can do so in a healthy way.....hurting as few folks as possible. ..... There are lots of other good things in alanon/naranon, but these are the main things that helped me the most......perhaps they can help you also....?
NoelleR
P.S. Where is normal? Isn't Normal in Illinois, or Indiana, or Kentucky.....? Yup, yup, yup.....lol
Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Earth School
Posts: 137
.....hold up there Nellie......
Originally Posted by NoelleR
"...if he expects his family to be there when he is done then he has alot of amends to make...Am I wrong?..." --- at this one I gotta let out a big, "Whoa, hold up there nellie."
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: To the North
Posts: 1,086
Your "recovery" is for you. For me, when I looked around me, my AH was not my only draining relationship. I knew that if I wanted to feel different around my friends and family - it wasn't their job to change, they are who they are, it was up to me to change the way I reacted to them. So, I did - I got help, and I figured out how to set boundaries, in a nice healthy way, I learned what it means to compassionate and supportive, and the biggest news to me was the way I was doing it before (much more "actively), was not really a good way to show compassion and support - those around me seem to respond and appreciate the "new" me much more.
I think when we first start this most of us feel the way you do, why do we have to do even MORE? Greeneyedgirl most recently asked this question also - might see if you can find her first post and read the responses (think it was within the last 2-3 weeks). IMO, whether it's via 12 steps, or some other way, learning what it will take for you to feel happy and peaceful - with or without your addict, is worth it ... FOR YOU! We're so used to that everything we do is for our A, that I think it feels like getting help for ourselves dealing with their addiction and behaviors feels like it's one more thing we're doing for them, but the truth is, this is for US, so after spending years and years of effort on them, why are we all of a sudden so ready to say enough when we finally get to a point where we can actually help ourselves? I learned, when I started my journey, that it really had very little to do with my AH, it was all about me!
12 steps is not the only way, if that's not something you are comfortable with, but don't give up on yourself! You deserve some care, understanding and healthy attention!
I think when we first start this most of us feel the way you do, why do we have to do even MORE? Greeneyedgirl most recently asked this question also - might see if you can find her first post and read the responses (think it was within the last 2-3 weeks). IMO, whether it's via 12 steps, or some other way, learning what it will take for you to feel happy and peaceful - with or without your addict, is worth it ... FOR YOU! We're so used to that everything we do is for our A, that I think it feels like getting help for ourselves dealing with their addiction and behaviors feels like it's one more thing we're doing for them, but the truth is, this is for US, so after spending years and years of effort on them, why are we all of a sudden so ready to say enough when we finally get to a point where we can actually help ourselves? I learned, when I started my journey, that it really had very little to do with my AH, it was all about me!
12 steps is not the only way, if that's not something you are comfortable with, but don't give up on yourself! You deserve some care, understanding and healthy attention!
Turning it all around
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Florida
Posts: 330
WhenNormal,
Welcome, I feel your frustration in the lack of control. Realizing that you don't have control will eliminate the frustration. Control is like trying to stick a square peg into a round hole! Try as you might, it just doesn't work. So stop trying.
I don't do the AA thing or the 12 steps. I never did like the meetings, believe me, I've tried. The problem was with me, not how I interacted with people. Who better to tell me of my problems than me. Who better to fix them than me. It was all about me.
SR is my therapy, writing is what helps me. Reading my own words unencumbered by addiction allows me to see clearly what I feel and need for recovery. It really doesn't matter how one recovers, it matters only that they do. Your husband MUST desire recovery. Forcing one to quit only backfires. They'll use any negative to justify the use for escape. It was the many subtle things that got me to take a look at myself. All I can suggest is to be as sneaky as the "hold" itself. Help him to see himself! Try to do this without any negativity. This will only work when he is not drinking! Keep posting! I hope this helps. Prayers
Welcome, I feel your frustration in the lack of control. Realizing that you don't have control will eliminate the frustration. Control is like trying to stick a square peg into a round hole! Try as you might, it just doesn't work. So stop trying.
I don't do the AA thing or the 12 steps. I never did like the meetings, believe me, I've tried. The problem was with me, not how I interacted with people. Who better to tell me of my problems than me. Who better to fix them than me. It was all about me.
SR is my therapy, writing is what helps me. Reading my own words unencumbered by addiction allows me to see clearly what I feel and need for recovery. It really doesn't matter how one recovers, it matters only that they do. Your husband MUST desire recovery. Forcing one to quit only backfires. They'll use any negative to justify the use for escape. It was the many subtle things that got me to take a look at myself. All I can suggest is to be as sneaky as the "hold" itself. Help him to see himself! Try to do this without any negativity. This will only work when he is not drinking! Keep posting! I hope this helps. Prayers
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,287
We're so used to that everything we do is for our A, that I think it feels like getting help for ourselves dealing with their addiction and behaviors feels like it's one more thing we're doing for them, but the truth is, this is for US, so after spending years and years of effort on them, why are we all of a sudden so ready to say enough when we finally get to a point where we can actually help ourselves? I learned, when I started my journey, that it really had very little to do with my AH, it was all about me!
Whennormal, you asked if you were wrong. IMO I see you making up your mind about what you want and what you need for your relationship to work out. That isn't wrong. 12 steps or not, do you have a plan and/or a clear idea of what you will need to stay with your AH? And if things don't work out, do you know what you are willing and ready to do then?
Of course, only you know what you really want. Listen to your heart, give yourself time, and take care of you. Nothing wrong with that.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Chatham, Ontario
Posts: 5
Thank you to everyone who has tried to help me. I really am surprised by all the posts.
I live in a small town where my husband is in an influential job and I am self-employed using his job as my stepping stone. The rumors and jokes, etc... have not stopped for over 2 years. We have 3 teenagers. Life is hell.
I don't want to do the 12 steps. For whatever reason I don't want to....
He should be FAR down the 12 steps as he has left "us" 5-6 nights per week for recovery for years only to end up in treatment again last week. I do want amends. I want my family back and I want my life back. I honestly don't know how to do it. I am worn out. I have taken on so much responsibility that I can't even see.......the light at the end of the tunnel.... Is it about the light at the end of the tunnel or just trying to get there?
I live in a small town where my husband is in an influential job and I am self-employed using his job as my stepping stone. The rumors and jokes, etc... have not stopped for over 2 years. We have 3 teenagers. Life is hell.
I don't want to do the 12 steps. For whatever reason I don't want to....
He should be FAR down the 12 steps as he has left "us" 5-6 nights per week for recovery for years only to end up in treatment again last week. I do want amends. I want my family back and I want my life back. I honestly don't know how to do it. I am worn out. I have taken on so much responsibility that I can't even see.......the light at the end of the tunnel.... Is it about the light at the end of the tunnel or just trying to get there?
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: To the North
Posts: 1,086
WhenNormal - For now, in my opinion, focus on what is and what you need to go forward from here. Going back is tough, in any circumstances. Your life is what it is right NOW, not what it was or what you wanted it to be. YOU are the only one who can make your life what you want it to be.
Hugs - sorry for all you are going thru, it's not an easy road by any means.
Hugs - sorry for all you are going thru, it's not an easy road by any means.
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