in a complete state of shock
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: in the south
Posts: 219
in a complete state of shock
friends,
I found out that the counselor my son and his wife are seeing does not accept insurance. Since I decided to COBRA my son's insurance I asked the person who told me this why would a therapist not accept the insurance my son had.....the reason....the therapist is NOT certified and NOT recognized by ANY insurance company. Oh, I was sick!
I later learned this is a charismatic counselor and the first things that they "drill" into the addict is that no, you do NOT have a disease and two you do not need AA. The only thing you need is the church. At least this is what I have been told.
I posted back sometime ago that my AS said he didn't have "time" for AA what with two jobs, going to counseling, and church on Sunday. See the separation for AA? Already happening and with a provided reason.
I don't think an unlicensed therapist is going to be much help, that's for sure and what little money my son has he gives to the therapist in payment. I don't know if his wife contributes at all toward payment.....but factor this in because I am going to let it all out.....here goes...........
I KNOW my son was wrong in what he did. I make no excuses BUT he is working two jobs and sleeping on the floor of an AA members house (paying rent) HE BIKES TO WORK BECAUSE THE WIFE WON'T GIVE HIM A CAR (SHE HAS TWO) and one of them is paid for and in my son's name plus she lives in a home with three bedrooms and we gave this house free and clear to my son BEFORE we knew he had a problem. So she and my grandson reside there in a lovely 3 bedroom house while my son sleeps on the floor of a friend's house, bikes to work (3 miles one way) works two jobs and gives her money . All the while going to this charismatic counselor so his wife can DECIDE if she wants to try again.
As I've mentioned in recent posts my son had a relapse in early June. He had just completed a six months program.....lasted six weeks and relapsed. Since that time I've had no contact with him but my uncle stays in touch with him. So I guess I continue down the same path and say nothing about this so called counselor. I might add that my son is easily swayed and he was hooked into The International Church OF Christ for about six months when he was in college and it was not a good situation. We had to go through deprogramming and everything.....so in other words he really is an easy target......so what do I do? Just stay quiet when I know he needs medication and a qualified therapist? If I say anything and cause waves then I'll be blamed forever more plus.....so any ideas out there? thanks in advance.......dixie
I found out that the counselor my son and his wife are seeing does not accept insurance. Since I decided to COBRA my son's insurance I asked the person who told me this why would a therapist not accept the insurance my son had.....the reason....the therapist is NOT certified and NOT recognized by ANY insurance company. Oh, I was sick!
I later learned this is a charismatic counselor and the first things that they "drill" into the addict is that no, you do NOT have a disease and two you do not need AA. The only thing you need is the church. At least this is what I have been told.
I posted back sometime ago that my AS said he didn't have "time" for AA what with two jobs, going to counseling, and church on Sunday. See the separation for AA? Already happening and with a provided reason.
I don't think an unlicensed therapist is going to be much help, that's for sure and what little money my son has he gives to the therapist in payment. I don't know if his wife contributes at all toward payment.....but factor this in because I am going to let it all out.....here goes...........
I KNOW my son was wrong in what he did. I make no excuses BUT he is working two jobs and sleeping on the floor of an AA members house (paying rent) HE BIKES TO WORK BECAUSE THE WIFE WON'T GIVE HIM A CAR (SHE HAS TWO) and one of them is paid for and in my son's name plus she lives in a home with three bedrooms and we gave this house free and clear to my son BEFORE we knew he had a problem. So she and my grandson reside there in a lovely 3 bedroom house while my son sleeps on the floor of a friend's house, bikes to work (3 miles one way) works two jobs and gives her money . All the while going to this charismatic counselor so his wife can DECIDE if she wants to try again.
As I've mentioned in recent posts my son had a relapse in early June. He had just completed a six months program.....lasted six weeks and relapsed. Since that time I've had no contact with him but my uncle stays in touch with him. So I guess I continue down the same path and say nothing about this so called counselor. I might add that my son is easily swayed and he was hooked into The International Church OF Christ for about six months when he was in college and it was not a good situation. We had to go through deprogramming and everything.....so in other words he really is an easy target......so what do I do? Just stay quiet when I know he needs medication and a qualified therapist? If I say anything and cause waves then I'll be blamed forever more plus.....so any ideas out there? thanks in advance.......dixie
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
Dixie, I know how all this can upset us, and wouldn't it be nice if they would just do what we think is right for them and get well and never use again?
If only it were so, not one of us would be here.
It's hard at times like this to believe "Hands Off the Addict, Hands Off His Recovery too." But the truth is, only they can find their path and even choosing a path that we don't like just may be the path of hardship that leads them to the path of recovery.
Expectations were my worst enemy. I expected my son to do the right things, get clean and stay clean. If he competed a program, I expected him to continue to do the "do" things and hold on to his sobriety. But expectations only led me to disappointment because in the end, my son chose his own way.
The good thing is, God doesn't operate on our expectations, and I have learned to trust that He is watching over my son and yours and that one day His light will touch their hearts and they will find that better path.
Sending special hugs and prayers for you and your son.
Hugs
If only it were so, not one of us would be here.
It's hard at times like this to believe "Hands Off the Addict, Hands Off His Recovery too." But the truth is, only they can find their path and even choosing a path that we don't like just may be the path of hardship that leads them to the path of recovery.
Expectations were my worst enemy. I expected my son to do the right things, get clean and stay clean. If he competed a program, I expected him to continue to do the "do" things and hold on to his sobriety. But expectations only led me to disappointment because in the end, my son chose his own way.
The good thing is, God doesn't operate on our expectations, and I have learned to trust that He is watching over my son and yours and that one day His light will touch their hearts and they will find that better path.
Sending special hugs and prayers for you and your son.
Hugs
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: in the south
Posts: 219
ann,
I do understand and appreciate what you are saying. I know you are right. But it is hard for me now and I think that he is very fragile and I don't want him to be taken advantage of and to tell you the truth I know his thinking and sorting things out is not what it used to be. In other words (how do I put this?) I believe his thinking/reasoning is not on target. I have done the hands off but somewhere inside me i am wrestling with the thoughts of what if.....what if I do say something? What if I don't? Oh good grief! It just smacks of exploitation to me (the counseling)....sort of like snake oil........I know this post doesn't make sense but its what I FEEL.....just need to get it out.....so thanks for letting me........and for your kindness...dixie
I do understand and appreciate what you are saying. I know you are right. But it is hard for me now and I think that he is very fragile and I don't want him to be taken advantage of and to tell you the truth I know his thinking and sorting things out is not what it used to be. In other words (how do I put this?) I believe his thinking/reasoning is not on target. I have done the hands off but somewhere inside me i am wrestling with the thoughts of what if.....what if I do say something? What if I don't? Oh good grief! It just smacks of exploitation to me (the counseling)....sort of like snake oil........I know this post doesn't make sense but its what I FEEL.....just need to get it out.....so thanks for letting me........and for your kindness...dixie
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 204
Be careful with what your son is telling you about the therapist. DO check credentials and DO get a Certified ONE! (Call your local APA or NASW) Your insurance company should also have a phone number on the back of your ID card that says "For mental illness or substance abuse, call this number" because there are different benefit levels for therapy/counseling. Your insurance company should have a separate managed care unit for mental llness/substance abuse, contact them and see about a referral. If you don't have one in your network near you, you could still however get an outside network one for inside network benefits. With MOST insurances you must pre-certifify therapy/counseling BEFORE going. Most people don't know this and only find out after they have gone a few times and get the insurance company denial in the mail. A good therapist/counselor will also help you with the pre-cert and claims filing.
There are some great counselors and therapists out there and many who have actually dealt with their own addictions or codependency (I hate that word)
Sometimes the first one is not the right one. But you would be surprised at the stories addicts will come up with. My xhb told me that his counselor assigned to him after his first stance in jail, that he wouldn't recover unless I let him come home and supported him" LOL
Thankfully I didn't buy into it. He admits now it was ******** and the counselor was a very good one.
There are some great counselors and therapists out there and many who have actually dealt with their own addictions or codependency (I hate that word)
Sometimes the first one is not the right one. But you would be surprised at the stories addicts will come up with. My xhb told me that his counselor assigned to him after his first stance in jail, that he wouldn't recover unless I let him come home and supported him" LOL
Thankfully I didn't buy into it. He admits now it was ******** and the counselor was a very good one.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: in the south
Posts: 219
jewelz,
thank you for the support andv I definitely did not mean to trigger anything but am just having a hard time as a mom observing and feeling apprehension. To my credit, I have not said one word in regards to this treatment method. I know I should not. It is their baggage but this is my only son and I just feel sad that this is how his life turned out. My mother (who is elderly and has been devastated by this as well as my dad) says that my sons wife should just make up her mind one way or the other instead of going back and forth always in limbo and dragging both sides of the family in with her indecision. I tell my mom it isn't that easy or cut and dried . My parents philosophy is "fish or cut bait" and I would be wasting my breath to try and change them due to their age and the fact that they don't know (nor should they at their age...) everything my son has done. I am just a mom that is sad and worried for her child.......thank you for letting me have a place to express this...dixie
thank you for the support andv I definitely did not mean to trigger anything but am just having a hard time as a mom observing and feeling apprehension. To my credit, I have not said one word in regards to this treatment method. I know I should not. It is their baggage but this is my only son and I just feel sad that this is how his life turned out. My mother (who is elderly and has been devastated by this as well as my dad) says that my sons wife should just make up her mind one way or the other instead of going back and forth always in limbo and dragging both sides of the family in with her indecision. I tell my mom it isn't that easy or cut and dried . My parents philosophy is "fish or cut bait" and I would be wasting my breath to try and change them due to their age and the fact that they don't know (nor should they at their age...) everything my son has done. I am just a mom that is sad and worried for her child.......thank you for letting me have a place to express this...dixie
Living in the light
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sweet Home Serenity
Posts: 706
Here are my thoughts on hands and mind off the addict.
When my son was growing up, as his Mom, I had a job to do. My job was to raise him well, to love, protect, teach and guide him. I knew what he needed from me then and I did my job well. He became an addict and changed. I needed to change too or stay obsessed, ill-at-ease, frustrated by my own expectations, sick at heart,
in a nutshell, miserable.
It is sad for Moms when a beloved son or daughter is an addict. I will
always feel some sadness for the way ASs life has been in addiction.
Today it is no longer my place, right, business or job to know best what he needs to do, how and when. By keeping my mind and hands off the addict, I accept he has his own life to live as I have mine. I can pray for him and wish him well always but I cannot afford to ride the merrygoround of his life.
Today I know where he is. He is in prison. In prison, he gets religion and that's okay because that is what works for him in his life at this time. I have no idea if he will ever get into any of the programs that help addicts overcome addiction. He has managed to stay clean for periods of time. I know longer have the old burning need to know is he or isn't he clean. I do have the burning desire today to take care of my
own business in my own life and live well. AS is in HPs hands.
When my son was growing up, as his Mom, I had a job to do. My job was to raise him well, to love, protect, teach and guide him. I knew what he needed from me then and I did my job well. He became an addict and changed. I needed to change too or stay obsessed, ill-at-ease, frustrated by my own expectations, sick at heart,
in a nutshell, miserable.
It is sad for Moms when a beloved son or daughter is an addict. I will
always feel some sadness for the way ASs life has been in addiction.
Today it is no longer my place, right, business or job to know best what he needs to do, how and when. By keeping my mind and hands off the addict, I accept he has his own life to live as I have mine. I can pray for him and wish him well always but I cannot afford to ride the merrygoround of his life.
Today I know where he is. He is in prison. In prison, he gets religion and that's okay because that is what works for him in his life at this time. I have no idea if he will ever get into any of the programs that help addicts overcome addiction. He has managed to stay clean for periods of time. I know longer have the old burning need to know is he or isn't he clean. I do have the burning desire today to take care of my
own business in my own life and live well. AS is in HPs hands.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: in the south
Posts: 219
frankie and doing well,
frankie thanks for the post . I will print and carry it with me when I become anxious I will read and reread it. And doing well, thanks for the info. I know for a fact that the therapist has NO credentials that an insurnace company will recognize. I know this because the last therapist my son dealt with told me so. This charismatic therapist does NOT file ANY insurance whatsoever. It is cash or check only upfront on each visit. No submission of forms.....why.........because they are not licensed and have not had formalized training. They are connected with a charismatic church working off premise......so I did check and found out from a reputable source that that is what the story is. So i guess they will continue as it should be and again at this point I have not made my feelings known but I can't promise that I won't. It is hard for me . I am taking one day at a time.....thank you for all of your input........dixie
frankie thanks for the post . I will print and carry it with me when I become anxious I will read and reread it. And doing well, thanks for the info. I know for a fact that the therapist has NO credentials that an insurnace company will recognize. I know this because the last therapist my son dealt with told me so. This charismatic therapist does NOT file ANY insurance whatsoever. It is cash or check only upfront on each visit. No submission of forms.....why.........because they are not licensed and have not had formalized training. They are connected with a charismatic church working off premise......so I did check and found out from a reputable source that that is what the story is. So i guess they will continue as it should be and again at this point I have not made my feelings known but I can't promise that I won't. It is hard for me . I am taking one day at a time.....thank you for all of your input........dixie
Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: SC
Posts: 1,027
To my credit, I have not said one word in regards to this treatment method. I know I should not. It is their baggage but this is my only son and I just feel sad that this is how his life turned out.
On a tear
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Volcano Country!
Posts: 3,221
I remember when my nephew decided to go to a faith based rehab that did not work a 12-step program. He is a meth addict. His parents are very religious and conservative. He was home schooled. He went out into the world at age 18 and was into full-blown addiction within 2 or 3 months.
Oh... I wish I had kept my ideas to myself. I don't think I hid my distaste, or my opinions. I was not rude... but I was unkind.
Then, you can guess what happened, can't you?
Two short years later, my OWN kid admitted she was a meth addict and had been for five years! I shot her RIGHT into a 12-step based rehab... and she came home and relapsed. So I did it again - this time with a recovery house at the end... and she came home and relapsed. In desperation, I even sent her to the faith based rehab... but they kicked her out... and she relapsed. The court sent her to rehab... and she relapsed.
While all this was going on, my nephew was soaring in his recovery... at that same faith based rehab. He was rekindling and repairing some relationships at home. He was "succeeding", while my kid was "failing".
My kid got clean again. My nephew went back out again. Both are clean today. Both have spouses and children and a commitment to being and staying clean and sober.
My opinions about the matter .... didn't make any difference in that respect.
The most honorable one in all of this is my nephews mother... my sis-in-law. She never, EVER uttered one unkind word to me... ever. She never even implied "I told you so". Not once. She has held me when I cried, prayed with me and for me and my kids. She is a very good person.
Whatever works.... works. Even if they paint themselves green and dance naked around a fire at midnight. I don't care. Whatever it is, is part of a Plan far more complex and far-reaching than any I can conceive.
I wish you well.... (((hugs)))
Oh... I wish I had kept my ideas to myself. I don't think I hid my distaste, or my opinions. I was not rude... but I was unkind.
Then, you can guess what happened, can't you?
Two short years later, my OWN kid admitted she was a meth addict and had been for five years! I shot her RIGHT into a 12-step based rehab... and she came home and relapsed. So I did it again - this time with a recovery house at the end... and she came home and relapsed. In desperation, I even sent her to the faith based rehab... but they kicked her out... and she relapsed. The court sent her to rehab... and she relapsed.
While all this was going on, my nephew was soaring in his recovery... at that same faith based rehab. He was rekindling and repairing some relationships at home. He was "succeeding", while my kid was "failing".
My kid got clean again. My nephew went back out again. Both are clean today. Both have spouses and children and a commitment to being and staying clean and sober.
My opinions about the matter .... didn't make any difference in that respect.
The most honorable one in all of this is my nephews mother... my sis-in-law. She never, EVER uttered one unkind word to me... ever. She never even implied "I told you so". Not once. She has held me when I cried, prayed with me and for me and my kids. She is a very good person.
Whatever works.... works. Even if they paint themselves green and dance naked around a fire at midnight. I don't care. Whatever it is, is part of a Plan far more complex and far-reaching than any I can conceive.
I wish you well.... (((hugs)))
Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Mary alice, KY
Posts: 122
Dixied
I am a licensed clinical psychologist. i do support AA, NA and any other support program that is accredited to work. As far as the insurance...If the therapist is not licensed in that particular state then insurance will not cover the visits. That's why there is licensing. We try to weed out the self-taught or the "organic" therapists. Can't you find one that is licensed and will accept the insurance that your son has. ...Viki
I am a licensed clinical psychologist. i do support AA, NA and any other support program that is accredited to work. As far as the insurance...If the therapist is not licensed in that particular state then insurance will not cover the visits. That's why there is licensing. We try to weed out the self-taught or the "organic" therapists. Can't you find one that is licensed and will accept the insurance that your son has. ...Viki
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