I am FURIOUS
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Burgh
Posts: 1,991
I am FURIOUS
I honestly am at a loss as to what to do I'm so mad.
Back in April, after a severe and debilitating stroke my Father was placed in a county nursing home. NO Taj Mahal by any means...a last stop for most on his floor. He can not walk, can barely talk and can not dress, bath or use the bathroom himself.
When my sister and I were checking him in, it was explained that because of new county laws, no smoking was permitted. We had no choice and said "then he won't be smoking" We then met with the social worker, a nice guy, who chuckled and said that many of the residents smoked, and that if he requested, they would take him outside and mentioned that the patients had rights, and that we couldn't NOT allow it. We said "fine" For months, he did not request to be taken outside even though he had cigs in his drawer.
He started asking to be taken out, which the staff did and now has a motorized wheelchair, so he takes himself out.
Both my sister and I received a message today from the social worker that administration saw him outside smoking ("caught him" they said) and if they caught him again he would be kicked out! Kicked out? To where?! Neither my sister or myself are qualified to care for him! To the streets?
They were going to visit him and explain and take his cigarettes. The social worker mentioned that he did if fact explain this on intake and wanted to know where he was getting the cigs. Last week a nurse CALLED me on behalf of my dad asking me to drop some off!
Now, they're all acting like we should have known better, and want US to do something. Stop taking him out!
Like I can control what goes on there 24/7...
This along with financial issues that keep arising from mixed messages from medicaid and their business office. Again, they deny previous comments. And again, my sister and I are supposed to have documents that don't even exist. They are assuming we are his caretakers by law? They get every dime he has coming in, which isn't a fortune, but its more than many have. He has no assets, we have nothing of his.
I left the guy a scathing voicemail. I want someones head on a platter right now, and I think its administration that keeps changing their minds.
I feel SO helpless.
Time to calm down I suppose and plot my action/revenge
Cece
Back in April, after a severe and debilitating stroke my Father was placed in a county nursing home. NO Taj Mahal by any means...a last stop for most on his floor. He can not walk, can barely talk and can not dress, bath or use the bathroom himself.
When my sister and I were checking him in, it was explained that because of new county laws, no smoking was permitted. We had no choice and said "then he won't be smoking" We then met with the social worker, a nice guy, who chuckled and said that many of the residents smoked, and that if he requested, they would take him outside and mentioned that the patients had rights, and that we couldn't NOT allow it. We said "fine" For months, he did not request to be taken outside even though he had cigs in his drawer.
He started asking to be taken out, which the staff did and now has a motorized wheelchair, so he takes himself out.
Both my sister and I received a message today from the social worker that administration saw him outside smoking ("caught him" they said) and if they caught him again he would be kicked out! Kicked out? To where?! Neither my sister or myself are qualified to care for him! To the streets?
They were going to visit him and explain and take his cigarettes. The social worker mentioned that he did if fact explain this on intake and wanted to know where he was getting the cigs. Last week a nurse CALLED me on behalf of my dad asking me to drop some off!
Now, they're all acting like we should have known better, and want US to do something. Stop taking him out!
Like I can control what goes on there 24/7...
This along with financial issues that keep arising from mixed messages from medicaid and their business office. Again, they deny previous comments. And again, my sister and I are supposed to have documents that don't even exist. They are assuming we are his caretakers by law? They get every dime he has coming in, which isn't a fortune, but its more than many have. He has no assets, we have nothing of his.
I left the guy a scathing voicemail. I want someones head on a platter right now, and I think its administration that keeps changing their minds.
I feel SO helpless.
Time to calm down I suppose and plot my action/revenge
Cece
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
I think I'd fight back, Cece. I'd go for a meeting and shoot spades telling them what you just told us here.
And then I'd suggest that THEY are paid to keep watch over their residents and that if they could not ensure that they could do that, perhaps a law suit or two might make them more alert. Mention "law suit" and "having their licence revoked" a couple of times and my guess is that they will bother you no more.
It's hard seeing that an aging parent is cared for, I was the one in my family to make all the arrangements for my mother and tend to any business that arose. It's just hard.
Hugs
And then I'd suggest that THEY are paid to keep watch over their residents and that if they could not ensure that they could do that, perhaps a law suit or two might make them more alert. Mention "law suit" and "having their licence revoked" a couple of times and my guess is that they will bother you no more.
It's hard seeing that an aging parent is cared for, I was the one in my family to make all the arrangements for my mother and tend to any business that arose. It's just hard.
Hugs
Don't get undies in a bunch
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: South Shore MA
Posts: 7,120
Originally Posted by cece1960 
Time to calm down I suppose and plot my action/revenge
Cece
Nurses do... Staff does...
admin....well, they cause problems for all.
If no smoking is the rule... don't bring him any unless you get a nurse or a Dr saying in writing...he can have them.
If your not giving him any and they find him smoking... they would be the ones giving them out and it is their problem to solve...at that point you could yell *LOL*
Starry Girl
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Starry Night
Posts: 251
Darling ((CeCe))
It makes me very very sad how our elders are often treated in our country. Often there is no dignity, there is no true care, there is only greed and miscommunication and bureacracy that piles miles of red tape on those who can no longer care for themselves.
I understand your frustration. It is So so valid. I have no experience to share but I hope things work out the way that is best for your dad. BIG MAJOR HUGS!!!
It makes me very very sad how our elders are often treated in our country. Often there is no dignity, there is no true care, there is only greed and miscommunication and bureacracy that piles miles of red tape on those who can no longer care for themselves.
I understand your frustration. It is So so valid. I have no experience to share but I hope things work out the way that is best for your dad. BIG MAJOR HUGS!!!
Forum Leader
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Burgh
Posts: 1,991
I'm a little calmer now...thanks Ann and Best 
I thought it was best to email the social worker, to allow me to plan my words well. I will follow up with a call tomorrow. I began by letting him know that I didn't "blame" the kind people who care for my dad, or him for that matter, but that I was appalled by the casual threat to kick a man in my fathers condition to the curb. I mentioned most of what I posted here, then thinking of you Ann, concluded with this:
" While I hope it never comes to this, I feel it only fair to mention now that should my father be aided in smoking by a staff member or resident, or should they not take reasonable precautions to prevent him smoking, the next conversation will be had between myself, "administration" and an attorney who acts on behalf of the rights of senior citizens."
I feel better now.
I thought it was best to email the social worker, to allow me to plan my words well. I will follow up with a call tomorrow. I began by letting him know that I didn't "blame" the kind people who care for my dad, or him for that matter, but that I was appalled by the casual threat to kick a man in my fathers condition to the curb. I mentioned most of what I posted here, then thinking of you Ann, concluded with this:
" While I hope it never comes to this, I feel it only fair to mention now that should my father be aided in smoking by a staff member or resident, or should they not take reasonable precautions to prevent him smoking, the next conversation will be had between myself, "administration" and an attorney who acts on behalf of the rights of senior citizens."
I feel better now.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 702
Cece,
I would be ticked off too. It seems they like to play games, and see how far they can get. I would get everything in writing, and maybe even call someone in the state or county level and complain about what is going on.
Take a deep breath, and stay as calm as you can while dealing with this. Yell and vent all you want here, but be nice to them, and just lay it out for them. They take him out, they gave him the wheelchair to go in, They told HIM HE COULD GO OUT AND SMOKE, not you but THEY DID!!!
Good luck,
Hugs coming to you
I would be ticked off too. It seems they like to play games, and see how far they can get. I would get everything in writing, and maybe even call someone in the state or county level and complain about what is going on.
Take a deep breath, and stay as calm as you can while dealing with this. Yell and vent all you want here, but be nice to them, and just lay it out for them. They take him out, they gave him the wheelchair to go in, They told HIM HE COULD GO OUT AND SMOKE, not you but THEY DID!!!
Good luck,
Hugs coming to you
Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: a better place
Posts: 4,047
This stinks, no wonder you are livid. It sounds like the administration is cracking down on the staff and they are all trying to cover their butts. It's lousy that they are talking as if they had no clue, but you know and they know that's not the case. They know too that they can say all they want, but the truth is they are responsible, not you or your sister. That being said, I think it's probably good to vent away here then handle them in a calm but firm manner....more flies with honey kinda thing.
Medicaid is the biggest ball of red tape going, so I'm not surprised you are getting conflicting info. I hope you don't have to file an appeal to get things resolved, but if you do...go for it. I know a few people who had to go that route with parents in nursing homes and they were successful. But that doesn't make it any easier to deal with; I know of nothing that makes me feel more helpless than bureacracy! Hugs.
Medicaid is the biggest ball of red tape going, so I'm not surprised you are getting conflicting info. I hope you don't have to file an appeal to get things resolved, but if you do...go for it. I know a few people who had to go that route with parents in nursing homes and they were successful. But that doesn't make it any easier to deal with; I know of nothing that makes me feel more helpless than bureacracy! Hugs.
Forum Leader
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Burgh
Posts: 1,991
Oh I forgot to mention...I was there on Monday and there was a notice posted at the elevator.
They are currently under annual audit.
Funny how the word "audit" brings about such bizarre behavior, huh?
They are currently under annual audit.
Funny how the word "audit" brings about such bizarre behavior, huh?
Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 472
Nursing homes are terrible-no matter which state. I worked at one in Chg. as a second job when my girls were growing up-A NIGHTMARE!!!!
Mom & gram threw gramps in a nursing home while I was at work-spent a fotune trying to get him out. I lost. Gramps lost his life also. He used to tell a story about "then" thinking he wa dead and ended up at the morgue. An old person just aming it up in his own mind? No, it was not-records prove he was telling the truth.
Point is-nursing homes are horrible places-they lie cheat and steal. Most that work there are caring people-just can only do so much. Medicaid-I have not got a clue. They cannot get what he does not have.
Check the fine lines of his admision papers-read the fine print-contact an attorney(first visit is normally a freebie) then contact the agency that governs the nursing home system.
Hope you can get it straightend out. They cannot get blood out of a turnip-don't let them get you and your family. LOL HUGS!!!!!
If he is at the retirement age-with no assets-should be no problem.
Mom & gram threw gramps in a nursing home while I was at work-spent a fotune trying to get him out. I lost. Gramps lost his life also. He used to tell a story about "then" thinking he wa dead and ended up at the morgue. An old person just aming it up in his own mind? No, it was not-records prove he was telling the truth.
Point is-nursing homes are horrible places-they lie cheat and steal. Most that work there are caring people-just can only do so much. Medicaid-I have not got a clue. They cannot get what he does not have.
Check the fine lines of his admision papers-read the fine print-contact an attorney(first visit is normally a freebie) then contact the agency that governs the nursing home system.
Hope you can get it straightend out. They cannot get blood out of a turnip-don't let them get you and your family. LOL HUGS!!!!!
If he is at the retirement age-with no assets-should be no problem.
Forum Leader
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In my little piece of heaven
Posts: 2,870
Cece,
I agree with the others, the more calm you are, the better you'll be able to figure out your best course of action.
I really believe that you'll be able to come to a mutually agreeable solution. In my part of the country some nursing homes are under some tight scrutiny... so perhaps you can use that to your advantage.
Good luck, and know we are all right there with you in your meetings. You might need them to set up a few more chairs.
Hugs
Cats
I agree with the others, the more calm you are, the better you'll be able to figure out your best course of action.
I really believe that you'll be able to come to a mutually agreeable solution. In my part of the country some nursing homes are under some tight scrutiny... so perhaps you can use that to your advantage.
Good luck, and know we are all right there with you in your meetings. You might need them to set up a few more chairs.
Hugs
Cats
Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: twilight zone,usa
Posts: 3,909
((((cece)))) i know how you feel.i went thru all that with the nursing home my brother was in.one person will tell you one thing & somebody else will tell you another. it is alot of stress trying to tend to somebodys affairs.my sister did most of it as she lived in town with him. i am sorry you are going thru this. fight this cece. prayers, hope
Bridge CLOSED
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: No ones business
Posts: 1,497
First of all, IF you talk to anyone, especially in a meeting. RECORD IT. Try to get everything said IN WRITING. If that is Email, then that works.
If you record meetings or phone conversations you may have to tell them by law for any of the conversation to be admissable in court, but if you are going to work thru administration, you might not need to tell anyone you have your little pocket recorder on.
Solid proof in the face of denials is always a good thing to have. It may not work with addicts but it can work in the legal system.
and MRB is right... Nursing homes are really bad unless you are really wealthy and even then.....
If you record meetings or phone conversations you may have to tell them by law for any of the conversation to be admissable in court, but if you are going to work thru administration, you might not need to tell anyone you have your little pocket recorder on.
Solid proof in the face of denials is always a good thing to have. It may not work with addicts but it can work in the legal system.
and MRB is right... Nursing homes are really bad unless you are really wealthy and even then.....
rozied
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: PA, USA
Posts: 1,292
Cece, I am sorry to hear what you are going through regarding your dad. I too think Ann had a great way of handling it & I am glad you sent them that e mail. It true they are very imtimidated by the words law suit or lawyer. I know my sons ex wked for a nsg home for a few days then was denied her pay cuz they wanted proof of her HS graduation. I called for her ( she was still with my son then ) and told them they should have asked for the proof BEFORE she started wk and now they had better pay her or they would hear from our attorney. She had a ck the same day.
Love,
Diane
Love,
Diane
Get Caught Reading
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Not in the boonies, thank God
Posts: 1,410
((((CeCe))))
Sorry for the BS your dad and family have to deal with.
I agree, it sounds like with the audit going on, they're having to "tighten down the hatch". B*st*rds!
Hope things get settled soon.
Prayers for your dad.
Linda
Sorry for the BS your dad and family have to deal with.
I agree, it sounds like with the audit going on, they're having to "tighten down the hatch". B*st*rds!
Hope things get settled soon.
Prayers for your dad.
Linda
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Burgh
Posts: 1,991
Thank you all for allowing me to vent. I'm sure the social worker appreciates it too because I was able "discuss" rather than yell in our conversation today.
Seems they've grandfathered those who were checked in prior to Feb07. My dad was admitted under a no smoking policy.
It still doesn't seem fair to me...double standards and rubs it in the face of those trying to adjust to their fate, but its the rules.
The soc worker admitted to misleading us, and understood our confusion. He knows the staff were the ones who got this all started too.
But, it seems administration wants to hear nothing of it, rules are rules.
My dad willingly gave up his stash and understands.
The soc worker felt terrible for the whole incident and apologized profusely.
I ended the conversation feeling validated in my displeasure.
So, we move on.
Someday, when it doesn't directly affect my dad, I'll go to bat again perhaps (promise I won't actually bring a bat
To be honest, those who work directly with my dad have been very kind.
Thanks for helping to stand up to the system
(((Hugs)))
Cece
Seems they've grandfathered those who were checked in prior to Feb07. My dad was admitted under a no smoking policy.
It still doesn't seem fair to me...double standards and rubs it in the face of those trying to adjust to their fate, but its the rules.
The soc worker admitted to misleading us, and understood our confusion. He knows the staff were the ones who got this all started too.
But, it seems administration wants to hear nothing of it, rules are rules.
My dad willingly gave up his stash and understands.
The soc worker felt terrible for the whole incident and apologized profusely.
I ended the conversation feeling validated in my displeasure.
So, we move on.
Someday, when it doesn't directly affect my dad, I'll go to bat again perhaps (promise I won't actually bring a bat
To be honest, those who work directly with my dad have been very kind.
Thanks for helping to stand up to the system
(((Hugs)))
Cece
On a tear
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Volcano Country!
Posts: 3,221
Wow, Cece... I somehow missed all this.
What a deal! I am so sorry for you, AND your dad, having to endure all this. I can't imagine still smoking myself and seeing that "some" patients were allowed, while others were not... how stupid is that?
If the addiction is allowed (with a safe, separate smoking area), then it should be allowed for all.
What buffoons.
I think you handled it with far more aplomb than I might have.
Your recovery is very, very good... Thank you for posting how it all worked out. I know I will be dealing with this someday, so I will squirrell this away....
Thanks... and good thoughts sent your way.
(((Hugs)))
What a deal! I am so sorry for you, AND your dad, having to endure all this. I can't imagine still smoking myself and seeing that "some" patients were allowed, while others were not... how stupid is that?
If the addiction is allowed (with a safe, separate smoking area), then it should be allowed for all.
What buffoons.
I think you handled it with far more aplomb than I might have.
Your recovery is very, very good... Thank you for posting how it all worked out. I know I will be dealing with this someday, so I will squirrell this away....
Thanks... and good thoughts sent your way.
(((Hugs)))
Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Quinlan, TX
Posts: 73
cece, i used to work in nursing homes. They cn have a smoke free facility. But, in the admission papers it should state that. Ask them to see a copy of their admission papers. and they should have a bullitian board with the rights of the residence and other things and where to make a complaint to the state if you have one... All nursing homes have to have one here in tx anyway.. Dont let them bully you ,you and your dad have more rights then you think....
I had to put my dad in one also it was a terrible place. Needless to say I only left him there for 3 days. Then I got a home health agency to come to my house and in texas medicade and medicare will pay for it...
Hugs and prayers ......
Dont let them get you down... Stand up and face them head on.... They are there to help your family. If not find another facility...
Good Luck....
I had to put my dad in one also it was a terrible place. Needless to say I only left him there for 3 days. Then I got a home health agency to come to my house and in texas medicade and medicare will pay for it...
Hugs and prayers ......
Dont let them get you down... Stand up and face them head on.... They are there to help your family. If not find another facility...
Good Luck....
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