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Old 06-11-2007, 11:23 AM
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help

well on wednesday i go to court to get a perm. RO unless my ah agrees to certain things like going to get evaluated for substance abuse and gets into a treatment program, and also goes to anger management. if he disagrees with these things than we go for the permanent RO. and may have to go to trial. Im not sure about the filing for divorce issue. i think we do that regardless to protect me financially.
anyway, my ah is in such denial. he does not beleive he is an addict. he sent me one email questioning that he might be, that maybe he just cant see it and maybe i am right...but now his last one says that he is not an addict, what happened, do i really want a divorce.???
He has never gone on binges and dispeared for any periods of time. he can be a good guy when he is not using..he was never abusive to me before the drugs.

here is his history with drugs:
he did coke in high school and early twenties.
stopped when we were dating (i think, or else just recreational use) and throughout our marriage until about 4 yrs. ago (?) when he started ordering some drugs on the internet and was seeking painkillers through dr.s ending up with oxycontin. eventually he started snorting the oxycontin. last winter/spring i took him to a addiction dr. who put him on suboxone and he stopped the oxycontin. he still taked the suboxone. but then he started with the cok again and has been using ever since with maybe a few weeks in between of not using (maybe). right now maybe he has stopped for a few weeks but im not sure about that either. during the past year hs has told me he has stopped but i would always find evidence to the contrary. also during the past yr. and a half if i approached him with thiings he didnt want to discuss (finding whit powder residue on bathroom counter or cash advances) he would usually get red in the face and start yelling at me and then it would escalte and about 6 times he has grabbed me, or put his hands around my neck, (not choking). this past time was when my daughter was present and starting hitting him to let go of mommy. now, you tell me...is this an addict??? is this someone who can quit on his own??? is this someone i can trust???? he also started watching porn recently, but i guess thats all related to the drugs...but that really makes my skin crawl.
i just feel bad because he cant seem to see through his denial at all......
advice??????????????
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Old 06-11-2007, 11:36 AM
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Sweetie, hes as much an addict as my husband. What you described could ahve been me describing, just in lots of posting pieces.

My AH lost his license, lost his business and now lives with no power. He went from functioning along time to the bottom dropping out. Hes sold all his tools, appliances in house everything in a short time, once he really started going down. With me he could ahve kept going but my health would not have. You tell me.
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Old 06-11-2007, 11:41 AM
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Until he sees it for what its worth then there is nothing u can do or can say to help thats all up to him. Maybe he pictures an addict different in his head and hes not like "them" so he doesnt see a problem with it. There is nothing left for u to do at this point thats all up to him. Time for u to let it go. I understand u really want to understand and hope all of the things he is doing is all related to the drugs. What if its not? Maybe this is just who he is with or without drugs? Maybe he has just changed his interests.

U will never understand and u will probably never get the answers your looking for as far as his drug use is involved. He isnt ready to talk about it and until he is u cant save him and u cant talk to him about it. As a recovering addict myself I could look u in the eye and lie straight to your face. I didnt want it pointed out to me I didnt want to talk about it. Until I was ready nothing could be said. In my head I knew but until I was ready to talk and admit defeat there was nothing u or anyone else could say.

Addict or not him touching u has crossed the line. Time to let it go time to let him pick up the pieces of his life and decide what he wants to do. What u want doesnt matter right now. Dont get dragged down trying to get answers to things u will NEVER get the answers to.
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Old 06-11-2007, 11:45 AM
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I don't know why you are asking. You KNOW he is an addict. You've been posting it on here for weeks.

He's an addict. He's in denial. He's not going to get better.

So, that's him. NOW WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT YOU?

hugs.
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Old 06-11-2007, 11:50 AM
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The post could have been written by me also -

My RAH did drugs when in HS & right after. When I meet him he wasn't using anything, said he never could. He ended up in the hospital from doing coke and thought he was going to die.

Well he used again - it started out as recreational but became a everyday habit. I didn't even know. I have never done drugs in my life. My RAH also use to think he wasn't a drug addict. He lost his job, his license, a ton our money, and pretty much almost lost his family.

He hasn't used in months - I cannot sit here and say I totally trust him because I don't, I don't think I really ever will again.

I agree - you need to let it go, I know it is hard. There is NOTHING you can do for him, it has to be him. He may be saying some of the things to get to you. My RAH use to play with my emotions so many times.

I don't think you will ever get the answers to your questions. I haven't to this day, and when I ask my husband today when he is clean, he still doesn't have the answers for me.

When my RAH was using he also watched porn alot.

You need to do what is best for you - don't get dragged down as kg0875 said, you have come this far - you can get thru this.
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Old 06-11-2007, 11:52 AM
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sorry drained, dont have any advice for ya right now, just want to let you know that you and yours are in my prayers
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Old 06-11-2007, 11:55 AM
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What I believe is that the majority of us who struggle with substance abuse/alcoholism are born with this predisposition to become addicted.

Like 90% of ALL youth, we "experiment" with drugs and alcohol at some point in our youth. Most of us discover fairly soon that we have a different experience than our peers.

When they (the normies) have a bad outcome with using, they tend to reduce or change their use ... or even stop altogether.

We addict/alcoholics don't. We continue to use, and build a tolerance and find the "right" way to use/drink so that we can be like everyone else. As our tolerance builds, we become sneaky and underhanded. Some of us even stop for long periods of time, only to be "blindsided" by another drug or behavior that we did not anticipate.

I don't know how many have talked about the drugs following surgery being key to starting them on the "real" road to addiction.

Becoming aware and then ACCEPTING our difference... our inability to "use like everyone else" is breaking through our denial and delusion. That takes a long, long, Loooonnnnggg time. And sometimes, some pretty difficult events.

Even with full awareness, the addiction sneaks back... convincing us that we have somehow "overreacted". That our using can be as easily controlled as >... fill in the blank... next door controls his or her drug use.

But that is just the addiction trying to rationalize its way back into our lives. And most of us don't recognize that until we've fallen for it a few times.

AA calls alcoholism cunning, baffling and powerful.

It is good for those of us who love addicts and alcoholics to be aware of that, too.

I think he sounds like an addict. And I think he will need to go through some stuff to bring his awareness into acceptance.

Addicts lose things. Some lose keys... cars.... friends... homes... spouses... Sometimes it takes losing things for that acceptance to begin.

This is partly why I urge spouses to attend Naranon or Alanon. There is a lot to learn and lot that makes us feel helpless. But meetings help me understand that there are things I can do to feel better and less fearful... and to find a way to be happy again.

(((DW))))
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Old 06-11-2007, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by drainedwife View Post
when he started ordering some drugs on the internet and was seeking painkillers through dr.s ending up with oxycontin. eventually he started snorting the oxycontin. last winter/spring i took him to a addiction dr. who put him on suboxone and he stopped the oxycontin. he still taked the suboxone. but then he started with the cok again and has been using ever since with maybe a few weeks in between of not using (maybe). right now maybe he has stopped for a few weeks but im not sure about that either. during the past year hs has told me he has stopped but i would always find evidence to the contrary. also during the past yr. and a half if i approached him with thiings he didnt want to discuss (finding whit powder residue on bathroom counter or cash advances) he would usually get red in the face and start yelling at me and then it would escalte and about 6 times he has grabbed me, or put his hands around my neck, (not choking). this past time was when my daughter was present and starting hitting him to let go of mommy. now, you tell me...is this an addict??? is this someone who can quit on his own??? is this someone i can trust????
i just feel bad because he cant seem to see through his denial at all......
advice??????????????
In my opinion YES he is an addict. NO, this is not someone you can trust.

Can he quit on his own? He is still in denial. Even the best treatment centers have a success rate of around 11%...No, I do not think he can or WILL quit on his own.

My advice is to go through with the permanent RO and divorce perceedings.

don't worry about him and his denial. Whether he can quit or not is HIS problem-he owns that problem, not you. You have no control over whether he quits or not.

You only have control over what you do about yourself-try to focus on the things you can control.
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Old 06-11-2007, 12:37 PM
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You are in a cross pull right now. You want him to get better but you are seeing reality at the same time.
What you need do at this time... Set and hold your boundaries. Do what you need to do for you and your daughter. He can catch up if that is his choice but until such a time you need take care of you as best you can.
Right now he is faced with choices and he will need accept what happens based on the choices he makes. The ball is in his court.
Do what is best for you and your daughter and hope that he does what is best for him.
You continue...he can catch up when he is ready, willing, and able.
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Old 06-11-2007, 01:03 PM
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He is playing you. It is what addicts do.
He is an addict.
He is in denial. You still seem to be in denial as well.

You have set up circumstances whereby you won't do the Permanenet RO if he behaves as you want him to. That, my friend, is typical of co dependent manipulative attempts at control.

Leave the "You do this and I won't do that" right out of the picture. Get the Permamanent RO. Stop giving him conditions to live by. Stop bartering for what you want. Bartering and training may work with a dog.. (if you do this I will give you a treat.. i won't put on the RO and embarrass you) the reward and punishment thing... it doesn't work on an addict. He is an addict.

Live for you. Replace him with meetings and work and your kids and their needs. If you have time left over, take more classes, read a book, clean house, learn how to cut the grass and go cut the grass (if you aren't already).

Do what you need to do to live your life.

Stop answering the phone. Shut it off if you need to. Change the number if you need to. Stop calling him, call an AlAnon friend or a Nar Anon friend or write here but don't call him.

With all you are needing to stop doing, you will have mental time and energy to move forward with your life doing what you want to do.

He is an addict. He has always been an addict for as long as you have known him. That is his business. Revovery or not is also his business. Don't make his addiction your business. Make living your life for you your business.
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Old 06-11-2007, 01:28 PM
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He's not gonna get treatment, he's too worried about his reputation.
Be prepared for him to refuse and accuse you of being the crazy one to all his peers. Dont react, only act with thought out actions and all will come to light for everyone
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Old 06-11-2007, 01:32 PM
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Please go to the forum Relationships and Parenting in Recovery and read what a healthy relationship is.

live
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Old 06-11-2007, 01:48 PM
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just wanted to clear something up...wed. i will also file a divorce complaint and that will eventually take everything and wrap it into one package in civil court which will protect me with everything i need to be protected by including financial....

i want to thank everyone for helping me and please continue because i am not strong and sooo afraid of the unknown...i am tearing up inside...
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Old 06-11-2007, 04:15 PM
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he is an addict & you can not do anything about him.let go & let God. let go or get dragged.you choice. i am saying a prayer for him & for you.read around & there is more advice.more information as how others have handled themselves in your shoes.hugs,hope
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Old 06-11-2007, 04:29 PM
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Drained,
I am glad you are filing for the perm RO. And you are filing for the divorce. At least you are taking steps to protect you and your child now. Remember it can be dropped later if he wants to get clean, and does it.
He is an addict and until he sees that and hits bottom there is nothing you or anyone else can do for him.
I went through a divorce and it was hard so my heart goes out to you at this time. My ex was not an addict but very controlling and abusive to me. I was afraid of being alone and not knowing what was going to happen, but I am better now mentally than I was while married.
Turn to your HP for help he/she will guide you in doing the right thing.
Hugs and prayers coming your way
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by drainedwife View Post
and then it would escalte and about 6 times he has grabbed me, or put his hands around my neck, (not choking). this past time was when my daughter was present and starting hitting him to let go of mommy. now,

You're still defending him. He put his hands around your neck.......not choking?? I'm sorry but the moment he even put his hands on you that was abuse........and in front of your daughter..............What's wrong with that picture?
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:36 PM
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You know he's an addict and you know that he cannot be trusted, why do you continue to question it?
Whether he choked you or not, he put his hands on you in an inappropriate way and that is abuse.
I agree with Loves, you are still defending him. By the sounds of your post you are still in denial just as much as he is.
So the porn and abuse all started with the drugs, in your opinion. Yes both of these things can, and have been, linked to drug use... but that doesn't mean they will go away if he stops using.. whether they came about with the drug use or not they are still seperate issues. And like addiction, abuse is progressive. So maybe he didn't choke you before, but what about next time?? There's absolutely nothing saying that he won't.
Honey, you need to stop denying and defending. Let it go, he's an addict and there is NOTHING you can do to change that. NOTHING AT ALL. As long as you continue to deny that he's an addict, and as long as you continue to defend him YOU are not going to get better either.
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:46 PM
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What bothers me the most and what stuck out to me more than anything was the fact your daughter saw what her dad was doing to you. In your own words she started hitting him so he'd let you go. And now the vicious cycle begins for your innocent child. The most unselfish thing you can do is PLEASE get some help. PLEASE let go of this man and let him get his own help. There's nothing you can do for him, but there's plenty you can do for you and your beautiful children who are also victims in this volitile relationship.
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:50 PM
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Drained u said your not strong enough but u will have to find the strength. Put all that energy and strength into helping u and your kids instead of trying to convince him he has a problem and needs help. Take the focus off of him and his addiction thats what u really need to do. Everything else concerning him is out of your control and no matter what u cant control it. Drugs may bring out some things in people but something tells me thats always been there its just coming out more cause of constant accusations and constant questioning in search of answers. I didnt like being pushed or asked questions. Especially questions u already know the answers to yet u want to hear them from him. Guess what you never will. Stop playing detective stop focusing on him. Start focusing on u and your children once the focus is off of him and on u watch how good u start to feel.
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:51 PM
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He is an addict. It is not hard to quit. It is hard to stay quit. Addicts deny they are addicts by playing little tricks with themselves. Especially with cocaine. But he has already crossed the line into addiction. If not, why is he losing you. Don't let him continue to play the greatest addict trick of all. Making you feel like the crazy one. Hugs, Marle
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