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Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
Posts: 3,410
(((GF)))
I really don't know where to start in my reply to you. See, I have lived through a very similar experience and it's hard for me to write about it without creating a novel. I too had thoughts about my ex having BPD - in fact, I started a thread on here ages ago. Whilst I can't diagnose anyone and I have no idea if he ever would be by a doctor, it was terrifying to realise that I was dealing with something so much larger than someone who drank a bit too much for my liking. It was seriously crazy-making stuff and it is not too dramatic to say that it shattered my world as I knew it.
All I can say is that there is light at the end of the tunnel. But to get to that light, I had to let go of the dreams I had, the hopes for my future with him and come to realise that his fantasy was not my reality. He viewed the world and its people in a very different way to me and, try as I might, I could not see it through his eyes and he couldn't see it through mine.
I too wanted to write to his counsellor. But it wouldn't have done any good, because of course I was just the vindictive ex when he spoke about me to others. Unlike by e-mail/phone/texts where he harrassed me for months to get back with him - even when he was engaged to someone else. Thankfully, I was seeing a fantastic counsellor myself with whom R and I had had some joint sessions. To have the validation from him that I wasn't imagining things and to put it all into some kind of context in my own head is beyond my powers of description. I think I would have had a breakdown if it wasn't for that counsellor.
I'm going to come back to this, if you don't mind. It's kinda hard to write about sometimes. But please know that I do understand and I wish we could talk about this in person.
(((hugs)))
I really don't know where to start in my reply to you. See, I have lived through a very similar experience and it's hard for me to write about it without creating a novel. I too had thoughts about my ex having BPD - in fact, I started a thread on here ages ago. Whilst I can't diagnose anyone and I have no idea if he ever would be by a doctor, it was terrifying to realise that I was dealing with something so much larger than someone who drank a bit too much for my liking. It was seriously crazy-making stuff and it is not too dramatic to say that it shattered my world as I knew it.
All I can say is that there is light at the end of the tunnel. But to get to that light, I had to let go of the dreams I had, the hopes for my future with him and come to realise that his fantasy was not my reality. He viewed the world and its people in a very different way to me and, try as I might, I could not see it through his eyes and he couldn't see it through mine.
I too wanted to write to his counsellor. But it wouldn't have done any good, because of course I was just the vindictive ex when he spoke about me to others. Unlike by e-mail/phone/texts where he harrassed me for months to get back with him - even when he was engaged to someone else. Thankfully, I was seeing a fantastic counsellor myself with whom R and I had had some joint sessions. To have the validation from him that I wasn't imagining things and to put it all into some kind of context in my own head is beyond my powers of description. I think I would have had a breakdown if it wasn't for that counsellor.
I'm going to come back to this, if you don't mind. It's kinda hard to write about sometimes. But please know that I do understand and I wish we could talk about this in person.
(((hugs)))
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 2,333
GF, for some reason I have just found this thread.
I am so sorry for you pain. Having been through the loss
of a love I know how hard it is to see beyond todays pain.
Having said that, it has been over a year and everyday does
get lighter, the sun does shine brighter and hope does get restored.
I dread the day my oldest son leaves home, even though I
complain about him all the time...lol so I get how that must feel too.
This is a hard time for you but there really is a light at the end
of the tunnel.....I know because I have found it.....Hugs to you.
I am so sorry for you pain. Having been through the loss
of a love I know how hard it is to see beyond todays pain.
Having said that, it has been over a year and everyday does
get lighter, the sun does shine brighter and hope does get restored.
I dread the day my oldest son leaves home, even though I
complain about him all the time...lol so I get how that must feel too.
This is a hard time for you but there really is a light at the end
of the tunnel.....I know because I have found it.....Hugs to you.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 689
Jazz -- yes, it his reaction. But it triggers my own sense of being unloved and unimportant.
BigSis, thanks for you wise words. I know this is all normal. I'm not beating myself up for feeling it. I just want a shortcut past it. And I know that's not possible. So the question I have to ask is not "What do I need to get past this?", but "What do I need to do for me while I'm going through this?".
The problem with my recovery process is that I sometimes think it's all on an intellectual level. I KNOW what I need to do. I have a lot of the knowledge. It's living it, follow through, etc.
I'm not sure what the definition is of an emotionally disable person is -- but I do know this has been a huge challenge. I do want to get angry -- and I am. But I'm having trouble too becuase I know this is outside of his control. But I also want to scream, and yell, and rant. That's what my therapist is for I guess!
I am in therapy and some time back, before this relationship began, my therapist had noted that I attract and get involved with 'wounded little boys'. So it's definitely in my sights -- I do need to hone my radar.
Sunshine -- yes I know that splitting is part of BPD. (splitting into all good/all bad). But I don't think there's going to be any heroic attempts to resume the relationship. I've heard that as 'hoovering'. But in the end the label doesn't matter. Maybe it's BPD, maybe something else. I simply need to accept and move on.
Yes Minnie -- this is exactly what it is like. I called after emailing that I couldn't do this anymore when I saw the betrayal fantasies taking hold. After 3 years, I felt badly leaving things in an email. So I followed up a few days later with a phone call (yesterday).
I remember staring at the phone with the dial-tone coming out of it after he cooly stated before hanging up: "I now understand everything. You have been lying to me from the beginning of our relationship and have been sexual with several men during that time. And nothing you say is of any interest to me any longer." And with that I, and the 3 years together, was dismissed. It did feel like something shattered. How does one compute that? And yes, without my therapist right now, it would be a lot more difficult.
Rita, Patty -- thank you for keeping me focused on taking care and the light at the end of the tunnel.
Originally Posted by BigSis
denial, anger, bargaining and acceptance (repeat as needed). In fact, doing so IS normal.
The problem with my recovery process is that I sometimes think it's all on an intellectual level. I KNOW what I need to do. I have a lot of the knowledge. It's living it, follow through, etc.
Originally Posted by BigSis
If you've been living with an emotionally disabled person, you have been living in a real war zone.
Originally Posted by BigSis
And if you feel a need to examine the "how" of getting into such a relationship/avoiding another one like it, perhaps a counselor for yourself IS a good idea.
Sunshine -- yes I know that splitting is part of BPD. (splitting into all good/all bad). But I don't think there's going to be any heroic attempts to resume the relationship. I've heard that as 'hoovering'. But in the end the label doesn't matter. Maybe it's BPD, maybe something else. I simply need to accept and move on.
Originally Posted by minnie
It was seriously crazy-making stuff and it is not too dramatic to say that it shattered my world as I knew it.
I remember staring at the phone with the dial-tone coming out of it after he cooly stated before hanging up: "I now understand everything. You have been lying to me from the beginning of our relationship and have been sexual with several men during that time. And nothing you say is of any interest to me any longer." And with that I, and the 3 years together, was dismissed. It did feel like something shattered. How does one compute that? And yes, without my therapist right now, it would be a lot more difficult.
Rita, Patty -- thank you for keeping me focused on taking care and the light at the end of the tunnel.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
(((GF)))
After 18 years together, my AH stopped speaking to me and we have not spoken for almost a year now. I can see now it has been for the best, but I still have days when the surreal aspect of it all hits me hard. To have someone in your life for so long, who then distorts the reality of your time together and severs all ties - well, that's not something you get over quickly. At the beginning of all this I had a couple fender-benders, so I know what you mean about crossing streets.
My therapist has been invaluable in helping me understand the possible underlying disorder my AH may suffer from. I was fortunate in that I did actually get to speak to the therapist he had last year.
The last year has been a process for me - separating the alcohol abuse from the other and understanding the "other" could very well exist even in sobriety. At first I thought it was just more concentrating on him, but I realize it is helping me understand me. You seem to be coming to some good understandings of yourself, too.
I wish I knew a faster way to get through it. Be good to yourself and hang in there.
After 18 years together, my AH stopped speaking to me and we have not spoken for almost a year now. I can see now it has been for the best, but I still have days when the surreal aspect of it all hits me hard. To have someone in your life for so long, who then distorts the reality of your time together and severs all ties - well, that's not something you get over quickly. At the beginning of all this I had a couple fender-benders, so I know what you mean about crossing streets.
My therapist has been invaluable in helping me understand the possible underlying disorder my AH may suffer from. I was fortunate in that I did actually get to speak to the therapist he had last year.
The last year has been a process for me - separating the alcohol abuse from the other and understanding the "other" could very well exist even in sobriety. At first I thought it was just more concentrating on him, but I realize it is helping me understand me. You seem to be coming to some good understandings of yourself, too.
I wish I knew a faster way to get through it. Be good to yourself and hang in there.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 528
I hope he doesn't try to hoover you....just be aware that he might and plan for what YOU will do if he does. It's so hard to not get sucked back in. Decide your boundary and stick to it. If he does have BPD and calls and you don't respond, watch out.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Litterbox City
Posts: 5,691
((GF)) no other words of wisdom as you have gotten many of those in the posts above. just know that we all wish continued healing for you at this time. the action you took was a monumental one and hurts now, but things will even out as the days go by (as i am finding out working thru my grief after almost a year).
Reikihelps
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: PA
Posts: 221
Dear GF,
I think it's great that you wrote to his therapist. Chances are the therapist already knew about the paranoia and distrust. I would think it could only help you to verbalize your distress, then move closer to letting it go. Do you journal?
Also, do you allow yourself to get angry or are you all filled with mourning? Since his accusations are so ludicrous, let that help you distance yourself from him. There has to be some kind of relief that you're not under his pressure 24-7. I have found dealing with a mental heath issue and addiction in a loved one to be utterly exhausting and consuming.
I hope you do something nice for you today. A massage, some aromatherapy, a special meal or dessert. You deserve some pleasure girl!!!!
Sounds like you're not isolating and that's awesome.
((((hang in there)))).
Reikihelps
I think it's great that you wrote to his therapist. Chances are the therapist already knew about the paranoia and distrust. I would think it could only help you to verbalize your distress, then move closer to letting it go. Do you journal?
Also, do you allow yourself to get angry or are you all filled with mourning? Since his accusations are so ludicrous, let that help you distance yourself from him. There has to be some kind of relief that you're not under his pressure 24-7. I have found dealing with a mental heath issue and addiction in a loved one to be utterly exhausting and consuming.
I hope you do something nice for you today. A massage, some aromatherapy, a special meal or dessert. You deserve some pleasure girl!!!!
Sounds like you're not isolating and that's awesome.
((((hang in there)))).
Reikihelps
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 689
Originally Posted by reikihelps
I think it's great that you wrote to his therapist.
Originally Posted by reikihelps
do you allow yourself to get angry or are you all filled with mourning?
I'M ANGRY THAT I HAVE NOT BEEN BELIEVED.
I'M ANGRY THAT MY HONESTY AND TRUSTWORTHINESS HAVE BEEN QUESTIONED CONTINUALLY.
I'M ANGRY THAT HIS ENDING TO THIS IS SO DISMISSIVE, CALLOUS & ARROGANT
I'M FURIOUS THAT I DID NOTHING TO DESERVE THIS CRUEL TREATMENT.
I'M FURIOUS FOR NOT BEING SEEN AND VALUED FOR WHO I AM.
I'M ANGRY THAT INTIMATE THINGS ABOUT MY PAST THAT I TRUSTED ENOUGH TO SHARE, WERE USED AS REASONS TO DOUBT ME AND MY SAFETY AS A PARTNER.
I'M ANGRY THAT I TRUSTED ENOUGH IN A FUTURE WITH HIM TO BRING HIM INTO MY CHILDREN'S LIVES, JUST TO HAVE MORE DISRUPTION AND LOSS.
I'M FURIOUS FOR HAVING PUT MYSELF FURTHER INTO DEBT TO SUPPORT HIM WHEN HE HAD NO INCOME AND PAY HIS F***INIG CHILD SUPPORT AND MEDICAL BILLS WITH MY LINE OF CREDIT.
I'M FURIOUS THAT I OVERLOOKED THE PAIN AND DAMAGE TO ME OF LIVING WITH THIS AND TRYING OVER AND OVER TO EARN HIS TRUST.
Yes, I am angry!
Reikihelps
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: PA
Posts: 221
you go GF!
I think this is progress getting this crap out and giving it voice. the key is to let it out and let it go. I tend to get stuck right before the "go" part. : )
Progress not perfection, right?
Soon you'll be feeling better and better.
I think this is progress getting this crap out and giving it voice. the key is to let it out and let it go. I tend to get stuck right before the "go" part. : )
Progress not perfection, right?
Soon you'll be feeling better and better.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sussex, NJ
Posts: 1,331
The trick for me was accepting that I was powerless .... once I accepted that, I was surrounded by an peace, a peace of my own making. It was wonderful and GF, you are powerless over this.
Whatever his problem, it's his problem, not yours. I think you already know this.
Whatever his problem, it's his problem, not yours. I think you already know this.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 689
Reiki -- I am like you. I get stuck in between 'get it out' and 'let it go'. I am still obssessing about him and what has happened. I'm angry, I'm sad, and everything in between. And it's hard to gain control over my thinking.
Tina -- yes, I have come to see this has been emotionally abusive. Had I to do this over again, I would put up a boundary that we only talk about this issue and his problem with trust and his doubts in a therapeutic context with someone to help us through this. And I would have insisted on this. Instead, I took on the role of trying figure out the right way to fix it -- a losing proposition.
Judy -- yes, I keep coming back to that fact, that I am powerless over this, just as he seems to be powerless over whatever psychological issues are in control of him. I do try to depersonalize it. What I find is I keep going back to the 'if only's'....if only this terrible distrust didn't exist, or if only those things that he had interpreted so wrongly hadn't happened. I know that's useless thinking. It's hard to let go because there was a lot good too. But I know almost everyone here could say that at one time or another.
Tina -- yes, I have come to see this has been emotionally abusive. Had I to do this over again, I would put up a boundary that we only talk about this issue and his problem with trust and his doubts in a therapeutic context with someone to help us through this. And I would have insisted on this. Instead, I took on the role of trying figure out the right way to fix it -- a losing proposition.
Judy -- yes, I keep coming back to that fact, that I am powerless over this, just as he seems to be powerless over whatever psychological issues are in control of him. I do try to depersonalize it. What I find is I keep going back to the 'if only's'....if only this terrible distrust didn't exist, or if only those things that he had interpreted so wrongly hadn't happened. I know that's useless thinking. It's hard to let go because there was a lot good too. But I know almost everyone here could say that at one time or another.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
Originally Posted by GettingFree
Reiki -- I am like you. I get stuck in between 'get it out' and 'let it go'.
Hope today is better, GF. Hang in there.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
Lundy Bancroft has a book with some interesting insight on this phenomenon and it goes along with what my DV counselor taught me. That it is about power and control. They don't really believe for one minute that you just had a quickie with that guy that was in the elevator with you for 3 floors. It is a manuever to keep you confused, on the defensive, explaining yourself, placating, and isolating.
my 2 cents,
live
my 2 cents,
live
Reikihelps
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: PA
Posts: 221
Hi GF,
Sometimes it helps me to give myself a limited time to "obsess. Ie - for the next 45 minutes, I am going to obsess; the rest of the night is reverved for better things! Give it a shot. (Of course you can choose your own time. I like to keep it under an hour. If possible, 30 minutes works well)
Sometimes it helps me to give myself a limited time to "obsess. Ie - for the next 45 minutes, I am going to obsess; the rest of the night is reverved for better things! Give it a shot. (Of course you can choose your own time. I like to keep it under an hour. If possible, 30 minutes works well)
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 689
Hi all,
Today is becoming better. I left the city this morning a bit of a mess to visit my sister for the weekend in cottage country and am situated on a beautiful lake right now surrounded by beauty. There are other people around, including 3 delightful little kids, which sure helps shift my focus from my issues, and that's healthy I know.
I had put a call into the therapist that my ex and I had seen together and got a call back this afternoon. Although I have my own individual therapist, I really wanted to talk with him as he knew my ex -- and I broke down crying on the phone as I recounted recent events. Before getting off the call, he asked me to do one thing: he asked me to write a letter to my ex, one that I won't send, in which I give back all the stuff to him. In other words, I give back the accusations, the blame, etc. It's his. It's not mine, and I can pass it back. I haven't done that yet, but I will.
I'm sure this will be part of both getting it out and letting it go!
I also started reading a book my sister recommended to me: "Men Who Hate Women and the Women Who Love Them." I'm seeing a lot of things that I did in this relationship that brought me to this point: ignored or rationalized those things that interfered with my romantic idealization; fused way too quickly, sacrificing my sense of self; took on a rescue role; blamed myself for not being able to fix what was his problem, his fears. And I'm only 50 pages into the book!
Live -- I'm sure you'd resonate with a lot here.
that's it for the update from Lake Muskoka -- thanks for all the support.
Today is becoming better. I left the city this morning a bit of a mess to visit my sister for the weekend in cottage country and am situated on a beautiful lake right now surrounded by beauty. There are other people around, including 3 delightful little kids, which sure helps shift my focus from my issues, and that's healthy I know.
I had put a call into the therapist that my ex and I had seen together and got a call back this afternoon. Although I have my own individual therapist, I really wanted to talk with him as he knew my ex -- and I broke down crying on the phone as I recounted recent events. Before getting off the call, he asked me to do one thing: he asked me to write a letter to my ex, one that I won't send, in which I give back all the stuff to him. In other words, I give back the accusations, the blame, etc. It's his. It's not mine, and I can pass it back. I haven't done that yet, but I will.
I'm sure this will be part of both getting it out and letting it go!
I also started reading a book my sister recommended to me: "Men Who Hate Women and the Women Who Love Them." I'm seeing a lot of things that I did in this relationship that brought me to this point: ignored or rationalized those things that interfered with my romantic idealization; fused way too quickly, sacrificing my sense of self; took on a rescue role; blamed myself for not being able to fix what was his problem, his fears. And I'm only 50 pages into the book!
Live -- I'm sure you'd resonate with a lot here.
that's it for the update from Lake Muskoka -- thanks for all the support.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: uk
Posts: 3,054
in cottage country and am situated on a beautiful lake right now surrounded by beauty. There are other people around, including 3 delightful little kids, which sure helps shift my focus from my issues, and that's healthy I know.
Enjoy your break - through all the sadness don't forget to allow yourself to enjoy too!! Take care GF...
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Keepin' my side of the litterbox clean
Posts: 2,136
His accusations have triggered deep emotional pain for you. With pain this deep, I'd venture to say that this is an issue from long ago; say, when you were a child and falsely accused of doing something yet having no power to defend yourself.
Like Minnie I, too, could write a book about being accused of everything from cheating to stealing, to attempting suicide. I had to get to the point that I stopped feeling angry, hurt, defensive, and started to deal with the pain and where it ultimately began.
You know in your heart you haven't done anything wrong, but it's understandable that you want your accuser to see the light. He won't. He's ill, and sounds paranoid. Regardless of the diagnosis, it's just that - a diagnosis, a label.
Please do something nice for yourself, whether it's a bubble bath, watching a funny movie on t.v., whatever. We all tend to beat up on ourselves too much and allow others to do the same. You realize you're dealing with a sick person and I'm sure you have a love attachment to him. Letting go of our dreams is the hardest thing to do, in my opinion, other than letting go of life itself. But just as letting go of life is the inevitable outcome we all face, so we must face that there are times when our dreams will be shattered.
Sending love and support your way because that's all I can do.
Like Minnie I, too, could write a book about being accused of everything from cheating to stealing, to attempting suicide. I had to get to the point that I stopped feeling angry, hurt, defensive, and started to deal with the pain and where it ultimately began.
You know in your heart you haven't done anything wrong, but it's understandable that you want your accuser to see the light. He won't. He's ill, and sounds paranoid. Regardless of the diagnosis, it's just that - a diagnosis, a label.
Please do something nice for yourself, whether it's a bubble bath, watching a funny movie on t.v., whatever. We all tend to beat up on ourselves too much and allow others to do the same. You realize you're dealing with a sick person and I'm sure you have a love attachment to him. Letting go of our dreams is the hardest thing to do, in my opinion, other than letting go of life itself. But just as letting go of life is the inevitable outcome we all face, so we must face that there are times when our dreams will be shattered.
Sending love and support your way because that's all I can do.
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