ASpouse

I think what Sarah is saying is that you are still trying to control the situation, same as before. I may have read it wrong though.

CatsTail

It's bait and don't take it. Take care of you.

Ngaire

BayouSelf

deax -

Just remember "Progress not Perfection". I hear everyone's points of view and I understand each of them, but some of us just have to take this in "baby steps". It's very scarry to let go, but you'll get there in your own time. Prayer for the strength from your Higher Power and he'll give it to you.

deax

Thank you, bluebayou.

elizabeth1979

Deax, I am not attempting to be hard on you.
I have been a queen enabler and have been told so by many people, some here, some not. I was only able to see it and get healthy when I was ready.

I wish I could express one thing to newbies here!
Alcoholics in active addiction lie and do what they need to do to feed their addiction. NOTHING anyone says to them is going to change that.

Nothing changes if nothing changes. Meaning...If you dont change your behavior and he doesnt change his behavior, what will be different this time around with him? Same story next chapter. Its a re-run.

The theories that they will 'come around', 'learn to listen to me', 'see how much they are hurting me, 'just stop', 'see I know what I am talking about' etc etc WITHOUT RECOVERY, are just that...theories.

OK, that above paragraph...now apply it to yourself. I know I said those things to my ex and I know he said them to me.

Recovery goes both ways. Its not just for the drinker.

deax

Right, I understand. But how am I NOT changing my behavior? We're still not going to be in contact, I'm not falling for this detox thing. I was talking to my neighbor last night, he has 17 years sober, and he says his brother goes in and out of detox every time his wife kicks him out of the house. So I'm not expecting anything without recovery... He needs to make his choices and figure out where he wants his life to go over the next year, without me being involved. What am I still doing wrong?

deax

Last night when I was on the phone with my friend I remembered a few things he said during our brief conversation that I had forgotten about when I originally posted yesterday, right after I taked to him.

He also said to me: "I love you so much I was even going to move up there to be near you all the time. I was going to move to be closer to you."
-- And yes. This is true. He was close to having an apartment, and then it was my fault he lost it actually, which now I htink may have been a blessing in disguise. But he said this just out of nowhere yesterday. What was the point? Was this just a guilt trip, like 'proof' that he loved me?

Now this is the one I have a real question about re: Friday:
When I said, "I asked you not to call me for a year," he said:
"Yeah but I don't want you to spend a year of your life waiting for me."
-So basically he took this year thing as me waiting for his recovery and still being committed to him, as opposed to it having anything whatsoever to do with me. It was clearly manipulative, right? And I just answered with, "Well it's not just about you..." If he says this again on Friday, how could I better respond? What's the message I want to send in response to a comment like that? How do I deal with the question of whether I'll date someone else in that time?

I know I don't OWE him any answers, but I also know he'll ask me and won't know how to respond.

elizabeth1979

Well, since you asked...

All of this is about HIM, his drinking, his recovery.
Very little has been mentioned about YOU.

This sentence..reads like you are stating he needs to recover without you around. True.
But, more importantly, YOU need to recover, without HIM around.
See my point?
Its perception.
Is he the leading actor with you the supporting role in YOUR OWN LIFE?

Recovery for me began when I became the lead in my own life. His issues didnt fill up my mind, my brain, my home, my family, my converations with friends and so on anymore.

denny57

Sounds like you made the year thing clear and he acknowledged it. What is there to talk about Friday?

deax, I still believe you should do what feels right for you. I got nowhere fast in my recovery if I didn't question myself and really acknowledge what I was doing, thinking, saying. I got honest with myself.

Jazzman

How about this for a possible motivation for that comment...

Where's he staying now? You mentioned something about his phone having been cut off, sounds like financial troubles? Does he have a "soft landing" now that he's out of inpatient or is he living in an "undesirable" living situation? Maybe it was a feeler to see if you would offer him to stay with you, since he'll be close anyway?

Maybe not but could be.... My ex was always putting out "feelers" to see if I could be a "possible" soft landing for her. She has to support herself AND her addiction right now and she KNOWS that will be a daunting task.
Who says you OWE him a response either?

deax

Well again I wanted to clear the air and get my thoughts straight and present them that way. I thought I should make it clear that this year isn't only about me waiting for him, that I need this time away for myself too so I can stop being so insanely attached to him and healthier overall. He's going to ask me about if I'm going to start dating or not, and I don't know what the "appropriate" thing to say is. I kind of want to say that I'm not making any commitment to him during this year, not that I am seeking someone else necessarily, but that it doesn't do me much good to stay devoted to him if I'm trying to let go and if he's only invited back into my life if he actually gets sober, which only time will tell. You know?

No, it's definitely not that. First of all, he's not closer at this time, he still lives three hours away in South Jersey. Secondly he still has his apartment, but he never pays his bills on time so the phone or the TV willl get shut off sporadically, so now his cell was just turned off (he never has a house phone, thinks it's a waste if you have a cell). Also, I'm still in grad school, so for the next year I will continue living with my mom because I'm not making much money (I work at the school I attend as a secretary, for the free tuition). So he knew there was no possible way he could live with me, my mom hates his guts anyway.

LaTeeDa

Keep trying. You'll get there.

L

denny57

I understand. When I did things like this it was because I was hoping, deep inside, that this would be the final conversation that would make him "see the light." I came to see that this was just more manipulation on my part. So instead of looking at it from the "he" point of view, I had to look at it from the "I." Or I turned it around. Whatever worked to help me dissect my true motivations.

I just want to put out there that instead of saying "he's going to ask me about if I'm going to start dating or not" I'd ask myself, do I hope he's going to ask me that so I can hint I might and maybe that will shake him up enough to get serious about recovery.

You're doing great, deax. I've been in your shoes. Good luck tomorrow.

deax

Meh, I don't think I agree even though that probably sounds like I'm in denial. I don't WANT him to ask me that because I think, if I know him, that'll just be his next excuse to go back to using if he isn't already. I know I'm the only reason he went into that detox, this is a game. And that's fine, but that's the effect I think my telling him I might meet someone else would have-- NOT that it would scare him into getting better. Honestly, I really do know the things he will ask me tomorrow, and I am just afriad of being unprepared w/o somthing to say because that's when I say things that I regret later. I'm just trying to see what you guys think is the "right" answer to the dating question...? Cuz I'm not sure how to handle it. I don't want to "wait" a year for him.

Thanks for all your help, denny.

minnie

"I will not speak to you for x amount of time. If you call, I will hang up. Hope everything works out for you. Bye."

How difficult is that?

Minx1969

Deax -

I know it feels weird but you do not OWE him any explaination for your behavior in the upcoming year...

We codies like to "explain" ourselves over and over and over again.

How about "I hadn't really given it any thought. It's really no longer your concern now anyway"

My exabf called a few times after we "broke up" to ask if I was dating any one?

I told him it was none of his business....He was trying to manipulate me and I wasn't going to play that game no more...

Stop being concerned with how he feels....

If it is meant to be, you'll get back together in a year...

deax

OK, so I am supposed to view this as officially a breakup then. I wasn't sure about that part, like if during the nc I was supposed to view it as just a "break" or whatever, I'm still confused about how to approach some things... But OK, if that's good enough then I'll just phrase it like that.

I don't know why I feel this need to explain, it's not like it ever did me any good in the past.

Minx1969

I guess the way I would look at it is this:

You go about your life, he goes about his life...

if after a period of a year or so of no contact - there's enough recovery on both sides, you may give it a try.

but then again after a year of no contact, you could be a completely different person Deax with no desire to even have any contact with him..

What he choses to do during that no contact is his choice..what you choose is your choice...

It is YOUR life afterall..

sunshinebluesky

I don't know why I feel this need to explain, it's not like it ever did me any good in the past.took me a VERY LONG TIME to REALIZE that,and finallly SEE,he will NEVER get it anyway. but,i do have to say that some of the aftermath short communications i had with him actually HELPED me see that...............thats why sometimes,if you are able to keep things in TOTAL PERSPECTIVE,which can be tricky....i think the slip ups of contact can actually help.

if ya do talk to him tomorrow,try and keep it short and civil.....he doesnt need or probably even want long explanations....dont know about you,but in these cases when i try ro rehearse,it never works out for me!!!
maybe saying something about ya cant make any promises on anything right now,you care about him but hes got to do what hes got to do for HIMSELF,not for you or any other reason.and you are going to do the same....wherever that takes you.
maybe ya should write something down,and read it as soon as he says its him!!!! then quickly say good bye.

deax

Yep, I hear you and I I feel exactly the same! I'm trying to be super aware of all of this because I really do not want to be on the phone with him for very long. If what I'm trying to say to him is that at this point and under the circumstances I don't want to re-engage or get into the nitty gritty and all the specifics (even tho I do have questions!) then I have to start with this phonecall, I have to make sure I don't send a mixed message by doing that back and forth one last time... I did write stuff down and originally it came to like 2 pages, and now I cut it down to half a page but it's more of a safety blanket for me, I won't read it word for word obviously. And I already know everything HE will say and I'm prepared for that too, though I'm sure he'll surprise me. But I have a better sense now of what the bottom line is so like someone said earlier, I want to feel comfortable with what I say but I won't get hung up on the delivery, and if he doesn't push the issue I won't offer any additional commentary either. I'm so nervous, I feel like this is going to make me go through a grieving process all over again because I feel like this time is the real thing. And that's why I think it's good for ME-- last time I didn't really want to say or do this NC thing. I wasn't ready, didn't know enough and was stillin too much denial. This time I do want this. Well, more accurately-- I still don't WANT it, but at the same time, nothing could talk me out of it. There's no alternative.

After work tonight I have to go to Al-Anon at 7:30 and then my neighbor told me to meet up with him at the AA meeting nextdoor at 8:30 because there will be a speaker there he wants me to see. So if he calls during either of those times I guess I won't answer and I'll just talk to him next time he calls when I'm free... I dunno.