GettingFree

I'm facing a transition in my work and having a lot of trouble deciding what's in my best interests.

I'm been on short-term-disability for the last 3 months for a back problem (disc problem) and that disability is about to wind up. I truly don't want to return to my job -- it's an incredibly toxic and stressful environment and I'm sure was a big contributing factor in making my back problems worse.

In the last month, I've been approached by a small company who really likes my work and would like me to work freelance for them. For business reasons, they're not ready at this time to hire someone fulltime. Apparently, they lost someone who did this work in a freelance capacity for the last 10 years and are looking at me as a replacement. But I'm not sure if they can make any commitment to me for me to know I can meet the income I need to hit.

I've had discussions and told them I can't really make the jump out of my full-time job -- or out of looking at an alternative full-time job -- without some commitment of volume of work or salary, etc. On the other hand, I don't even know right now if I want to be gunning for full-time 9-5 (or because of the industry, could be 9-?) should they offer it. The independence and flexibility that freelance offers is very attractive -- but the uncertainty of it and the loss of benefits is a definite challenge to me.

So here's the thing: I don't know if I'm being hyper-fearful about taking the jump and if I should trust that this can work out, and I can supplement whatever work I get from them with other freelance work. Of if I should continue to scout other full-time work for the security, benefits, etc. Or if there are negotiating tricks I'm not aware of.

Basically I'm scared. I've never been good at negotiating for myself, even though in so many other ways I'm seen as very strong, confident and a take-charge person in my profession.

Any feedback or advice would be very welcome!

Minx1969

Hey GF -

You know that I switched from a full-time job in December of 2004 to contract work for 2005 and beyond.

how many months would the freelancing pay for?

Can you go to part time (or 4 days a week) with the current (albeit) toxic job.

You could use your "disability" as a jumping off point to open discussions with the current job..this way you have the benefits and still have some flexibility to freelance. Sounded like it was very demanding..maybe if they don't want to lose you, you could give up a little of your salary but make it up freelancing.

I know not wanting to give up the benefits..struggled with that one but since my contract positions pay more (and are more freeing) I am ok with that today.

Can you pick up more freelance work? (or work with a contracting company like I do to get some contract work)?

Do you have enough saved in the bank to make it through some rough times?

There is a little leap of faith..

just a few things to think about.

Minx1969

Another thing to think about is that if you get another fulltime job you might be able to negotiate 4 days a week.

I have a friend who is a contractor whose contract says 32 hours a week (standard 40 hour workweek in the US)

Just another thought..I had a friend who was a Brand Manager for a big consumer products company..she left to have kids..

she now is a consultant for the same company billing lots of $ per hour.

So..can you consult part time for the current company you work for?

I'm not sure you can negotiate too much more on the freelancing..other then the rate..

ask them how much work they will be giving you..sounds like you should ask some more questions.

GettingFree

Hi Minx,

Thanks for all your suggestions. I have thought about approaching my current CEO with the idea of consulting or freelancing for them when my disability is up. It seemed like a good solution that would remove me from the day-to-day politics and allow me flexibility to do other work.

However, the more I thought about it, the more I am sure that a clean break with this company is the best. I've worked in a number of environments, and by far this is the most debilitiating I've ever been in. It's not the hours or work demands -- I've been in places where it's been far more challenging in that respect.

What's really toxic is a culture of blatant disrespect bordering on abuse that stems from the CEO (who I report to). He's a triple type A who has a very autocratic style of management, lacks any form of civility unless he's courting the board of directors or venture capitalists, and loses his temper with someone at regular intervals. I used to leave in a knot of steel daily.

So...

The thought of 4 days a week with another position is a thought -- but I think it's harder to apply for a new position this way rather than negotiate for a change after you've been there for a while and have proven your value. But I'll certainly speak to the headhunter about this.

As far as enough saved up ...hmm.. I may have to rely on my LOC if I have a shortfall, and hope I'd gain ground back. My investments (not a lot) are all in RSPs (similar to a 401K), which means I'd be taxed heavily should I withdraw.

Yes, I've asked about how much work they'd have to give me. I had lunch with one of the principals today who clearly wants me. However, I think she needs to decide if she wants to go with me exclusively to fill this need, or divide it between me and another freelancer who's more junior (she'd use me on the bigger and more senior-client-facing jobs). Hopefully, she'll think about it more and get back to me on where she's at next week.

I'm just so freakin' unsure and feel so vulnerable. Kinda stuck by indecision. Three kids, a mortgage and a partner whose in his own work transition now makes it so much harder. Wish there was an easy answer. Maybe I'm just using this post to think this aloud and move myself closer to jumping.

gf

DesertEyes

Hey there GF,

I know how scary that jump can be. I've jumped back and forth from consultant to employee lots of times, and for 20 years I had a disabled wife with huge medical bills to worry about.

In reading your post I see mention of only _two_ options. Staying in the toxic company or contracting for the one client. Are there any other companies you could work for full-time?

Could you go contract for just as long as needed to find another full time job? Can you stay on disability until you get a job? If you don't like contracting could you then get a regular job?

My point is that you have a lot more options than just two. If you set up a few more options then you're not "leaping off a cliff", you're "jumping with a parachute".

Am I making sense?

Mike

GingerM

GF,

I can offer you no advice, but I can offer you a compatriot in fear. I gave notice to my company that I will be leaving in a couple of years (needed that much notice as my job is very niched and there simply isn't anyone with the experience needed whom we could hire right off so we need time to train a new person and it's a long learning curve).

The fear for me is fear of the unknown. I won't be going to a new job. I don't even know what I'm going to do, except that whatever it is, it will be to help other people in some capacity. But I'm terrified....and that's at least two years away for me.

If I can't sort out what I'm afraid of, I'm sure this must be gnawing at you. Wish I had some good ideas, but I can give you a 'me too', for what it's worth.

GettingFree

Damn it. (Is that okay mods to say here???)

I'm doing what I do when I obsess. Up at 2 in the morning, unable to fall asleep, while the mice run around in my head. Yuck. This too shall pass.

Yes...I'm not closing that option, although because of my specialty and level, positions are not that plentiful. I've applied for positions at a 'lower' level, but that seems to not be received well. The headhunter spoke to me about an opportunity today he's putting me forward for next week.

That said, because of my back, I've started to question going back into any office environment working at a desk 9to? -- even one with a positive culture -- in an industry that can often put demands for extra hours to meet client deadlines. It really does seem the flexibility that freelance may give (the ability to work at home a fair bit) may be the better option healthwise. Sitting for an extended period is still the worst, and most painful, part of what's going on with me and my back.

With the present company? As I talked about, I wouldn't want to. Afraid I'd undo all the progress I've made these past 3 months.

So far the insurance company has extended benefits only till May 14th pending a letter from my doctor. If they do approve longer, likely won't be much, maybe another couple of weeks. So this is getting imminent, if not, immediate.

Next week, I'm going to get in touch with someone I've spoken to once already who may need 1/2 a body. So...I'm exploring. It's the urgency with which I have to make a decision about returning to the old job or not that's the kicker.

I realize one thing I'm struggling with is that I'd love get more of a commitment from the first option, and right now I have the leverage of not wanting to leave full-time work. But once I decide to leave, I lose that.

thanks again for you helpful advice Mike! (now just waiting for the mice to stop their scurrying around inside that head of mine)

GettingFree

Do I ever hear you Ginger.

Trust in the unknown isn't something I learned to do very well. Duh. I couldn't even trust what was known!

But I'm feeling my way on the edge outside the window - and like Mike has said -- trying to pack a parachute, or two, or three.

Thanks for your 'me too' support. Keep us posted how it's going for you vis a vis the job and moving towards the unknown.

gf

mallowcup

With a good plan in place you face the change with that plan. The change shoudn't be complete fog. If it is, it probably isn't a good plan. I would become more comfortable negociationg for your self before making the move. We can't wish oursleves into a new career. We have to walk head on into it with skills and confidence. Youhave to take on the persona of those who impress you in business. That sounds harsh and maybe discouraging, it isn't meant to be. I do think until fear is turned into a more productive emotion, I wouldn't make the move. If you came to me to sell yourself, I'd want to be convinced. You may be sweating bullets but you can act. Absolutely no reason you can't make this move and be absolutely successful. You have to believe it.

GettingFree

Hi Mallow,

I've done a pretty good job convincing others in the past of my value and talents -- so I'm not worried about that. I'm pretty articlulate about my abilities and have always done well once I get to an interview. However, job openings in my field at my level are few and far between without a willingness to relocate.

And just as an aside, the feelings I share here are not what I present on the outside. On the outside in the working world, I'm seen as confident, creative, accomplished and decisive.

So my fears aren't about convincing someone of my talent. They're twofold:

1) making a decision to let go of the safety net of being a salaried employee and embrace the uncertainty of a freelance career.

2) negotiating for myself. I see this as a skill quite distinct from my other capabilities and one I've always been unsure of.

I'll go head to head and negotiate very capably for a strategy, a plan, a creative idea. But when it comes to negotating for my own compensation or terms, it's another thing altogether. It seems I have a hard time asking for what I think I'm worth, or insisting that certain terms be met in a certain way, and I think I let myself be taken advantage of. I'm working at it.

That's why I was asking for suggestions.

thanks

gf

mallowcup

You know why we have safety nets? Safety nets are not something that should be let go of necessarily. Why not remeasure the whole thing. That safety net is worth a lot. With a safety net you can move more freely. Mabe you just realized it's value. I don't hinkit takes bravery to work without a net, I think it is wise to look at the quality of life when you have one and when you don't. All the benefits of freelance aren't worth anything if you fall without a net. Is there somewhere in the middle? Can you try some freelance while holding this job to see how it goes? Can you talk to someone else who does freelance to get some advice?

DesertEyes

Heya GF,

Here's a couple more things I've done that might be useful.

Sounds to me like that safety net of yours is dependent on the actions of others. Companies go broke, managers get fired, economies falter. My safety net is _not_ in being an employee, my safety net is in _my_ ability to get another job should the current one vanish. I may not be able to get the same kinda job in the same field (I'm also pretty specialized), but I know I can _a_ job somewhere. As an ACoA I have learned not to make my happiness and financial security dependent on somebody else. ( or is that from Al-Anon? so many programs I get them confuzled !!! )

If I am lacking a skill in a certain area I don't attempt to use those skills until I have developed them properly. What I do is re-define the problem. If you can't negotiate for yourself, then don't. Negotiate for your family, for your kids, for _their_ future. When you go into the negotiating session don't think of what _you_ are worth, think of what your _kids_ are worth. That oughta bring out the Mama bear in your negotiating technique

Mike

minnie

GF

What does your soul tell you to do?

And what's the worst that could happen if you do it?

GettingFree

Minnie & Mike,

You're both right.

The worst that can happen: I take the chance on freelance, it doesn't work out as hoped, I roll any LOC that I've had to access into my mortgage, and I change course and get a new full-time job.

The best: I enjoy new flexibility and freedom, better working conditions in terms of my health, remove myself from corporate politics, and maintain my income.

And what does my soul say? I'd love the second to work out. Go for it. I think I can do it.

I'm having lunch next week with a colleague who began freelancing 3 years ago and has been encouraging. I'm going to pick his brains clean. And I'm going to be meeting with another one whose going to help me get my book (portfolio) into digital format so I can court work outside my city.

As for negotiating, great idea. Bringing up my inner lioness protecting her cubs is sure to help.

Thanks all -- I'm feeling in a much better, and more confident, space!

gf