Pick-a-name

Given the chance, that's the way I would go. Me working on me, him working his program and starting over to build a new workable relationship...one day at a time. I wouldn't force it, nor would I move back until I knew it was the right thing for me. period. I have to get myself healthy first.

Good luck. Take your time and do what YOU need to do. Your AH is a big boy; he needs to work on his recovery for himself; it's his not yours. You have your own to consider. He can easily be in your lives and do for you and the kids living apart...IF he wants to. JMO

Pick-a-name

For what it's worth......I thought the same thing. Easier for him (how? haha); isn't that the crux of it all.......always looking for an easier way out of the hard stuff. You have the kids and the responsibility for them, right? How much easier does it get than for them to just "worry" about themselves and their wants.............sorry if I sound a bit resentful, but it is sooooo typical and this counselor is buying everything he is selling. JMO

Ayers1995

I agree that I have the kids and the responsibilities...and he should be working on himself. Why can't he figure out what those things are?? He keeps focus on working on the alcohol problem, helping with the kids, keeping the house up, not losing his temper. These things he thinks are DONE... NOW WHAT? Why aren't you home? (his way of thinking)

Truthfully...I'm not sure what all I'm supposed to be working on. As for the counselor, I will go back to her website and credentials...they said something about addiction and stuff...but I will check. We have our meeting tonight, and I'm not sure where I stand on things...I know I'm not ready to move back, but I have been spending a little time with him. He's trying to court me all over.... I don't know.. 1st things 1st.

megamysterioso

Good morning Ayers. It seems that his "working on the alcohol problem" is not working since those empty bottles were found. He's probably doing his best at the other stuff, but won't that other stuff sort of fall by the wayside if the drinking kicks back up again? I feel a little odd sharing my opinion with you sometimes b/c I live with a drinking man. I feel like I don't have any children to consider though so if the "other shoe drops," I alone will suffer that consequence. You and your children will suffer if/when that happens.

I'm sure you've thought and thought and thought about this, so all the following is probably not new, but... Don't move back in if YOU are not ready period. Can't you just imagine moving back in and things going right back to the way they were and you having to struggle to "break free" again??? Do you want to go through that mess another time? Do you want to live with him again right now knowing that the 1000lb. weight of him pressuring you to be the "good, understanding wife" will be forever present? How are you prepared to deal with that? If you don't cooperate fully with him (based on HIS standards of how you should be supporting him), don't you think the guilt thing may start again? You may even perhaps feel responsible for his "progress"???? You should NOT put yourself in that position!!!! It is NOT your responsibility and you will once again lose yourself in a household where 99% of the focus is on HIM and his "effort" to "do better."

denny57

Your own counselor would help you there. Sounds like you're being pressured on all sides to go back because HE needs it. It's very possible you may need to do just that so you can figure out what you're supposed to be working on. Good luck at your meeting tonight.

(())

Ayers1995

Morning Mega,
Please don't EVER feel odd sharing your opinion with me. I feel we've made sort of a friendship through this board, and HONESTY... is what I need in my life. I appreciater very much your post.
I am having a great deal of feelings about the bottles that were found. I am trying to remind myself ACTIONS-NOT WORDS. That's what my MOTTO needs to be. I get caught up in the words, and all of the other sweet actions, and put aside the 'major thing'. Yes, if the other shoe drops...those things will fall by the wayside. You are absolutely right. Me and the boys will be the ones to suffer.
For some reason, maybe since we've never gone through this before, I imagined that me scaring the mess out of him... If I moved back in, (only when I'm ready, I agree) that things probably wouldn't go back to the way they were. I know he NEVER expected me to move out. Never believed that I would. NEVER...

Would I want to have to struggle to get out again?? NO!! But, iwe would continue counseling and if I felt like things weren't going well, I shouldn't be so scared (of the unknown) and of convincing him to let me go. Yes, I feel alot of pressure from his family and him to be more supportive... But I do know that I am not to blame.

This is what I was thinking... not move back in. Cause I'm not ready to resume things.. maritally. (sex, kissing saying I love you)... but slowly courting and spending some time together. Him work his things... Me work on mine. I certainly feel stuck on step 1. I read all of the other steps...and I say ok.. I can do that, I can do that...but when a situation arises...I guess I don't do that.

I don't want to lose myself. I want to continue finding myself...and if I find the man that I married so long ago along the way...that'd be great. i hope in this life it is actually possible. Write back, because really all I am doing is trying to collect thoughts and Truth.

megamysterioso

Hi Ayers. I consider us friends here too, but I don't want to ever seem insensitive to you b/c I DO care about what happens to you. I also don't want to seem like some "all-knowing" person b/c I'm in a less-than-perfect situation myself. LOL--oh yeah- I've got all the answers all right LMAO.

I would not put much stock in the rationale you used above. February of 2005, I "scared" my AH by threatening the end. I stayed at the inlaw's house for a night, had them take him away the next day, shut off his cell phone- did as much as I could at the time to prepare for our separation. This was a weekend so not much I could do legally. If my parents were in the area, I probably would have moved in with them at that time. My boundary was that he go into inpatient rehab or I would not take him back. We did not have the money to afford that, but I thought his dad would pay for it. Long story short, he came back w/o inpatient rehab and I took him back. He proclaimed how it was a life-changing event for him. He supposedly knew "what was important" and wanted to be a better man. He said he was shocked and very scared when he felt me "pull away my love." Well- since then, we have had a few Jerry Springer episodes. The problems did not magically disappear b/c of all that. Because I took him back (and believe me, things were not lovey-dovey nor have they been ever since), I think a part of him realized, "well, I guess since we're under the same roof, things can resume as normal b/c there is obviously no REAL consequence to my actions." So---- I don't think he really gave 100% to continue to do better. He did as much as he HAD to in order to keep me complacent.

Things have changed with us somewhat at this point. I am really not unhappy anymore and am trying to take it one day at a time with us. How I've dealt with it is this:

I don't have any expectations that he will EVER quit drinking completely. That is no longer a goal that I'm striving for him to achieve. I am very realistic about this. I need to be able to cope with him drinking "moderately" and I can cope with that. I have set my boundary that I will not tolerate any more of those Jerry Springer episodes in my life. AH knows this and he also knows that I have no fears or quams about us getting a divorce. We have learned to communicate with each other without arguing or raising our voices to each other. I have let go any pre-occupation with or urge to try and control his drinking. I know that it is NOT my burden to carry. I focus on myself and what I want and like first and foremost. I no longer put myself second in EVERY aspect of our relationship (I really used to do this with him all the time- he ALWAYS came first). I've found that in doing so, he seems to be more considerate to me!!! Weird how that works, but he is very willing and able to compromise these days.
Things are better these days for us. Whatever the future holds, I have no idea. I'm doing the best I can today.

Living separately is the only way you can do this for now IMO! Your idea of "courting" sounds OK to me, but I don't know that it will work if it will derail him from the MAIN objective. If he sees you regularly, I'm afraid he will focus using that time together to "prove" to you with WORDS that he has changed and that you need to come home. His main objective SHOULD BE to get his drinking under control by showing you with ACTIONS that he is sincere in getting sober. If you decide to continue seeing him, I would set some clear boundaries with him first. For example: "I don't want you to even ask me about moving back in when we are spending time together. The purpose of this time together is to get re-acquainted with the new sober you- the sober you that you will be working on when we are NOT together." "Don't rush me or pressure me, just show me. I will talk with you about that when I am ready" "Please respect me enough to give me this time to see and appreciate the steps you are taking." Something along those lines. His main goal seems to be getting you back rather than taking recovery seriously. That needs to flip-flop big time.

GettingBy

Oh I had LOTS of anger and resentment. I was angry about his approach to living ("I'll do as I damn well please even if I am married!"), his inability to be financially responsible, the drinking and driving... oh the list went on and on. I was super pissed about all the things HE was doing to ME... Alanon helped me figure out that he wasn't doing anything TO me, I was just taking on too much responsibility for him. Al-anon helped me to figure out why I was so angry. I learned how to deal with my hurt feelings BEFORE they festered into resentments. I still get angry from time to time, but I've learned how to put it all back into perspective.
Ya know, I'd be lying if I said it didn't bother me. There are times when I look at him, and the voice in my head screams, "Don't you think you've had enough?" or "Good god do you really need a beer NOW, for crying out loud?" And then I remember that he's just doing what he does and that is really none of my business. I also try and remember how it feels when he nags me... that helps me keep my mouth shut, and walk away. Honestly, since I've stayed detached from the drinking (ie, keep my mouth shut, no yelling, no scolding, no nothing!) he's started to see the drinking problem all on his own. He's struggling with accepting the nature of the disease, and b/c of Al-anon, I've been able to stay out of it so he can figure it out on his own.
I'd just like to point out that being detached doesn't mean having little or no involvement. My husband and I still do ALOT together, even though I'm detached from him. Being detached, to me, means respecting my husband as an individual who's free to make his own decisions... even if don't agree. We do our best as a couple to come to agreement, but sometimes a compromise just is NOT possible (like the drinking). That's being detached. Accepting that the other person has "their ways" of doing things, and that not everything has to be done "my way." Oh yeah... and being detached also means getting off the tracks before the alcoholic train runs me over!
Oh yeah, I definetely fell out of love when I first started Al-anon. It was hard. I was going through so many changes within myself. All those feelings that I had stuffed away for so long... all coming up into my face. I was raw, and there was no way I was going to let some drunken jerk hurt me anymore! My first reaction was to ask him for a seperation, and we did. We were seperated for about 3 weeks, and I think that's when it clicked for me that I was just as much a part of our marital problems. My controlling habits had gotten out of control, and I finally had to face the music. I think the biggest thing that really brought the love back into our marriage... was big dose of humility, on both sides. Instead of letting our big fat egos get in the way, we both humbly acknowledge our roles and agreed to focus on our own sides of the street, instead of each others. We still slip on occasion, but we're way better at catching it before it festers and breeds resentment.

The most important thing for me now, is that I have learned to take it one day at a time. I don't know what lies around the corner, so I do my best to take care of me, make decisions that honor me, and always, always, always, remember that no choice is EVER final... I most certainly have the right to change my mind!

Hope this helps in some way!
Shannon

ASpouse

Ayers, I think all the answers lie within yourself. For me, and I am with my RA, the dealbreakers were clear and simple:

He must go to AA for the rest of his life
He drinks, I'm gone with the kids

He knew I meant it. There was no debating about it, talking about it, thinking about it. Those were my two conditions and if we (myself and our kids) weren't important enough to him to agree to my conditions, then that was it.

Ayers1995

Sounds like good dealbreakers Judy. That's what it all comes down too. Thanks for sharing....

Zoey

Shannon..Wonderfull post. I always enjoy when you share.

Ayers .. Sorry for "but in" here, just felt needed to say that. You have good helpers. HUGS to you.

ASpouse

Not easy by any means and I had to be very very very strong to stick to them.

Fortunately for me, my husband knew I meant what I said.

pmaslan

and that is what it comes down to ...."meaning what you say..."

Cynay

and saying what your mean

Ayers1995

Thanks for sharing Shannon... it's experiences like yours and others that I was looking for. I appreciate your sharing....

IrshIzNotSmilin

It is good to just think , go to a meeting, journal and read and when you are ready for whatever action you will know.