Mixed feelings this morning

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Old 02-02-2006, 12:12 PM
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TexasGirl, remember how I told you of the night my AH didn't come home so I drove to where we were, then saw he was at his office? At that very moment, right at that second, I just knew he was in there with her. I didn't need to see it, I didn't need any more "evidence". I KNEW. I left feeling so validated, so angry, so resolved that this was IT, the final straw. After about two hours, I was out of control in full force codependant mode. When he got home he walked through the door all mad at me saying terrible things. Things like, "I didn't come home last night because I was mad at you, I was so tired of the daily struggle of being with you, I don't want to be here anymore, I'm packing and leaving." He told me he wasn't with anyone and the fact that I could think that disgusted him after how much he's shown me his love. WHAM, I fell for it, I was begging him not to feel that way, not to think those things. *I* ended up on the desperate end. *I* ended up BEGGING him to stay. He did. He went nowhere and that night told me he was sorry for what he said, that he didn't mean it but he was angry and that is why he didn't come home. Let me tell you I didn't question it, I clung to his story because I didn't want to rock the boat. He wasnn't mad at me, I left where we were and he was to be right behind me, we kissed and said we loved each other. His reason for how he got mad is he ended up seeing an old high school boyfriend of mine. CRAZY I tell you. We are now in our mid thirties. To this day, I doubt myself...."was he with her, wasn't he?" Right at that moment, I KNEW he was, I just KNEW. Your doubts are about YOU, not his honesty.

If we let ourselves we will always need more evidence, it's never enough and they will never admit it.

Don't do this to yourself. Stick to the facts. You are no match for his lies right now.
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Old 02-02-2006, 12:24 PM
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He will never admit it. Document everything and check detailed billing. Do a google on the phone number. Maybe new sliding bolts for the next time he takes a walk? dax
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:50 PM
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Hi again,
Before I say anything, please know I'm not defending him. I want to tell you all what he said, and will you help me wade through it?

First of all, I asked who he went with, and he said a client. M - Who? H - Someone I’m working on getting their business. M - What is their name? H - Don. M - Don? And whose telephone number is xxx-xxxx? H - OK, you’re right, do you want to know the truth? M – Yes. H - It was Donna. She’s a client of mine.

OK. So I know all of that is true. He apologized for lying and said he did it so I wouldn’t be mad. Duh. He also said she is 42 (we’re 27), and that nothing happened between them. He said she’s recently divorced, and she’s been asking him to go do something for a while.

Reasons I believe him: He’s cute, and I can see a recent divorcee flirting with “the younger guy.” I’ve seen him drink with the STRANGEST of people all in the name of having someone to drink with. Once he hung out at the bar with some 70-year-old man who was a client. Also, if he were going to hook up with someone, I don’t imagine it would be someone his mother’s age. If that’s even her age, but why would I believe that since he lied about everything else?

Reasons I don’t believe him: He lied 4 times this morning to cover his a**. I know for a fact he didn’t immediately come home from the bar (they were “driving around”…how old are we???). Why would he start telling the truth then?

Reasons it shouldn’t matter: Hook up or not, a real man and husband does not sneak out of the house, have some woman pick him up, hang out in a bar, drive around town, sneak back in, and lie about the whole thing to his wife.

I’m confused.
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Old 02-02-2006, 03:15 PM
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One reason you shouldn't believe him.....why did he feel it was necessary to sneak off in the middle of the night after you had been to bed and why did he get home at 6 something in the morning? Those are your hard facts. That is what you know. Regardless of where he was or who he was with or what he was doing.....he is your husband and he should not be sneaking around in the middle of the night. JMO If you hadn't woke up to notice him missing, would you have ever known?
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Old 02-02-2006, 03:21 PM
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TG, I cannot express to you how much I understand of this....you sound like me, 3 years ago, every word you've written I've said, to myself to others...but I stayed, maybe the wrong decision, I know it was sometimes, we have since had two amazing children but I wouldn't have missed them had I never had them.....I know in my heart of hearts he will never do that to me again.....and if he does....more fool me because I will not complain then. Just, I understand if you do decide to stay and I give you so much admiration if you take the step and leave. You love him, you don't want to leave him, you want to believe he'll change....that's what we all want from our A's, cheating or not. Just know something I've learned, I always had the dream, my prince, would never hurt me, leave me, cheat on me....but I have learned, people are people, people make massive mistakes everyday, massive choices everyday. I remember when he did the same to me, he came to my house one night when we were broken up and I talked to him, I mean really TALKED to him. And getting a little graphic here, but I told him it's not just the lying and the cheating but that part of him, that 'part' was supposed to be for noone else, I took great pride in my fedility, it is something to be proud of, that you can say "no. I love this person I won't hurt them, I am proud of my relationship"
yes, i think you should go now, yes, a lot of the time I wish I had gone. But I want you to know that he's a person, someone you love, and you know that, and you are a great person, very kind andefeeling from what i know of you and I hope if you do go, you go with forgiveness and warmth in your heart and make your way happliy. Good luck!
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Old 02-02-2006, 03:40 PM
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Isn't it enough that he lied?



Again.
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Old 02-02-2006, 03:47 PM
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What type of client would call in the middle of the night? I can only think of one kind .....
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Old 02-02-2006, 03:56 PM
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My thoughts exactly Judy.....is your husband on call 24/7?
What could possibly be so important that it had to be discussed in
the middle of the night. What's up with the driving around thing
after the bar? Like I said my advice today is a bit off (due to my
own personal drama) but come on TG you can't possibly be
buying into any of this ...can you?
Aren't you getting tired of the lies at this point, they really seem
to be piling up!!!!
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Old 02-02-2006, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by pmaslan
My but come on TG you can't possibly be
buying into any of this ...can you?
My thoughts exactly.
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Old 02-02-2006, 04:47 PM
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(((TexasGirl)))

I completely understand how you feel right now. If I'm correct, you are wondering now if he's really telling you the truth because he tells this story and it seems so believable the way he tells it that you actually start feeling as though you've over reacted. And he makes this woman sound like some old woman that just needs a friend and he's just her friend, went out and had a few drinks, drove around and talked, no big deal - and then you're thinking that he wouldn't want to be with some older woman - she just needed a friend, and your ah was just being a nice guy to someone he works with that is going through a rough time. And yes, he lied - but you understand why he did - because you know that yes, you would have been very mad and upset had you known the truth.
And so there is no resolution in your mind - there are only more confusing, spinning, out of control feelings and thoughts rushing through your mind. And yet, his story sounds so reasonable, it makes sense, and at least now you have a story to go with - whereas before you only had questions and your own inner turmoil to feed off of.
So you come here to SR, confused. A part of you wishing that maybe you'd not even mentioned it to begin with. Because you read the replies and you think to yourself, "They really don't understand. He told me the truth (I think) and I can't prove otherwise. And I'm now doubting myself, and and and" Feeling foolish, but at the same time still having hope that he actually is telling you the truth. Wanting so much for the insanity to end that you want to believe his story.

And my heart goes out to you in such a big way. There have been many times where I've told a friend or a family member something that my ah had done. And then, I hear his side of it and I'm wishing I'd not said anything to anyone at all. And then when I tell them what he has said and how I believe him, they look at me with surprise, sometimes with complete unbelievable expressions on their faces, and they point out to me how no matter what he said, he still did this or he did that, etc. and it hurts. Because a part of me knows they just don't "get it" and then it's also because there is that part of me that wants to stay in my land of denial.

But there is something to be said about being "In" the mess versus being an objective outsider. We (the objective not personally hurt by his actions) see it differently than you do. We see that he lied to you, we see that he was sneaking out in the middle of the night, we see that he was keeping a secret from you, and we've watched you struggle through the pain that he's caused you. We see that he has hurt you again, that his actions are questionable, and that there is no reason why he should be "hanging out" with a 42 year old divorced woman in the middle of the night, sneaking off to a bar, out driving around, etc. This is sooooo disrespectful, so unfair, and so wrong for a spouse to do this while his wife is in bed sleeping (whether he's an A or not). And just like Jessica pointed out - what if you had not woken up? You would have never ever known about this.

(Just noticed, I should not have said "we" above as I can only speak for myself, not other members on this board. But don't want to have to go through and edit it all, so sorry about that)

My point TexasGirl is that regardless of what your gut feelings are saying versus that part of you that wants to believe him ----- wade through the mess and look at the facts. Regardless of it all, he treated you disrespectfully, he lied to you, and there is a major about of broken trust.

While reading your post, I was thinking of the "Abused Woman" syndrome. How each time, they convince themselves that it wasn't so bad. And they promise themselves that if it gets worse, they'll leave. Add in that boiling frog story and I guess what I'm asking you TexasGirl is this.....

Where are your boundaries?
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Old 02-02-2006, 04:54 PM
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Standing....you can include me in the "we" thing.....
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Old 02-02-2006, 05:59 PM
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My Ah has clients too....only none that he sees that late at night. That isn't "going to do something" it's sneking around at night. TG, a lot of men (especially once who do not have too much respect for themselves) view a recent divorced woman as "easy." Why? Because sometimes, they're vulnerable.

TG, it doesn't matter if we think he's lying, you don't want to believe it.

If a friend told me this story, just as you did, I"d sit back and try to help her see the truth in this situation. Your AH did what mine would, he admitted to what he had to. Only when he realized you knew more wouldhe offer more. Once he realized you didn't know much, other than a girl.....he filled in the spaces knowing he had to say something. His entire story is nothing short of stupid.

Now, if you want to stay, I won't blame you. Heck, I am you. But don't fool yourself, he's lying. What's more, it's gonna drive you crazy.
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Old 02-02-2006, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by pmaslan
Standing....you can include me in the "we" thing.....
Me too
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Old 02-03-2006, 01:34 AM
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Oh dear Tgirl.

I feel so bad for you right now. If you chose to accept his story then your life doesnt have to change. You are simply chosing the comfort of not having to do anything that will change your living situation or your financial situation. I can totally understand this.

Change is scary. You fear the unkown. You dont want to lose him in case he turns into the man you have always dreamed he can be, or will be. He will most likely find another enabler and you will not be the person to share his life anymore. And that most likely your worst nightmare come true...i know it was mine. (when i say you, i mean people in general)

As i said. All totally understandable.

However, if you let it slide, you will have no peice of mind. You will be eaten up inside wondering who he is with and what they are doing every single time you dont know exactly where he is. And eventually he might just decide that he wants to leave anyway. Maybe to be with someone who accepts him totally for who he is (translation- a new woman who enables without question and doesnt see all his flaws YET).

It is honestly one of the most horrible situations anyone can find themselves in. An A cheating. Someone you have put your life on hold for, given up so much for, and tried so hard for, chosing to betray you?! Its just to awful to contemplate. But unfortunately sweetheart, it is so common.

My therapist once told me that a new/different ..... (insert what ever word you want for womans parts)can give them the same high that a full bottle of scotch does. And it can be just as addictive too.

Hard to accept but its the truth.

For me, it was the cut off. I went through so much for him because of his disease. I just COULD NOT go through that too. No matter what the implications were. But that is just my limit. You have to decide what you can take and what you cant.

Big hugs to you sweety...
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Old 02-03-2006, 05:37 AM
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Hey TG,

I'm sorry but those meatballs he threw at you were definetely his "game", or "dance", whatever you want to call it. Unfortunately, it worked because it got you distracted. You're now focusing on everything but the truth.

The truth is a faithfully married man does not leave his house in the middle of the night to go hang out with a newly single woman. I don't care what her previous marital status was, or age... she's a single woman now and you're husband is hanging out until the early morning hours with her. That's not a business meeting.

I'm a firm believer that it stops being "business" after the second drink. That's my boundary. When B was staying out until 11pm-midnight at bars with "clients"... it wasn't business, didn't even matter that they were male clients, getting drunk together is not doing business. Like my grandma always said...

Let's call a spade a spade.

So back to what really matters... YOU. Texasgirl, what are you doing to take care of you? How is your plan to move on going? How's the job search? Any thoughts on your pups or a car?

As always, my thoughts are with you TG.
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Old 02-03-2006, 07:14 AM
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Morning all,
I'm really not defending his actions as a business meeting by any means!!! Clearly it was a personal meeting during personal hours of the day. And it was lied about, and you're right, I would not have ever known if I had not been looking.

This is not the first time he's left after I've gone to bed. So that part does not surprise me. If anyone wants to drink with him, he is so glad and goes out with them. Pot heads, low-class people, weird old men, this man who's on pain killers for chronic pain so he's always whacked out, recent divorcees...

So that's what throws me off...the behavior is typical of him, it just so happens that it was a woman this time. I have removed all my emotions from him doing these things before, but when you throw a female into the mix, my alarm bells go crazy. And I know that even though she's older than him, that doesn't mean anything really (and I DID NOT mean my original statement as in insult to anyone, by the way!!!! We all know women in their late 30s and 40s are much more comfortable in that department than those of us in our insecure 20s!). Obviously her intentions were less than honorable. Maybe his were too. He's obviously comfortable lying about the situation, so I can't get real answers from him. The fact is, I will never know with 100% clarity. Never.

Last night, he said, "Do you want to know the closest I've ever come to cheating on you?" I looked at him incredulously. "One night when I was at the bar with a friend, some girl came up to me and pulled me in and kissed me. I didn't kiss her back...I pulled away from her." What???!!! What he didn't get is that had he not been out at the bar late while I was at home, that never would have happened, and that if you put yourself in places where bad things can happen, they can and do.

All of this to say, I've been unhappy with his behavior before, I know I do not want to start a family with an active A, and I have been looking for a good job in another city already. Did he cheat? Maybe. Was I planning to leave anyway? As soon as I have everything set up, yes.

In the meantime, I asked him to get the car title for me. I continue to look for jobs. And cheater or not, the behavior was questionable enough for me to have continued motivation to work towards my plan.

I appreciate you all more than I could ever express.

M
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Old 02-03-2006, 07:32 AM
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TG, I hope you'll be okay and not too terribly anxious. I've also heard the, "I've never cheated on you, the closest was some girl calling me and I talked to her once but felt I was betraying you....." Something like that. It felt good when he'd say that, heck, it still does. For the moment when he's giving his explanations or for the moment when he says, "I'd never do that to you," I feel better. But then, when I'm alone and let it enter my mind, I feel insecure and icky again. I remember the truth. It's such an exhausting struggle. Then the next thing happens after I have somewhat gotten to a more comfortable place and it all comes up again.

Please don't have kids with this man. Take it from me, it doesn't change a thing. You see, I had a baby with mine and guess what happened? NOTHING. Now, I get to have things happen while trying to also take care of a baby, ALONE.

We're here for you.
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Old 02-03-2006, 08:08 AM
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I feel like I should let you all know that I'm not saying I believe him. I really don't know. Facts are facts, lies are lies. Does his story make sense? Parts of it. But it was laced with lies from the beginning.

The point is, I should not have to deal with this. I should not be placed by my husband in situations where I have to worry and wonder. That is not fair or normal.

I'm job searching, and I bought a GRE test prep book that I've been working through should I opt for grad school. I e-mailed the advisor twice, but I haven't heard back yet. I'll call her today. I've looked at a couple of apartments in the town I will move to, and I found one in a good location, but off the beaten path so it's cheaper. The plan's not ready, but it's been in motion.
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Old 02-03-2006, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by TexasGirl
The point is, I should not have to deal with this. I should not be placed by my husband in situations where I have to worry and wonder. That is not fair or normal.
Too bloody right. Bottom line, whether alcohol is involved or not.

I have a feeling you'll be just fine.
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Old 02-03-2006, 08:27 AM
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The point is, I should not have to deal with this. I should not be placed by my husband in situations where I have to worry and wonder. That is not fair or normal.
Bravo, TG! That's it in a nutshell! Glad to hear that your plans are in motion!

:-) Shannon
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