equus

Honestly I think you have acted as you believe you should - just right now it's getting out of whack. I do think it's difficult for you to reckon divorce with the image you have of yourself (I could still be wrong). I think alot of the negative feelings are coming from how you see you not her.

Have a think - perhaps I'm up the wrong tree?

ASpouse

At last check, I think there were "women" in blue and many women in the military also who were keeping us safe.

Did you not just say that you are a protector and rescuer? Isn't that what a man does? Isn't that what a husband is supposed to do? Well to my reading these threads for many months, maybe more than a year or two, I've seen more women who look at themselves as protectors and rescuers of their alcoholic husbands and KNOW they are enablers. Not one woman here has ever taken the position that being rescuer and protector to their husbands/SO's makes them a good "woman" or a good "wife". My question is why should those characteristics symbolize a good husband and man?

Of course you would have rescued and protected a family member, a brother! You are a co-dependent and an enabler. This is what we do. We rescue, we fix and we protect. It is not determined by gender, as you would like to think.

.

A real man does not do that. A real man teaches his family how to care for themselves. A real man is there for support and encouragement. A real man is there if there is a need for a shoulder to cry on.


Then I have to ask why she feels this great need to rid herself of you if you were so encouraging and supportive? Obviously she didn't think so!

This is just plain and simple good manners. I would hope that everyone here practices good manners also. These good manners you have does not designate you as a "man" or a "husband". It designates you as someone who has respect for others. That is a good thing.

I don't think you are a victim of anyone or anything except yourself.

Believe me, I LOVE men .... there are many times when I say "Honey, can you carry this, it's too heavy for me" or "would you mind helping with blah blah blah, you're so much better than I am at it" or anything along those lines. I'll play special music because I know my husband prefers it to what I like, I'll cook certain meals because I know they are his favorites. It's a dance between men and women, a delicate dance than changes with the rhythm of the music. Sometimes the music is down and dirty, sometimes it soft and light, sometimes is crazy and intense. But all in all, relationships between men and woman is a dance.

I'll be the first to admit that there are many things that men can do that women can't but conversely there are many things that women can do that men can't. We are simply wired differently.

What I don't care for is men making a well defined line between the sexes. I thought that ended quite a few years ago!

guyinNC

I guess I was born in the wrong age. I thought ladies prefered the Knight in shining armor.

Chivalry was a strict code of honour and service

To never do outrage nor murder

Always to flee treason

To by no means be cruel but to give mercy unto him who asks for mercy

To always do ladies, gentlewomen and widows succor

To never force ladies, gentlewomen or widows

Not to take up battles in wrongful quarrels for love or worldly goods



I guess I need to look into the metrosexual stuff!

ASpouse

How long ago was Camelot? 500 years ago? Gosh, I don't know, but damn Guy ..... you might be bitch-slapped today if you treated a woman that way LOL! Not to mention that they would be highly suspicious of that sort of treatment!

I think it's sweet, I really do and any woman would be lucky to be treated that way ...... problem is most woman don't want to be treated that way, at least not completely that way.

guyinNC

Here you over step your bounds and inserted your foot

The rest of your comments I take no offence.

minnie

Knight in shining armour? No thanks. See, just as I don't think people need rescuing, I don't need it either. I see it as demeaning - like I can't handle stuff myself. Strips away my dignity.

And if someone tries to "parent" me, guess what happens? I become a spoilt kid and rebel.

equus

I don't know whether to hope that's edible.....

ASpouse

......... just to add, I used to be able to do virtually anything a man can do, maybe not as good, but I was darn close! Well maybe with the exception of peeing standing up ..... that I definitely can't do! <VBG>

I've learned I don't want to be a good as a man, I want to be good as a woman, that's enough for me!

robina

Well now, I don't have any problems with manly men...
I kinda like manly men...
As long as they respect my intelligence and abilities.

I think Guy is being the only kind of man he knows how to be.
It sounds like his heart is in the right place, he just needs to work more on his recovery.

guyinNC

I am off for a facial and then I think I will go to the gap!

Oh well, I learned a lot today!!

ASpouse

My apologies!

Let me restate it ....... why did she feel the need to leave you and her kids? She could have stayed home, drinking herself into oblivion every day and night! I won't guess and neither should you. But if you were so encouraging and supportive, then why exactly did she leave?

Guy only you know the answers to these questions, this is not something you need to throw out there into cyberspace, but there is something Guy, one small piece of this puzzle you are not disclosing. Your situation almost adds up, but is just a little short.

equus

Guy - would you humour me? I'll trade you for the succor you'd prefere to offer.

Would you write a list to yourself of all the roles you feel a husband should take? Not on here - I want it to be absolutely how you feel without our influence. And I want it to include protector and rescuer because you have already stated those.

Then cross off all those you can no longer play regardless of your choice - because she will soon no longer be your wife.

Are the only ones left by any chance protector and rescuer? Is it possible that remaining protector is the last way you can remain a husband (as YOU see husband)? Is it possible that without that role you really would be left only as an ex husband?

Do YOU need that last role?

ASpouse

What's with the egg equus?

pmaslan

Oh no....Judy are you playing detective today........lol

ASpouse

Oh God NO!

But I did have a friend of mine in Buffalo who used to do some sleuthing for me with puppy placements in her area. We used to sign our emails "Bond Out"! BTW, I am quite a good sleuther, however I really curbed that nasty habit...... I found out lots of stuff about people I really didn't need to know! Not good at all. LOL

elizabeth1979

Drama drama drama.
Geez.
Guy, I dont think the issue is with being a manly or chivalrous man. I happen to find chivalry nice, when done in a respectful manner and when valued by the other party.

The only thing I will add here is that there is a line between respect and protecting a healthy person and controlling a sick one.

I dont think its my place to say whats wrong or right with anyones belief sysytem, but I do think we digressed from the point of Guy, stop trying to involve yourself in the alcoholics life in the name of "protection".

Judy, you say things that offend me and my belief system sometimes. Sometimes you dont. But each time I am made uncomfortable by your comment, I usually can get the positive point I think is meant through the tough love approach, which I do value.
Im not sure in this case, what the value in your comment that Guy in someway sent his wife running out and caused her illness. I see the tough, but not the love.

Three c's?

Just my opinion. Oh, Take what you like and leave the rest

TomsGirl

Guy, What was your relationship/partnership with your wife like before the alcohol? Any glaring issues then?

Pick-a-name

Guy: you sound fine to me.

As for your wife; why are we trying to look at this as if she were not an alcoholic; she is.

All the rest.........hmm. Interesting for discussion. Peolple complaining not enough help from their spouse,too much, etc. Hopefully we are all doing our best without enabling the addiction. Hard; as we all know.

JMO

guyinNC

We have been together twenty years. Looking back...she had hole in her life she could not fill. I'm not sure if she was ever really happy. For some reason, she never was able to make any close friends. My family, and even hers commented that she came off " like salesperson in a high end clothing shop". She was always nice, always smiled sweetly, seemed concerned....but somehow it was superficial. She had to present an image to others of perfection.

She opened up to me, I loved her... but again no close friends. She did as she pleased, worked when she wanted to, bought what she wanted.....and controlled the checkbook. We lived a nice suburbon, middle class life, great kids etc.

For some reason she was still not happy. Delayed effects of adult child of an alcoholic? Living with a chivalrous man?

Sometimes life is what it is...

guyinNC

I know I have many faults...I'm sure if i had been a better husband, more attentive, perhaps this nightmare could have been avoided.