Codependency
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Show Me State
Posts: 6
Codependency
What happened to compassion and caring? 
Is seeking help for someone who is destroying themself a character flaw? Is it bad for my emotional well being? When my husband and I were married 20 years ago I had no plans of "detaching" myself from him. I thought we were joined as one.
Is seeking help for someone who is destroying themself a character flaw? Is it bad for my emotional well being? When my husband and I were married 20 years ago I had no plans of "detaching" myself from him. I thought we were joined as one.
On a tear
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Volcano Country!
Posts: 3,221
If the way your life is going is working for you - then don't change it.
If it isn't, and I presume you came here to Sober Recovery because something isn't going well, then there are things we who love addicts and alcoholics can do that can help our lives be better.
One of those things for me was a hard look at the particular "things" I was doing and finding out just why they weren't working!
Alanon has helped me understand that I can only learn this stuff as fast as I can learn this stuff... so I have to give myself permission sometimes to try some ideas on faith.... or on the experience of others for whom it has worked... or just as something new to try....
So far, so good.
I hope you can find some answers.
If it isn't, and I presume you came here to Sober Recovery because something isn't going well, then there are things we who love addicts and alcoholics can do that can help our lives be better.
One of those things for me was a hard look at the particular "things" I was doing and finding out just why they weren't working!
Alanon has helped me understand that I can only learn this stuff as fast as I can learn this stuff... so I have to give myself permission sometimes to try some ideas on faith.... or on the experience of others for whom it has worked... or just as something new to try....
So far, so good.
I hope you can find some answers.
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
Posts: 3,410
Welcome BBW! If you read around this site, I think you might get the answers to your questions. Or, if you are like me, you will get a whole raft of new questions, but with a loving, supportive bunch to stimulate the answers within yourself.
That phrase and way of thinking was my biggest downfall, tbh. I am my own person. Any partner of mine is their own person. We may choose to share our lives, but enmeshment led me to come close to losing my soul and I was no good to man nor beast.
I have no lack of compassion, but I do know the limits of my powers. I can't stop any adult doing something that they want to do (although I can voice my concerns about their behaviours and minimise their impact with effective boundaries.) And I do believe that we all choose the path of least resistance until we learn another way. I don't think I have met an alcoholic who wasn't drinking to numb emotional pain of one kind or another. Drinking was the easiest way of avoiding feelings. Recovery comes when the consequences of drinking outweigh the benefits of the numbing, imho. Then they are free to follow a different path.
And that was true for me too, although I am not an alcoholic. I chose to put all my focus on others in order to avoid thinking about my own emotional pain. And I kept on doing that until the situation had created so much new pain that I couldn't avoid it any longer. That was when I found SR, got a counsellor and started going to Al-anon.
I look forward to getting to know you.
Originally Posted by Big Bad Wolf
I thought we were joined as one.
I have no lack of compassion, but I do know the limits of my powers. I can't stop any adult doing something that they want to do (although I can voice my concerns about their behaviours and minimise their impact with effective boundaries.) And I do believe that we all choose the path of least resistance until we learn another way. I don't think I have met an alcoholic who wasn't drinking to numb emotional pain of one kind or another. Drinking was the easiest way of avoiding feelings. Recovery comes when the consequences of drinking outweigh the benefits of the numbing, imho. Then they are free to follow a different path.
And that was true for me too, although I am not an alcoholic. I chose to put all my focus on others in order to avoid thinking about my own emotional pain. And I kept on doing that until the situation had created so much new pain that I couldn't avoid it any longer. That was when I found SR, got a counsellor and started going to Al-anon.
I look forward to getting to know you.
Alcohol is a cruel mistress!!!
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: crownpoint newyork
Posts: 820
Hi BBW, I also took my wedding vows very seriously. I may only have 6 months of recovery under my belt, where other here might have been at the recovery process much longer, but I may have a few ideas. I understand what u are saying about caring and compassion and wanting to help your H find help. Some folks around here would call it "enabling". I think as long as someone doesn't do everything for someone and lets them 1) hit "there" bottom or 2) Be the leader in there own recovery 3) Not try to push soberity on them if they aren't ready or truely want it, helping is ok. I feel that I will only support my H not do for him what he can do for himself, after all he is an adult. Believe me it has taken me awhile to get to this point in my recovery. If we don't let them take responsibiliy for there own lives we will never get over being codependant and they never have to make a mature decision for themselves. Even nonalcoholic relationships are plaqued by women who will put a diaper on a man and treat him like a helpless fool. When I was young my first serious relationship was like that, I babied the hell out of him. After a few years and a breakup I swore to myself that I would never again make those mistakes and never live with a man out of wedlock. Live and learn I guess!! Keep coming back these folks here have alot to teach us. Take Care!!
1000 Post Club
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Recoveryville, USA
Posts: 1,297
[QUOTE=Big Bad Wolf]What happened to compassion and caring? Is seeking help for someone who is destroying themself a character flaw? Is it bad for my emotional well being? When my husband and I were married 20 years ago Why?
If you were meant to be "one" person, you wouldve been born that way.
You are you, He is he, and together you are a "we". Not a "one".
Caring for another is wonderful. Obsessively caring, controlling is not.
There is a difference.
Is seeking help for someone who is destroying themself a character flaw? Is it bad for my emotional well being? When my husband and I were married 20 years ago
I had no plans of "detaching" myself from him. I thought we were joined as one.
If you were meant to be "one" person, you wouldve been born that way.
You are you, He is he, and together you are a "we". Not a "one".
Caring for another is wonderful. Obsessively caring, controlling is not.
There is a difference.
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London
Posts: 1,229
I personally do not trust anything written by Bill Wilson, and believe that what does not make sense in Coda is because its a religious system of belief. Other ways of interpretating reality are available.
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
Posts: 3,410
Five, you're wrong. Al-anon is an off-shot from AA. CODA is also a 12 Step fellowship.
Codependency was a word that came out of the recovery "movement", but not exclusive to the 12 Steps. Some like the word, others don't. The bottom line, for me, is that excessively focussing on someone else to the detriment of my own happiness and well-being is not a place I ever want to be in again. Whatever word I use to describe the collection of behaviours, it always comes back to balance.
Codependency was a word that came out of the recovery "movement", but not exclusive to the 12 Steps. Some like the word, others don't. The bottom line, for me, is that excessively focussing on someone else to the detriment of my own happiness and well-being is not a place I ever want to be in again. Whatever word I use to describe the collection of behaviours, it always comes back to balance.
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: uk
Posts: 3,054
I don't think anyone can really tell someone else their path. We have to live with the decisions we make so for me it's a process of listening, thinking, reading and talking.
I'm not 'one' with my hubby, he belongs to him and I to me but I'm not independant from him either, he's my best friend, lover and husband - in reality we are interdependant.
Recently I realised my attachment had caused negative feelings and anger so I'm working on the love that exists regardless of 'having' someone, the love just watching someone be, enjoying the time together without feeling like he should be mine.
Compassion is SO important to me but to make it real and worth something I find I have to work at it, looking at myself and my motives, looking at what I genuinely do for me or for someone else. I don't believe compassion means a boundryless existance, if I want to be helpful I need to be healthy and that means caring for myself too.
I don't do Al-Anon but some parts I agree with, others not. I still seek help where and when I can, I read alot and take very little for granted and I'm learning I need to work pretty hard to live the way I want to - I keep making mistakes!!
I don't think so but it can still be a mistake and it could be something I do actually for myself, to keep what I want. It takes alot of thinking - but that's my fav hobby!!
Alcohol addiction is teaching me to think deeper and harder than I have for years - I feel indebted to it!
All I know is that compassion is entwined with respect for others - once I make a person less than me in my mind, childise them, view them as less than my own worth in EVERY way I can't reach compassion and become more likely to behave from anger, jealousy, resentment, fear, and selfishness.
And oh Hell am I ever still learning!
I'm not 'one' with my hubby, he belongs to him and I to me but I'm not independant from him either, he's my best friend, lover and husband - in reality we are interdependant.
Recently I realised my attachment had caused negative feelings and anger so I'm working on the love that exists regardless of 'having' someone, the love just watching someone be, enjoying the time together without feeling like he should be mine.
Compassion is SO important to me but to make it real and worth something I find I have to work at it, looking at myself and my motives, looking at what I genuinely do for me or for someone else. I don't believe compassion means a boundryless existance, if I want to be helpful I need to be healthy and that means caring for myself too.
I don't do Al-Anon but some parts I agree with, others not. I still seek help where and when I can, I read alot and take very little for granted and I'm learning I need to work pretty hard to live the way I want to - I keep making mistakes!!
What happened to compassion and caring? Is seeking help for someone who is destroying themself a character flaw?
Alcohol addiction is teaching me to think deeper and harder than I have for years - I feel indebted to it!
All I know is that compassion is entwined with respect for others - once I make a person less than me in my mind, childise them, view them as less than my own worth in EVERY way I can't reach compassion and become more likely to behave from anger, jealousy, resentment, fear, and selfishness.
And oh Hell am I ever still learning!
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Show Me State
Posts: 6
I did push sobriety on him. He has been in an inpatient treatment program for 28 days. He needed help - a functional alcoholic. He was still providing for the family financially, coaching basketball, teaching Sunday school and even a member of the school board. But at home he hid out and drank. I saw the excessive drinking as a cry for help. Do you folks think I was wrong to intervene?
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London
Posts: 1,229
Originally Posted by minnie
Five, you're wrong. Al-anon is an off-shot from AA. CODA is also a 12 Step fellowship.
Codependency was a word that came out of the recovery "movement", but not exclusive to the 12 Steps. Some like the word, others don't. The bottom line, for me, is that excessively focussing on someone else to the detriment of my own happiness and well-being is not a place I ever want to be in again. Whatever word I use to describe the collection of behaviours, it always comes back to balance.
Codependency was a word that came out of the recovery "movement", but not exclusive to the 12 Steps. Some like the word, others don't. The bottom line, for me, is that excessively focussing on someone else to the detriment of my own happiness and well-being is not a place I ever want to be in again. Whatever word I use to describe the collection of behaviours, it always comes back to balance.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: uk
Posts: 3,054
Originally Posted by Big Bad Wolf
I did push sobriety on him. He has been in an inpatient treatment program for 28 days. He needed help - a functional alcoholic. He was still providing for the family financially, coaching basketball, teaching Sunday school and even a member of the school board. But at home he hid out and drank. I saw the excessive drinking as a cry for help. Do you folks think I was wrong to intervene?
I don't think it centres around what you get right or wrong, mostly it will be about how much he wants to beat the booze - not whether you shoved him in the recovery direction.
That said although many people here believe families are powerless I don't. I don't think we can control but I think there is some influence, especially if someone is actually some of the way there themselves and wants to get it sorted.
I hope you don't feel judged here - it isn't what SR is for, none of us live in each other's shoes enough for that.
Take care!!!
How Important Is It?
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Cyberia
Posts: 612
Originally Posted by equus
I don't think we can control but I think there is some influence
Once family members get into recovery and start changing (getting better), this forces the alcoholic to act.
They can either decide to stay sick, or they can decide to get better. Either way, it is up to them to decide.
It is completely out of our control. To me, that is what detaching means. It means I am acknowledging I have no control over this terrible disease.
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