Going to a rave in about an hour...

Old 09-24-2005, 08:32 PM
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Going to a rave in about an hour...

I just wanted to say to everyone I will think of all of you when I'm there, though it maybe just another rave, its actually quite special. One this large held in such a prestigious huge building in SF is rare and its only a few blocks from my home. But even more, raves have been a serious delima introduced to my life this year and though I feel like its easy to just tell me stop going, it really isnt that easy.

The number one thing and I mean this with all honest that makes me addicted to raves is the music, it is the very one I've been ONE with for many years, it was only this year I was introduced to places that played even better ones then the music I listen to all day and night and get lost in whether it be engineering code or working out or driving...

The one thing I fear is the drugs. Introduced to it first time this year, and never been to a rave without the drug so far (twice this year).

I met a few friends who do drugs like its nothing and they were going to go with me, I told them I didnt want to do drugs but I've been out with them before and they pressure me a lot to drink and though I had a good time, I know they will pressure me to drop and I am scared of that because I am afraid of addiction / losing my mind. So in an effort to protect myself, I told them I could not make it and that was that. I didnt plan to go, but I cant help it, last minute before it starts I feel the energy everywhere as its only a few blocks from my building and I've decided I'm going to go.

But in an effort to protect myself, I've invited the normal healthy girl who really likes me round here, the one who is really normal, never been to a rave, very familiar with all of my recovery / problems, she is willing to go with me and I think going with healthy people who will just go for the music, the people and dancing like theres no tomorrow maybe a way for me to enjoy the raves without the drugs.

Hopefully I wont have some rave girl seduce me as has happened last time and try to get me in their world...

Thus this time going to a rave is actually very exciting, but yet, I'm nervous, and this is why its special, because its a test for myself I feel. I sometimes fear its the beginning to a big change in my life, yet its somethings that really calls for me in my heart, becoming one with the music and living life to the fullest!

I wanted to say I hope everyone has a wonderful Saturday night, and you will all be in my hearts.

Loves always
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Old 09-24-2005, 09:28 PM
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Codemaster,

I'm here praying for you that you stay in the light and don't use. It's so easy to be pulled back in in that type of situation...I know...I could never go to a rave again. Hard enough for me just to step foot in a bar. Anyway, prayers are with you that you don't "drop" Your mind is worth keeping sane.

I find that the healthier I get, the less attractive situations that can get me into trouble are. I'm jealous of those that can go to places that are risky and not use but I had to learn the hard way, I simply am not one of those.

You can surround yourself with healthy people and that certainly helps, but for me, I tend to just hurt those healthy people in situations where I have easy access to unhealthy things, heck I can twist up just about anything!

Geesh, really praying for ya here! Hope "testing" yourself turns out well, but because of who I am, it simply sounds dangerous.

Hugs,
~FaithChaser
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Old 09-24-2005, 09:52 PM
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AA's have a saying "Stay out of slippery places."

You can't, don't or won't go to any kind of meetings. Get a Nar-Anon book or AA Big Book and read one or the other.

If your friend keeps you out of trouble this time, then you will feel you can go alone,
then back to the gals that are trouble.
If you do not want to change. It is your life.
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Old 09-24-2005, 10:38 PM
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...and this is why [the rave is] special, because its a test for myself I feel.
Humm, sounds very familiar and it wreaks of denial. Let's just substitute the word "alcohol" for "rave" and recast your sentence:

"...and this is why today is special, because it's a test for myself...to determine if I can have just one drink and stop."

We've all heard those words before, and we all know this is a disaster waiting to happen.

But in an effort to protect myself, I've invited the normal healthy girl who really likes me round here, the one who is really normal, never been to a rave, very familiar with all of my recovery / problems, she is willing to go with me and I think going with healthy people who will just go for the music, the people and dancing like theres no tomorrow maybe a way for me to enjoy the raves without the drugs.
Yes, denial is a powerful thing. Let's recast this sentence a bit, too:

"But in an effort to protect myself, I've invited a non-drinker, one who is really normal, who's never been drunk, who is familiar with my drinking problem, and I think going with a non-drinker may be a way for me to get through the evening without drinking."

I'd ask if you're starting to see the light yet, but obviously you're not, as you're still making excuses, and you're still trying to convince yourself and others that you don't have a problem. That you don't seek out unhealthy people and toxic relationships. That you can control your womanizing, drinking, and drugging.

Remember the old saying, "birds of a feather flock together?" That saying reminds me of the time my ex-alcoholic boyfriend came home from an AA meeting saying how messed up all the folks at the meeting were. You know, they'd lost their homes, their car, their jobs, their family, their friends, and many were now homeless and sleeping in the gutter or on park benches. And he said he'd learned a lot from that meeting, that he was no where near as messed up as they were because he'd never slept on a park bench.

Well, just a few weeks after that, he'd lost his home, his family, and his friends. And last week his boss called me to say that he's about to lose his job. But yet he still thinks he's "no where near as messed up as they were."

Yeah, riiiight.

You say that you want to change, that you hated the chaos your ex-A girlfriend brought into your life, that you want to find a healthy relationship, but your actions are saying something completely different.

Instead of seeking out a healthy, normal girl, you're using one to convince yourself that you can control yourself around the booze, drugs, and loose women.

Well, you're fooling yourself and you're using a nice girl. Shame on you.

So my question to you is do you want to change or do you want to continue down a destructive path?

It's not "all about the music," Code. As a matter of fact, it's not about the music at all. It's about you getting a thrill when you surround yourself with drinking, drugs, and loose women.

Let's call it what it is.
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Old 09-25-2005, 02:33 AM
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Think you need to post over in the NA/AA forum.
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Old 09-25-2005, 03:28 AM
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What doormat said.
Code, I don't think you will ever get more heartfelt honesty about what's going on in your life than doormat's post.
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Old 09-25-2005, 04:35 AM
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A Rave Is A Dance Party
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Old 09-25-2005, 06:05 AM
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raves and sobriety

this urges me to point out the fact that
people don't force anything into your mouth.
and that if you have half a mind to go to a party with drugs and do them, you will. but if you have a whole mind to not use drugs,
just as if you have a whole mind not to be seduced,
you won't be doing any drugs or seduced, no matter where you are.

a friend of a friend is a recovering alcoholic and works at the liquor store.
so what? it pays the bills!

this brings up a major beef i have with people who tout the people places and things concept too much..--- wherever you go - there you are.

they told me i have to change my career as a techno producer (ie change the music i make) if i want to stay sober. F--- THAT! the music that moves me is electronic dance music, the kind you find at raves. im a total trance/nu school breaks addict. and i know i'm allergic to psychedelics.

i went to many parties sober, with that intention. and i still can....still do.

the question remains to many ignorant people that have never been to a party is wether you can have a good time at a rave without drugs. i've done the research folks.. the answer is yes! if you want to dance, a rave is the best place to do it at. period. the music is amazing - the vibe is amazing.

then there are those other ignorant folks who say "if the drugs dont kill you, the lifestyle will" doh! there is nothing remotely unhealthy about listening to music and dancing the night away!! i dont see anyone at raves with guns and prostitutes like you can see on any major city corner. if anything, the party people ive seen are more cleancut , intelligent and harmless than most people walking around in any given suburban mall.


end rant.


peace love unity respect (remember this one?)
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Old 09-25-2005, 08:26 AM
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peace love unity respect (remember this one?)
Well, apparently you don't, as you tend to label others who believe differently than you do "ignorant."

Perhaps folks might be more willing to listen and try to understand your point of view if you conducted yourself in a more respectful manner, but you've shown us that you can't.

As my mother always told me, "if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all."
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Old 09-25-2005, 01:34 PM
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Hi,

I'm a recovering alcoholic/addict of 71/2 years. As far as being an "ignorant" person I guess I am as I take my sobriety very seriously. Part of that includes avioding slippery places, people and things. I'm very proud of my sobriety and I've worked hard for it and I don't like the label "ignorant".

End of my rant.

Code master,

In a nutshell, you haven't hit your bottom. And yes you are right it is easy to say don't go to those places.

When and if your life starts seeming unmanageable to you then maye you'll want to do things differently.

F.Y.I If you are doing Ecstasy.....very addictive drug.

Ngaire
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Old 09-25-2005, 08:28 PM
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Hello all,

I appreciate the words from all, I dont think anyone is wrong and I understand it all. Your right, I have been trying to convince myself nothing is wrong and I can cancel my therapy. Matter of fact, I was talking with the girl and she along with everyone else normal tell me I dont need any help, I'm normal and I believe them, at least want to believe them.

I dont consider myself a regular user of Ecstacy, I've tried it twice and I do like it, but I am still at least, if partially, in control and like ngaire said I have not hit bottom but I dont plan nor want to because I think I will lose too much if I ever hit that point.

She told me what I am addicted to is not the music too, its the thrill as someone said so I realized that last night. She is almost like my personal psychologist cause she really understands psychology but I have to admit she was not familiar with addiction before meeting me.

She helped me realized something last night... something that really I felt was an eye opener as she has been trying to understand this 'problem' I try to describe her that you all understand, and she said its possible that...

Because in my high school years I was the skinnest, even uglist guy in the school. I really was, skinnest bones, tight pants, big glasses and button shirt tucked in with pants pulled up really high, the typical nerd, nobody believes I was like that when they see me now. Laughing stock by seniors, picked on, and got no attention whatsoever. Even worst, the lowest GPA in school and teachers never got along with me, one counselor said in front of my friends I had the lowest GPA in HS and if I wanted a tutor, and another one literally told me the reason she gave me an even lower score then I deserved was because of her personal opinion of me.

I felt really hurt, lack of attention, no friends, and when the teacher tell you this at 16-18, you dont know how to handle it or who to tell or what, so I just shut up and take it and hope my HS years pass by as quick as possible.

Mid high school, I made a decision and changed my entire life style, stopped using computers and worked out every damm day two hours a day. I went from schools skinnest dorkiest to schools strongest guy and I started becomming popular among the girls, the seniors who come back to visit gave me suprising respect and matter of fact would be intimidated by my size, life changed from there but the working out only covered my insecurities that was inflicted from lack of attention.

Thus, my friend last night, told me that I lacked ATTENTION growing up, from school, friends and even family. Thus, I am desiring this now 3 folds and I find it easily at raves or she jokes from ghetto areas. She said your kidding yourself if you think your high and mighty by going to a lower place to compete, its as if your going to 5th grade right now and taking the test with the 5th graders and you think your awesome by scoring top.

Shes right, I realized it was not all about the music, it was gaining the attention, winning girls from their boyfriends, or just the ego stroking (being all honest here).

Thus she woke me up, it was all about attention and I think about it and shes right. She said even if you took E last night, it wouldntve been the same cause there was no one to impress (I just went with her, in LA I usually go with group and always meet new people, girls, guys, whatever). She said your high gets off from the attention.

Furthermore, she said a movie was made from people like me because its a common problem. I dont know how familiar you guys are with the rave / trance scene, it of course is loved by all nationalities, but no one will deny that in a rave, its 98% all Asians and there are a ton of them from all walks. She said many Asians have a hard time with America because they cant fit in with the American culture very well, kind of left out from school groups or even work, then they really arent back home in Asia, and thus they go from being picked on to forming their tight groups and they find themselves escaping with drugs / raves but the worst part of it all is even though they maybe picked on, they end up going too extreme and doing things even the people who were picking on them would never do, such as murder. Thus thats why when I go to raves, theyre all Asians, foreigners having a hard time finding acceptance. Thus I am a odd mixed, technically American, but I am not fully looked by the Asians as a true Asian and I dont quite fit with the American crowd either as they see me as more Asian too... I'm in the exact area where she said leads my kind to these groups, drugs, raves, she looked around and pointed it all out and she is right. These tight groups of people you can see are looking for acceptance and when they find raves dominated by Asians, mainly foreigners and also ABC's, they feel right at home, as I do.

She said the problem is not ecstacy in my life, its not even so much addiction to choas, the main thing she sees in me is a desire for attention and shes right.

Part of me is happy, but part of me is quite lost at this moment. I'm good at working hard to ignore these issues, but only now, do I feel closer to danger that I seek professional help.

I am glad to come back here and say I did not use. I will say about 3 times, as I was just resting by the wall listening to trance, people asked me if I was rolling and sometimes I said yes just to hope theyll leave me alone but I was not and first guy offered some to me and another guy handed a drop for free to my friend who went with me. We both rejected, but honestly I started telling the guy to hook me up, it was when my friend slapped me I told him forget it...

None the less, I had a really good time, the dancing and the music brought me to a high escape and she had to agree, she said going there you will forget any and all problems in life... she said shes never had such a good time at a dance before.

Thus she also says I am not ready to go to raves alone, I will fail in holding back offers.

I'm trying to figure it all out, sorry for the long post, I just feel like I learned a lot last night and I am really in love with her ability to understand and good psychology. I dont say that to just to give her credit as I dont give many people good credit for their understanding of people easily (not that I understand people that well), but she has said many other things that proven true even in non-addiction related topics and thats when I started to believe she is good at understanding the mind.

Loves to all...
Philip
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Old 09-25-2005, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Dakoda
Oh...that was simple! In my day we used to call that 'going clubbing'. Rave sounds a lot more glamorous! Clubbing kind of brings to mind the days of the caveman. Hmmmm....now that I think about it.....
Raves are actually very different then clubbing.

Clubs play music, people dance, and people drink. It tends to close around 2 a.m. when the alcohol selling stops and the music is rarely ever trance. Often its hip hop or things you might hear on the radio more often. Clubs dancing typically is filled with people dancing hip hop style but not as often going all out wild, some clubs you may find people mainly standing and doing small dance movements in place.

Raves play trance music, in CA at least, its dominated by Asians / Mexicans / Latinos but all nationalities are found there, though just look round and you may only see Asians out of the 20,000 that was there just last night and this is typical. Raves typically end at very late hours, 4 a.m. 6 a.m. 8 a.m. and even 12 p.m. They do not drink much, they usually do ecstacy instead of drinking and the dancing is different. People who seem like they perform professional dancing can be found there, but they are just regular ravers, the beat is often times very fast and loud and hard and its really an art to see, people have neon lights glow sticks as cheesy as it sounds in their hands and they can do some really artful dance moves with it and its really something... its different for sure, you could never call a rave "clubbing" if you ever been to one. You have neon magic everywhere, incredible dancers from people you would not even think ever danced in their life types, and everyone is happy and high and "accepted" because all is on drugs. Different then alcohol, you dont have the loud annoying screaming, or fights, but ecstacy / coke / meth have plenty of their own psychological problems and hallucinations.
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Old 09-25-2005, 08:39 PM
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Finally, I understand you care and are trying to help, but please dont tell me I'm a drug addict. I dont know where the root of my problem lies at the moment and that is what I'm trying to figure out, I am offended if one can assume I'm a drug addict after trying something. Ever try pot? I never, but most people have, I dont call them drug addicts just cause they try it. Do you drink? I do, but I can stop in a fingersnap, it only makes me tired and unless I'm with friends who socializing by drinking, I dont care to ever waste all that money on the expensive alcohol to just feel ******. I've recently decided I'm basically not even going to drink with friends anymore, I'll go and get a redbull instead its when the pressure comes in to drink I am weak at. Alcohol is a drug and some of you guys drink more then me on a regular basis but I dont ask you to go to AA.
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Old 09-25-2005, 09:33 PM
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Code:

Based on your posts, I've noticed you crave attention. And any kind of attention will do, even negative attention. As a matter of fact, you seem to particularly seek out negative attention. And you obviously get a thrill out of it.

This was abundantly clear in the story you shared about speeding along on your motorcycle after a problem with your girlfriend. An event that ended up in a high-speed chase and police pulling you over and roughing you up. Your need for attention was so great that night that you were not only willing to risk your life, but the lives of other, innocent people as well. Could you have lived with yourself if you had killed someone that night? How far will you go in order to get attention?

Your need for attention is also clear by the nature of your posts. You tell us you're about to act in a unhealthy manner and then you sit back and wait for us to react. You like attention. You crave it. You need it.

But it's not our attention you really want. It's not attention from pretty girls, or drug dealers, or alcoholics, either. It's self-love that you're craving. For some reason you don't think you're worthy of love and healthy relationships, so you look for attention elsewhere, from external sources.

And the reason that you keep seeking more external attention and shouting "hey everybody look at me!" is because external attention doesn't satisfying your need for internal attention, your need for self-love.

That's where the "taking care of yourself" part of Alanon comes into play. I interpret "taking care of yourself" as learning how to love yourself. Learning to be nice to yourself. Learning how to stop criticizing yourself. Learning how to forgive yourself for past mistakes. Learning how to accept your weaknesses. Learning how to value your strengths. Realizing that some folks may not notice, value, or appreciate your strengths and what you have to offer to the world. Accepting that that's something that you can't change. Recognizing that you have emotional needs and learning how to fulfill them yourself. Learning how to take care of yourself when life throws you a curve. Learning how to recognize toxic people and situations and how to avoid them. Realizing that you are every bit as handsome, as worthy, as interesting, as intelligent as any man. And most of all realizing that you are worthy of love.

Your attention-seeking tactics obviously aren't working, as you keep trying and failing to get the attention you need. Don't you think it's time to try a new tactic?

Don't you think it's time to try Alanon? You have everything to gain and nothing to lose.

The choice is yours.
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Old 09-25-2005, 10:59 PM
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Thanks FormerDoormat, I feel this is the root of my problems and I never thought of my cop incident the way you put it but your right, it supports this reasoning even more. My friend who informed me of the root of the issue also said as everyone here has said that I must learn to believe in myself, and once I can do that, I wont need any of these external attention or validation to be happy, I will be able to fly in life if I can learn to believe.

The main thing I was left with after she told me this was what to do about it... she did not know the answer to it but said she believes I will overcome it.

Your posting confirmed and further extended the analysis to include a solution which I was going to start seeking, or am seeking, thus my latest posting. I didnt know Al-Anon could teach you the things you listed, I am not sure I really understood "taking care of yourself" the way you defined it...

I was told by my therapist to go to CODA meeting instead of Al-Anon cause she said I dont have a member around me who is addicted to drugs, do you think CODA would be just as fine? This way I could meet the requirements of my therapist and also try to find how to solve this desire for attention problem...

I read your posting many times by the way, thanks for helping...
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Old 09-25-2005, 11:27 PM
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CM.....try CODA and Alanon and continue with your therapist .

Make a 6 months committment to self awareness and solutions.

You are worth the effort!
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Old 09-26-2005, 02:54 AM
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Originally Posted by CodeMaster
I am still at least, if partially, in control
Famous last words of most of the alcoholics/addicts I know, right before things got ugly for them.
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Old 09-26-2005, 03:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Gabe
Famous last words of most of the alcoholics/addicts I know, right before things got ugly for them.
Fortunately I dont think my problem lies in drug addiction, more the need to be accepted / desire for attention as cheesy as it may sound. It took me a while to figure this out, but I truly think I'm on to something as common sense and obvious as it maybe to others, its an eye opener to me... I thought it was rave problem, ghetto problem, loose girls problem, drug problem, but now I think I realized the root to all of this. Those things are problems, though it is not the source of the problems, I believe fixing the source will fix the dangerous lifestyles, and thus it comes to believing in myself.

I feel I have a direction for recovery now, I believe destiny set the stage last night for this very discovery, and only now I believe I can change, I dont feel confused anymore for some reason, I think its cause I figured it out.

I think FormerDootmat hit it right on the spot, but if you think I'm set to become a drug addict, your certainly entitled to your opinion.
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Old 09-26-2005, 03:42 AM
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The 'thrill' of the chase... The anticipation... The score...
I'd get more adrenaline pumping through my veins before even using sometimes.
It's the Pavlov's dog thing, you know.
The drugs and booze are an infinitely tiny marker of what it is that really makes me an addict. That I absolutely need to satisfy my inner attention junkie, even in the face of overwhelming evidence that the behaviors I engage in are dangerous, is a much better indicator.
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Old 09-26-2005, 06:37 AM
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I believe fixing the source will fix the dangerous lifestyles, and thus it comes to believing in myself.
I agree with you 100%. Your interest in a dangerous lifestyle is just a symptom of your problem, not the problem itself. And I think therapy can help you determine the root of your problem. If your therapist thinks that CODA would be a better place for you than Alanon, then I'd follow his/her advice.

I think you're intelligent, honest, caring, and unique. Rarely do I come across a man who can so easily express his feelings, needs, desires, and fears. It takes a lot of inner strength to do that. I think once you realize how special you are that everything will fall into place and you'll find new interests and healthier relationships.
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