bad news
Caring for the 3 little bears
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Oz
Posts: 509
bad news
some of you know my AH was taken to hospital two mornings ago for methadone and alcohol withdrawal (his home health care nurse found him in horrible shape, was afraid he was going to have seizures)
they discharged him today and would not even offer him their outpatient program. His social worker told me they didn't feel he was in good enough physical condition to be part of the outpatient program. Apparently none of the inpatient programs in town will take him either because of the pic line/iv antibiotics for hip infection - there is no open wound, he is not in isolation, they let him attend groups.
I can't believe they felt he was stable enough to discharge him, after two days. He hasn't had methadone for 9, but had been drinking heavily for at least five.
So, I was actually quite hopeful that he had decided to go to a 30 day program. He is very unstable mentally - and crying almost uncontrollably everytime i have talked to him in the past 24 hours. I hear methadone withdrawal is horrible and lasts a long time, but its day 9...
So, his plan is to go to the meth clinic tomorrow and talk to them (probably to get more meth) BLHA BLAH BLAH
This man is very sick you guys. I found myself getting sucked back in today... started calling social workers, nursing supervisor, home health care people, rehab hospitals.
But, there were many contradictions during a teleconference with him and his social worker, so i feel he is manipulating both of us. So, i told them both, that I was sorry I had gotten involved and that I was stepping out and they could figure out his plan without my involvement.
The plan is, there is no plan, other than him going to the meth clinic tomorrow.
But, I really think this guy is going to die soon if he doesn't get help. But, since no one will take him, what are his choices.
I KNOW KNOW KNOW, i need to stay out, and I am going to try to stay out. I just really think he is very sick.
I thought alcoholism was the most horrible thing on the planet. Well, oxycontin and methadone or just as bad, if not worse.
Keep me in your prayers. Keep him in your prayers.
Thanks.
they discharged him today and would not even offer him their outpatient program. His social worker told me they didn't feel he was in good enough physical condition to be part of the outpatient program. Apparently none of the inpatient programs in town will take him either because of the pic line/iv antibiotics for hip infection - there is no open wound, he is not in isolation, they let him attend groups.
I can't believe they felt he was stable enough to discharge him, after two days. He hasn't had methadone for 9, but had been drinking heavily for at least five.
So, I was actually quite hopeful that he had decided to go to a 30 day program. He is very unstable mentally - and crying almost uncontrollably everytime i have talked to him in the past 24 hours. I hear methadone withdrawal is horrible and lasts a long time, but its day 9...
So, his plan is to go to the meth clinic tomorrow and talk to them (probably to get more meth) BLHA BLAH BLAH
This man is very sick you guys. I found myself getting sucked back in today... started calling social workers, nursing supervisor, home health care people, rehab hospitals.
But, there were many contradictions during a teleconference with him and his social worker, so i feel he is manipulating both of us. So, i told them both, that I was sorry I had gotten involved and that I was stepping out and they could figure out his plan without my involvement.
The plan is, there is no plan, other than him going to the meth clinic tomorrow.
But, I really think this guy is going to die soon if he doesn't get help. But, since no one will take him, what are his choices.
I KNOW KNOW KNOW, i need to stay out, and I am going to try to stay out. I just really think he is very sick.
I thought alcoholism was the most horrible thing on the planet. Well, oxycontin and methadone or just as bad, if not worse.
Keep me in your prayers. Keep him in your prayers.
Thanks.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,955
Wray,
It's really sad that there is seemingly nowhere for him to go. How are people supposed to get well when their are no resources to help them do that? I will say a prayer for him, and others in similar situations.
Hugs,
Gabe
It's really sad that there is seemingly nowhere for him to go. How are people supposed to get well when their are no resources to help them do that? I will say a prayer for him, and others in similar situations.
Hugs,
Gabe
Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Where the sun always shines!
Posts: 1,625
wray - Hang in there. Follow your mind and do what you need to do. I'm sorry for all this pain you and your AH are going through. It must be very frustrating for the both of you.
After taking care of him for so long, this must be very hard for you. Ask your HP for guidance and strength.
I will keep you in my prayers tonight.
(((wraybear)))
After taking care of him for so long, this must be very hard for you. Ask your HP for guidance and strength.
I will keep you in my prayers tonight.
(((wraybear)))
Last edited by JessicaNAJ; 01-06-2005 at 09:32 PM.
Supply Manager
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Cleaverville
Posts: 2,898
(((Wray))))
You do whatever it is that is going to make you feel good about yourself. Screw all the enabling, codie boogymen. When this is all done and over with I want you to have no regrets. Not one! I want him alive so you CAN detach.
Whatever it takes, I pray for your own personal peace...
((((Hugs))))
JT
You do whatever it is that is going to make you feel good about yourself. Screw all the enabling, codie boogymen. When this is all done and over with I want you to have no regrets. Not one! I want him alive so you CAN detach.
Whatever it takes, I pray for your own personal peace...
((((Hugs))))
JT
Dee at Mt Bully
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Placerville, Ca
Posts: 251
Wray--I'm so sorry this is happening to you. It must be incredibly hard to step back
even though you realize you are being minipulated. My heart goes out to you. You
are in my prayers. Please keep us posted--Prayers and Smiles--Dee
even though you realize you are being minipulated. My heart goes out to you. You
are in my prayers. Please keep us posted--Prayers and Smiles--Dee
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: uk
Posts: 3,054
I can understand your frustration - not what you're going through, but I can understand the frustration.
In th UK there are people caught between Mental Health Services and Substance Abuse Services - both can claim the other should have responsibility of care. They are different departments with different budgets which I feel is often at the route of the dispute.
Because here it's a state health system there is some come back if departments have failed to provide care when there is enough evidence to support the need for it. Like it or not here it does make a difference if there's someone to fight their corner, whether that person is a social worker who asks for her opinion that care is needed to go on the record, a relative that says 'I've told you how bad this is - I want that on the record because if you ignore it - I'll raise a complaint', a drugs worker, anyone. I know a homeless drinker (he sells magazines and for years we've chatted) he's only just getting out this trap because he got stabbed five times while on the streets and a nurse fought hard for him.
I think you can do nothing to stop him being at risk, or to change his behaviour, but if your system is in any way like ours telling the proffessionals that you keep records of conversations, a journal, copies of letters, etc etc will make a difference. If you can switch your answer phone to record while you speak with them - then state your view clearly and ask that they put it on the record you might suddenly find them a lot more helpful. It also may help to find out what the proffessional responsibility is of the different people involved. Ask them to state their role and tell them it's because you're getting confused so need to write it down.
I've done this through work with kids in care that start to fall through the net and it is powerful. It's a bit like being in a restauraunt when they think you're a mystery customer!!
This isn't about you rescuing him, it's just being an advocate so that those responsible take his life seriously see that they must do their jobs. Patients and service users are far more likely to be blamed with no proffessional repercussions (sp?) when they are alone. Proffessionals know this - good ones and bad ones both use it but in VERY different ways.
I hope this helps - I've no idea whether the system is so different there as to make it redundant. In reality from what you describe I think only those with specialised training can really help. I think there's a point where we're so out of our depth that even if we were prepared to risks our heart and souls (I don't agree with doing that but...) we're totally unable to make a difference alone.
In th UK there are people caught between Mental Health Services and Substance Abuse Services - both can claim the other should have responsibility of care. They are different departments with different budgets which I feel is often at the route of the dispute.
Because here it's a state health system there is some come back if departments have failed to provide care when there is enough evidence to support the need for it. Like it or not here it does make a difference if there's someone to fight their corner, whether that person is a social worker who asks for her opinion that care is needed to go on the record, a relative that says 'I've told you how bad this is - I want that on the record because if you ignore it - I'll raise a complaint', a drugs worker, anyone. I know a homeless drinker (he sells magazines and for years we've chatted) he's only just getting out this trap because he got stabbed five times while on the streets and a nurse fought hard for him.
I think you can do nothing to stop him being at risk, or to change his behaviour, but if your system is in any way like ours telling the proffessionals that you keep records of conversations, a journal, copies of letters, etc etc will make a difference. If you can switch your answer phone to record while you speak with them - then state your view clearly and ask that they put it on the record you might suddenly find them a lot more helpful. It also may help to find out what the proffessional responsibility is of the different people involved. Ask them to state their role and tell them it's because you're getting confused so need to write it down.
I've done this through work with kids in care that start to fall through the net and it is powerful. It's a bit like being in a restauraunt when they think you're a mystery customer!!
This isn't about you rescuing him, it's just being an advocate so that those responsible take his life seriously see that they must do their jobs. Patients and service users are far more likely to be blamed with no proffessional repercussions (sp?) when they are alone. Proffessionals know this - good ones and bad ones both use it but in VERY different ways.
I hope this helps - I've no idea whether the system is so different there as to make it redundant. In reality from what you describe I think only those with specialised training can really help. I think there's a point where we're so out of our depth that even if we were prepared to risks our heart and souls (I don't agree with doing that but...) we're totally unable to make a difference alone.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: out of town
Posts: 85
You are describing a very sick man here. I think there is a difference between a codie and a human being. I think their is a difference between enabling and doing the right thing so that you can live inside your head. Do what you need to do so you have no regrets. Prayers are with you.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ma
Posts: 145
"I KNOW KNOW KNOW, i need to stay out'
Wraybear,
Now is not the time to detach yourself. As equs said, BE THE ADVOCATE. Remember anything "good" taken to the extreme is bad. Forget the code if you want, do want YOU want to do.......
Wraybear,
Now is not the time to detach yourself. As equs said, BE THE ADVOCATE. Remember anything "good" taken to the extreme is bad. Forget the code if you want, do want YOU want to do.......
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Dixie
Posts: 612
Wraybear - But for the grace of God go we... I know it must be so difficult for you, as well as your AH. We can only take our detachment so far. I agree with everyone else. You can open the door, but he has to walk through it. Right now, he can't even find the door. Show him the way, but let him walk through it. I think you will find peace in yourself if you do this.
Caring for the 3 little bears
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Oz
Posts: 509
UPDATE...
Well, I am beginning to believe I was sucked in again. I am going to start a thread titled "conversation with an addict" to explain more, and then you all may understand my reason for disengaging.
I believe my AH LOOKED so bad, and was using a WALKER instead of crutches while he was in the rehab hospital, so the rehab staff felt he was in such bad shape physically, they couldn't cater to his physical problems.
The social worker told me they didn't feel he was a candidate for the outpatient program because they were unsure if he would be able to get there and they didn't have the staff to help him with his IV antibiotics.
#1 he wouldn't be able to get there, because he is drunk or abusing his methadone, that is why he is there in the first place.
#2 this is a guy who drives, gets himself, when not totally drunk, to AA meetings 4-5 times a week, goes on a 1 week vacation in July, gets in and out of a boat - visits Mt. Rushmore and the entire time had a cooler of antibiotics and a pic line that he administers himself. There is no "pole" to be pushed, it is a little rectangular box that he hooks up himself and just has to sit in one place for about one hour.
My point is, i totally understand the rehab place not wanting to be liable - if his pic line got infected, etc. But, I do believe my AH was making his physical disability appear much worse than it truly is. HE LOOKED BAD BECAUSE HE WAS WITHDRAWING FROM METHADONE AND ALCOHOL.
Now yes, if he wouldn't have gone to the hospital, he probably would have died - due to his addiction. Is that a good enough reason for me to be less compassionate?
You bet it is. I have been living with his alcohol addiction for almost 17 years, and the past three, a drug addiction too.
I have no compassion left for this guy. I am sorry if that is wrong, but it is gone. I can't subject myself or my children to this any longer.
Please read my post titled "a conversation with an addict" when you get a chance and I appreciate your feedback. I will try to get it written in the next few hours.
Thank you, your not so compassionate friend, wraybear.
Well, I am beginning to believe I was sucked in again. I am going to start a thread titled "conversation with an addict" to explain more, and then you all may understand my reason for disengaging.
I believe my AH LOOKED so bad, and was using a WALKER instead of crutches while he was in the rehab hospital, so the rehab staff felt he was in such bad shape physically, they couldn't cater to his physical problems.
The social worker told me they didn't feel he was a candidate for the outpatient program because they were unsure if he would be able to get there and they didn't have the staff to help him with his IV antibiotics.
#1 he wouldn't be able to get there, because he is drunk or abusing his methadone, that is why he is there in the first place.
#2 this is a guy who drives, gets himself, when not totally drunk, to AA meetings 4-5 times a week, goes on a 1 week vacation in July, gets in and out of a boat - visits Mt. Rushmore and the entire time had a cooler of antibiotics and a pic line that he administers himself. There is no "pole" to be pushed, it is a little rectangular box that he hooks up himself and just has to sit in one place for about one hour.
My point is, i totally understand the rehab place not wanting to be liable - if his pic line got infected, etc. But, I do believe my AH was making his physical disability appear much worse than it truly is. HE LOOKED BAD BECAUSE HE WAS WITHDRAWING FROM METHADONE AND ALCOHOL.
Now yes, if he wouldn't have gone to the hospital, he probably would have died - due to his addiction. Is that a good enough reason for me to be less compassionate?
You bet it is. I have been living with his alcohol addiction for almost 17 years, and the past three, a drug addiction too.
I have no compassion left for this guy. I am sorry if that is wrong, but it is gone. I can't subject myself or my children to this any longer.
Please read my post titled "a conversation with an addict" when you get a chance and I appreciate your feedback. I will try to get it written in the next few hours.
Thank you, your not so compassionate friend, wraybear.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Astral Plane
Posts: 64
I dont blame you one bit for running out of compassion. Honesly, even we as human beings can only take so much. Think of it as "the boy who cried wolf". Only you know where you limit is and if you are at it, then good for you for admitting it. Dont over extend yourself for the sake of someone using and abusing your good nature. Heck, I give you credit for 17 years! Lots of love, hugs and prayers to you.
Blessings,
MysticCat
Blessings,
MysticCat
Ugh!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Enchanted Elmoland
Posts: 180
Wray,
I've been reading your posts, and I very much doubt that you don't have any compassion. I really never responded before because I thought I'm in such a different place with my AH that my post wouldn't mean too much. After re-reading your posts this morning I see that I was very wrong... My AH may not have the physical ailments that yours does, but the addiction is the same. And in both cases it just seems to get worse day by day. At a recent alanon meeting I attended, the topic was all about detaching with love. HUH? How the heck do you do that? One woman tried to explain it to me. She said that I am not to suffer because of the actions of my AH, I am not to cover-up his mistakes, I am not to prevent a crisis if it is in the natural course of events or "take care" of him. I wonder where the line is drawn?
Last night I told my hubby that he couldn't drive his pal home from our house cause he was drunk, so, I drove his pal home (he's in a wheelchair and unable to drive). On the way home, his pal told me that there was no way he would have allowed my AH to drive him home, that he would have told him himself had I not stepped in to let him know that he was just too drunk to drive. I "took care" of it. In doing that I wonder today how it may have effected the AH had I not stepped in. Hearing from a freind he cares about and trusts that he doesn't want him to drive him in his state of drunkeness maybe he would have heard it rather than from his nagging wife who always takes care of everyone and everything? The natural course of events...
I do feel I am at the very end of my rope, tired of watching this man destroy himself a little everyday. I do however still have compassion for him, he is afterall a human being just doing what he thinks he needs to for his survival. Even if that is warped and causing his brain not to funtion anymore. I miss the part of him that I knew when we met but he's not coming back....
You are in my prayers,
~Faith
I've been reading your posts, and I very much doubt that you don't have any compassion. I really never responded before because I thought I'm in such a different place with my AH that my post wouldn't mean too much. After re-reading your posts this morning I see that I was very wrong... My AH may not have the physical ailments that yours does, but the addiction is the same. And in both cases it just seems to get worse day by day. At a recent alanon meeting I attended, the topic was all about detaching with love. HUH? How the heck do you do that? One woman tried to explain it to me. She said that I am not to suffer because of the actions of my AH, I am not to cover-up his mistakes, I am not to prevent a crisis if it is in the natural course of events or "take care" of him. I wonder where the line is drawn?
Last night I told my hubby that he couldn't drive his pal home from our house cause he was drunk, so, I drove his pal home (he's in a wheelchair and unable to drive). On the way home, his pal told me that there was no way he would have allowed my AH to drive him home, that he would have told him himself had I not stepped in to let him know that he was just too drunk to drive. I "took care" of it. In doing that I wonder today how it may have effected the AH had I not stepped in. Hearing from a freind he cares about and trusts that he doesn't want him to drive him in his state of drunkeness maybe he would have heard it rather than from his nagging wife who always takes care of everyone and everything? The natural course of events...
I do feel I am at the very end of my rope, tired of watching this man destroy himself a little everyday. I do however still have compassion for him, he is afterall a human being just doing what he thinks he needs to for his survival. Even if that is warped and causing his brain not to funtion anymore. I miss the part of him that I knew when we met but he's not coming back....
You are in my prayers,
~Faith
Caring for the 3 little bears
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Oz
Posts: 509
Thank you all for sharing, and Faith, thanks for the story. Yes, we all have different stories, but yet we are all so much alike. We could each write a book, and our stories would be the same with the exception of probably a few details. Hey, I just thought of a money making deal... Let's each write our stories, take the best from each, make one book and split the profits!?!?!?!? oh, wait a minute, we would probably be the only ones to buy it though. LOL
right now I am struggling with calling two doctors to let them know what happened last week. I truly believe he has our primary care physician fooled and his plan is to fool this new physiologist he is seeing Tuesday. Would this be interfering with the "natural course of events." I feel really codie even thinking about doing this.
right now I am struggling with calling two doctors to let them know what happened last week. I truly believe he has our primary care physician fooled and his plan is to fool this new physiologist he is seeing Tuesday. Would this be interfering with the "natural course of events." I feel really codie even thinking about doing this.
Ugh!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Enchanted Elmoland
Posts: 180
Hey Wray,
I'm a bit sleepy and punchy this eve. so bare with me pah-leeze.
I think (and I'm a codie myself so my thinking is a bit off) is calling his docs in a sense to take care of you? Would ease your mind and give you some sense of peace? Do what is best for you, personally I would probably be on the phone 24/7 trying to fix and change everything, but then again I know my thinking isn't right... YET (working hard on that one). BABY STEPS!
I think some of the stories on here are so funny, some so sad, they would make an incredible book. Real life is most definately stranger than fiction and my life would make a poopy lifetime movie grrrrrr I wannna do better than that.
Hugs, you are still in my prayers. Oh and a great pal of mine told me not to be afraid to pray for blessings for yourself as well. It works HP got right on it when I asked.
~Faith
I'm a bit sleepy and punchy this eve. so bare with me pah-leeze.
I think (and I'm a codie myself so my thinking is a bit off) is calling his docs in a sense to take care of you? Would ease your mind and give you some sense of peace? Do what is best for you, personally I would probably be on the phone 24/7 trying to fix and change everything, but then again I know my thinking isn't right... YET (working hard on that one). BABY STEPS!
I think some of the stories on here are so funny, some so sad, they would make an incredible book. Real life is most definately stranger than fiction and my life would make a poopy lifetime movie grrrrrr I wannna do better than that.
Hugs, you are still in my prayers. Oh and a great pal of mine told me not to be afraid to pray for blessings for yourself as well. It works HP got right on it when I asked.
~Faith
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