GoldenDog

Hi all, it's been over a year since I left. Some may remember me, I don't post often but read almost everything. Divorce should be final in a few months. I am good for the most part, of course the less contact with the alcoholic ex the better but I can't cut contact completely. The issue is our kids. We have college age kids, one unfortunately has embraced the drinking lifestyle and will either struggle the rest of his life or hopefully outgrow it like many college kids do. Our daughter unfortunately has become the substitute for the wife, not in a sexual way but in the care taking way. It is my biggest regret that I didn't deal with this before I taught her how to care for an alcoholic. She and I have had some frank conversations about her Dads drinking but not before he has verbally abused her and manipulated situations to where she isn't sure of herself. For example, they were talking about something and she confronted him, he was drunk and told her the only reason she comes around is so she gets her inheritance. To make it worse when she asked him about it he denied, then justified by saying she said something to make him say that and then eventually said he didn't mean it. By then the damage was done, she was crushed that he would say that about her, she checks on him daily, she visits him more than our son (he lives a few hours away now), and she spends more time worrying about him than any college kid should. We have talked about the fact that he is an adult and responsible for himself and she doesn't have to check on him all the time. Unfortunately, a couple months ago he fell in a parking leaving a restaurant and severely sprained his ankle. (He has decided the style of boots he has worn for 20+ years are the culprit, not the drinks he had with dinner) She is worried that he is not able to be safe on him own, it's her Dad I get that but he will ruin her life if she allows him to depend on her now. Luckily she knows the conversations we have about his drinking are not me trashing her Dad but explaining his behavior and the alcoholism. She calls him a high functioning alcoholic, a term I didn't know she knew. I suggested counseling through the school but she doesn't want them to know there are issues, she doesn't believe its confidential. I told her we could go to al-anon together. She isn't ready for that. I want to shield her and protect her from him. I can't. I'm not sure what I thought would happen when I left, I just knew I couldn't do it anymore. I didn't think about the kids beyond they are adults, can cook, clean, pay bills, basically care for themselves. I never thought they would have to take over for me, if I did I probably wouldn't have left. Not that they weren't affected even then, they were but I still want to protect them. We wouldn't have had these conversations I'm sure, they wouldn't understand what I hid from them for so many years but maybe I could have prevented some of the hurtful things he's said. I know I can't control it, didn't cause it and can't cure it. i need to share that with her. The damage an alcoholic does affects much more than the spouse. I can be the stable influence in their lives, I can love them and try to help them cope with having an alcoholic Dad when they are ready to deal with it. I can share what I've learned here and other resources and I can pray they don't inherit this devastating disease. I guess I am coaching myself up. For anyone on the fence about leaving, I wish I had left 15 years ago when I first identified the problem, instead I tried to make it work, covered for him, moved 2 states away from the drinking friends (he just found more) and ultimately sacrificed my health for him. It wasn't worth it but I do so wish I could figure out how to protect the kids. The manipulations, the denial, the lack of accountability not to mention blaming me for everything is unending and it breaks a Mommas heart that they have to deal with this.

Thank you to all of you that are faithful to this board. Even if we don't post often you are still helping us, don't stop. Any suggestions as to how best support the kids would be most welcome.

trailmix

Your kids have experienced this all their lives and apparently it has affected your Daughter a lot. I also had an alcoholic Father - I know the eggshell drill. I did it too, as did we all. I think the difference is, while my Mother did protect us from the worst of it, there was never any downplaying of his drinking. "Your Dad is drunk" was more the norm. My Mom was very much in charge and I never felt the need to take care of my Dad, ever, not even after they divorced (I was a bit younger than your two are now).

The truth is, he probably isn't all that safe on his own, drunk people don't have the best judgement, as you know. The question is, why has she decided she is now his caretaker and how can you help her with that. Have you tried handing her a copy of codependent no more, by Melody Beattie? Maybe some Al Anon literature? I think a good question (to her) would be, how do you think you're helping him? Because truthfully, while he probably appreciates having someone around to talk to while he drinks, nothing changed (and nothing is going to until he decides, for himself, that it will).

On the flipside, you can offer information to them, but you can't protect them from it, anymore than you could "fix" him.

Eauchiche

A favorite saying I use is, "God ain't got no grandchildren."
How I use it in recovery, means that we all have to work our own program.
It seems that you are in recovery, but your children are not.
Maybe invite them to an AlAnon meeting?

Seren

I wish I could tell you some magic way to get your children to understand. Unfortunately, they grew up in a home with active alcoholism, and it is a disease that affects the whole family. They are adults now, so you can't make them do anything. But, you can talk to them about your own experience and what you are learning now. Hopefully, they will begin to seek support for themselves IRL.

Amaranth

Hi Goldendog
I really feel for you dealing with this situation. I can share a little about my experience. I hope it helps. It´s almost 5 years since I left my alcoholic (now ex) husband. My kids were 15 when I left. The last 5 years have been chaotic for all of us. So many things have happened and we have all had a bit of a rough ride. What I see now with hindsight is that things were always changing - the way we all related to one another. There was a whole new dynamic to be worked out. I left a huge enabler shaped hole in the family when I left. One of my sons fills that hole from time to time. He seems to feel sorry for his dad. He wants to protect him and help him so he does for a while and then something happens to make him lose that desire to help and he backs off. I´ve stopped asking him about it now. He loves his dad no matter what and he loves me too. I have had to learn to back off and leave him to work out his relationship with dad by himself. Hard, because there are so many things I want to explain to him, i so desperately want to protect him from being hurt by his dad, I want to shield him from the disappointments, I want to share a load of resources with him. help, help, help.
At the end of the day I realise it´s far more useful to leave him to do it his own way. He confided in me just the other day. He´s working for his dad at the moment. He told me he´s not getting paid. His dad got the wages money up front and spent it so he can´t pay the workers. My son wants to help him so he´s working for nothing. I tried not to say anything judgemental or crtical of his dad. I said there´s a word for that you know and my son said yes I know- its called enabling.
I was kind of shocked by his grasp of the situation. He knows what he´s doing but he´s doing it because he wants to. He´s trying to help his dad get back on his feet. He´s been here so many times before and he knows nothing works but he´s still willing to try. His expectations of his dad are pretty low now. But that´s their relationship and at this point, 5 years on it´s really none of my business. It´s been hard to watch my kids being manipulated and taken advantage of and even neglected by their dad at times. Getting involved only puts strain on my relationship with my kids. And that relationship is none of my ex´s business. I would not welcome his input if he were to explain to my kids about all my faults.
I´m keeping my side of the street clean. I´m here if my kids want to talk and they can ask for my input. They have their own ways of finding information. They have the internet, their friends to talk to. I think our kids turn out to be far more resourceful than we think they are.
My home is a safe and calm space these days. The less energy given to my ex here in this house, the better.
Your daughter will work it out. It won´t be easy and she may well suffer hurts and disappointments from her dad. It is awful to watch but better to provide her a safe space, free from him. By talking about him, you bring him into your space and into your relationship with your daughter. I think encouraging her to attend Al-anon is a good idea but this is something we must all do alone. Going together, I think would restrict her ability to really open up.