My Awakening - Very sudden today!
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Yep - I felt so strong and sure and tonight, I just feel sad and scared and want to cry for the first time since this hit just over a week ago. Trying to hold it all in til everyone is in bed! Why why why did he ******* do this to us 
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Right now this probably won't make you feel any better but this is pretty normal in my experience. I asked my first husband for a divorce and within hours I was somewhat panicked and yes, sad and all that (there was a lot of crying to come). I even tried to back out of what I had said. He actually said to me, no, I know you meant it. He was right, I had.
It wasn't all fun and good times after that. I was also scared, we were married for quite some time and I married at 19, I had never lived on my own even. But it works out. Doesn't mean from time to time there won't be melancholy about it all, but that's the way it is and it does diminish over time. The most important thing is to focus on your own life and what that will be like now. Gone will be having to look in a golf bag or at the bottle in the cupboard, walking on egg shells, being told to **** off. Imagine that.
Also, your Daughter will never have to see her Father drunk again.
It wasn't all fun and good times after that. I was also scared, we were married for quite some time and I married at 19, I had never lived on my own even. But it works out. Doesn't mean from time to time there won't be melancholy about it all, but that's the way it is and it does diminish over time. The most important thing is to focus on your own life and what that will be like now. Gone will be having to look in a golf bag or at the bottle in the cupboard, walking on egg shells, being told to **** off. Imagine that.
Also, your Daughter will never have to see her Father drunk again.
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Well the crying is here - I am trying really hard to hold it back so my child doesn't see it but I am struggling and feel like I'm going to explode into tears at any moment and yes, as you say, I feel myself thinking maybe he can change maybe he can be this man I see tonight forever again Maybe that was a year's worth of booze in the golf bag ... but at the same time I just know that he was like VERY drunk MANY times around us and we had no idea. I know the illness has caused him to lie and he didn't really want to do it ... what if he can recover? My mind is whirling a million miles a minute right now. This is going to be a nightmare many months isn't it My life is one trauma after another. When will it stop?!
Maybe that was a year's worth of booze in the golf bag ... but at the same time I just know that he was like VERY drunk MANY times around us and we had no idea. I know the illness has caused him to lie and he didn't really want to do it ... what if he can recover? My mind is whirling a million miles a minute right now. This is going to be a nightmare many months isn't it My life is one trauma after another. When will it stop?!
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Well, I think it helps to get perspective. Did the illness cause him to lie? Do you actually really know him as a sober person? Even when an alcoholic puts down the drink for a day or week or month, doesn't mean he's all better, alcohol changes the brain.
Also, if he was so pleasant tonight, where did that come from? No withdrawal, no drinking, hmm. That seems odd. I could be wrong but I'm guessing he had a few drinks somewhere. Alcoholics think about alcohol mostly all the time. When they aren't drinking they want to be drinking, when can they drink next? Where can they get it? So all, as has been, is not as it seems perhaps.
Another thing is, you do share a child, it's not like he is going to drop out of your life completely. Healing, for you, will take as long as it takes, it's been a whirlwind, but you will be ok, you won't always feel like this.
Also, if he was so pleasant tonight, where did that come from? No withdrawal, no drinking, hmm. That seems odd. I could be wrong but I'm guessing he had a few drinks somewhere. Alcoholics think about alcohol mostly all the time. When they aren't drinking they want to be drinking, when can they drink next? Where can they get it? So all, as has been, is not as it seems perhaps.
Another thing is, you do share a child, it's not like he is going to drop out of your life completely. Healing, for you, will take as long as it takes, it's been a whirlwind, but you will be ok, you won't always feel like this.
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He is often fairly pleasant lately and has always been like that until closer to bedtime which is why I thought it was something to do with a sleep disorder - he'd get nasty then pass out. I don't smell anything on him and the stash I'm aware of is untouched but I know that means very little. The neighbour came by and my parents him and I had each a drink and my husband said no thanks to the offer of a beer ... I suspect he's white knuckling it for a few days at the moment.
I have never been a religious person but lately, I'm becoming a little bit so. I had prayed for clarity on Saturday night in bed, then a moment of sheer clarity came to me last night as I wrote about. Then I started to backpeddle and someone shared a video of this prophet lady which I watched when I don't usually watch the videos that are sent to me - it was interesting so I clicked into her page and came on this:
Love is large and incredibly patient. Love is gentle and consistently kind to all. It refuses to be jealous when blessing comes to someone else. Love does not brag about one’s achievements nor inflate its own importance. Love does not traffic in shame and disrespect, nor selfishly seek its own honor. Love is not easily irritated or quick to take offense. Love joyfully celebrates honesty and finds no delight in what is wrong. Love is a safe place of shelter, for it never stops believing the best for others. Love never takes failure as defeat, for it never gives up.1 Corinthians *13:4-7 *
More clarity - it is like god or the universe or whatever the higher power is it leading me away from him right now - that's how it feels. But I keep doubting it. I guess that is normal.
I have never been a religious person but lately, I'm becoming a little bit so. I had prayed for clarity on Saturday night in bed, then a moment of sheer clarity came to me last night as I wrote about. Then I started to backpeddle and someone shared a video of this prophet lady which I watched when I don't usually watch the videos that are sent to me - it was interesting so I clicked into her page and came on this:
Love is large and incredibly patient. Love is gentle and consistently kind to all. It refuses to be jealous when blessing comes to someone else. Love does not brag about one’s achievements nor inflate its own importance. Love does not traffic in shame and disrespect, nor selfishly seek its own honor. Love is not easily irritated or quick to take offense. Love joyfully celebrates honesty and finds no delight in what is wrong. Love is a safe place of shelter, for it never stops believing the best for others. Love never takes failure as defeat, for it never gives up.1 Corinthians *13:4-7 *
More clarity - it is like god or the universe or whatever the higher power is it leading me away from him right now - that's how it feels. But I keep doubting it. I guess that is normal.
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Alcoholism is not linear, it's not an exact science. Some people can drink heavily all their lives with no real repercussions, most can't. He may be abstaining somewhat right now, remember you dropped a bombshell on him the other night. For years he has been hiding in the garage drinking copious amounts of alcohol, that's all you know about so far. He lies and is very secretive, I'd bet my golf bag there is other drinking going on. If he is coming home all pleasant, that seems out of the norm, him being grouchy before bed could be onset of withdrawal, you just don't know.
You mentioned he doesn't smell like "that" anymore, well maybe he has cut down, with all the health problems and your bombshell, he may be backing off a bit for now. It's because the liver can't handle all the toxins, if he is drinking less maybe it is managing.
People who hide their vodka in a bag in the garage are not just quitting cold turkey without any sign of it. You can't smell it, but it's pretty easy to hide I think, many do, there are a few stories here of wives that had no idea. He's been drinking all these years and you didn't notice. Maybe he got sloppy for a while.
I'm going to guess if you spoke to him about his drinking right now his reply would be something along the lines of - can't I get credit for how well i'm doing now, I'm trying!
You know what you know. You sent him that message about his drinking, is he still just ignoring it? What happened to the therapist?
You mentioned he doesn't smell like "that" anymore, well maybe he has cut down, with all the health problems and your bombshell, he may be backing off a bit for now. It's because the liver can't handle all the toxins, if he is drinking less maybe it is managing.
People who hide their vodka in a bag in the garage are not just quitting cold turkey without any sign of it. You can't smell it, but it's pretty easy to hide I think, many do, there are a few stories here of wives that had no idea. He's been drinking all these years and you didn't notice. Maybe he got sloppy for a while.
I'm going to guess if you spoke to him about his drinking right now his reply would be something along the lines of - can't I get credit for how well i'm doing now, I'm trying!
You know what you know. You sent him that message about his drinking, is he still just ignoring it? What happened to the therapist?
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I love your messages trailmix!! You are a very smart lady!
I understand no illness is linear - I learned that the hard way with my daughter's illness. You are right - men who hide in the garage chugging straight vodka don't just stop - although I wonder if he tries quite often for a day or 2 and goes back to it over and over again - before serious withdrawal kicks in. Maybe the odd swig here or there to keep his hands from shaking! I certainly don't think my husband has stopped drinking for good and I'm sure that tomorrow night, when the family openly drinks on the weekend, he will openly partake then maybe take a few swigs too!!
The therapist told him he couldn't see him - the therapist was actually my therapist who I recommended to him as he is a man - I emailed to set myself up a chat as so much is going on now and he told me that my husband had emailed him and that he could not take him on and he offered him advice about how to find a local therapist. My husband hasn't mentioned any of it yet and I'm sitting quietly waiting to see what he says next, if anything! Will he actually searchfor his own therapist? Seeing as he has been watching tv with my dad all night, I don't think he will, but maybe I'm wrong - we shall see I suppose.
Meanwhile, my brother's divorce lawyer firm can speak to me on Monday but they want their retainer tomorrow of a few grand - so big decision to make!!!
I understand no illness is linear - I learned that the hard way with my daughter's illness. You are right - men who hide in the garage chugging straight vodka don't just stop - although I wonder if he tries quite often for a day or 2 and goes back to it over and over again - before serious withdrawal kicks in. Maybe the odd swig here or there to keep his hands from shaking! I certainly don't think my husband has stopped drinking for good and I'm sure that tomorrow night, when the family openly drinks on the weekend, he will openly partake then maybe take a few swigs too!!
The therapist told him he couldn't see him - the therapist was actually my therapist who I recommended to him as he is a man - I emailed to set myself up a chat as so much is going on now and he told me that my husband had emailed him and that he could not take him on and he offered him advice about how to find a local therapist. My husband hasn't mentioned any of it yet and I'm sitting quietly waiting to see what he says next, if anything! Will he actually searchfor his own therapist? Seeing as he has been watching tv with my dad all night, I don't think he will, but maybe I'm wrong - we shall see I suppose.
Meanwhile, my brother's divorce lawyer firm can speak to me on Monday but they want their retainer tomorrow of a few grand - so big decision to make!!!
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So I guess this is why his hands shake?? He has a near constant tremor in his hands but it does go away at times. Sometimes when he is really sick with this, his face has a very pronounced tremor with the hand. So the hand - that's likely the shakes? One of my previous diagnoses was the starts of Parkinsons - the symptoms are almost bang on really!! But it's booze?! I mean I thought I drank too much with my spritzers! I wonder how many people out and about with shaking hands are alcoholics?? I thought it was just s aying and not actually this pronounced.
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Re the child - this is a HUGE issue I am struggling with. He is British - he has nobody here - I think he'll need to go back if we split but then he's leaving his daughter! I don't know if he'll do it, but he doesn't make enough money to do much on his own here! So I can't see how he could stay and I'll be fighting for full custody. How do alcoholics even fight for custody? My husband won't make a doctors appointment - how is he going to call and deal with a lawyer? I guess his mother will do it for him?
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Maybe, I've seen different outcomes here where the AH will lie and fight to get custody and those who get some custody and then just kind of fade out of the picture, really it depends how he decides to live his life.
If he is a permanent resident in Canada, even if you are divorcing he will probably be able to stay and even convert to citizenship in a few years if he wants to, but that's his thing. For custody, again, from stories posted here, so much depends on where you live. Some states give custody pretty much regardless, some parents have successfully required that the other parent must submit sobriety tests before and during visitation or have supervised visitation only, at least for a while. Canadian law differs from province to province but I'm sure you can get a lot of information online.
Whether he can afford to stay is another matter, also up to him.
As for the lawyer, most should offer a free initial consultation.
I get that you feel somewhat bad/responsible for the situation he is about to be in, but you can't sacrifice yourself for him (well you can but do you want to).
If he is a permanent resident in Canada, even if you are divorcing he will probably be able to stay and even convert to citizenship in a few years if he wants to, but that's his thing. For custody, again, from stories posted here, so much depends on where you live. Some states give custody pretty much regardless, some parents have successfully required that the other parent must submit sobriety tests before and during visitation or have supervised visitation only, at least for a while. Canadian law differs from province to province but I'm sure you can get a lot of information online.
Whether he can afford to stay is another matter, also up to him.
As for the lawyer, most should offer a free initial consultation.
I get that you feel somewhat bad/responsible for the situation he is about to be in, but you can't sacrifice yourself for him (well you can but do you want to).
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Originally Posted by StephEgan 
So I guess this is why his hands shake?? He has a near constant tremor in his hands but it does go away at times. Sometimes when he is really sick with this, his face has a very pronounced tremor with the hand. So the hand - that's likely the shakes? One of my previous diagnoses was the starts of Parkinsons - the symptoms are almost bang on really!! But it's booze?! I mean I thought I drank too much with my spritzers! I wonder how many people out and about with shaking hands are alcoholics?? I thought it was just s aying and not actually this pronounced.
It's all very disconcerting and a huge shock for you. You will probably start to feel a little more - centered with it all after a few days.
I can hear the disbelief in your messages, I know it's hard to wrap your head around.
He sat outside crying all night saying he has been secretly drinking this vodka for 10 years! I had heard him over the years doing it - I would hear a little cap twisting off a bottle in the kitchen from the livingroom and would ask what he was doin gand he would lie!
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An old maxim from medical school-----When you hear hoofbeats, think, first. of horses----not zebras!
Another good one which I learned from a neurologist supervisor-----"Judge a symptom by the "company" that it keeps.
Another one----by dandyion----when you start to get confused---back away from Dr. Google and speak to an expert.
Another good one which I learned from a neurologist supervisor-----"Judge a symptom by the "company" that it keeps.
Another one----by dandyion----when you start to get confused---back away from Dr. Google and speak to an expert.
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Addicts are very resilient and resourceful. It is their survival instinct. That is the part of their brain they live in most of the time.
You are in shock at the moment, please be kind to yourself. Ramp your self care up.
You are in shock at the moment, please be kind to yourself. Ramp your self care up.
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Originally Posted by trailmix
It can be sure. What about sweating during these episodes? It's not always the case but can be quite common in withdrawal. Could he have other issues? Absolutely. But he has told doctors he doesn't drink, how can they possibly figure out what's going on.
It's all very disconcerting and a huge shock for you. You will probably start to feel a little more - centered with it all after a few days.
I can hear the disbelief in your messages, I know it's hard to wrap your head around.
When you question yourself, just remember what he said. At least here he was telling the truth.
It's all very disconcerting and a huge shock for you. You will probably start to feel a little more - centered with it all after a few days.
I can hear the disbelief in your messages, I know it's hard to wrap your head around.
When you question yourself, just remember what he said. At least here he was telling the truth.
But the years of lying will be impossible to get over I think.
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Originally Posted by trailmix
It can be sure. What about sweating during these episodes? It's not always the case but can be quite common in withdrawal. Could he have other issues? Absolutely. But he has told doctors he doesn't drink, how can they possibly figure out what's going on.
It's all very disconcerting and a huge shock for you. You will probably start to feel a little more - centered with it all after a few days.
I can hear the disbelief in your messages, I know it's hard to wrap your head around.
When you question yourself, just remember what he said. At least here he was telling the truth.
It's all very disconcerting and a huge shock for you. You will probably start to feel a little more - centered with it all after a few days.
I can hear the disbelief in your messages, I know it's hard to wrap your head around.
When you question yourself, just remember what he said. At least here he was telling the truth.
I was really sad last night and cried a bit - this morning I feel ok again and had a good sleep. I am very confused as are my parents and everyone feels bad for him. My dad told me that I am "intense" and to stop doing that! I got upset and said so he's an alcoholic because I am intense?! Don't blame me - then he said "see there you're doing it again I didn't say that". I'm like ummm yeah you did say that!!! And btw, I got my intensity in conversation from my father! He's the world's worst!
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Originally Posted by dandylion
An old maxim from medical school-----When you hear hoofbeats, think, first. of horses----not zebras!
Another good one which I learned from a neurologist supervisor-----"Judge a symptom by the "company" that it keeps.
Another one----by dandyion----when you start to get confused---back away from Dr. Google and speak to an expert.
Another good one which I learned from a neurologist supervisor-----"Judge a symptom by the "company" that it keeps.
Another one----by dandyion----when you start to get confused---back away from Dr. Google and speak to an expert.
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Originally Posted by PeacefulWater
Addicts are very resilient and resourceful. It is their survival instinct. That is the part of their brain they live in most of the time.
You are in shock at the moment, please be kind to yourself. Ramp your self care up.
You are in shock at the moment, please be kind to yourself. Ramp your self care up.
Scared, sad, confused, angry! I'm heading up to the trailer with my daughter this afternoon - river and campfire for the weekend with friends (and drinks if that's allowed to say in here! I like some drinks but am not an addict).I think my husband is staying home and helping my dad install a new hot water tank. My dad is going to try to pay attention for signs of the drink for me. I know if he drinks, he'll be creating a new stash as he knows I know about the old one so my dad needs to use his nose and discernment well!
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I emailed my therapist about my flip flopping and that of my parents' - his response:Hi Stephanie,
Denial is part of the alcoholic game. For a detailed rundown of how many moves the alcoholic and people around him can play, there is a classic book by Claude Steiner and Eric Berne called "Games Alcoholics Play":
Games Alcoholics Play: Steiner Ph.D., Claude M.: 9780345323835: Books - Amazon.ca
Feel free to ignore your parents' reactions, because they may have been drawn in by the behavioural change strategy - the alcoholic will seem fine for a while so that everyone around can doubt their own suspicions. Hold on to your clarity and reread what you wrote periodically to keep up your resolve in the face of the denial of others.
I've order the book on kindle and am reading it now. It sounds like he knows the alcohol issue well so I'm really looking forward to speaking to him next week!!
Denial is part of the alcoholic game. For a detailed rundown of how many moves the alcoholic and people around him can play, there is a classic book by Claude Steiner and Eric Berne called "Games Alcoholics Play":
Games Alcoholics Play: Steiner Ph.D., Claude M.: 9780345323835: Books - Amazon.ca
Feel free to ignore your parents' reactions, because they may have been drawn in by the behavioural change strategy - the alcoholic will seem fine for a while so that everyone around can doubt their own suspicions. Hold on to your clarity and reread what you wrote periodically to keep up your resolve in the face of the denial of others.
I've order the book on kindle and am reading it now. It sounds like he knows the alcohol issue well so I'm really looking forward to speaking to him next week!!
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I like your therapist already! He really does seem to have a handle on this.
Your parents probably don't understand alcoholism and that's ok! Who knows much about it until you have to? No one teaches this stuff.
Some alcoholics can go days and weeks without a drink if they really try, doesn't change anything. Until the problem is addressed, until the alcoholic addresses it with the help of professionals - nothing changes.
Glad to hear you will be able to have a nice time this weekend.
Your parents probably don't understand alcoholism and that's ok! Who knows much about it until you have to? No one teaches this stuff.
Some alcoholics can go days and weeks without a drink if they really try, doesn't change anything. Until the problem is addressed, until the alcoholic addresses it with the help of professionals - nothing changes.
Glad to hear you will be able to have a nice time this weekend.
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My parents think he can't help it and that it would be wrong to ditch someone with a disease they cannot help. I disagree about all of that - there are many theories about addiction. I think he has a mental health issue yes but could have sought help and treatment long ago before it got this bad. His disease is denial and it has led to emotional abuse, lies and deceit. He has the power to stop all of this - it isn't like cancer (mind you i guess many cuases of cancer are the victim's own doing) or having been born with some sort of genetic defect. I know they say they have found genetic links now - but my thinking has always been, genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger. He denied this for a decade to this point and he could have admitted it many years ago and had my full support to get help. I think it has likely gone too far now to go back ....
I decided not to go to the trailer as none of my friends are going - too cold now for swimming
I decided not to go to the trailer as none of my friends are going - too cold now for swimming
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