Control, Anxiety and Waiting for the Next Relationship

Old 07-29-2021, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by LifeRecovery View Post
I don't know, and I am okay with that.

I am too old for the idea of biological children, and that is okay with me in a way that it was not previously.

I am starting to believe that I am ready for the idea of intimate relationships again. As an aside but I have feared falling into old patterns with relationships prior to this because I played a similar role with boyfriends, friends, family members etc. Some of that is shaking out right now and I am embracing it rather than fearful of it.

I would absolutely consider a non-traditional route to being a parent again fostering, adopting etc.

I trust that more will be revealed, for us both.
Thank you LifeRecovery.
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Old 07-30-2021, 05:33 AM
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I don't view marriage (or long term relationships) as codependent. I view them as "inter-dependent" which is different. Choosing to live lives together and work out a division of labor is a different experience from the codependency I had with Late AH. Codependency, to me, would be staying in a bad relationship because I didn't see a way to be alone, or I would rather be in a bad relationship than have no relationship at all. Now I can admit my errors and walk away, admit I can't change someone else or control anyone but myself. Codependent Velma was consistently disappointed that her husband didn't live up to her standards (or maybe just a teensy bit of her felt superior to the addict she was married to? Maybe that's a draw, as well?) Yes, I took my marriage vows seriously. That doesn't give me the right to demand someone change him- or herself to suit me, or the power to make it happen. Now I understand it wasn't Late AH's job to live up to my standards - it was my responsibility to get out of a relationship where the person simply couldn't function well enough to meet my needs.

The columnist Ann Landers used to opine, "Marriage isn't reform school. Your spouse will be like your fiance' -minus the halo and wings." I accept Current Guy for who he is: not perfect, but our morals and expectations of one another mesh. I'm not out to *change him into the person I want to be with.* My self-esteem isn't based on making my marriage work, or making it appear that my marriage works. If things were to turn in another direction, now, instead of hectoring Current Guy into being the person I want, I'd wave good-bye. I'd do it sadly, because I'd probably still love him, but I'd do it.

In the midst of the worst of my depression I was seeing a psychologist. He asked a telling question: "Why are you still married to this person?" I just looked at him. He finally said, "You're getting something out of it." It was true, and it's true for people even in unhealthy relationships. Whether it's financial security, or the appearance of a great marriage, or status, or not wanting to admit a mistake, the reason is there.

I guess - people in interdependent relationships walk away when it no longer serves them. People in codependent relationships stay.

I readily admit mistakes now. Hard for me, but I'll bet people who've known me over the years find me much more pleasant to be around now.
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Old 03-10-2022, 10:34 AM
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Update and needing some advice from you all

I had started dating again and met a man I fell hard for. I had done some light dating and would usually screen people out after a few days or weeks of dating. I found I hate online dating and was taking a break from any sort of dating when I met David.

We had instant chemistry, a lot of the same interests and talked for hours each day phone calling and texting. He really asked some deep questions wanting to know me. I felt some fear and reluctance opening up so quickly but decided to overcome the fear. We hung out all the time and when he was on work trips talked all the time.

He is an Afghanistan veteran and I noticed a bit of an adrenaline junkie always getting injured during extreme sports, pushing himself through injuries and wanting to do more extreme sports like jumping out of an airplane without a parachute and hooking onto someone else's. This worried me and I told him I wanted to support his interests bit that I wanted a future with him. He said he understood and he saw me as wife material.

I also was worried about his workaholic attitude. He worked 12 to 16 hours a day and 60 to 80 hours a week. He says they are just very busy because his work involves cyber security and they are ramping up due to the situation in Ukraine. But even his boss was asking if he was ok and told him to go home. We went out to eat and all he talked about was that he should have still been in the office. He says he wants to ramp down and have a life outside of work but he kept on working overtime,

2 months in to dating we hang out and he talks a bit about his time in Afghanistan. He seemed ok but a little teary. suddenly goes cold , turns to me and says that Im a single woman. I was shocked and flustered. I just said that I wasnt that I was with him. He later was irritated with me and got cold and angrily asked why I do things I dont want to do. I was shocked as I have never told him that I do things I dont want to do. I felt like he was talking about himself

From that moment on he was extremely cold towards me. Even my parents noticed when he came to meet them even though he bought flowers and everything. He stopped kissing me. He kept making excuses that he had to work wheras before he told me talking to him waa a destress.

I confronted him and told him that he had gone cold on me. He said that he couldnt decide what he wanted and was conflicted between work opportunities and me. I told him it was over


He asked if we could hang out and be friends. That hurt me the worst after we had both said that we loved each other. I told him no.

But Im heartbroken and I keep on thinking about how to fix it. I never had conversations like that with someone and I wonder how someone can go from 100 percent in pushing the relationship forward to actively avoiding me. I feel I have whiplash and I know my co dependency is being activated heavily.

I want to go back to him and fix it but I know that is going to get me tangled in something I dont want anymore. I also feel incredibly stupid and played. My heart is so tired
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Old 03-10-2022, 11:16 AM
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Frankly, you may be much better off finding out this now then later. Who knows what is going on with him—could be personality, PTSD, inability to commit, etc., so I think you did the right thing in going no contact.

He may not have meant to “play” you, or maybe he was manipulative. The bottom line is he treated you poorly and your boundaries were healthy enough to both call him out and put a stop to it.

I think that is a win, though a painful one. Dating is when you find out if you are mentally, emotionally, and physically comparable with another person before a long-term commitment.

Some of those qualities were there, but clearly, some were not. You handled yourself very well in a difficult situation

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Old 03-10-2022, 11:33 AM
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Well done on looking after yourself and protecting your well being. Staying no contact will allow you to heal.
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Old 03-10-2022, 11:39 AM
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Thank you guys

I struggle with feeling I failed by having sex with him too early even though at the time it was what I wanted and enjoyed it feeling an increase in intimacy with him.

I also feel like I failed for opening up so much to him emotionally about my life instead of forcing it to be slower.

I also struggle with the status of single once again and the fear of not having children once again

i also struggle with the fear that I wasn’t good enough for him to commit to
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Old 03-10-2022, 11:43 AM
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Sometimes most of the boxes are checked when we meet someone and start to get to know them, most but not all. I think it's telling that you are far along your healing journey that you were able to be open to meeting and getting to know someone, able to be honest and open - hearted, yet when you noticed something was not right, you listened to your intuition and honored what you felt was best for you.

Not everyone is relationship material.

You can love someone yet recognise you're neither of you right for each other, and let each other go.

This sounds like growth and loving yourself and living life to me.
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Old 03-10-2022, 11:44 AM
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HI NewHeart,

Sorry that you meet someone special and they flipped out on you. You are not stupid for opening your heart to love. If you don't open it you will never find love.

You are correct in deciding that it should be over. I know it hurts to say that its over to someone you care about. But yourinstinct from everything you have learned here kicked in and gave you the strength to do what you needed to do.

I know you want to fix him and get back the person you fell in love with. Just like an alcoholic he has to figure what is up with him self. You can only tell him how you feel. The rest is up to him. Keep being strong and coming back for advice.
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Old 03-10-2022, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by ironwill;[url=tel:7776999
7776999[/url]]HI NewHeart,

Sorry that you meet someone special and they flipped out on you. You are not stupid for opening your heart to love. If you don't open it you will never find love.

You are correct in deciding that it should be over. I know it hurts to say that its over to someone you care about. But yourinstinct from everything you have learned here kicked in and gave you the strength to do what you needed to do.

I know you want to fix him and get back the person you fell in love with. Just like an alcoholic he has to figure what is up with him self. You can only tell him how you feel. The rest is up to him. Keep being strong and coming back for advice.
everyone’s responses have been wonderful but I think you hit the nail On the head in terms of my codependency. I want to talk to him about work life balance and how important he is to me. I want to show him I am ready to commit. I can’t accept that I may have done everything just fine and I also am having trouble accepting that these may be deep rooted commitment issues he has. I want to think it is just cold feet that I can fix with a conversation and more love.

My instinct is telling me he has a lot of good work he has done in untangling his emotional state but that there is a lot of dissociation and intimacy issues he still has. Not just from going to war but a horrible divorce he experienced from his parents and his parents using him to run their businesses as a child and as a pawn in the divorce. He easily disassociated and would go into work mode. I noticed he did that with me. Do all the things one should do in a relationship but completely emotionally not there. I want to believe that somehow loving him could get him to love me intimately in return. It’s hard to accept that is not how it works and only he can change.


im taking this on as a failure of not being good enough so I can fix what it is and get back the really good parts of being with him
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Old 03-10-2022, 12:32 PM
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One other thing is I am blaming myself for not reaching out to him more. When I confronted him on his coldness he said he wasn’t sure about the relationship due to work obligations. I then said that that wasn’t fair for me to wait around. I wonder if I threw a good thing away by not trying to work it out with him about how I could make it work despite his concern. But maybe that was a fantasy. He shut down and didn’t try and the previous comments about me being single and then the only times he had enough time to see me were late at night for sex. Anything else he became too tired for. It isn’t like as a recovering co dependent that I don’t know how to be accommodating. I just wonder if I pushed him away at the end without trying hard enough…it’s always my fault is what it comes down to
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Old 03-10-2022, 01:27 PM
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You can question yourself and your actions, but the telling thing is his actions: if he only made himself available at night for sex, why? Someone who values you and wants to be with you will make the time, and not just give you leftovers. See this for what it is.
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Old 03-10-2022, 01:59 PM
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I'm a guy and I think he was using you. I'm really sorry to say that, but the tactic of always being too busy (except for sex) sounds like typical alpha male manipulation. Quite honestly I did that when I was much younger and in a very demanding job, and am very ashamed of those behaviors now. Reaching out to him more would have just made it worse. You handled it very well. You had nothing to do with this except you naturally (and honestly) started to get close and want more and he ran the other way because that's not what he wanted. When he said he wanted to remain friends he most assuredly meant "with benefits".
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Old 03-10-2022, 02:54 PM
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It's tempting to lay the blame on yourself, because it feeds the illusion that you somehow have control over him and his behaviors.

You have the right to the kind of relationship and partner you want, but not everyone's going to fit that bill.
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Old 03-10-2022, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by advbike;[url=tel:7777053
7777053[/url]]I'm a guy and I think he was using you. I'm really sorry to say that, but the tactic of always being too busy (except for sex) sounds like typical alpha male manipulation. Quite honestly I did that when I was much younger and in a very demanding job, and am very ashamed of those behaviors now. Reaching out to him more would have just made it worse. You handled it very well. You had nothing to do with this except you naturally (and honestly) started to get close and want more and he ran the other way because that's not what he wanted. When he said he wanted to remain friends he most assuredly meant "with benefits".
thank you very much for this. I keep on thinking I was being dumb but I was being natural and honest. His behavior was the shameful one not mine.

and yes I do think he wanted to remain friends with benefits. It’s why it hurt so much because my emotional life with him was centered on love and his was sex.

he was very skilled in having long conversations for weeks with me first and talking about a future and emotional intelligence. But it was all predatory behavior
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Old 03-10-2022, 04:42 PM
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To be honest when I started to read your post and you said:

He really asked some deep questions wanting to know me. I felt some fear and reluctance opening up so quickly but decided to overcome the fear. We hung out all the time and when he was on work trips talked all the time.
I thought manipulation. Now, the above, as you know, is not always a bad thing, someone who is genuinely interested in someone is really nice. But you felt fear about it and brushed that aside. There is a reason you had that feeling. When you are not comfortable - stop. Whether that is negotiating on a car or dealing with a person - that gives you time to step back and really analyze why you feel that way.

We all feel uncomfortable and anxious sometimes, some people get anxious in crowds and hate the grocery store! They choose to ignore it because they - need food! That's a good - fear - but do it anyway - choice.

Unfortunately, you can't fix him. That disassociation is real, for whatever reason. It's horrible! I'm so sorry you got hurt here. I am really glad you decided to cut contact there though.

You didn't Cause it, can't Control it and can't Cure it.

There is nothing wrong with you either, you are worthy.
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Old 03-11-2022, 02:57 AM
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Thanks Trailmix

I was worried it was my own fear of vulnerability but I did say my fear was over how fast it was. Ive just never seen someone go so far into the emotional manipulation angle so deeply I thought it must be real. I feel fear around opening up again after this to be honest but I guess I did do well and have to trust I will stop it if I need to
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Old 03-11-2022, 05:40 AM
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Hi Newheart,

im taking this on as a failure of not being good enough so I can fix what it is and get back the really good parts of being with him
You are plenty good enough and not a failure. It takes courage and strength to put yourself out there and opened your heart to love . You did reach out to him as much as you could. It is not up to you alone to have a relationship. It takes two people opening up together to have a relationship. You can not fix him no matter how much you say or do. He has to realize that his actions are what you see and he needs to figure them out.

You need to do stuff for you. Put you first. Find the things that bring joy to your heart. You heart will open up again, it takes time to heal from being emotionally manipulated. Just take it one day at a time and know you are worthy. Keep being strong.
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Old 03-11-2022, 09:03 AM
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Thank you ironwill. I did the best I could and I couldn’t control him. It wasn’t my worst parts that opened up to him but my best. I want him to validate that but he can’t. I can validate it myself
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Old 03-11-2022, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by NewHeart View Post
Thanks Trailmix

I was worried it was my own fear of vulnerability but I did say my fear was over how fast it was. Ive just never seen someone go so far into the emotional manipulation angle so deeply I thought it must be real. I feel fear around opening up again after this to be honest but I guess I did do well and have to trust I will stop it if I need to
You did have the warning bells and you pushed that aside and you know what, that's ok! We all do that sometimes, it's not a failure - just a learning experience. You are wiser than even you know.

Next time you won't. Try not to worry too much about this going forward, yes, you've had a big shock, but the next person you date might be completely "normal" - you'll know this because you won't feel that fear and if you do you will ask them to slow down (other people make mistakes too). If they respect that, that's a great sign.

You will heal from this, it will take some time, but there will be brighter days ahead.



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Old 03-13-2022, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by NewHeart View Post
I was listening to Codependent no More which is truly a great book. I hear my story in every line.

What really stuck out for me was the parts about ruminating and anxiety. Believing one will never find a real relationship and Waiting around for others to make you feel like you have a purpose.

It stuck out to me as I was not only dating an alcoholic which was incredibly painful for me to leave but I was ruminating and controlling about my future. I am terrified to the point of having daily anxiety about never getting married and having a kid which would mean I was lonely and a loser. Listening to the book I realized mentally (but I still have the fear) that I was trying to control the negative emotions by controlling the outcome. I cannot let go of outcomes and I have been here many times before.

When I graduated undergraduate and couldn't find a good job I ruminated on being a loser and beat the hell out of myself and compared myself to all my peers who had a good job. I beat myself up about studying humanities. I didn't feel like I got past that until I graduated grad school and got my first real job years later. During that time I stayed in a relationship with a man who ignored me and cheated on me, tried to have sex with my sister and I felt trapped because I had given him my word. I kept on trying to fix the outcome of him being a good man who would marry me.

I feel that my extreme fixation on marriage and kids is me trying to fix the outcome of my life. I really just want life to unfold. I want to dream but let go of dreams if they don't work, are unrealistic, or unhealthy and still love me. But I'm telling myself I am not loveable until I have the white picket fence. I don't want to live in limbo and anxiety like I did with my job situation for years.

I'm also realizing that I am fixating on stereotypical values about being a woman and sacrificing for others and being dependent and having people who are dependent on me as being the greatest sources of love and self worth. I am seeking out people who will reinforce that...for example my long term Christian therapist who told me the greatest love of all time were kids and that the way to become an adult was to be a parent. I am a part of a hippy crunchy homebirth group where women breast feed until 5 years old. These things aren't wrong but its like Im seeking out that which stresses me out to ruminate on and beat myself up about.

I think I have become controlling around trying to find love again. I signed up for two dating apps. I hated the process especially because it felt forced and rushed. I started to pressure myself into liking these men even though I had no attraction and the majority felt desperate or dramatically socially awkward. I really just want to focus on the 12 step program and grieving my last relationship but the co dependent voice came up and said...hurry up you are not getting any younger. I'm angry that I didn't start this process at 27 and that I got involved in my last relationship and wasted time. Each day I don't have a boyfriend feels like another day wasted of not trading my youth for a relationship. I read Settle for Mr. Good Enough which is based on that whole idea that one has to get married by 33 because statistically one's chances of marriage dramatically decrease. Then friends are telling me how hard it is to get pregnant past 35. Every activity that does nit lead to meeting a man I reject even if it is something I would like to do. I do have men who want to go out on dates with me but a big part of me also wants to be left alone and just heal but as I said before trying to slow down and relax a wave of anxiety hits me and I feel like I need to work towards the outcome I want. My mother and sponsor tell me to let life unfold and God will present the right person to me but I ruminate on aging without marriage and losing my value as a woman and forever feeling the way I do now.

Codependent No More reminds me that this is not related to the external world and it is my internal world which is causing these feelings. It's not what happens but how you react. Intellectually I know that it is true but so much of me does not. I say ok yeah...but let me find a man and have a kid first then I will let go because then everything will be fixed in life. This constant rumination and fixing is an addiction. It is similar to alcoholism.

I don't know what I am asking. I know a lot of you had wonderful responses to this rumination about marriage and kids in my last thread but I guess I would like to know if people really healed fron this co dependency. Sometimes I feel like I am going to feel like this forever and I truly am having a hard time breaking this cycle of rumination. I don't like living like this or who it is making me become
I struggle with wanting a romantic partner to be completely satisfied with my life. I do have a child who is absolutely amazing. He brings me so much joy but I feel a big hole in my heart. My partner whom I loved and adored blindsided and left me 5 weeks ago and I still cry every day. I'm much older than you at 48 so the chances or being remarried are slim to none.
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