wraybear

Just wondering peoples thoughts on this one.

God okays divorce for the reason of adultry.
Is alcoholism adultry?

It has many of the same characteristics of it like abandonment, selfishness, meeting own needs first, and the list could go on and on.

Hmmmmm?

StandingStrong

In my opinion, no, they are not the same.
I know that I have compared the similarities many times over the years - the secrecy, the lies, hiding it, etc. however - while there are similarities, I don't consider them the same.
Adultery (in my opinion) is much more personal. And though loving an alcoholic hurts and comes with it's own set of betrayals, I feel that adultery is a more personal wounding betrayal.
However........what if the addiction of the adulterer is that of sex (sex addict)........then you have an addiction which is closer to the idea of it being the same as alcoholism because it's an addiction, just not the same drug of choice.
From the Bible standpoint (and many may disagree with me on this one), but I do believe that in some cases, alcoholism is definately a reason to divorce. The Bible may read that adultery is allowed - but it also says things such as a man should respect his wife and that you shouldn't be a drunkard, etc. So in that idea.....I see it as the person drinking is not following the rules which were intended to make a good marriage. Let's not also forget the abuse that comes into play with an alcoholic or addict - the verbal and physical abuse, etc. When the non-addict has given and done all they can to make the marriage work and the addict is not making an effort, I don't believe that God would want you to stay in an environment where you would continuously be sad, hurt, miserable, possibly physically wounded and/or killed, etc.

I really do see the similarities. As I said before, I've often compared them myself, but when it comes down to it, I don't view them as the same though the similarities are many.
I hope that my post was understandable as I was having a fairly hard time trying to explain how I see the differences.

Momamy3

In both alcoholism and adultery and any other addiction, the addict is taking what is rightfully yours as the spouse (emotions, time, energy, finances, etc), and giving it to someone or something else. The same poor balance in the family results.

ellima01

I actually never thought of it. I struggle with divorce and it not being God's way of doing things. I have always said if my AH was a cheater I would leave- but he isn't a cheater- he's a drunk and I honestly don't know if it is OK to leave (or if I would be doing God's will) and not my own. I have prayed about it often- I still am not sure of the answer.

spirit

mm, god doesnt make ou choices we as people do. however as people we look to a god for spiritual guidance not direction and i am suer he doesnt make us do stuff.

addiction is an illness which requires physical and psychological intervention to stop.

adultery is a choice. however it too requires physical and psychological intervention to stop.

they have similar impacts, are often linked or used as excuses to blame the behaviour of both - but they are not the same.

been there done that got the t shirt - believe me
kath

Momamy3

Many times adultery is borne out of a sex addiction. To what degree addiction is an illness is on another thread so I am not going to go into that now. No matter what, the addiction and the mistress are unhealthy ways of coping with life, and they take the spousal attentions away from the family.

The head of the AA group over here mentioned to me when I found my AH drunk that I should feel the same way as I would if I had found him in bed with another woman. I did feel the same way.

Cadence57

Yes, I think, emotionally, it's not far removed from adultery.
The addict pays more attention to the bottle than to his wife
He hides, he lies, he sneaks around... it has all of the same trappings as adultery except the object of his affection happens to be the object of his affliction -- the bottle.
Just my two cents
Marti

leem03

How about having both?? My AH is involved in an affair too. My dumb butt still can't get up and leave him. I am still holding out hope. You know why? She is a drinker too. She has no attachments, no child to care for.......it is easy for them to spend all day out at the bar without worries.

I am still hoping that he will get his crap together and realize what he is giving up to live the life of a single man.

So when you say you would leave if it was an affair with a woman instead of the bottle, don't bet on it. My Ah's bottle led him right to the woman.......& Here I sit!

Dee at Mt Bully

Ya know--I never ever thought about it but I think Alcoholism may be the biggest
cheat of all. When you think about it--they are gone emotionally--they spend money
the family needs--they rob there children of a parent and stable home enviroment-
this list could go on and on. It's a good question--personally I don't think adultry
could add much emotional pain at this point. I just hope she wants him and has enough money to support him--LOL--Just random thoughts--Smiles--Dee

FaithChaser

Once again I'm shocked at how I thought I was the only one who had these thoughts! I've referred to my ah's misteress as, "Bud" for quite sometime. As far as what the Bible means as far as adultry, I've also prayed on that one for quite sometime. There are many veiwpoints, but I found a website that I really enjoyed reading: http://www.godskingdomministries.org/divorce.htm
According to him alcoholism is most definately grounds for a divorce.

dax

They are only similair if the spouse is a sex addict-which most cheaters are not. I have been thru both. He never cheated[that I know of] while drinking. I was ready to leave him because I could not live with a man who was reliable to be unreliable. However when he got sober, it was easy for me to forgiver all the things he did because he was sick-AND BECAUSE HE REALIZED HE HAD A PROBELM AND GOT HELP FOR IT.
The infidelity happened in the program-anAA friendship that after 2years turned sexual and went on a long time. If he had not broken off contact[it took 7 months and a PI to get him to do so], I would have divorced him then also/ However, the affair has had much more long lasting damanging effects on our relationship. I may still divorce this man. I can not turn over all the years of lies- me thinking he was just going to meetings to stay sober[dumb huh?] when he was mixing in his little AA mistress too. He was sober, not sick and no excuse. He is a selfish jerk. He is doing his best finally to make amends. It may be too late. Only time will tell. dax

Magichappens

Since I see alcoholism as a mental illness, I put myself in the position of someone who is dealing with a mental illness. People with mental illnesses don't have the ability to think about others.

That being said, people who deal with loved ones with a mental illness have a very hard road. Everyone has a point they reach where they can't keep giving. That is why I see support as such an indespensable tool. Without it, I don't have the strength to make decisions that are best for me. I allow guilt, anger, and fear to drive me.

Even infidelity can be caused by grave emotional problems in a person. But I have to make decisions based on what I can live with, not why someone does what they do. Hugs, Magic

Cadence57

I believe there is a fine line between mental illness and alcoholism. People with mental illness don't hold the key to their problems -- in otherwords, someone who is schitzo (sp) can't simply decide to stop being that way and help himself by going to a support group and working a program. And to an extent, someone in the throws of addiction may not feel like they have a choice, but they do. Alcoholics and drug addicts of the world can, and do decide to quit and get help every day. There is a lot more "free will" and conscious choice involved in alcohol and drug abuse - I don't believe that people with mental illnesses have that advantage.

gelfling

What an excellent post. It allows many people to open up to their thoughts and beliefs and makes us think really hard.

My thoughts in the past were that alcohol was my AH's other *****. Sorry for the bluntness. See, the question brought back the thought.

Grounds for divorce? A marriage is a union between 2 people, contracted in love and devotion with total committment to each other. To love, honor and cherish until our dying breath. That's not happening anymore. It's turned into a one sided marriage and we're carrying the burden of trying to hold to our promises with someone who is no longer capable to holding up their end of the deal. Here's an example I heard once. A marriage is like a cruise liner. Full of entertainment, rough weather occasionally, but the sun comes out and all is well again. A marriage with an alcoholic/addict is like being in a dingy that's leaking and you're bailing your guts out trying to save you and the AH/AD while he sits there blaming you for the hole in the boat.

Grounds for divorce? Yeppers!!! God does not want us to be sad, miserable and in pain. His plan for us is a life aboard a luxury liner. Not in that dingy. If a spouse/partner causes great pain and misery because of the booze, it's not God's intention that we stick it out. From a spiritual position, the contract is null and void. Lots of statements regarding 'til death do us part are man made.

Kathy

Cadence57

Great analogies!!! Yes, I've often thought of my exA's beer as his lover - he would do anything for her... I refuse to play second fiddle to ANYTHING!!

Magichappens

People with mental illness do have options. There is medication that can help. Schitzophrenics can function. But many "choose" to get off their meds. Why? Part of the mental illness is that they can't recognize they have one.

I guess that I don't see alcoholics as having as much control as some people feel they do. To me, it seems that if they could choose to have a better road, they would. Mental illness is hard to understand from the outside. I just deal with it in a way that I can take care of myself. Whatever works, right?

Chy

Wow, good topic! No in my opinion they are not the same though they are parrallel in the emotional distress it causes families and loved ones.

frankly

My opinion - they are not the same, they just create the same problems and pain. If someone who is not an addic commits adultry they do it with the ability to control their actions, a conscious decision (not alway circumstances always play a role), When in the context of an addiction, alcohol, drugs or even sex, they have lost that control. A disease, I could never equate adultry with a disease unless it was a sex addiction. I believe addiction is a mental disease, chemicals and pleasure receptors are altered. Damage is done to brain cells, adultry does not do that. I believe one is medical and the other is moral. But both produce the same results. Pain.

I have experienced all, the addicted spouse, the adultry and the mental illness (mother was manic depressive skitsophrenic (sp). I have experienced the pain and suffering from all three. In my personal experience I found it easier to come to terms with and forgive the pain from the addiction and mental illness, it was a lot harder for the adultry because that seemed like it was a conscious choice, still within his ability to control. Granted alcohol and drugs deminished his ability to control even the adultry actions but it just seemed like the adultry hurt more.

Momamy3

even in a mental illness. Back to what I said in my other post, if serial killers have different brain structures than the rest of us, do we forgive them more because their frontal lobes are less developed (scientifically proven)? At what point do we hold people responsible for their brain dysfunctions/illnesses? Where is that line? If we decide the alcoholic, schizophrenic, etc. can't help himself/herself, and therefore should be given more leeway than the rest of us, we will be living in a different world than we do now.

Society cannot allow for serial killers to go free, regardless of how much choice they had in their brains being messed up. Can we allow for the alcoholic to ruin the family just because we have decided he/she can't help it?

I am just wondering how people draw that line because as much as I can tell (I actually do have a degree in neuropsychology), you can draw a biological basis for all of our maladaptive behaviors. As humans, though, we have the ability to overcome and compensate through our higher brain.

P.S. I don't have the answer...just wondering what everyone thought.

melissaealy

This is a great post.I my self thought I was the only one who prayed to God asking that same question.As a matter of fact last night I asked god again to help me because I dont wont to do the wrong thing.The bible says for better or worse and in sickness and in health till death do u part.and alchol is i sickness and it is also worse so of corse Im comfused not knowing what to do.and its kinda funny cause as soon as i came on here i seen this post.I keep trying to hang in their because i dont want to do the wrong thing.that is so ture that they more attention to the bottle then they do to u.I guess Ill just have to keep praying about this and see witch way god guides me.Good luck to all of u and God Bless.