Don’t know how to respond

Old 09-21-2020, 06:01 AM
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Don’t know how to respond

I have a close friend who seems to be a high functioning alcoholic or at a minimum a heavy drinker. His social life revolves solely around drinking, he binges, forgot things that happened, seems to self medicate during stressful times, and constantly jokes about drinking.

I’ve expressed my concerns for him a couple of time. He has backed off the friendship somewhat in the past 6 months after the last time I expressed my concerns but still contacts me every couple of weeks. There is a connection between us but he has stepped back knowing that he knows he has issues and doesn’t want to hurt me.

My question is: last week In text he mentioned going on a boys weekend with big joking emojis after it. I know It would be a drink fest. I couldn’t and didn’t even respond. 5 mins later he texted a very nice good night. And I didn’t respond to that either.

I had no desire to respond. I wasn’t about to joke about the upcoming boys weekend. The first thing that came to my head was “isn’t every weekend boys weekend?” But I knew I shouldn’t say that.

We no longer talk about things related to alcohol. If it come up peripherally and subtly, like this did, he makes a joke.

How do you respond to the elephant in the room? And the jokes to try to play it off? I can ignore them. Or just say “have a good time”. I won’t respond with anything snarky. And I’m not there to remind him of my concerns. I feel bad that I completely didn’t respond. I just couldn’t. I just can’t go along with him making light of it anymore.
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Old 09-21-2020, 06:22 AM
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First, you accept that this is who is he right now and this is where he is at related to alcohol. You've said your peace, and he clearly is not interested in changing.

So the question is, is this someone you want in your life? If so, how much? You don't owe him anything, and you cannot change him, so all that's left really is to decide what your boundaries are moving forward.
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Old 09-21-2020, 07:00 AM
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Freshstart-----I can share my own approach to such a situation---which may not be a popular or shared approach. But, it is mine.
When I am thinking about my very closest (platonic) girlfriend(s)----I feel an obligation to warn them of any approaching dangers that I am aware of , for them. It is natural, for me, to be concerned for their best welfare and to discuss any such situations with them. By doing so---I feel that, at least, I have done my best duty as a dear friend. I would, also, expect the same thing from them if I was in some danger of anything. Friends---close and dear friends are honest with each other when they discuss personal issues with each other. *********I feel that, "friends" that do not discuss close personal issues with each other are not dear friends---but, are simply friendly social acquaintances*******.

Now, if the situation is not that of a purely platonic one---and, has any shades of romantic tinge to it---I think that the dynamics are different than that of a dear friend relationship.
In this kind of relationship YOU are a part of whatever is going on. In the occassion of any addiction----like alcoholism---every person who is close to the person is affected.
Here is the thing about the elephant in the livingroom---it doesn't just stand there----it grows bigger and fatter as it stands there. (and it also puts poo on the floor--lol.
There is no point in trying to ignore the elephant---because it will become more obvious and troublesome as time goes on. If the elephant takes up---say, one third of the living room, now---it will, sooner or later, take up one half---then three quarters, etc. Once in the room---the elephant will take over the whole living room. Like it or not. The elephant doesn''t care.

Freshstart----in the case that there might be any romantic tones with this friend---I don't think that there is any way to completely avoid the alcoholism element. He is going to do what he wants to do---you can't change that. You have no control over his Ultimate decisions. I believe that YOU are the one with decisions to make, at this point. You have the right and power to decide how you want to function in this relationship---whether you want to live with the drinking and accept any consequences that come from it---or, distance and detach yourself from it----or, actually leave the relationship because you can't or don't want to live with it, Keep in mind that alcoholism is progressive over time, so it won;t stay the same as it is right now,

Here is what I would do in regards to his joking approach to the drinking---I would say something like this----"Don't joke with me about your drinking---because I do not see it as a joking matter. Do whatever you want, but don;t ever joke or expect me to smile or laugh or agree with you---because I won't."
That would be my starting point.

I had a difficult situation with one of my very close girlfriends---it wasn;t about drinking, but, she was entering into a relationship with a guy that I could clearly see was inappropriate and abusive....If you would like, I will tell you the story of how I handled that elephant in that room---lol.....
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Old 09-21-2020, 07:40 AM
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Sometimes it is best to react with no reaction.
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Old 09-21-2020, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by nez View Post
Sometimes it is best to react with no reaction.
Which is what I did. So I do agree No reaction is sometimes best. It just feels very uncomfortable. Like I was rude to not respond. But it felt like the right thing at the time. And knowing him, I think he gets it. He stepped back in the friendship because he saw that he was “wreaking havoc” on me.
Having been previously married for 22 years to an alcoholic narcissist, I have really come to understand boundaries and the benefits of no reaction/grey rock. And I guess it applies here too.
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Old 09-21-2020, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Freshstart1111 View Post
There is a connection between us but he has stepped back knowing that he knows he has issues and doesn’t want to hurt me...

We no longer talk about things related to alcohol. If it come up peripherally and subtly, like this did, he makes a joke. I just can’t go along with him making light of it anymore.
Hi,

I just want to put this out there - now that you've repeatedly voiced concerns about his drinking - he's probably backing off so that you don't badger him. It's hard for non-addicts to understand that an addicts true and real relationship is with their drug of choice. In this case, alcohol.

He may consider you and his "boys" friends - but alcohol is his true " Go To" buddy. When we're in our addiction - we don't allow anyone or anything to come between us and it.

I think you did the right thing. You're not obligated to respond to his each and every text. Let it go. The further you distance yourself from him, the louder your message will become. Funny how it works that way ...

If you haven't yet - you might consider writing him a very blunt, succinct, honest letter telling him how you feel and what you're going to do to preserve your own heart and sanity.

Best.
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Old 09-21-2020, 08:37 AM
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@dandylion Love love love your response. Spot on. The elephant has been getting fatter for the past almost two years. The relationship isn’t strictly platonic as there are feelings but no specific dating. Both coming out of long term relationships with narcissists. I chose to look within myself to heal. He has chosen alcohol to cope with the resulting low self esteem and confidence.

I have recently distanced and detached. The Language Of Letting Go has really helped. For this relationship as well as understanding what happened in my marriage to an alcoholic narcissist and in dealing with a narcissistic parent. This current “friendship” has been the first in which I’ve put in some boundaries and been completely honest about my feelings. I have in the past said to him that all the talk couldn’t be about drinking. And he has respected that. It is far less than it used to be. I think he just can’t “help it” when his life revolves around friendships with other heavy drinkers. I guess the fact that he stills drinks is bound to come up in conversation. I’ve told him that it wasn’t funny to me anymore how drunk he gets.
He is a very good and kind man who has gone through some traumas and hasn’t found the right coping mechanisms. So I have set boundaries in some ways. I guess the hard part is that I haven’t set boundaries for most of my life with my ex husband or parent. It is just new and uncomfortable to set them I guess, which is why I probably felt bad that I completely ignored and didn’t respond to his text.
I guess my other question would be: if he knows that his life revolves around drinking and I can’t have that in my life, why does he keep coming back to me? I’ve set boundaries about talking about drinking. I know he has the utmost respect for me. I wonder if deep down he is looking for someone to be honest with him about his drinking.
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Old 09-21-2020, 08:48 AM
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Silence is a reaction.
And knowing him, I think he gets it.

My question is: last week In text he mentioned going on a boys weekend with big joking emojis after it.
"I am going to the museum to see the Van Gogh exhibit this weekend. I am really looking forward to it!" is an example of a response without a reaction.


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Old 09-21-2020, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by nez View Post
Silence is a reaction.


"I am going to the museum to see the Van Gogh exhibit this weekend. I am really looking forward to it!" is an example of a response without a reaction.

Makes complete sense. So I definitely reacted by not responding. I guess part of me is glad that I didn’t respond. Like said above, the silence is loud. I can’t help him. I can’t change him. I’m just glad that I maybe have planted some seeds. And I’m glad that I am learning boundaries with a good and kind man who doesn’t take offense and I believe really understands.
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Old 09-21-2020, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Freshstart1111 View Post
I guess my other question would be: if he knows that his life revolves around drinking and I can’t have that in my life, why does he keep coming back to me? I’ve set boundaries about talking about drinking. I know he has the utmost respect for me. I wonder if deep down he is looking for someone to be honest with him about his drinking.
Those in active addition prefer it when things don't change. He would very likely prefer if it you would both pretend you don't feel the way you feel about his drinking. He would like you to join him in pretending it isn't a problem. He has no obligation to respect your boundaries--it is up to you to maintain them.

You attribute a lot to him and how he sees you or thinks about you or feels about you, which I can understand, but which doesn't really serve you. If "deep down" he were looking for someone to be honest with him about his drinking, he already knows you will be, and he has not chosen to avail himself of that support. He could be light years away from even thinking about being willing to address his drinking. The question is really what are you going to do in the meantime.
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Old 09-21-2020, 11:20 AM
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I wonder if deep down he is looking for someone to be honest with him about his drinking.
I am not him so I can't answer for sure but...no.
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Old 09-21-2020, 11:50 AM
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I agree with the others, maybe this is wishful thinking on your part? That is completely normal, but probably not good for you.

He hasn't given any indication he wants to quit and after you have broached the subject a few times, he has backed off, I think that is your answer.

Generally, with addiction, there are underlying reasons why he drinks, as you mentioned in his case, possibly as a coping mechanism. Pretty much everyone on earth knows that drinking copious amounts of alcohol is not good for you, but that is absolutely his choice.

Why does he keep in touch? He may think that a relationship with you would be nice, but he is, perhaps, realistic enough to know that isn't going to happen, that you are not willing to enter a relationship with an alcoholic. That is a good thing on his part (and yours). He has decided that, at least for now, he will drink.

Personally? You know what you know, you know this is going nowhere fast, is it possible if you continue this periodic contact that you are going to get hurt here?
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Old 09-21-2020, 12:01 PM
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Freshstart-----the reason that he keeps coming around ----after you have have told him that you cannot have the drinking (that his life revolves around) in your life---is because he knows that he Can. He has made no move toward changing his actions, and you are still pretty much there in the relationship. He will, likely, avail himself to as much as you are willing to give.
Alcoholism is a powerful force within an individual and I doubt that not responding to an email would be enough to turn it in another direction. When pushed against the wall---alcoholics will chose the alcohol until and unless they make the decision to change their life. That is a major---Major---major expectation to expect from an alcoholic.

Your thought that he may be just waiting for someone to be honest with him about his drinking---seems a bit like Rebecca from Sunnybrook Farm thinking, to me. lol---Rebecca was a sweet girl, but a bit naïve to life's realities.

It is sort of like the girl who thought that the bull wouldn't gore her because she was a vegetarian.
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Old 09-21-2020, 06:30 PM
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Thank you all for your responses. The harsh truth is what I need to hear. It is just so sad to see someone who has dealt with tragedy struggle so much. It really hurts to see it. To know the kind of human he is who has turned to alcohol to cope with his grief and his circumstances. Nothing really has changed in the two years I’ve known him. I have come to the realization it may never change. Truly at this point, the main thing I do for him is pray for him. That maybe his late wife will “get through to him” somehow. He deserves far more and better in his life than he’s giving himself. Thank you all again.
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Old 09-22-2020, 04:53 AM
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How do you respond to the elephant in the room? And the jokes to try to play it off?

Save your breath, he's not interested. You must decide if this is a relationship you want. I wish you the best.
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