He's admitted aloud he has an alcohol addiction and says he's quitting. I guess we are staying for..
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FWN, you are doing your best in the current situation and your wish to keep the family together is understandable and to your credit. I have an idea about how it will play out, but I also get that you feel you have to give it a chance.
You (he) almost had me convinced after reading your initial post. Stopping drinking completely, seeing a therapist, agreeing to your terms. Then I read the follow-up post.
-He has to drink at the Christmas party!!! That is the most transparent BS I've heard for a long time and I am a regular here on F&F. I'm an A who went cold turkey just before Christmas time. I avoided most drinking occasions for a long time, and if I went made sure I drank soda water out of a huge glass. I still decline most drinking invitations, not because I'm tempted but because I don't enjoy watching others get drunk. Without blowing my own trumpet, because it took me years to get to this point, I didn't drink because I was cast iron determined to live a sober life. Your AH just isn't there, I'm sorry.
- The spending time on his own because he hardly ever has the house to himself. He must know that he's putting himself in the best situation possible to drink without restraint. If you're really determined you'll run a mile from anything that could trigger you.
He is probably sincere, but then he was all the other times as well. It's just really really hard to stop drinking unless you reach that incredible pitch of determination that allows nothing to get in the way of sobriety. There have been many posts on this forum from partners whose As have stopped drinking, become withdrawn, short-tempered, hard to live with. That's what early stage recovery generally looks like.
I hope you and the kids have a great holiday and you don't worry too much, given the circumstances.
You (he) almost had me convinced after reading your initial post. Stopping drinking completely, seeing a therapist, agreeing to your terms. Then I read the follow-up post.
-He has to drink at the Christmas party!!! That is the most transparent BS I've heard for a long time and I am a regular here on F&F. I'm an A who went cold turkey just before Christmas time. I avoided most drinking occasions for a long time, and if I went made sure I drank soda water out of a huge glass. I still decline most drinking invitations, not because I'm tempted but because I don't enjoy watching others get drunk. Without blowing my own trumpet, because it took me years to get to this point, I didn't drink because I was cast iron determined to live a sober life. Your AH just isn't there, I'm sorry.
- The spending time on his own because he hardly ever has the house to himself. He must know that he's putting himself in the best situation possible to drink without restraint. If you're really determined you'll run a mile from anything that could trigger you.
He is probably sincere, but then he was all the other times as well. It's just really really hard to stop drinking unless you reach that incredible pitch of determination that allows nothing to get in the way of sobriety. There have been many posts on this forum from partners whose As have stopped drinking, become withdrawn, short-tempered, hard to live with. That's what early stage recovery generally looks like.
I hope you and the kids have a great holiday and you don't worry too much, given the circumstances.
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I know I’m being played, I wonder if he knows or he’s just so deep in it he’s clueless.
i brought up him not drinking at the party last night before bed and he gave me a guilt trip about how this could be the last time he gets to have a party like this with these people (he’s legitimately concerned he may lost his job for reasons unrelated to drinking) and that there’s a good chance he will start the new year with no job, no friends (the only friends he had he hired on at his current job), no house (because if he loses his job he cannot afford it - which isn’t entirely true since my parents hold the mortgage on this house so that feels manipulative), and no family (because he already plans on failing?). And that he just wants to have a good time at the party but he’s assured me he won’t get drunk, whatever that means.
And then I said okay well how can I be certain you won’t drink while I’m away for a couple of weeks? He said he doesn’t know but he’s going to try.
This is all BS. Does he know that? Because I know what this looks like to you guys.
How do you leave a person in these circumstances? I’d feel better if his job was safe. I feel like a terrible wife.
I wish I’d have never spoken to my sister about this, speaking with her is what made me waver on leaving. I know her ex was an alcoholic but the situations were SO DIFFERENT.
AH tells me I’m in my head too much and that I was very happy with our plans yesterday morning. Which is true. But I see this for what it is even if he may not.
i brought up him not drinking at the party last night before bed and he gave me a guilt trip about how this could be the last time he gets to have a party like this with these people (he’s legitimately concerned he may lost his job for reasons unrelated to drinking) and that there’s a good chance he will start the new year with no job, no friends (the only friends he had he hired on at his current job), no house (because if he loses his job he cannot afford it - which isn’t entirely true since my parents hold the mortgage on this house so that feels manipulative), and no family (because he already plans on failing?). And that he just wants to have a good time at the party but he’s assured me he won’t get drunk, whatever that means.
And then I said okay well how can I be certain you won’t drink while I’m away for a couple of weeks? He said he doesn’t know but he’s going to try.
This is all BS. Does he know that? Because I know what this looks like to you guys.
How do you leave a person in these circumstances? I’d feel better if his job was safe. I feel like a terrible wife.
I wish I’d have never spoken to my sister about this, speaking with her is what made me waver on leaving. I know her ex was an alcoholic but the situations were SO DIFFERENT.
AH tells me I’m in my head too much and that I was very happy with our plans yesterday morning. Which is true. But I see this for what it is even if he may not.
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FWN 
To stay or go is a decision only you can make. It is your decision whether or not to live with (in your words) his BS.
All of this is his addiction doing the talking.
Take good care of yourself over the holidays!
To stay or go is a decision only you can make. It is your decision whether or not to live with (in your words) his BS.
Originally Posted by fortworthnative
he gave me a guilt trip about how this could be the last time he gets to have a party like this with these people (he’s legitimately concerned he may lost his job for reasons unrelated to drinking) and that there’s a good chance he will start the new year with no job, no friends (the only friends he had he hired on at his current job), no house (because if he loses his job he cannot afford it - which isn’t entirely true since my parents hold the mortgage on this house so that feels manipulative), and no family (because he already plans on failing?). And that he just wants to have a good time at the party but he’s assured me he won’t get drunk, whatever that means.
Take good care of yourself over the holidays!
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He offered to move out. I said no. There's no way I want him having his own place where he can do whatever he wants and pop in and just do the fun things with the family. NOPE.
This right here ☝🏼 No matter where HE lives HE’S going to do what HE wants to do. You leaving your own home and him staying put (alone) is the same as him having his own place. My AH moved out and this is exactly what happened. Yes he only wants to participate in the “fun” stuff and yes he drinks whenever he wants. BUT...he did that while living at home too, only difference now is me and kids dont have to watch, interact and have a front row seat to his alcoholism AND we are staying in OUR home. The home I busted my a** for and the home my kids are secure and safe in. I hear spouses/so’s all the time asking how do I get my A spouse to move out. Yours offered it up.
I don’t mean to sound harsh...only a different perspective. I know when I was in the middle of the chaos all I wanted to do was get as far away as possible. I wanted to take my kids and just go, anywhere, literally get in the car and never look back. Basically, run away from my troubles. I am thankful every day that my AH left and I didn’t have to uproot myself or children.
You make the right decision for you and your children, as you see fit. Stop worrying about him and what he’s going to do. It’s hard to let go of that, I get it, I really do.
And now it sounds like he’s laying the guilt trip on pretty thick. (Alcoholics are masters of this) he’s deflecting, grasping at straws big time! Get your muck boots on the sh*ts going to start getting deep. If he looses his job, that’s on him. If he looses his family, that’s on him. Please don’t let his guilt trip / pitty party waver your boundaries/resolve. I too felt soooo sorry/sad for my AH. His life was so terrible, everyone was out to get him, it was everyone else’s fault (including me) blah blah blah ... guess what??....ALL excuses, lies, manipulation.
Again I don’t want to sound harsh only realistic. I do hope your AH chooses recovery. We all want that, for you and our own SO’s. But be prepared, as others have said...more will be revealed.
Only you can decide what your future will look like. I wish you peace and clarity and a BIG hug 💛
This right here ☝🏼 No matter where HE lives HE’S going to do what HE wants to do. You leaving your own home and him staying put (alone) is the same as him having his own place. My AH moved out and this is exactly what happened. Yes he only wants to participate in the “fun” stuff and yes he drinks whenever he wants. BUT...he did that while living at home too, only difference now is me and kids dont have to watch, interact and have a front row seat to his alcoholism AND we are staying in OUR home. The home I busted my a** for and the home my kids are secure and safe in. I hear spouses/so’s all the time asking how do I get my A spouse to move out. Yours offered it up.
I don’t mean to sound harsh...only a different perspective. I know when I was in the middle of the chaos all I wanted to do was get as far away as possible. I wanted to take my kids and just go, anywhere, literally get in the car and never look back. Basically, run away from my troubles. I am thankful every day that my AH left and I didn’t have to uproot myself or children.
You make the right decision for you and your children, as you see fit. Stop worrying about him and what he’s going to do. It’s hard to let go of that, I get it, I really do.
And now it sounds like he’s laying the guilt trip on pretty thick. (Alcoholics are masters of this) he’s deflecting, grasping at straws big time! Get your muck boots on the sh*ts going to start getting deep. If he looses his job, that’s on him. If he looses his family, that’s on him. Please don’t let his guilt trip / pitty party waver your boundaries/resolve. I too felt soooo sorry/sad for my AH. His life was so terrible, everyone was out to get him, it was everyone else’s fault (including me) blah blah blah ... guess what??....ALL excuses, lies, manipulation.
Again I don’t want to sound harsh only realistic. I do hope your AH chooses recovery. We all want that, for you and our own SO’s. But be prepared, as others have said...more will be revealed.
Only you can decide what your future will look like. I wish you peace and clarity and a BIG hug 💛
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he gave me a guilt trip about how this could be the last time he gets to have a party like this with these people (he’s legitimately concerned he may lost his job for reasons unrelated to drinking)
I wish I’d have never spoken to my sister about this, speaking with her is what made me waver on leaving. I know her ex was an alcoholic but the situations were SO DIFFERENT.
Also, sometimes people, as well-intentioned as they are, hand you the wrong map. If you were in a car trying to find, say, Houston, and you didn't have road map, and somebody handed you a detailed map of San Antonio which went down to side street level, you wouldn't go very far. However, if somebody handed you a Texas map that only showed highways, you'd be able to find your way.
Also, never underestimate someone's capacity to bury their head in the sand. My aunt and uncle watched my cousin, their son, abuse his siblings for years and they did absolutely nothing until Child Protective Services finally stepped in. I was told to be gracious to him because he was family - even though he had hit me and threatened to kill me. I was around eight at the time and was known as the good girl, but something inside of me "clicked". I responded by telling him that I hated his guts. I didn't realize it at the time, but that response probably spared me the worst of his abuse (even though I got a reputation for being rude and standoffish with his family. It's a reputation I wear gladly.).
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Originally Posted by fortworthnative 
How do you leave a person in these circumstances? I’d feel better if his job was safe. I feel like a terrible wife.
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Originally Posted by fortworthnative
I also really want to work on myself starting after the holidays. I'm going to try a few al-anon groups here and see if one is a good fit. I need it.
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I think when someone is ready to change, there are no delays, no "one last time" hurrahs, no waiting, no next week, next month, or next year.
When someone is ready to change, they are ready right now, and they cannot imagine waiting to get started. For anything.
But really, FWN, this is not about whether he is ready to change. It is about whether you are.
When someone is ready to change, they are ready right now, and they cannot imagine waiting to get started. For anything.
But really, FWN, this is not about whether he is ready to change. It is about whether you are.
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FWN,
None of this sounds like a person who is ready to stop drinking.
Sounds like the Xmas party and the alone time are his believing in one last drink binge before he gives it up.
Which, IMO, is just not going to happen.
You have played this tape before. You know how it will go.
And anyone who tells you that you should keep the family unit together has no freakin clue about living with addiction.
Sounds like you have a good exit plan in place, when you are ready to use it.
Remember what we say round here. Don’t listen to what someone says, look at what they do.
Good thoughts and good luck.
None of this sounds like a person who is ready to stop drinking.
Sounds like the Xmas party and the alone time are his believing in one last drink binge before he gives it up.
Which, IMO, is just not going to happen.
You have played this tape before. You know how it will go.
And anyone who tells you that you should keep the family unit together has no freakin clue about living with addiction.
Sounds like you have a good exit plan in place, when you are ready to use it.
Remember what we say round here. Don’t listen to what someone says, look at what they do.
Good thoughts and good luck.
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Originally Posted by fortworthnative
How do you leave a person in these circumstances? I’d feel better if his job was safe. I feel like a terrible wife.
I meant my marriage vows. My AXH used them against me when he got desperate, "for better or worse, in sickness and in health!I'm sick! I need you to be strong for us!"... I took that to heart. I stayed and got sicker myself because I was trying to save a man and a marriage, neither of which was he putting any effort in to. I used up all my strength and then all my reserves, my life spiraled into chaos while he kept manipulating, drinking, lying and bargaining. In that order. In a cycle that went on for years.
My AXH and I set really bad examples for our children. Despite us almost never fighting, we still lived in a dysfunctional marriage, for more than two decades. I hate that, that was my children's "normal" growing up. Codependence is just as bad as alcoholism to pass on to our kids. I see it in my daughter and....damn. (At least she is aware and acknowledges it is an issue she is working on)
I hope your husband starts making better choices. I want him to seek recovery for himself so that everyone that loves him can have a better quality of life. I truly, truly want him to get well for all of your sakes'... but I don't think he is there yet. I think he is sincere in that he wants to get sober and do the right thing for his family... but wanting to and actually doing are completely different things. He is proving that by STILL (with everything on the line) "having" to drink at the Xmas party. It's more of the same. It's always going to be something that is happening that will "require" that he consume alcohol. That's how it works for the active alcoholic.
I am sorry your family is going through this FWN. I've been there, I've been you. Those were the roughest, toughest, worst days of my life.
No matter what you choose to do I hope you continue to stay here with us. You are not an idiot for loving your husband and wanting to believe in him and your marriage. It's very hard being married to an addict so please do keep reaching out for support wherever it can be found.
*hugs*
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I want to post links here to 2 old threads, will also bump them up in case they're useful to anyone else.
The first one is about how we find ourselves delaying hard decisions, b/c the A is trying, after all...
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...es-trying.html ("But He's TRYING...")
The second is about how wanting something and being willing to do what it takes to have it are 2 different things:
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...vs-i-want.html (I am Willing to vs I Want to)
The first one is about how we find ourselves delaying hard decisions, b/c the A is trying, after all...
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...es-trying.html ("But He's TRYING...")
The second is about how wanting something and being willing to do what it takes to have it are 2 different things:
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...vs-i-want.html (I am Willing to vs I Want to)
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FWN...….I really do encourage you to not talk to your sister or dad about the details of your personal decision making, in the future.....at least---don't use them as your Consultants....lol. After you have made personal decisisions, you can TELL them...if you want to.
I learned this lesson the hard way....
When I was a youngish woman/wife/mother....at your stage of life...I am so gad that I lived far enough away from my family of origin so that they could not look over my shoulder. They were very strong minded nd had more "old fashioned" ideas than I had...
I talked to them over the phone...and, made long drives to visit....but, I turned to my friends and others when I struggled with personal decisions.
What I did was TELL them, after I had made a final decision on those kinds of matters. I told them that I was pregnant, again...that I was getting a divorce...that I was returning to school...that I was moving...
Yes...I did share with them...but...they were recipients of the news...not consultants in the process.
Yes...family does get to have an opinion...because everyone has an opinion on everything....but, they don't get a VOTE! Thank them for their input and then move along.
I think that you mentioned that they could be rather controlling?.....so were my parents....
I learned this lesson the hard way....
When I was a youngish woman/wife/mother....at your stage of life...I am so gad that I lived far enough away from my family of origin so that they could not look over my shoulder. They were very strong minded nd had more "old fashioned" ideas than I had...
I talked to them over the phone...and, made long drives to visit....but, I turned to my friends and others when I struggled with personal decisions.
What I did was TELL them, after I had made a final decision on those kinds of matters. I told them that I was pregnant, again...that I was getting a divorce...that I was returning to school...that I was moving...
Yes...I did share with them...but...they were recipients of the news...not consultants in the process.
Yes...family does get to have an opinion...because everyone has an opinion on everything....but, they don't get a VOTE! Thank them for their input and then move along.
I think that you mentioned that they could be rather controlling?.....so were my parents....
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No judgment here. I've been where you are, and I know it's very stressful.
Have you ever listened to the podcast "Love Over Addiction"? It's done by a woman with three kids who was, as she says, "married to a good man suffering from addiction." She gives a lot of practical advice about how to stay sane and healthy in the midst of active addiction, particularly if you're not ready to (or may never) leave your AH. I know you mentioned checking out Al-Anon in the new year. But this podcast, which can you listen to during nighttime feedings (!), may help provide a bridge to that time when you're able to get to in-person meetings. Just a thought, FWIW.
Have you ever listened to the podcast "Love Over Addiction"? It's done by a woman with three kids who was, as she says, "married to a good man suffering from addiction." She gives a lot of practical advice about how to stay sane and healthy in the midst of active addiction, particularly if you're not ready to (or may never) leave your AH. I know you mentioned checking out Al-Anon in the new year. But this podcast, which can you listen to during nighttime feedings (!), may help provide a bridge to that time when you're able to get to in-person meetings. Just a thought, FWIW.
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I am overwhelmed and in awe of the support you guys are giving me, thank you.
I'm so mad at myself because I'd STEELED myself, I was ready, but talking to my sister really made me question myself (she called ME, I'd already made my decision). The ONLY reason why I was even talking to anyone about this decision was because I was going to be staying with her. And I had to tell my dad because he'd have to know too.
I think it will be fine. I can feel myself gearing up to be ready, truly ready. He says I can write up my expectations and he'll sign in. I think it will go something like this...
I, XXXXX, know that in order to keep my family together and here with me in XXX, I must give up alcohol because of the affect it is having on my wife and my family. I am going to work with my therapist regularly to gain the tools I need to succeed. And if I cannot succeed with this alone (failure is defined as drinking/lying about drinking), I must start the intensive outpatient program here on the very next day available. If I choose not do start the IOP, I know my wife and children will move to XXXX until I've been sober at least 6 months, maybe more. And there will be no more mention of trying to moderate. I am welcome to try moderation once again, but I know my wife and children will not be here to witness it.
If my friends saw that I was doing this I'd be so embarrassed. You guys said earlier in this thread that I should talk to my good friends instead of my family and you are 100% right. Each of my 3 GOOD friends (known all at least 10-15 years) is supportive of me leaving, knowing what they know, knowing that I am NOT the controlling wife he says I am, knowing that I'm going to go completely crazy in this house if I stay and he continues to drink. Versus my dad and sister who were both relieved that I'm staying and still working on it with him.
Whatever. He's now coming with us for Christmas with my family and I'm coming back here with him while my 2 older kiddos visit their grandparents alone. So he's not getting all of that alone time. I was doing that for him but you guys are all right, it's just an easy way for him to drink. While I am displaced with my infant in a house full of people who have no idea what I've been going through. And on NYE. Not that we do anything for NYE anymore, last year there was no drinking (he'd just gotten the DWI) and we watched movies and went to bed at like 9. Sounds wonderful really.
Thank you thank you everyone. I know I'm a broken record, but this time feels different (me, I feel different and ready) and I feel like things are as crystal clear as they could possibly be with him. And he says he's ready too, that if he fails we can go. And having him on my side there, at least for a little while, benefits me legally.
So even though my gut tells me this is more of the same (from him), it doesn't feel like more of the same (inside me) as far as the understood consequences. And now I'd even feel good for straight up renting a place instead of staying with my sister for a few months to 'figure things out' - I feel like I've already done that due diligence.
Slowly but surely. Leaving is hard. I'm not as strong as I thought I was, but I'm getting stronger.
I'm so mad at myself because I'd STEELED myself, I was ready, but talking to my sister really made me question myself (she called ME, I'd already made my decision). The ONLY reason why I was even talking to anyone about this decision was because I was going to be staying with her. And I had to tell my dad because he'd have to know too.
I think it will be fine. I can feel myself gearing up to be ready, truly ready. He says I can write up my expectations and he'll sign in. I think it will go something like this...
I, XXXXX, know that in order to keep my family together and here with me in XXX, I must give up alcohol because of the affect it is having on my wife and my family. I am going to work with my therapist regularly to gain the tools I need to succeed. And if I cannot succeed with this alone (failure is defined as drinking/lying about drinking), I must start the intensive outpatient program here on the very next day available. If I choose not do start the IOP, I know my wife and children will move to XXXX until I've been sober at least 6 months, maybe more. And there will be no more mention of trying to moderate. I am welcome to try moderation once again, but I know my wife and children will not be here to witness it.
If my friends saw that I was doing this I'd be so embarrassed. You guys said earlier in this thread that I should talk to my good friends instead of my family and you are 100% right. Each of my 3 GOOD friends (known all at least 10-15 years) is supportive of me leaving, knowing what they know, knowing that I am NOT the controlling wife he says I am, knowing that I'm going to go completely crazy in this house if I stay and he continues to drink. Versus my dad and sister who were both relieved that I'm staying and still working on it with him.
Whatever. He's now coming with us for Christmas with my family and I'm coming back here with him while my 2 older kiddos visit their grandparents alone. So he's not getting all of that alone time. I was doing that for him but you guys are all right, it's just an easy way for him to drink. While I am displaced with my infant in a house full of people who have no idea what I've been going through. And on NYE. Not that we do anything for NYE anymore, last year there was no drinking (he'd just gotten the DWI) and we watched movies and went to bed at like 9. Sounds wonderful really.
Thank you thank you everyone. I know I'm a broken record, but this time feels different (me, I feel different and ready) and I feel like things are as crystal clear as they could possibly be with him. And he says he's ready too, that if he fails we can go. And having him on my side there, at least for a little while, benefits me legally.
So even though my gut tells me this is more of the same (from him), it doesn't feel like more of the same (inside me) as far as the understood consequences. And now I'd even feel good for straight up renting a place instead of staying with my sister for a few months to 'figure things out' - I feel like I've already done that due diligence.
Slowly but surely. Leaving is hard. I'm not as strong as I thought I was, but I'm getting stronger.
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FWN,
I believe you are right and that he is playing you. If he really wanted to stop, he wouldn't be saying the Christmas party might be my last chance to party with his coworkers. Never heard of anyone loosing there job because they didn't drink with their coworkers. He is just making an excuse to drink again. Same with saying if he should get his own place. Thats just him wanting to drink someplace where you wont be the alcohol police. If he really wants to save his family and marriage,the no drinking and getting help has to come right now, not after one more time of drinking.
You are not an idiot, you are smart and have seen that a change has to happen. Yes, you might wavier a bit from time to time, but when you stop and think about everything you come to the correct decision. You know what you want you life to be and just need to stick to your boundaries. why I can't tell you to stay or go. I can tell you that he needs to do his journey be it get help or continue to drink and you need to do your journey of healing yourself and your kids.
Be strong FWN and have a good day.
I believe you are right and that he is playing you. If he really wanted to stop, he wouldn't be saying the Christmas party might be my last chance to party with his coworkers. Never heard of anyone loosing there job because they didn't drink with their coworkers. He is just making an excuse to drink again. Same with saying if he should get his own place. Thats just him wanting to drink someplace where you wont be the alcohol police. If he really wants to save his family and marriage,the no drinking and getting help has to come right now, not after one more time of drinking.
You are not an idiot, you are smart and have seen that a change has to happen. Yes, you might wavier a bit from time to time, but when you stop and think about everything you come to the correct decision. You know what you want you life to be and just need to stick to your boundaries. why I can't tell you to stay or go. I can tell you that he needs to do his journey be it get help or continue to drink and you need to do your journey of healing yourself and your kids.
Be strong FWN and have a good day.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
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Originally Posted by fortworthnative
I know I’m being played, I wonder if he knows or he’s just so deep in it he’s clueless.
which isn’t entirely true since my parents hold the mortgage on this house so that feels manipulative, and no family (because he already plans on failing?)
And then I said okay well how can I be certain you won’t drink while I’m away for a couple of weeks? He said he doesn’t know but he’s going to try.
This is all BS. Does he know that? Because I know what this looks like to you guys.
Is this BS, yes most definitely. Does he know? Does it matter? It may be the addiction talking but you can't really separate the two at this point. It would be like if he had a broken leg and deciding that leg isn't part of him anymore because it's not currently ok. The addiction is in control.
How do you leave a person in these circumstances? I’d feel better if his job was safe. I feel like a terrible wife.
I wish I’d have never spoken to my sister about this, speaking with her is what made me waver on leaving. I know her ex was an alcoholic but the situations were SO DIFFERENT.
AH tells me I’m in my head too much and that I was very happy with our plans yesterday morning. Which is true. But I see this for what it is even if he may not.
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Posts: 8,637
"I promise," the addict pleads, sometimes with tears in his eyes. "I know I have been wrong, and this time I have learned my lesson. You'll never have to worry about me again. It will never happen again!"
But it does happen again and again, and again, and again. Each time the promises, each time their breaking. Those who first responded to his sincere sounding promises of reform with relief, hope and at times even joy soon become disillusioned and bitter.
Spouses and other family members begin to ask a perfectly logical question: "If you really love and care about me, why do you keep doing what you know hurts me so badly?" To this the addict has no answer except to promise once again to do better, "this time for real, you'll see!" or to respond with grievances and complaints of his own. The question of fairness arises as the addict attempts to extenuate his own admitted transgressions by repeated references to what he considers the equal or greater faults of those who complain of his addictive behavior. This natural defensive maneuver of "the best defense is a good offense" variety can be the first step on a slippery slope that leads to the paranoid demonization of the very people the addict cares about the most. Unable any longer to carry the burden of his own transgressions he begins to think of himself as the victim of the unfairness and unreasonableness of others who are forever harping on his addiction and the consequences that flow from it. "Leave me alone," he may snap. "I'm not hurting anybody but myself!" He has become almost totally blind to how his addictive behavior does in fact harm those around him who care about him; and he has grown so confused that hurting only himself has begun to sound like a rational, even a virtuous thing to do"!
http://www.bma-wellness.com/papers/A..._Lies_Rel.html
But it does happen again and again, and again, and again. Each time the promises, each time their breaking. Those who first responded to his sincere sounding promises of reform with relief, hope and at times even joy soon become disillusioned and bitter.
Spouses and other family members begin to ask a perfectly logical question: "If you really love and care about me, why do you keep doing what you know hurts me so badly?" To this the addict has no answer except to promise once again to do better, "this time for real, you'll see!" or to respond with grievances and complaints of his own. The question of fairness arises as the addict attempts to extenuate his own admitted transgressions by repeated references to what he considers the equal or greater faults of those who complain of his addictive behavior. This natural defensive maneuver of "the best defense is a good offense" variety can be the first step on a slippery slope that leads to the paranoid demonization of the very people the addict cares about the most. Unable any longer to carry the burden of his own transgressions he begins to think of himself as the victim of the unfairness and unreasonableness of others who are forever harping on his addiction and the consequences that flow from it. "Leave me alone," he may snap. "I'm not hurting anybody but myself!" He has become almost totally blind to how his addictive behavior does in fact harm those around him who care about him; and he has grown so confused that hurting only himself has begun to sound like a rational, even a virtuous thing to do"!
http://www.bma-wellness.com/papers/A..._Lies_Rel.html
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,637
Originally Posted by fortworthnative
Whatever. He's now coming with us for Christmas with my family and I'm coming back here with him while my 2 older kiddos visit their grandparents alone. So he's not getting all of that alone time. I was doing that for him but you guys are all right, it's just an easy way for him to drink.
Then he decides to stay home while you are away and it's unclear whether you told him to go with you or he offered and if he did offer was it after you telling him he just wants to drink for 2 weeks?
The wee red flag is that this is all an attempt to control the uncontrollable. You are painting the picture you want by asking him to jump through these hoops and not allowing him to make his own decisions?
Please know this is said with kindness. You can't control his drinking by having him in your sights all the time. If you could he would have quit drinking 9 years ago. You can't solve this for him, you can't solve "him" for you, it is out of your control.
You didn't Cause it, can't Control it, can't Cure it.
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