Relapsed Codie
 

Hi codieinsc, welcome back but sorry for what brings you here, of course.

The part of your post that really stood out to me is this:

You can, but you won't, why is that? What is holding you there, what held you there before.

Nothing here has changed, he is still that same guy who, I'm guessing, almost destroyed you before.

Sticking around here is a great start, but some real life support would go a long way. Do you have a counselor of some kind? A therapist?

I know how easy it is for this to happen and your story just shows how we are continuously recovering. Thanks for sharing. The scary part is how easy it can be to loose that confidence and self esteem after all the hard work. I'm sure you will get it back. I too have taken a knock in mine lately and trying to build it up again.

It's scary and being emotionally exhausted certainly doesn't help. That's a good caution for anyone who is in this type of relationship. Eventually it wears you down, your self-esteem is shot and there appears to be no way out.

Time to circle the wagons codieinSC. We are here for you for sure. Have you attended Al-Anon at all? Have you read Codependent no more?

Most importantly, what are you doing for your own well being. As you have been down this road before, you probably know that self-focus is your ticket back to well being. Meditation? Journalling? Staying close to SR.

Have you written a list of all the reasons, in point form, of why this relationship is so bad. Of the terrible things he says and does? That's kind of a good starting point I've found. Keep the list close and when you are ruminating or magically thinking how wonderful it could possibly maybe be if this and this and this changed - refer to it. 20 times a day or more as needed.

Play the tape forward. Where does this same road lead? When do you cut your losses? How much more painful will it be?

Denial and rationalization are at the heart of all addiction, including codependency. I suggest remembering the worst times between you and preparing for a repeat. How about Alanon?

I guess I do love this man but the denial and pretending is making me sick.

i'm gonna challenge this.
LOVE does not make us SICK.
unhealthy attachment DOES.

you still live across the country right? so going No Contact is pretty easy to do. over time you let yourself begin to look to him for comfort and contact. you convinced yourself it was ok to start taking his abuse again. you convinced yourself you didn't need to be in No Contact.

he didn't somehow magically weasel his way in.
you opened the door and put out the welcome mat.
which means you can roll up that mat and shut that door anytime.
the power lies with you.

One day at a time.

While no contact or low contact can be very beneficial in dealing with certain toxic relationships, there are many more skills to be learned. Little things weave together to create healing and growth. :grouphug:

It takes courage to be here, to post and want more. I'm glad you're here.

I'm still figuring out how to use this website (I'm not the best with computers) so I'll reply to everyone at once and hope you all see it.

First of all, I really appreciate your replies. The support on this forum is so helpful. I need to be called out on my crap. Anvilhead, you're right: I did let him back into my life. I can't pretend he has all the power when I'm allowing it to happen. About healthy love, I honestly only have experienced this with my parents and children. My romantic relationships have always been chaos. Every single time I feel like I'm in love with a man, I simultaneously become a wreck and the relationship quickly becomes unhealthy. Granted I choose the wrong men but of course, it's also me. I don't think I'm capable of being in a healthy romantic relationship.

I'm wondering what you all think about being a victim of abuse and codependency. I've read "Why Does He Do That?" a few times and in it, Lundy says if you are victim of abuse, you are a victim, not a codependent. Am I trying to see myself as a victim and denying my own sickness?

When someone is both an alcoholic and an abuser, things get so complicated. When I first started my relationship with this man, I actually tried to get him to stop drinking. (Eye roll). I'd get mad at him when he drank and we did the whole sick dance of him pretending to go to AA and me believing he was going to change. That is beyond over so I do feel like in terms of his alcoholism, I'm at a point of clarity.

Is codependency a refusal to take care of yourself or put yourself first? Is it a willingness to be dragged down by the sickness of someone else? Am I a love addict? I've spent years in therapy but honestly, no therapist was as helpful as the people on this forum. I had three different therapists and was never told I might be a codie!?!?

Glenjo, it IS important to keep up the work even when things are going well. I didn't do it. I started to see a psychiatrist after a lifetime of dealing with anxiety. Started Zoloft and felt almost normal for a while, but I wasn't paying attention to the deeper stuff.

Anyway, thank you all again so much for the welcome. Hopefully I can help others beginning their journeys. There's strength together.

Not being an expert in abuse or codependency I can't see why it can't be both.

In the end both things get you to the same place, stuck in a relationship that is unhealthy for you.

Codependency may well be what opened the door for him to come flying back in to your life. Either one may keep you stuck there. But in the end, it really doesn't matter does it? You are unhappy with it and that's really all that matters.

Abuse is insidious, no doubt about that. Understanding why he does it is helpful, I suppose, in that it lets you identify it. The question is what are you going to do about it, how far down that road are you willing to go. You have a relationship with an alcoholic that is abusive.

I totally get this. You are stuck, you know what you need to do but don't have the strength to do it. Well you do. Baby steps. You don't have to fix all this in an hour, or a day or even a week. Slow, steps. Manageable pieces.

First things first, you need support so stick with it. I'm glad you came back and posted. What kind of family support do you have? Do you have siblings you can talk to at all? Sharing this will remove some of the burden and help you to see things more clearly and help you to regain strength. Spend time with family and friends.

Instead of reading why does he do that, focus more on why you shouldn't be in this relationship. It's one thing to be in a relationship with an alcoholic, it's another to be in an abusive relationship. There is no excuse for that kind of behaviour toward you, none.

Firm up your boundaries. Say no. When he is on the phone talking to you about love and marriage, what is your response? Do you discuss the abuse? If not, why not?

You know that going NC with him is really the way out of this, perhaps to start you could let him know that you need a week to think about things and that you aren't feeling comfortable? Then take that week for yourself. Do good things for yourself. Spend time with friends, post here, eat well and get lots of sleep. Allow yourself time and space to get out of the fog you are stuck in?

Maybe the first boundary would be to not speak to him for a week. The second (if you still want to talk to him after that week) might be to never speak to him when he has been drinking.

https://melodybeattie.com/the-other-side-of-that-story/

[QUOTE=trailmix;7160623]Not being an expert in abuse or codependency I can't see why it can't be both.

In the end both things get you to the same place, stuck in a relationship that is unhealthy for you.

Codependency may well be what opened the door for him to come flying back in to your life. Either one may keep you stuck there. But in the end, it really doesn't matter does it? You are unhappy with it and that's really all that matters.

Abuse is insidious, no doubt about that. Understanding why he does it is helpful, I suppose, in that it lets you identify it. The question is what are you going to do about it, how far down that road are you willing to go. You have a relationship with an alcoholic that is abusive.



I totally get this. You are stuck, you know what you need to do but don't have the strength to do it. Well you do. Baby steps. You don't have to fix all this in an hour, or a day or even a week. Slow, steps. Manageable pieces.

First things first, you need support so stick with it. I'm glad you came back and posted. What kind of family support do you have? Do you have siblings you can talk to at all? Sharing this will remove some of the burden and help you to see things more clearly and help you to regain strength. Spend time with family and friends.

Instead of reading why does he do that, focus more on why you shouldn't be in this relationship. It's one thing to be in a relationship with an alcoholic, it's another to be in an abusive relationship. There is no excuse for that kind of behaviour toward you, none.

Firm up your boundaries. Say no. When he is on the phone talking to you about love and marriage, what is your response? Do you discuss the abuse? If not, why not?

You know that going NC with him is really the way out of this, perhaps to start you could let him know that you need a week to think about things and that you aren't feeling comfortable? Then take that week for yourself. Do good things for yourself. Spend time with friends, post here, eat well and get lots of sleep. Allow yourself time and space to get out of the fog you are stuck in?

Maybe the first boundary would be to not speak to him for a week. The second (if you still want to talk to him after that week) might be to never speak to him when he has been drinking.



You all produce the most thoughtful, well-written responses so quickly.

I never speak to this man when he's drinking. I learned that lesson over and over again the hard way. That's why the time change has made things better because I can avoid him when he's drunk by being asleep or pretending to be asleep.

I'm always walking on egg shells with him. I would never bring up the abuse because he'd lose his **** and I'd somehow pay the price. I will be punished if I don't go along with his denial. He's really subtly controlling, always wanting to know where I am and what I'm doing. I used to mistake it for love. I thought he cared what I was up to in the same way I care what my kids are up to. But it isn't that.

I have support in California but I don't have anyone here. I have one pretty good friend but she's really healthy and I think she'd be horrified to find out I have this side to me. The positive of her is I've never attracted anyone so healthy into my life before and thought it was sign I was finally healthy myself. The downside is I'm embarrassed in front of her about who I really am.

The A keeps me company on the phone. We talk for hours a day on the days he isn't teaching (He is a professor at a university so has many days free.) That isn't healthy. Who talks for hours each day, especially in an on and off relationship that's gone on for ten years? That level of interaction isn't sustainable and then the backlash comes. Also, all the time I'm wasting speaking to him means I'm not out trying to meet new people. I'm like an addict, self-isolating with my drug. I do understand that.

The hardest part of letting go of him is letting go of the fantasy that he loves me. His obsessive nature and control feels like passion sometimes. It's so damn depressing to accept the fact that I've wasted years of my life with this sick person who is incapable of loving anyone. The loneliness I'm going to face feels daunting. I appreciate the suggestion to take care of myself. If you are actively loving yourself, the love of a man doesn't feel as necessary. It's easy to forget to do that, especially when it doesn't come naturally.

You're absolutely right that I should focus more on why I'm in the relationship rather than "Why he does that?" My attempt to try to understand him is just a way of avoiding looking at my own stuff. This is why I love SR. It helps so much to put things in writing and get feedback. You can totally see where your thinking has gone awry!:

Reading your post gives me cold chills. Been there, done that.

The difference in me today and the me back then is no way would I do that to me today. I have earned back my self respect.

Is it me or is this site really hard to navigate? I quoted your entire reply. Omg.

I have support in California but I don't have anyone here.

and you won't if you don't CHANGE your ways and attitudes. as long as you stay glued to the phone with somebody or continue the chant "there is no one here for me, there is no one here for me" you build a force field around yourself that guarantees nobody can get IN.

and you might want to look at that. are you hoping to be rescued? are you willing to put yourself out there - even attending alanon, or signing up for pottery class, or an activity club? there are lots of "singles" clubs that aren't about hooking up. but you can't expect the new THEMS to come find you, you'll have to be out in the open!!!

and you don't have to fix it all in one day. start with phone time. think about WHAT ELSE you could be doing. what are you avoiding? WHY are you avoiding it?

is this really about HIM..............or about you?

Cunning, baffling, and powerful, isn't it?

I realized in looking at this that it probably can be quite confusing to start (I've been posting for a while so haven't thought about it).

If you want to quote the original comment, you are on the right track. You can edit that original quote too if you like, if you just want to display a line or two that had a question - just be sure to leave the Quote codes at the beginning and end and just edit/delete portions of the text in-between.

If you just want to make a general or blanket reply, that won't include any quotes. scroll down to the bottom of the page and use the Reply button on the left or the Quick Reply box at the bottom center.

You might want to read the part you wrote about eggshells over and over again. You aren't in a relationship with him, you are a hostage.

I was in a relationship once where there was all the constant text/phone contact and I too found it flattering at first. I then realized, as you do, that it was a control issue, not love or caring. The relationship was "officially" over, but the contact continued long distance. When it became time to go NC, as it inevitably does, I finally said hey, I need some time without contact. It was a huge gaping hole in my day. No waiting for a text or call or message. No long stupid conversations.

Each day it became better, one day at a time (but those first few days were rough), having support is so helpful. I would say it was a couple of weeks before I really felt comfortable with it. Not to say I was completely over the relationship, that took time, but the further away I got from it the happier I became and the better my self-esteem was (which I didn't even realize was taking a beating!), eventually you break free.

Perhaps don't think of it as ending a relationship, think of it as regaining your freedom.

Summer is just around the corner, you could be out soaking up some sunshine instead of on the phone with him!

As for your healthy friend, maybe share a little with her. If she is as healthy as you say, she has probably had some trials of her own and might have wisdom to share as well?

Alcoholics don't just pop out of the bushes and latch onto random people, they attach to the ones who are receptive. Everything you've listed here gets more and more pronounced, the longer you involve yourself in an unhealthy relationship, which (I'm coming to believe) is the very nature of a relationship with an active alcoholic. The struggles you list only get greater when involved with an active alcoholic because that relationship speaks to all of the troubles already inside you.

Have you ever gotten involved in Alanon? It would provide a great opportunity for you to address the underlying reasons that you're attracted to this man to begin with. Remaining in contact with an active alcoholic will bring out more and more of your depression and social anxiety. AlAnon would be a great arena in which to work on the challenges that set you up for receptivity to him. Just like AA, AlAnon is full of people who have made the choice to change their lives for the better. The people with whom we choose to spend time have an enormous influence on us. Look at him, then go spend time around them - which parts of yourself do you want to foster?

California is an absolute HAVEN for addicts and codependents. I should know. I have lived here almost 50 years. Even now, I am plotting my escape.

You made a good move to the east coast, and you could do it again. While I don't believe in "geographic cures," there is something to be said for distance , especially from your qualifier.

Statistics aren't what matter - the people we are drawn to are what matter. Alcoholics/addicts and codependent-prone people have a sixth sense for one another. We will zero in on each other with laser accuracy. This is why it's so important for us to know that in order to change our lives, we have to work on ourselves. The whole world seems like it's full of addiction when we are responsive to the kind of relationships that go along with it.