Being a non co-dependent
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Being a non co-dependent
I have read Co-Dependent No more (a great book) which I probably need to read again.
I no longer feel the rapid heartbeat in my chest when he falls of the wagon but I feel anger which is co dependent behaviour. For the most part I don't check up on him but I know when he is lying to my face, it is just something in his mannerisms and in my gut. He is never rip roaring drunk in front of me though he has opportunities with business travel to be out of state/country which I am sure he does. He thinks that if he hides it from me then all is a ok.
I want to be able to detach more. I cannot leave due to financial circumstances and I live in his home country which makes it more tricky. I have a job, my own money and occasionally I will go on trips or stay in a hotel just to get some space.
What have others done to get to a level of detachment that you really don't care. It is so difficult to be detached and have any semblance of a marriage. He can still work, hold down a job. High functioning I suppose. He has tried AA many times and mostly because I told him I would leave. I don't want to tell him that anymore, I want to stay in my home but leave mentally, emotionally and occasionally physically.
Am I asking the wrong questions?
I no longer feel the rapid heartbeat in my chest when he falls of the wagon but I feel anger which is co dependent behaviour. For the most part I don't check up on him but I know when he is lying to my face, it is just something in his mannerisms and in my gut. He is never rip roaring drunk in front of me though he has opportunities with business travel to be out of state/country which I am sure he does. He thinks that if he hides it from me then all is a ok.
I want to be able to detach more. I cannot leave due to financial circumstances and I live in his home country which makes it more tricky. I have a job, my own money and occasionally I will go on trips or stay in a hotel just to get some space.
What have others done to get to a level of detachment that you really don't care. It is so difficult to be detached and have any semblance of a marriage. He can still work, hold down a job. High functioning I suppose. He has tried AA many times and mostly because I told him I would leave. I don't want to tell him that anymore, I want to stay in my home but leave mentally, emotionally and occasionally physically.
Am I asking the wrong questions?
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Givenup…….if you are desiring detachment.....alanon can help walk you through the concepts.....and, if you keep posting here, we can help you.....as many of our members are struggling with the same issues that you are.....
the way that I, personally, look at it is that detachment is but one "tool" to give a person enough "space" to begin to gain more clarity and to do their own self-examination......I see detachment as a tool and a good first step for the partner of an alcoholic....
I think it takes more than that to fic the marriage.....lol...I am not even sure that "fix" is the right word...because as long as alcoholism is an issue...it will continue to erode the relationship form the inside.....
from what you write, it sounds (to me) like what your goal is to have, basically, an economic arrangement. And, frankly, that is what some marital arrangements are. I have seen lots of them.
That is possible for some people.....I think it comes down to how you are put together. some people seem to be fine with only a body that takes on oxygen and gives off carbon dioxide.....others, can't seem to do that.
You will know what you can or can't be satisfied with...…
the way that I, personally, look at it is that detachment is but one "tool" to give a person enough "space" to begin to gain more clarity and to do their own self-examination......I see detachment as a tool and a good first step for the partner of an alcoholic....
I think it takes more than that to fic the marriage.....lol...I am not even sure that "fix" is the right word...because as long as alcoholism is an issue...it will continue to erode the relationship form the inside.....
from what you write, it sounds (to me) like what your goal is to have, basically, an economic arrangement. And, frankly, that is what some marital arrangements are. I have seen lots of them.
That is possible for some people.....I think it comes down to how you are put together. some people seem to be fine with only a body that takes on oxygen and gives off carbon dioxide.....others, can't seem to do that.
You will know what you can or can't be satisfied with...…
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Originally Posted by Givenup2018 
It is so difficult to be detached and have any semblance of a marriage.
Like dandylion, I don't believe detachment is a long-term tool for living with an alcoholic, but a short-term means of getting through an uncomfortable situation while you work to find a better situation for yourself.
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Yes, what Sparkle just said I agree with!
What you are asking to do is be an empty shell. Is that who you really want to be? There is no magic turn off switch to make you not care or make you not get angry anymore. It's not even codependent behavior, it's human nature to reach to these situations.
Huge hugs.
What you are asking to do is be an empty shell. Is that who you really want to be? There is no magic turn off switch to make you not care or make you not get angry anymore. It's not even codependent behavior, it's human nature to reach to these situations.
Huge hugs.
Originally Posted by SparkleKitty
I would go even further and say that it is impossible.
Like dandylion, I don't believe detachment is a long-term tool for living with an alcoholic, but a short-term means of getting through an uncomfortable situation while you work to find a better situation for yourself.
Like dandylion, I don't believe detachment is a long-term tool for living with an alcoholic, but a short-term means of getting through an uncomfortable situation while you work to find a better situation for yourself.
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Originally Posted by Givenup2018
What have others done to get to a level of detachment that you really don't care. It is so difficult to be detached and have any semblance of a marriage.
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What you can let go of is any semblance of control, you can detach from caring whether or not he drinks, he is a grown person who wants to drink and he will, he obviously has no problem with his drinking. Truth being you can't control anyone and that's ok.
If you don't purposefully detach you will naturally detach after a while anyway, the hurts, the deception, the disregard for your feelings will kill your warm feelings after a while.
All that said, you can let go of control until the cows come home, but the absolute fact is you are still in a relationship with a person who uses a mind-altering substance to excess, that is a problem in a relationship. That affects trust, reliability, etc etc
I think Al-Anon is a good idea, if nothing else you will have a support group and you will learn the basics of detachment, it's a start.
To get where you say you want to be you will need to start accepting him more as a room-mate than a Husband. Do you actually still see him as a relationship partner right now?
I totally agree with Dandylion that some people are cut out to be able to do this and some are just not.
If you don't purposefully detach you will naturally detach after a while anyway, the hurts, the deception, the disregard for your feelings will kill your warm feelings after a while.
All that said, you can let go of control until the cows come home, but the absolute fact is you are still in a relationship with a person who uses a mind-altering substance to excess, that is a problem in a relationship. That affects trust, reliability, etc etc
I think Al-Anon is a good idea, if nothing else you will have a support group and you will learn the basics of detachment, it's a start.
To get where you say you want to be you will need to start accepting him more as a room-mate than a Husband. Do you actually still see him as a relationship partner right now?
I totally agree with Dandylion that some people are cut out to be able to do this and some are just not.
"O you must wear your rue with difference".
Join Date: Aug 2017
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I agree with Dandylion. I think if one chooses to live with an addict, one has to totally accept that they have the right to continue to drink, drug or whatever. That means, you have to be totally okay with it... and also okay with the consequences. If you are not okay with it, then you are going to live with someone you grow to actively dislike or resent -- a roommate you dislike or resent.
There are a lot of people here who have left long-term marriages with nothing -- no money, no job, nothing. Personally, I tried detachment and that was when my ExAh became physically abusive... so I left with nothing. I had, maybe, $500 to my name. He took everything -- it was theft, but since our accounts were joint, there was nothing I could do about it.
So now I put this to you: Are you able to leave any time you want? Are you able to live with a marriage that is purely an economic arrangement? If you want to stay in your marriage and be an emotionally absent spouse... you could do that. I don't think you need to ask if that is the "right" thing for you to do. I think you need to do what you feel is right for you. The "right thing" is different for everyone. Not everyone has the same type of marriage. There are some marriages that are open marriages. There are marriages of convenience. There are people who marry, divorce, remarry... etc... etc. There are people who separate but don't divorce for religious reasons. There are people who live together, have children, and never marry. There are people in long-term long distance relationships. There are people with pets instead of children. There are also people who live with addicts and are totally okay with it... and there is nothing wrong with that.
Personally, I think you have a right to feel angry. I don't think you should question your feelings. You feel angry for a reason. In your situation, it's NORMAL to feel angry. Anger may not be conducive to living with the subject of your anger though. If you simply try to "stop" being angry, you might eventually become resentful.
Now the other thing you may want to consider: do you think your husband will accept you detaching in this way? Is this type of detachment something he will notice -- what I mean is, will he think he's getting the "silent treatment"? Is he going to still expect intimacy? I ask these questions because if, after being "ignored" for a while, he suddenly drops divorce papers in your lap, you don't want to be blindsided, you want to be prepared. So... even if you do plan on staying, which is totally fine, I would consider consulting a lawyer as a precaution. I also would not tell him about it.
If you are constantly threatening to leave... and then you don't. It really sends the message that when he crosses your boundaries, there are no repercussions... and this might lead to more lying about things -- financial things, affairs, other things. If you attend AA, you might get a clearer idea about what to do about this. So far, your husband's drinking has not had negative affects on your finances and you were able to complete your studies and keep your career. But be prepared for the progressive nature of addiction... if untreated, it does, always, lead to serious life outcomes for the addict as well as the people close to the addict: financial ruin, chronic health difficulties, homelessness, violence, children who need therapy... etc.
There are a lot of people here who have left long-term marriages with nothing -- no money, no job, nothing. Personally, I tried detachment and that was when my ExAh became physically abusive... so I left with nothing. I had, maybe, $500 to my name. He took everything -- it was theft, but since our accounts were joint, there was nothing I could do about it.
So now I put this to you: Are you able to leave any time you want? Are you able to live with a marriage that is purely an economic arrangement? If you want to stay in your marriage and be an emotionally absent spouse... you could do that. I don't think you need to ask if that is the "right" thing for you to do. I think you need to do what you feel is right for you. The "right thing" is different for everyone. Not everyone has the same type of marriage. There are some marriages that are open marriages. There are marriages of convenience. There are people who marry, divorce, remarry... etc... etc. There are people who separate but don't divorce for religious reasons. There are people who live together, have children, and never marry. There are people in long-term long distance relationships. There are people with pets instead of children. There are also people who live with addicts and are totally okay with it... and there is nothing wrong with that.
Personally, I think you have a right to feel angry. I don't think you should question your feelings. You feel angry for a reason. In your situation, it's NORMAL to feel angry. Anger may not be conducive to living with the subject of your anger though. If you simply try to "stop" being angry, you might eventually become resentful.
Now the other thing you may want to consider: do you think your husband will accept you detaching in this way? Is this type of detachment something he will notice -- what I mean is, will he think he's getting the "silent treatment"? Is he going to still expect intimacy? I ask these questions because if, after being "ignored" for a while, he suddenly drops divorce papers in your lap, you don't want to be blindsided, you want to be prepared. So... even if you do plan on staying, which is totally fine, I would consider consulting a lawyer as a precaution. I also would not tell him about it.
If you are constantly threatening to leave... and then you don't. It really sends the message that when he crosses your boundaries, there are no repercussions... and this might lead to more lying about things -- financial things, affairs, other things. If you attend AA, you might get a clearer idea about what to do about this. So far, your husband's drinking has not had negative affects on your finances and you were able to complete your studies and keep your career. But be prepared for the progressive nature of addiction... if untreated, it does, always, lead to serious life outcomes for the addict as well as the people close to the addict: financial ruin, chronic health difficulties, homelessness, violence, children who need therapy... etc.
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Originally Posted by FallenAngelina
Loving detachment doesn't mean that you don't care. It doesn't mean that you are emotionally detached and indifferent. Loving detachment means that you unhook from needing a person to do or be something in order for you to be happy. In my view, all healthy relationships require loving detachment - allowing the other person to be what he freely chooses. The concept of loving detachment comes out of the AlAnon program and it usually takes a whole program to understand and incorporate into one's life, especially if you come from a co-dependent background, which is by nature based on control. Loving detachment is not indifference and constantly turning a blind eye, it is lovingly giving up attempts to control and setting aside the false premise that other people can stand in our way of happiness in life.
Right now I don't want to be loving at all, I just don't want to deal with him, talk to him etc. I am happy when he is overseas, the longer the better.
I want to get to the point of indifference which essentially means the marriage is over
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Originally Posted by Givenup2018
Right now I don't want to be loving at all, I just don't want to deal with him, talk to him etc.
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Originally Posted by Givenup2018
I don't want to tell him that anymore, I want to stay in my home but leave mentally, emotionally and occasionally physically.
Am I asking the wrong questions?
Am I asking the wrong questions?
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I repeatedly practiced taking the focus off the alcoholic and deal with my own issues. Saying Alanon slogans also helps: "I'm powerless over people, places and things." Also being rigorous in not asking about the drinking. It's a process, it takes practice.
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I live in SE Asia and there are many AA meetings but no AlAnon meetings anywhere near me. There used to be but the lady moved overseas. I went today but was told it was only AA now, felt so disappointed.
Feeling very alone and weepy, my resolve is weakening. He comes in at 10pm, sober says “evening”, I respond. I’m watching TV, then go to bed. I moved into my kids room. I don’t want to be near him. Feeling sorry for myself. This is not how I envisaged my life, been down this road so many times, I am tired. Listening to CoDependent No More again, I hear me in there.
Feeling very alone and weepy, my resolve is weakening. He comes in at 10pm, sober says “evening”, I respond. I’m watching TV, then go to bed. I moved into my kids room. I don’t want to be near him. Feeling sorry for myself. This is not how I envisaged my life, been down this road so many times, I am tired. Listening to CoDependent No More again, I hear me in there.
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Originally Posted by Givenup2018
I live in SE Asia and there are many AA meetings but no AlAnon meetings anywhere near me. There used to be but the lady moved overseas. I went today but was told it was only AA now, felt so disappointed.
Feeling very alone and weepy, my resolve is weakening. He comes in at 10pm, sober says “evening”, I respond. I’m watching TV, then go to bed. I moved into my kids room. I don’t want to be near him. Feeling sorry for myself. This is not how I envisaged my life, been down this road so many times, I am tired. Listening to CoDependent No More again, I hear me in there.
Feeling very alone and weepy, my resolve is weakening. He comes in at 10pm, sober says “evening”, I respond. I’m watching TV, then go to bed. I moved into my kids room. I don’t want to be near him. Feeling sorry for myself. This is not how I envisaged my life, been down this road so many times, I am tired. Listening to CoDependent No More again, I hear me in there.
I wonder, they always say an AA meeting is just two people and a pot of coffee (something like that) - why can't Al-Anon be the same? I wonder if you spoke again to the AA person if maybe you could organize an Al-Anon group? I'm sure there are many others that would like to join as well?
Not to say that you have to be the main organizer, but perhaps this person could start taking names of those interested or something. Or give you space to bring a coffee pot and start your own.
That aside, I'm sorry you are feeling so down, but it's surely understandable.
Ideally you would probably like to have a close relationship with your Husband but as that is not to be at the moment, perhaps it's time to detach yourself a bit. Expecting him to be what he is not hurts you.
Have you looked at ordering the Al-Anon literature online?
Here is the link for the online meetings:
https://al-anon.org/al-anon-meetings...onic-meetings/
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I am a member of an online group, perhaps I must start again, though I find it very instrumental I prefer the wisdom from here. They tried to start AlAnon many times here but few attend. I think it’s the culture and shame. If one doesn’t acknowledge the problem then there isn’t one, it’s a shame based culture so people don’t seek help or maybe they think they don’t need help.
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Well we are certainly here for you! Face to face support is nice to have but if it's not available - nothing to be done there.
So you want to stay in the current situation, I understand (as in physically stay in the country/house etc) but you know the relationship is doomed as long as he continues drinking? You have a boundary about drinking?
I guess what I'm asking is, what do you want. Do you feel you will be able to remain where you are and detach from your Husband emotionally? As mentioned above, some can do that, if that's completely not in your nature, then it will just be emotional torture.
So you want to stay in the current situation, I understand (as in physically stay in the country/house etc) but you know the relationship is doomed as long as he continues drinking? You have a boundary about drinking?
I guess what I'm asking is, what do you want. Do you feel you will be able to remain where you are and detach from your Husband emotionally? As mentioned above, some can do that, if that's completely not in your nature, then it will just be emotional torture.
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Originally Posted by Givenup2018
I am doing a course on co-dependency, I need to work on me some more. Knowledge is power I believe. My problem is hope.
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