Gonna take a step backwards, I think.
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 151
Gonna take a step backwards, I think.
Been spending some time with DS and AW - together and with AW alone.
First, AW and I took DS to see Santa - it was a pleasant day. As good as can be expected under the circumstances (she's living in a SoberLiving house; I have an order of protection for DS that gives AW only supervised visits with him).
Second, I picked up AW form her SoberLiving House and brought her to DS pre-school for their Christmas program. That too was pleasant (until the end, more below)
Third, AW and I went shopping for Christmas presents for the kids (DD 18 y.o.; DS 4 y.o.) -- we're not divorced (no action pending) and I didn't want to play that game of I got them better presents (because I have a job and money and she doesn't). That started ok and ended on a sour note.
So, DD's Christmas program: Go to drop her off at Sober Living house and DS son says something like "Merry Christmas" to her and her response is "What's "merry" about it"??" or something like that. I didn't say anything in response.
Yeah, I get it life sucks for AW right now -- the SoberLiving house is full of recovering addicts, you share a room, etc. But, at least you have a roof over your head, etc. She's got legal problems and possible incarceration facing her in the next year, but you're out now and can see DS. Also, its Christmas and he's 4 years old, don't be a "Debbie Downer".
Now, Christmas shopping with her for the kids. When we were going to the stores, she said "we both know where this is going" - to which I said "I haven't made any decision to file for divorce; but if you have please say so." Silence.
Then she says "you just don't get we're not a family anymore." And I say to her, I don't think there are any rules about what is or is not "a family" - we can choose how we do this, no matter what transpires between you and me with respect to a divorce. [ note, I know family's were the ex-H or ex-W is still invited over for Xmas day or eve so the kids see both parents able to get along - I admit, it's not usual; but again, there are no rules about how people do this).
When we finished I offered to take her back to her SoberLiving facility - which she accepted. On the way there, she learned they had moved her to another house nearby, but she didn't have the code and she had to kill an hour. So, I said "do you want to grab a late lunch?" And she said "yes."
We order - it's a Steak 'n Shake (so sit down fast food). And we're talking and I say "Yeah, DS's daycare is closed from 12/21 to 1/2 - so there are some days I have to work and get DD to watch DS during the day."
And she's says "can I help watch him during those days?"
If you've been following my posts, you know that we JUST got a court order saying that AW gets supervised visitation with DS only. She's only been "sober" (AFAIK) since 10/5, so about 75 days +/-. So I say: "well if your mom or someone else is around."
Clearly, she's upset by this -- goes to the restroom. Comes back gets her food boxed to go. And says she's taking the bus to her new SoberLiving House.
I don't argue -- I just eat my lunch and let her do her thing. Seemed irrational to me -- it was raining and cold out here yesterday, but if that's what you feel you gotta do, then I'm not here to stop you.
To me, AW being alone with DD is a "boundary." She knows this. The order/agreement is in effect for the next 9 months.
To me, AW knew she was walking into a "electric fence" with that question and should have expected to get shocked by my response.
Or maybe not, maybe she thought I'd say "yes, ok, you can watch DS alone during those days." To me, it would not have been RATIONAL for her to think that given what we just did in Court a few days back, but ....
In any case, I'm just going to take a step back from contacting her for a bit except when necessary (exchanging DD, etc.).
MCE Saint
First, AW and I took DS to see Santa - it was a pleasant day. As good as can be expected under the circumstances (she's living in a SoberLiving house; I have an order of protection for DS that gives AW only supervised visits with him).
Second, I picked up AW form her SoberLiving House and brought her to DS pre-school for their Christmas program. That too was pleasant (until the end, more below)
Third, AW and I went shopping for Christmas presents for the kids (DD 18 y.o.; DS 4 y.o.) -- we're not divorced (no action pending) and I didn't want to play that game of I got them better presents (because I have a job and money and she doesn't). That started ok and ended on a sour note.
So, DD's Christmas program: Go to drop her off at Sober Living house and DS son says something like "Merry Christmas" to her and her response is "What's "merry" about it"??" or something like that. I didn't say anything in response.
Yeah, I get it life sucks for AW right now -- the SoberLiving house is full of recovering addicts, you share a room, etc. But, at least you have a roof over your head, etc. She's got legal problems and possible incarceration facing her in the next year, but you're out now and can see DS. Also, its Christmas and he's 4 years old, don't be a "Debbie Downer".
Now, Christmas shopping with her for the kids. When we were going to the stores, she said "we both know where this is going" - to which I said "I haven't made any decision to file for divorce; but if you have please say so." Silence.
Then she says "you just don't get we're not a family anymore." And I say to her, I don't think there are any rules about what is or is not "a family" - we can choose how we do this, no matter what transpires between you and me with respect to a divorce. [ note, I know family's were the ex-H or ex-W is still invited over for Xmas day or eve so the kids see both parents able to get along - I admit, it's not usual; but again, there are no rules about how people do this).
When we finished I offered to take her back to her SoberLiving facility - which she accepted. On the way there, she learned they had moved her to another house nearby, but she didn't have the code and she had to kill an hour. So, I said "do you want to grab a late lunch?" And she said "yes."
We order - it's a Steak 'n Shake (so sit down fast food). And we're talking and I say "Yeah, DS's daycare is closed from 12/21 to 1/2 - so there are some days I have to work and get DD to watch DS during the day."
And she's says "can I help watch him during those days?"
If you've been following my posts, you know that we JUST got a court order saying that AW gets supervised visitation with DS only. She's only been "sober" (AFAIK) since 10/5, so about 75 days +/-. So I say: "well if your mom or someone else is around."
Clearly, she's upset by this -- goes to the restroom. Comes back gets her food boxed to go. And says she's taking the bus to her new SoberLiving House.
I don't argue -- I just eat my lunch and let her do her thing. Seemed irrational to me -- it was raining and cold out here yesterday, but if that's what you feel you gotta do, then I'm not here to stop you.
To me, AW being alone with DD is a "boundary." She knows this. The order/agreement is in effect for the next 9 months.
To me, AW knew she was walking into a "electric fence" with that question and should have expected to get shocked by my response.
Or maybe not, maybe she thought I'd say "yes, ok, you can watch DS alone during those days." To me, it would not have been RATIONAL for her to think that given what we just did in Court a few days back, but ....
In any case, I'm just going to take a step back from contacting her for a bit except when necessary (exchanging DD, etc.).
MCE Saint
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 685
Hi MCE, it is often said around here, to see if an addict is really in recovery tell them "no" and see what happens. Her reaction to your very foreseeable "no" says a lot.
And the sarcastic remark to your son about Christmas not being merry isn't appropriate.
Not to negate her sober time of course, but she's got a ways to go. It's a good idea to back off and let her work on herself.
And the sarcastic remark to your son about Christmas not being merry isn't appropriate.
Not to negate her sober time of course, but she's got a ways to go. It's a good idea to back off and let her work on herself.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,637
I think 53500 hit the nails on the head there.
That comment to your Son was really inappropriate but more than that it shows a selfish attitude is still prevalent. She is not "seeing" him, she is not connecting with him.
As parents (as I am sure you already know) we don't GET to burst the balloons of our children. No matter how snitty we are feeling. We are all guilty of it from time to time for sure, none of us is perfect.
But if you can't say Merry Christmas to your 4 year old, that's a big deal.
Your idea to back off is a good one I think.
Oh and I totally agree with you on how you are doing this doesn't have to be any particular "way". Doesn't have to be standard, can be friendly and whatever way people are comfortable with. That's a really good approach in my opinion.
That comment to your Son was really inappropriate but more than that it shows a selfish attitude is still prevalent. She is not "seeing" him, she is not connecting with him.
As parents (as I am sure you already know) we don't GET to burst the balloons of our children. No matter how snitty we are feeling. We are all guilty of it from time to time for sure, none of us is perfect.
But if you can't say Merry Christmas to your 4 year old, that's a big deal.
Your idea to back off is a good one I think.
Oh and I totally agree with you on how you are doing this doesn't have to be any particular "way". Doesn't have to be standard, can be friendly and whatever way people are comfortable with. That's a really good approach in my opinion.
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Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Southern US
Posts: 510
Whew! When I saw that you'd taken a step back I had a different perception on what your post was going to be about. You've got a lawyer brain, though, and that is a good thing. I will say this: I think you are handling this about as classy as you can. You know your wife better than any of us do.....I am optimistic things can work out if she will work her program and do what she needs to do. In the meantime, you're doing what you need to do. It's hard taking on all of the parenting responsibilities. Sometimes I get depressed and I will admit, my AH (if he's in a functioning enough place) will step up and do the dishes or swiffer the floor. I know what you're doing far surpasses that. It also sounds like you have compassion and love for your wife....not to the detriment of your children, though. I just want to give you a high-five on doing a great job.
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6,262
Nobody tells you how slow recovery is when you quit drinking. People newly sober -- and 75 days is that -- tend to be very cranky and self-pitying but if she has a program she'll learn how to deal with that. In the meantime you're doing a brilliant job in not responding to her baiting.
Life is good
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 4,036
You didn't engage. You didn't get caught in the hooks. It seems that you're clear-minded and have what's best for yourself in mind, and this is very important. What's healthy for you is what's best for your child.
I see this as 10 steps forward.
One day at a time. My husband's recovery has a better chance of success with me staying focused on my own stuff and being an emotionally stable, confident, authentic, light-hearted parent.
I see this as 10 steps forward.
One day at a time. My husband's recovery has a better chance of success with me staying focused on my own stuff and being an emotionally stable, confident, authentic, light-hearted parent.
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Boston
Posts: 2,936
from mango212 "staying focused on my own stuff and being an emotionally stable, confident, authentic, light-hearted parent."
That's the stuff right there.
And wow MCESaint, you did great letting the court decision speak for itself and just letting her get on the bus.
That's a big step forward for a lot of us - let them be, let them be, let them be with their own anger and their own choices...
By keeping your focus on your son you'll keep knowing what's the right thing to do...hang in there!
Peace,
B.
That's the stuff right there.
And wow MCESaint, you did great letting the court decision speak for itself and just letting her get on the bus.
That's a big step forward for a lot of us - let them be, let them be, let them be with their own anger and their own choices...
By keeping your focus on your son you'll keep knowing what's the right thing to do...hang in there!
Peace,
B.
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: maine
Posts: 1,548
Originally Posted by MCESaint 
We order - it's a Steak 'n Shake (so sit down fast food). And we're talking and I say "Yeah, DS's daycare is closed from 12/21 to 1/2 - so there are some days I have to work and get DD to watch DS during the day."
And she's says "can I help watch him during those days?"
And she's says "can I help watch him during those days?"
Life is good
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 4,036
Originally Posted by velma929
Maybe I'm missing something. She said 'help.' She didn't ask to be alone with him. Is your daughter (an adult) not comfortable with having your wife there while she watches your son, or have your wife's supervisors been specified by the court?
Don't try to apply the logical to the illogical perhaps.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
MCE....GOOD FOR YOU!!!
You were baited....and did not take the hook. Great job!!!
Thing is, she is feeling the CONSEQUENCES of her own bad behavior. That's painful, and that's good. It may be what motivates her to stay clean. Or maybe not, only she can say.
Super proud of you!!! Someone said above, tell an addict no and see what happens. That is so right, you truly see where they are in their own recovery when things like this happen. She's still very absorbed with one person....herself.
Hugs.
You were baited....and did not take the hook. Great job!!!
Thing is, she is feeling the CONSEQUENCES of her own bad behavior. That's painful, and that's good. It may be what motivates her to stay clean. Or maybe not, only she can say.
Super proud of you!!! Someone said above, tell an addict no and see what happens. That is so right, you truly see where they are in their own recovery when things like this happen. She's still very absorbed with one person....herself.
Hugs.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
Maybe I'm missing something. She said 'help.' She didn't ask to be alone with him. Is your daughter (an adult) not comfortable with having your wife there while she watches your son,
My personal opinion on asking the 18 year old to supervise her own mother with visits is not fair to that 18 year old. That 18 year old should never be asked to be placed in the middle of something like that. It's best to keep the 18 year old totally out of that situation.
I also agree with the telling an addict no and receiving a not fully in recovery response, but you handled it extremely well.
I also think letting her follow through with her decision to take a bus instead of you driving her without any attempt to try and change her mind was wonderful.
My personal opinion on asking the 18 year old to supervise her own mother with visits is not fair to that 18 year old. That 18 year old should never be asked to be placed in the middle of something like that. It's best to keep the 18 year old totally out of that situation.
I also agree with the telling an addict no and receiving a not fully in recovery response, but you handled it extremely well.
I also think letting her follow through with her decision to take a bus instead of you driving her without any attempt to try and change her mind was wonderful.
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