AutumnMama

I caught my (STBX) husband lying at a marriage counseling appointment last week. Not sure if it's even worth bringing up at the next appointment. Like--what's the point? It only crosses my mind because he was lying to the therapist and not me, haha.

And he's not even drinking

hopeful4

My XAH lies. He lies when he is drunk. He lies when he is sober. Basically, if it comes out of his mouth, you should question it, if you can even make sense of what he is talking about. Harsh, but so true.

I am SO GLAD he is my XAH, not my AH. Thank you Baby Jesus!

Michsm

My XAH lied lied lied all the time..but to him, he didnt lie, I was crazy, never listened to him or didn’t hear him correctly. Always my fault that he lied.

Florence

Chances are, unless he's active in recovery, if he's talking he's lying. You don't have to tell him anything about what you know or what you don't know, about him or anything else. Know what you know, and know it without his input and without getting his feedback.

You get nothing out of trying to verify lies with the liar. See also: my signature line.

atalose

I think when we ask the question – how do you get past the lying we aren’t asking ourselves the correct question which should be – why am I tolerating the lies?

I believe it’s futile to continue to attempt to call out an alcoholic on their lies because lying is such an ingrained part of the disease for so many.

I think you are taking the healthies action you can for yourself by taking a break from the relationship. And I believe that since you have been reading around here for almost a year and have gained a better understanding of the kind of life you will have with him should you return, that this time apart is going to do your self-esteem wonders!!!

Trinity7777

Thank you everyone <3 I'm at the airport, waiting for a flight to go see my family for Thanksgiving. By myself. Trying not to cry. Today is day 4 of no contact. We've never gone a day without talking or seeing each other. This is rough.

I had an ex-addict tell me that the kindest thing I can do for him is leave him; that I'm helping him kill himself by staying with him and accidentally enabling him, keeping him from hitting rock bottom... I'm holding on to that because I feel like I'm totally abandoning him. He has no true friends and he alienated his family with his alcoholism many years ago. It's hard to not feel responsible for him. Especially on a family day like today. Not to mention I love him dearly and hate the thought of him in pain.

Historically when I go out of town he really spirals out of control and doesn't do well. Not to mention the fact that we're not speaking, he recently got fired, and it's a holiday. I have a lot of anxiety about leaving town. But I know there's nothing I can do even if I were to stay.

My emotions are all over the place, from rage to sadness to disgust to guilt, and everything in between. I can't sleep or eat. I'm really hoping to have a break from all of this for the next few days while I'm gone. I don't want to break down when I'm with my family. They don't really know what's going on, at least not the extent of it. Everyone will be asking where he is and how he's doing. I don't want to do this 😢

I'm thinking about emailing him happy Thanksgiving. I don't know what to do 😢 I hope all of you have happy Thanksgivings.

Trinity

FeelingGreat

Hi Trinity, it is hard to leave someone to rely on themselves, but I think your friend is right. If he's going to really feel the consequences of drinking, and develop the power within himself to fight it, he has to be on his own. I know it's sad, and difficult.

As a recovered A who got my life back, I've really lived this. It took me years, and many tries, to get to the point where I was determined to stop drinking, but it had to come from me.

Difficult as this is for him, the state he's in hasn't come around randomly. The alienation from F&F, the job loss and you leaving has all been engineered by him.

Michsm

Trinity, this is new and raw, your emotions are totally valid. I have been there and the truth is...not easy. I felt all those emotions and still do on days like this as well. Just know there are others that are going through what you are going throught and you are strong! You can do this. Each day, gets a bit easier, I know at first it may not seem like it but it does.

dafunbra

When I was drinking I lied all the time, to the people who meant the most to me. One of the cornerstones of my recovery is the absolute necessity of being brutally honest, both with myself and others. Until I realized that and made that decision along with the decision to not drink I wasn't ever going to get any better. I'm grateful for the limited amount of sober time that I do have, and very much want it to continue to grow. For that to happen, my lies had to stop.

trailmix

Hi Trinity, I am so sorry you are hurting. This is a bad situation anyway you look at it and unfortunately those are the facts.

You have been with him some time now and nothing has improved. Even when you are with him his addiction continues.

So you have gone NC and that is a good thing, what are you hoping to gain? Are you wanting to normalize your life or are you hoping he will come to his senses and stop drinking or all of the above? I assume you had a talk with him before going NC.

I ask this as you mention texting him.

Hang in there!

Trinity7777

I truly appreciate the support everyone, it is much needed.

Basically on Friday I had reached my breaking point with the lying and the way he has been treating me lately. His drinking is beyond out of control, and has been for a long time. I don't feel up to going into details yet. But it's all day every day, vodka only, his health and mental well-being are really suffering. And you all know everything that goes along with this, so I'm miserable and worried and blah blah blah
​​​​​
So Friday I had told him I could officially no longer continue our relationship as is. I finally reached my limit. He asked me not to write him off yet, to please just give him some time to show me that he could make some changes. I told him I couldn't talk to him during that time, but that I would support him if he reached for recovery. He got fired the next day, wanted me to support him through that. I didn't feel sympathetic or up for that, so when he got nasty I blocked him on Sunday night. Prior to that he had acted on board for the time apart, but I guess he didn't think it'd actually be no contact :/

So yeah, we had talked about going NC prior to it starting it for him to work on his plan and for me to keep myself from getting hurt any further. But he couldn't respect it and has gotten very angry that I blocked him. He has tried calling from other numbers, which I didn't answer, but he left voicemails. And he has been asking a mutual friend to call me for him. But our friend told him no (this friend is aware what's going on) and said that my ABF is now saying "If she won't talk to me, f*** her." I know he's just hurting, but that doesn't sound at all like he's taking this time to formulate a plan if that's what he's saying

And that's where I am now. Sometimes feeling justified, sometimes feeling guilty, I'm just all over the place. I had the strong urge to email him Happy Thanksgiving earlier, but that feeling has passed. The hardest moments for me are when I get triggered by thinking about truly losing him, and that I should just take it all back so we can be together again. I know I can't do this, but man, the urge is so strong I know I can't back down on this. I hope I'm strong enough to maintain it.

trailmix

Yeah, it's not fun.

Few things that might help. First of all make a list of the negatives and keep that handy. It helps to remind you why you are doing this at all. It's easy to slip back in to only thinking of the positive aspects.

Read that list 20 times a day if needed.

You told him what you need (him seeking recovery), you are at your breaking point. If he doesn't make changes then you will be right where you are now, miserable. Perhaps once he calms down and had a chance to think about it he will see it. More will be revealed on that.

But it's hard yes, it's hurtful and there is no way around that, but it will get better.

FallenAngelina

I'm in a similar place, Trinity, so am with you in your struggle. I can't recommend AlAnon highly enough. The program and community address everything you're going through right now. I strongly encourage you to not try and do this by yourself. AlAnon is not about dealing with the alcoholic so much as it is about learning to think in healthier ways for ourselves. The program and the people are such positive influences in my life.

I am right there with you. I'm just now really understanding that a good relationship with an active alcoholic is impossible. Many hugs to you. I feel ya.

Trinity7777

Trailmix-- you're so right, I have a pro/con list in my journal at home from a while back when I was trying to gain strength to leave-- guess which side was waaay longer.. lol. I need to put it in my purse and add the new complaints I have since then :p Thank you for your continued support and great advice <3

​​​​​​FallenAngelina-- I have been thinking hard about Al-Anon.. Thank you for letting me know a little more what it's about. I ordered one of their books and have been reading it, but hadn't had the guts to go to an in-person meeting yet. I did check, and there are meetings every day in my area. I'm going to commit to getting past my social anxiety and going to a meeting this coming week when I get back in town. I'm wishing you the best in your journey. It does bring comfort knowing there are others who know exactly where I'm coming from, though I'm sorry so many of us can relate!

FallenAngelina

My experience is that social anxiety is fear of being judged negatively. AlAnon is specifically non-judgmental. Nobody tells you what to do and in my experience, the atmosphere is welcoming. You can go and just listen - you need not speak until you are ready. And when you are ready, people listen, they do not comment on or judge what you've said. If one meeting group doesn't resonate with you, keep trying out others. Every meeting group is different in feel, but they all follow the same principles. You absolutely do not have to go through this alone. Peace and serenity is possible to begin having in your life right now. You need not wait for something to happen or not happen with your BF.

honeypig

Just wanted to jump in and second everything FA said about Alanon. Reading around their website ( https://al-anon.org/ ) might help you understand what Alanon is and does, and what to expect at a meeting. If you google "alanon podcast", you'll find a ton of results. I know some people here have found it helpful to listen to these in their cars on the way to or from work, in the morning when they get up, or whenever they can squeeze it in.

Alanon was not my only or total recovery course, but it was VERY helpful, especially in the early days. I don't think anything else could have taken the place of it. I hope you do go, and I hope you find it helpful.

ETA: And some people do NOT find it helpful. If you are one of those, it doesn't mean there's something wrong w/you. But I really would encourage you to give it a good, thorough trial before making that decision. Just like here at SR, everyone there has been or is currently in your shoes. For me, just the sense of acceptance lifted such a weight from my shoulders. Even if I didn't learn anything else there (which of course I did, I learned TONS), it would have been worth it just for that.

Trinity7777

Thank you, I'm definitely going to give Al-Anon a try! I do feel less anxiety about going knowing that I won't be on the spot having to stand up and tell my story or something. I also have a friend who is in a very similar relationship as me (all of us) who said she would love to attend a meeting with me.

I'm actually kind of excited to go. In some ways I feel like all of this has happened so that I would finally recognize and address what I realize have been lifelong issues with codependency and low self esteem.

Amusic

LyleW

My AW lies daily. When I see she has been drinking and confront her she flat out denies it. She says she can’t believe I am saying this when she tries so hard. She usually gets mad and goes to bed. Her defensiveness is always another giveaway. I usually regret starting the drama but somehow feel the liars should not win. In the past I have caught her red handed and even then she spins a web. I have come to see that lying is just a part of this disease. Now I am asking for advice. Should I stop pointing out the secret drinking every day? It seems that this is what alanon is teaching. Is that correct? Thanks.

trailmix

Hi Lyle and welcome.

She is lying because she doesn't want the confrontation, the argument, she just wants to drink. Pointing it out or not doesn't seem that it will make much difference really?

The message is that you didn't Cause it, can't Control it and can't Cure it (the 3 c's)

Are you already attending Al-Anon?

Have you tried actually sitting down with her and discussing her drinking, expressing the fact that you are concerned asking her if she is considering getting help?

When she says she is "trying so hard" to her mind this might be true. She may well be drinking but have some plan to cut down or put certain limits on it, for instance if she was having 8 drinks again she now promises herself she will only have 5. To an alcoholic that can be considered "really trying".

What conversations have you had with her so far, what does she have to say?