FireSprite

Meaning - part of their codependent behaviors mimic narcissism as a method of protecting their vulnerability?

I think true narcissism is actually very rare but that some of those behaviors can show up in all kinds of dysfunction. In observing someone's talk/actions this weekend I kept trying to figure out what it was that seemed out of place & I think this is it - it's the first time I'm interacting with someone who is possibly codependent but that reverts to bolder, more narc-type behavior to counteract feeling a lack of control. I feel like I've seen him display empathy, etc that would rule out full-blown narcissism. (& again, I do think that the Dx is thrown around loosely any time someone displays behaviors that fall under the Narcissism spectrum.)

All of the red flags seem to be pointing more toward codie issues than anything like addiction or ADHD or mental illness - efforts to control, poor boundaries, passive aggressive interactions, poor communication, unexpressed expectations, issue with self-image, taking everything personally & perfectionism, to name a few...

A male, more aggressive version of my old codependency? What a weird mirror........

It really reinforces my opinions that:
A - we're all broken somehow & the labels really don't matter except when they help us find the right help faster
B - I'm still not excited about the idea of dating, lol
C - Recovery ROCKS. I have never been able to so clearly set boundaries, send someone back to their own side of the street once they've been crossed & not spin circles taking all their red flags personally. I can & do walk away when that switch flips - boundary crossed? Gotta go....!
D - A relationship with an unrecovering codie seems just as difficult as one with an active addict - even just basic friendship.

Anyone ever run into something similar?

Mango212

I absolutely get what you mean. There are some narcissistic people in all walks of life. One of the people in my life with very strong narcissistic behaviors also has co-dependent behaviors.

Active addiction can also mimic narcissism. Considering that recovery is a journey, it may take time to be able to differentiate.

This resonates with me:

https://selfcarehaven.wordpress.com/

atalose

So very true!

Glenjo99

"Underneath all addiction is codependency"..quote from melody Beattie from her book codependent no more.

The guy I was seeing, had narcissistic qualities for sure and was hugely codependent. Not sure if he was full blown narcissist but had certain traits. So I would say yes in answer to your question, all on a continuum.

ShootingStar2

Believe the red flags. Which ever way they are blowing, they are a very important clue that he is not the healthy person you want to spend your time with.

ShootingStar2

FireSprite

They just seem like such conflicting "isms" that I wasn't even sure both could exist in the same person.

It's also insanely ironic to me that I get healthy in recovery as a codependent, can spot the addiction flags from miles away & one of my first "relationship tests" brings me face to face with a worse version of my former self.

I mean, c'mon.......

This is just a maybe - it's all very presumptuous of me, no doubt. I don't know this person well enough to say any of this with certainty, more will be revealed for sure. But it helps me to navigate my next steps to have this kind of awareness. Eyes wide open indeed, lol.

Glenjo99

So interesting to view others through the eyes of recovery. I'm early days over a couple of months, and already I can spot a codependent pretty quickly. I was approached by a guy who was using alcohol and drugs after about a month, had all the charm and good looks, but after he mentioned he liked to "use" at weekends, I never bothered him again. Despite his texts. Early days but I'm proud of myself for realizing I deserve better. Good luck with your next steps.

LifeRecovery

I know for me that the worst of my codependent behaviors were about filling the need to not have a lot of emotion in the room. I was outside myself trying to direct everyone else, but it was ALL about me feeling okay and managing me.

Though I never would have seen it that way in the middle of it it has a flavor of what you are talking about.....especially manipulation and anticipating that someone else owed me something or should be able to read my mind.

Also, I don't think this is what you were referring to, but just in case. I recently have come to realize how self-focused my recovery has been. I am not saying that to criticize myself and it was time well spent.

More what I mean was now that I have done the navel gazing that was needed; I have room for the outside world. It brings me great joy but I also have been experiencing sadness, anger and just how much the world needs me to be healthy, physically, mentally and energetically. I have room to be of true service in a way I could not have when I was in the thick of it. I have room to be externally focused instead of internal.

trailmix

That big gaping hole, vortex of the narcissists ego, what that actually translates to in terms of personality (or lack thereof) is complicated!

Maybe he is just mirroring someone else in his life. Whomever that may be, I hope you don't get to meet THEM!

hearthealth

Firesprite, I think your spot on about this. I know people, to varying degrees, who could be described in these two sentences.

FireSprite

I thought I could too - and I can, when they fit the "classic" stereotype. This is like a new flavor of dysfunction to me - a different mix than what *I've* personally run into before. Maybe it's far more common than I realize, but new to me & I find it fascinating from a psychological standpoint.


Yes - exactly. Most of the time, in my experience, we Codies go about this very passively, martyring ourselves when everyone else falls down on meeting our needs... we like to think we're being very plainspoken when in fact, we're just using a different, quieter brand of manipulation. We tend to draw inward so it's curious to me to see someone hit that same roadblock & manage it so differently (outward). It reminds me more so of addict behavior than codie but I KNOW better than that because dysfunction doesn't have these types of strict compartments or definitions. (and I see zero evidence of an addict otherwise)

Again - I'm making many assumptions here & just taking notes with my eyes open. I haven't spent the kind of time with this person that would even allow me to call this an educated guess - right now, it's a definite Judgment & I will wait for more to be revealed.....

FireSprite

So in interesting that you said this!



I read a bunch of stuff about this yesterday & from one to another to another link I ended up reading about Codie children of Narcissists mixing in this "mirroring" with more mainstream codie behaviors.

For example - the father is a narcissist & while the son isn't, he still picks up certain behaviors from the dad & mixes them in with more "traditional" codependent behaviors as a way of managing. OR (if I'm understanding my basic reading) he just becomes co-narcissist as a method of managing the narc parent, which to me, sounds like the same thing as addiction.... an addict parent produces a codie child & a Narc has their Co-Narc. Both are essentially codependent but there can be subtle differences.

http://www.alanrappoport.com/pdf/Co-...%20Article.pdf

Very, very interesting to learn about a new version of this.

aliciagr

Can a Codie also have Narcissistic Qualities?

YES. My codependent is a combination of many things: she will give until it hurts her, but does so to feed her own selfish needs created by that poor relationship she has with herself. She feels like the victim and seeks sympathy also feeding her needs. She takes what she can from others by using fear, obligation and guilt. All for her needs without thinking about how the other person is affected. Its all based on her path, her way, her needs, her vision for herself and others !