honeypig

LifeRecovery, I just put that Santorelli book on hold at my local library. It sounds wonderful; thanks for the mention of it.

FireSprite

Oh yes, I'm in no way anti-religion. My life experience is mine - it's not something everyone can relate to.

I know, it's sad when you realize that not everyone finds sanctuary in their religion.... it took me a long, long time to isolate this difference in myself. Most people find comfort in their church & religion & my experience was the opposite - my church judged & punished. It was never a "safe" place. The more I questioned, the more I targeted & separated myself.

I've been told many times that my mind works in different ways, lol. I think this is part of my ACoA survival skills - how to get over, under or around obstacles without drawing too much attention to myself. By the age of 14, this was getting increasingly difficult..... by then I'd started to really expand my reading & influences & I discovered rock & roll & hello, the rest is history.


A big part of my disconnect was due to my very large, extended Sicilian family having strong ties to "that" priest & "that" church & watching the duality of it play out. The preferential treatment, the do-as-I-say-not-as-I-do mentality, the hard praying people striving for absolution during Mass then nearly killing each other to get out of the parking lot first afterward. Using the Bible's teachings when it serves you & especially when you can use it to level judgment against others in ways you refuse to acknowledge in yourself.

I watched these people mentally & emotionally abuse my mother for 2 decades all the while clutching their rosaries to their chests in every dramatic fashion. When my father passed away, the church was complicit in helping them do things "their" way in direct opposition to the very wishes he himself had verbalized to the priest just weeks earlier. Their money/loyalty had higher value than his literal dying wishes.

If I hadn't been convinced by then, this would have sealed my opinion of what I'd been observing with my own eyes all those years.

LifeRecovery

I have to admit I have not read the whole thing. A number of years ago I took a Mindfullness Based Stress Reduction Course (MBSR) and this was read as one of the readings. It made me tearful in class and as I work in healthcare I went out and purchased the book right away.

For me I am just in a place that reading can start to be about recovery again; it waxes and wanes for me. I read a bunch of this when I got the book out to type it up and I enjoyed it very much.

Firesprite I also found that for me my wounding was tied into my religious upbringing plus a dose of alcoholism in generations removed. It made for rigidity, structure and a whole lot of untreated co-dependency which for me loosening has been what my recovery has been all about. For a while in therapy I was making statements where I used my religious upbringing as my feelings. This feels Catholic was said a lot when I was feeling stuck, guilty or full of shame. To be clear I see this as what my family did with the religion, less about the religion itself.

Finally I have finally gotten back into a meditation practice and am enjoying the series you have posted about. Thanks for always doing that.

firebolt

Oh FS - this stuff was an amazing rabbit hole for me - and in all honesty, I should have kept going deeper. Maybe at some other time, maybe I'm not ready this second, I dunno...but...

This book changed my life. And sent me on an inner child spiral through podcasts, research papers and on and on.

https://www.amazon.com/Conquering-Sh.../dp/1616495332

I ended up with this book because I needed to know how the hell I became Codie. I didn't grow up in an addicted family (that I knew of) and I needed to figure out when I went off the rails. It helped me sooo much with family dynamics, forgiveness and self talk. Finding my inner child and nurturing her, because it didn't happen the way I needed it to happen as a child.

That led me to the Codependency No More Podcasts. It was started by a man whos sister ended up with an addict and fought like hell to get out - and he wanted to know why. He interviews some really really brilliant experts, and a couple of the interviews are on this subject.

THose led me to researching codependency schemas - our specific individual'symptoms' of codependency, where they developed from, and how the hell to fix them. Psychologists in Europe do schema work A LOT, but they haven't done much here in the states with it - interesting, and I don't know why. If you get into this at all, enjoy, my friend!! Fascinating and helpful stuff!

FireSprite

Oh yes, I've been in the rabbit hole long enough now that I'm answering to "Alice".

Lol, but seriously....

You guys lead me to the BEST resources; thank you, thank you , thank you!!

I have both of these books on order now & in the meantime, I'm also making sure to take time to do my Positive Word Journal every day & I keep adding & updating my Vision Board that I started in January.

Reading some of my older posts reminded me:

https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...-solitude.html (Solitude)
When you practice self-love, you MASTER self-love."
~Don Miguel Ruiz

(here is more of the expanded thought behind that excerpt):
“All your life you tried to be good enough for somebody else, and you left yourself last. You sacrificed your personal freedom to live according to somebody else’s point of view. You tried to be good enough for your mother, your father, your teachers, your beloved, your children, your religion, and society. After trying for so many years, you try to be good enough for yourself, and you find out that you’re not good enough for yourself. Why not put yourself first, maybe for the first time in your life? You can relearn how to love yourself by accepting yourself, unconditionally. And you can start by projecting unconditional love to the authentic you.”
― Miguel Ruiz, The Fifth Agreement: A Practical Guide to Self-Mastery


Pathway's thread in another part of the forums led me into my youtube searching & I ran across a podcast with Bruce Lipton that I hadn't heard & while it was a bit of the same info as his book, I heard new stuff in there too:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqlG0ZOX6rU&t=11s

Goosebumps, I'm telling you. We have every ability to change everything around us 100%; we really do. I'm going to.


My mother stopped in for a very uncomfortable visit last night - because what would my life be without more FOO stuff added in right now?

We tried, but it's obvious we never quite measure up for her - I don't lead the conversation in ways that allow her to indulge her victimization, she can't focus on anything positive for more than a couple of sentences & she's consistently waiting for me to bring up the "right" topics - namely, all of her "isms" & procedures (none of which work) & my sister. All dead-end convos.

Every other statement is a passive aggressive dig that highlights how I am obviously not doing enough for her & don't care enough about all of her struggles..... which I spent years chasing before realizing it was a never ending void of my energy because I never created a difference & there was no end in sight.... the recovering Me realized those efforts needed to be spent on myself & then-very-young-DD instead. "It's a good day if I don't wake up cringing in pain..." (said half under her breath)

DD tried to engage but eventually just left the room. I thanked her later for trying & she had that big wide-eyed, wth? look on her face. "Why does she make everything so hard?", DD wanted to know.

My husband was in & out between yard work & other chores, which is very normal for him but irritated the heck out of her obviously. Of course, she's physically uncomfortable/in pain in every moment - whether sitting or standing, whatever, so it's hard to know the source of every grimace... lots of deep sighs, pain expressions, body language. Last time they saw each other was the embarrassing public fight we got into at my niece's graduation & she would rather die than apologize to him for her behavior - he "has it coming" in her mind (for reasons she doesn't even comprehend) so her own behavior gets a pass. Ironically, all he did that day was shock both of us by defending me to her & she was an out of control banshee.

I spoke to her after that ~once~ and when I called out how she gets obviously irritated at my positivity & disposition to see the glass as half-full, she admitted I was right. I know, I replied, because I can SEE when you roll your eyes and I'm standing right here. So, I asked, isn't it really ME that isn't being accepted here? That I am accepting all of you & all your pros & cons but the fact is none of you accept ME for who I AM - you all want me to change to fit your needs? How do you think that makes ME feel??"

.......crickets.....

Earlier this week I added a quote to my wall that says, "Stay away from people who make you feel you're hard to love" & last night that AHA moment hit.

My mother is the one that makes me feel very hard to love. That's a big part of the hurdle I have to overcome in this.

All this junk started bubbling fiercely again about a week ago & I was stream-of-conscious talking it through with my BFF on the phone which is how I was able to make the ACoA connections that brought me to posting about all of this. At the end of that very long & emotionally exhausting convo, a rainbow appeared in the middle of the passing storm & literally ended at the corner of my property. I was frozen in place & couldn't even gather my wits long enough to call DD over to see it. It lasted only moments because it was a fast-moving system with lots of rain in sections that gave way to giant holes of blue sky right behind.

The thing is - my father had one common quote that became ingrained in all of us over the course of his recovery from drugs & alcohol:

"It takes both sunshine & rain to make a rainbow"

It was like an exclamation point at the end of the conversation from my HP.... I'm going in the right direction, I'm positive.

I just have to remember to keep going.

Mango212

Last time I saw my mother was when she ambushed me at a park after several months of No Contact. She wanted to talk. I said "F-that" and walked away.

Best thing I've ever done for myself and DS.

Much more has been revealed since then. I'm continuing No Contact, healing, no regrets. If I ever walk away from a relationship that's meant to be, I trust it'll get worked out in the future. That for *** this day *** putting my healing first is more important than anything else.

Mango212

Fabulous rainbow quote & sign!

Keep your focus on signs like these and life gets more & more fun.

FireSprite

AKA - "what I should have done".... but I'm getting smarter about it.

I have been LC for about 2 yrs & that's part of what is driving her nuts, but again, her issue not mine.

I have only held off on NC because of DD but that is increasingly becoming unnecessary. My mother used to call DD's phone only when she wasn't getting me to respond to calls/texts on mine & I didn't want to put DD through that.

But now she just doesn't call DD at all. Muhammad refuses to go to the Mountain & prefers to pitch a hissy-fit waiting for It to come to Her.

Mind you - 2 yrs ago when I went LC I begged her to just stop focusing on whatever was "wrong" with us & just try to focus on bonding with DD in ways that could/would heal her. For all the amazeballs that my kiddo is, she has never gotten personal attention from my mother. She would babysit when asked (but not request), will ask DD to join them when she already has plans with my niece/nephew - but in no way tries to contact, talk to or connect with DD at all in any other way & never has. I've brought this up many times since DD was about 5 & even my sister agreed that this was a very f'd up dynamic.

I told my mom that there was a huge growth opportunity here for her - she could mend a lot by developing real relationships with the grandkids.

But no.

Mango212

Forward, ho!

You're seeing the issues and problems clearly. One day at a time.