OpheliaKatz

Thanks for this. It's a good article.

Women are NATURALLY BETTER at empathy.
The male brain is WIRED FOR SEX and the female brain is WIRED FOR CONNECTION.
Men are BIOLOGICALLY DRIVEN to procreate with many women rather than establish bonds with one monogamous partner.*

Gosh. I heard this line of reasoning so many times from my stbxAH.

biminiblue

Yeah, and if we keep reading that over and over we believe it.

I still say that even if we are biologically inclined toward something, it can be overcome with our HUGE human brains.

That, "I'm programmed that way," line of BS is just that - and if every woman would refuse that type of reasoning there would be change. If women continue to accept it, there won't be.

I have a male acquaintance who is going through a divorce. He is Filipino and his soon to be ex-wife is American. He told me he's going to go to the Philippines and find a new wife because women have too much power in this country. You know, instead of maybe learning to give and take, just go find a more subservient woman.

I know it's more complicated than that, but I'm coming at this from the position of not really wanting the type of men who are out there and who believe it's still 1955.

Clover71

It sounds like for now you want to dip your toe in the water and not wade into a cold pool. A friend with benefits maybe?



Lol @ Sasha

lizatola

Aeryn, I can relate. But, what I've found is that I had to stop looking at my relationship in terms of what I could get out of it. When I'm truly happy in my home is when I am giving or when I'm watching the family around me interact and am invited to interact with them.
My relationship with my bf is tough at times, but only because we both lack communication skills from both our FOO issues, etc. He's open to listen to me, most of the time, and I'm open to hearing his opinions. Neither one of us tries to fix the other. He lets me be, I let him be.

You won't lose you by being in a relationship with someone who doesn't try to take YOU away from you. My relationship compliments my life, it adds joy and vitality that just adds to what I already have.

It's not always easy and I've had a LOT of bumps along the road. And, admittedly I should have stayed single longer before I jumped into a long term commitment. My bf has often said that he doesn't need me in his life. He wants me in his life. I used to think I should only be with someone if they needed me because I had such an inflated desire to be 'needed' because that was what made me feel of value in a relationship. I had to let that go and I'm glad I have because we love each other just because.

You may be in a place where a relationship isn't right for you. 2 jobs, raising a little one, etc can be enough to fill your cup without another relationship to have to make room for....and that's OK too.
I think you're on to something and if you are OK being single and not wanting to be in a relationship, I think that's awesome! You're an inspiration honestly.

lizatola

I'm so glad I don't believe that BS because my XAH had me convinced that all men were like this. My XAH used to believe in gender roles and his entitlement to sex and I felt like my body was just an extension of 'his possessions'. I remember him telling me that he didn't want me to work outside the house because I'd probably meet someone, fall in love, and leave him. UGH

I don't feel that way with my current partner. His level of respect and how he values what women bring to our world, is refreshing.

Aeryn

I sound like a guy but yes perhaps something really really casual but just dating the one.....the guy with no time is the one I liked the best of the lot. lolol A friend of mine only sees her BF every other weekend because they are so busy....doesn't sound half bad.

I just have a lot I've earned on my own and honestly don't want to share it....I sound selfish but that's how I feel. This is *my* house I put everything I had into it....not going to share except with little E.

Aeryn

BTW for me the point of emotional labor isn't who is or isn't doing it...it's the toll it takes on a partner (be it a man or woman) if they are carrying all of that burden in a relationship...it's exhausting. My XRAH never had sexist attitudes but I still carried the burden of the emotional labor because he was too lazy and irresponsible. I frankly don't want to keep track of holidays birthdays needs etc for someone else...and as for empathy I'm a crappy codie because it's not one of my strong suits...I used to be great at it...not so much any more....maybe a side effect of being with an A?

But I do agree the gender roles our society has created are really awful. I'm sorry but I work full time, own my own home (that I paid for myself), did improvements on my own home, and do all the finances...those gender roles don't apply to me so that eliminates a large portion of the dating pool as well...I tend to get guys that are threatened by my success OR worse guys who want to piggyback off of it (ie live in MY home...no no no no no)...finding a true equal is going to be difficult.

Aeryn

Ok the pineapple express gave me a great laugh! lol...I swear some of these available guys!

I still can't get over the gy that wanted to move into my home...he told me he could help with the baby....UMMMMM....NO. He has his own 14 yo that lives with his ex...how in the hell could he help me with a baby. Then he told me his hotel manager job is temporary because he plans to be a famous DJ (this is probably the real reason he wants to move in my home I have a good location for that kind of thing). We can't make this stuff up.

lmao

Though I disagree the good ones get taken early...in my experience the ones that married early tend to be the less successful ones in life and most likely to be divorced. The older good ones...well they aren't looking in my experience. I mentioned I had a guy friend on the dating site with me....he's not really looking...sort of the same attitude as me...he doesn't want to lose what he's earned (I'm going to sound jaded but both of us view marriage as a financial contract...and we don't want a part of that - now he could be up for a long term without marriage he's said he's open to that but absolutely no to marriage). There are good men out there but in my experience they don't want to re-marry...they are fine single and while they don't mind companions they aren't really looking (if you read my first post I mention an older man that falls in that category)....I'm not saying they want to party either they just don't want the emotional/financial burden of marriage...so maybe they are casual BF material but they aren't looking so how to find them...who knows? So I guess after I said all that maybe you're right...if you're looking long term the good ones may not be out there or available.

lizatola

My bf said exactly what you said when we first started dating and neither one of us was looking to cohabit with anyone either. And, technically, we both would be fine on our own, as well. He has said that if I leave him (guess he has no plans on leaving me, lol?) he would just date casually and look for a companion to have sex with, dinner with, occasional concerts, etc. He said he'd want to focus on getting his kids through college and just enjoying the fruits of his labor. And, I get it.

I have the same view as you about marriage in our country today. It's a legal/financial contract. I sometimes think I want to get married for different reasons but I remember what I went through in my divorce and how it all came down to assets, liabilities, and money. A division of property so, in my mind, I see marriage as a combining of property and, like you, I don't want to share. Call me protective, fearful, selfish, whatever......I have a decent amount put away for retirement and I'm not going to give it to anyone but my own child.......no matter how much I love that person today.

As for scary dating stories.....a program friend of mine who is a VP at a large company here in town and quite financially stable was propositioned by a guy on a dating website. After a few good back and forth texts, he finally reveals he's living in his car!!!!
Ummm, dude....you got big problems if you're mid-40s and living in your car! She's had the craziest stories from trying to date in her 40s that I've ever heard. Most of the guys I've run into just aren't emotionally available or just don't want commitment or have other priorities. I honestly don't have any horror stories from dating myself.

Clover71

It's not selfish. But I would also be cautious in throwing the baby out with the bath water. It's strange for a guy to want to move in with you like how you described. One red flag doesn't equate to a war on men. Lol

OpheliaKatz

Yeah this is how it went when it came out of my stbxAH's mouth: "I hate domestic violence, I hate gender roles because I'm not a big guy, I'm not an alpha male. I'm totally a safe guy but women all like the alphas. I also hate domestic violence cause it's sexist that people tell men not to be violent because it takes two -- the women are nags and they instigate arguments, so it's not just the men who are to blame. I mean, if you were nagged all the time, you would want to choke someone too. In fact, I'm often victimized by women -- you have NO idea how painful the sound of a woman screaming is! It hurts me. So I am not sexist AT ALL, I mean, hey women always choose the alphas over me... and also it's cause biologically these big guys have something to offer that I don't... like money. I'm not sexist, so I am totally content to let a woman support me, in fact I support the idea of her supporting me. In fact, those women who choose alphas are going to get what's coming to them cause men naturally want to spread their seed around -- especially those men. You had better not go out too often, you don't know if an alpha male is going to try to take you away from me. And if you're hanging around the alphas -- like that hairdresser, he seems alpha -- you won't want to sleep with me... and if you don't sleep with me enough, I have to tell you that because I'm male, I'm going to want to sleep with other women... but if that's what YOU want, I'm okay with that because I respect you, I'm a feminist man. I'm glad you are not insecure and shallow like those other women who date alphas, who wear lots of make up and pony tails and high heels and skinny pants... and probably have no education. I found you because you have more sense, you're generous, you're kind, you're responsible. You're like my mother. You are not selfish, you take care of people. And it's so nice to have a woman around, especially a caring woman. It's nice to listen to the gentle chirping of a female voice in the background... instead of the angry male voice inside my head.... But sometimes, I'm going to leave the house and come home dirty... because even though I'm not an alpha male, I'm still male and being wild is something I think men do... etc."

I'm just paraphrasing. It's not like he said all that at once. It was like those words were a gentle drip from a leaky faucet over time. I now understand that this type of talk is often called two things 1) bloviating 2) grooming.

So yeah... now when a guy walks up to me and says, "#metoo, I'm an ally!" I'm immediately suspicious and then I look deeply into his eyes for signs of a hang-over.

OpheliaKatz

Seriously, if you want a good dud detector, ask them for the name of their favorite 1) movie, 2) super hero 3), book, 4) song, 5) and what they would want for their last meal if they were going to the chair.

If 1) if "Pineapple Express" and 2) is "James Bond" (and I mean Bond before Craig), you have a problem.

OpheliaKatz

This was online dating right? Sorry, memory sucks. Menopause.

I think sometimes online dating is like going to a sushi train. Some of that fish has been sitting there for a while.

OpheliaKatz

IS Pineapple Express, not "if". Arthritis.

Aeryn

Oh this guy was my high school sweetheart so we didn't meet online he just reconnected with me that way...I think that's why he felt the gumption to ask. Let's just say I did well after high school while it seems he did not LOL.

Oh this is not the only red flag for sure......tons and tons and tons of them...all over....my BFF has a horror story from online dating that I shall never repeat it is so awful.

Sasha1972

The worst/best online dating story I ever heard came from a (female) friend who met someone for coffee, they seemed to be getting along fine, and after a couple of hours when it was time to go, internet dude said, "You seem really nice, and don't take this the wrong way, but I'd rather f*** my ex-wife than you". Fortunately my friend is pretty quick off the mark and she responded "Great, we agree - I'd prefer it if you f***ed your ex-wife instead of me, too".

Who says romance is dead?