2kind4me

Hello. I’m a newbie and have been reading a lot - so much so that I’m more confused about something. My ABF is theoretically sober for about 3 weeks. We don’t live together and I’m trying to find the right boundaries. Do ask if he’s still sober, went to meetings or therapy etc ? It seems like withholding my concerns is not honest but I don’t want to be a “provoker” or whatever. I can’t just carry on like I assume it’s all good ...
ok that’s it. Thanks

Bekindalways

This is a really good question. Most folks around here say to give it a year. I also feel like it really is their side of the street so best if you leave him to it.

When I left my qualifier he swore up and down that he was done and going to get better all by himself. His confidence in his own ability was kinda a deal breaker for me. I didn't say but felt, "Dude this is so much bigger than you and your puny abilities."

What are you doing for yourself? What would make the relationship truly good for you?

More will undoubtedly be revealed both in his sobriety and what you want for yourself.

Maudcat

My feeling is that it’s the other person’s recovery, and it’s best if I just stay out of the way of it and work on myself.
As in, think about and refine the plan going forward, whether you are together or not.
Peace.

trailmix

Do you have a boundary about him being sober? Is this something you expressed to him or have you just decided this for yourself?

2kind4me

I have definitely expressed that he must be sober. He is well aware. However I have a very hard time knowing because he drinks a little all the time. But yes, I believe it will be revealed.

Eauchiche

Dear 2kind
GOOD for you that you don't live together!
If you read these boards much, you will see that many who post here are trying to escape a very bad home environment with their addict.
Him "drinking a little" is probably a very big red flag, to be honest. It never stays "a little" with alcoholism, which is a progressive disease.
Keep coming back!

Bekindalways

Pardon if you have said this already but is he going to AA or doing this on his own?

2kind4me

He’s supposed to be going to AA and a therapist. We had bad weather this week but I haven’t heard mention of either in the last week. I’m dying to nag but realize it’s on him and I can’t control that.

biminiblue

I would say nothing about his recovery.

I am an alcoholic with 22 years total sobriety without AA, so it's not like that is the magic bullet. Lots of people "in" AA still drink - so don't use that as a yardstick. I could go to a meeting and drink an hour later. There is no one watching if I don't want them to watch.

Thing is, people in and out of meetings and therapy drink. Once a person becomes addicted it is a daily discipline to not use.

If you can come up with a boundary that protects you, so be it. If you can't, move on. If he has had problems with alcohol there will always be a chance of really bad things happening if he drinks AT ALL. Even one.

2kind4me

If I can come up w a boundary that protects me, if not move on... what you are saying is exactly the thing. I know for sure that the meetings offer a false sense of security. And you hit the nail on the head in that I want to protect myself. Period. I really don’t think I can. He’s way too good at hiding it so I have to accept that I’ll never really know....

biminiblue

Therein lies the rub.

It's hard, no doubt about it.

aliciagr

I was very confused about this subject also, and in part I think it was because there are basically a lot of differing views, but remember people and relationships are all different too. You might want to search online under "alcohol use disorder, substance use disorder. There are usually parts in there for family/friends who have concerns and want to be supportive, AND it will help show the complexities involved. Lots of things that we see like lying, sneaking, denial, refusal to see the negative consequences - much of that is caused by changes in the brain due to addiction. They are basically symptoms.

Personally I didn't do anything different in regards to talking to my husband. But it can be a sensitive subject sort of like talking to someone who has a lot of weight to lose. Wanting to be supportive but not wanting to make the person feel uncomfortable.

Bekindalways

2kind4me, your situation is a bit different in that you can't tell if he is drinking. This could of course change over time and his drinking becomes obvious. I never thought there was an upside to the folks who's Qualifiers pass out in a puddle of bodily fluids but at least they know what is going on.

Ugh. I do see your dilemma. Even if he is working a program and doing well on his recovery if he slips and starts drinking again years from now, you won't know and you can't really expect him to come clean with you.

trailmix

Really you need to accept him just as he is. He may well be drinking, he might not be, regardless you either accept that or you don't.

Sounds like you have a communication problem and little to no trust with him. Is that ok with you? If not maybe that's something you want to look at.

If you want to know if he is drinking I say ask him. Why is that some kind of taboo subject? You mention you really want to nag him (about meetings etc), that really is not a good idea and is overstepping what should be another boundary, whether he drinks or not is his decision, he knows your stance on it, saying it 20 times won't change that.

tomsteve

im not that smart, but it seems dieing to "nag' could be wanting to hear,"yes, i have been drinking" more than,"no, i havent."

Ladybird579

I never ask my exah if he has been drinking. He doesn't live with me so I don't care. However even when he did he hid the extent of it despite being home 24/7 all our marriage. It sounds to me you don't trust him and that's OK. Why should you? Alcoholics lie..regardless of if lying is a symptom of their addiction ( and am not convinced on that theory but that's a whole different thread) it doesn't make it any easier to bear. If he keeps topped up with little and often drinks it's hard to work out but little and often soon becomes lots all the time.

Regardless 3 weeks is very early days. He could be working a programme or he could be drinking. Only he knows. Can you live with the uncertainty for a very long time?

2kind4me

Just saw this. And you are smart and insightful and I think you’re right. I don’t know why though. It almost feels like I’ll feel relieved when the bubble is burst... I tell myself I won’t stay w him if he relapses. Maybe I just want the tension over ... not sure. But thank you for saying that. And don’t say you’re no smart. Lol

honeypig

2kind, this was EXACTLY my situation. Every once in a while he'd overshoot and actually be noticeably drunk, but most of the time the signs were so subtle that if I noticed anything at all, I was never sure if I was imagining it or not. And of course, if asked, he would deny it.

He also secretly smoked cigarettes for the entire time we were married--we both smoked when we met, then soon after we married, he suggested we quit b/c some friends of ours were quitting. I actually DID quit, but he just pretended. I'd catch him once every few years, when he left a pack on the table or something, and there would be a fight. He'd swear he was really quitting this time, and things would go underground for another few years.

He was an amazing hider. He pretended to go to AA meetings every Sunday at 10 AM for 4 years--FOUR YEARS! In reality, he'd just drive into town and sit at a park or peruse the hobby shop. He was always careful, however, to not actually BUY anything during the time he was supposed to be at the meeting, b/c credit card slips have the date and time of the transaction printed on them, and he was concerned that I might look at that and know that he couldn't have been at his AA meeting when he said he was. Can you believe that? I would never in a million years have thought to check the dates/times...I was outclassed in the Sneaky Olympics right from the get-go, and I knew it.

I feel for you, b/c yes, this does add another whole layer to the mess--as another member posted, if our A's were passing out nightly, we'd KNOW, and maybe it would be a little easier to get on with things. But the doubt and the guilt on my part, the seemingly heartfelt denials on his part, certainly made it more difficult to see the right action for me to take.

For me, the end came when he came downstairs from his "airplane modeling room/drinking lair" one afternoon and confessed that he'd never had more than a few days at a time of sobriety over the past few years, when he had been supposedly sober and in fact chaired his local AA meeting for a year. He said "I've never once even asked for help when I wanted to drink, never made a phone call to my sponsor or any other AA friends--I just drank."

At this point, we were legally separated already, so all that remained was to convert that to a divorce. We did that, he moved out several months later, and so far as I know, he is drinking still.

honeypig

Wanted to add one thing to my post above, regarding the hiding of the smoking--I did NOT insist that he quit, only asked that he be open about the fact that he smoked instead of telling me he didn't. This was my initial stance on the drinking, too--"why don't you just drink openly? It's not like I don't have a beer, a glass of wine, a mixed drink, on a Saturday afternoon/evening myself." So it's not like he felt he had to hide b/c I demanded that he quit and he didn't want to. He hid for reasons that only he knows, to this day.

OpheliaKatz

Hi, I don't know how long you have been with your boyfriend, but you don't live together... so... I wouldn't try to "keep tabs" on his drinking. I guess because it's really his choice if he drinks or not, and also, there is a chance he will lie about it anyway.

The only thing you can do in this situation is to ask yourself what you want from a relationship. Recovery for addicts is life-long. They have to spend every waking minute of their lives consciously not choosing to use their DOC. He's not just a person who drinks excessively and then one day decides he has had too much partying, he is someone who is addicted. You may never know if he's sober or not. My stbxAH was an expert liar. So what are your boundaries?