And so it begins ...
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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Wheelsup....Oh, I think he has noticed your distance...and, I think he knows why....
I think that if you could see inside of his head...you would see a "war" going on in there....
He is a practicing alcoholic....the thing that scares an alcoholic more than anything else, is the idea of giving up the thing that allows them to function...It is like asking a fish to give up water, or you to give up oxygen...they can't imagine living without it....
He is probably fighting that alcoholic voice that whispers to him 24/7.....that tells him to keep drinking....
The more he worries about it...the more the voice tells him to drink.....
When faced with life's difficulties...most non addicted people will think to try to deal with it...the alcoholic thinks..."I will have a drink and I will feel better".....
A question---If he does say that he notices you behavior changes....what do you think that will mean? What do you anticipate will happen...?
I think that if you could see inside of his head...you would see a "war" going on in there....
He is a practicing alcoholic....the thing that scares an alcoholic more than anything else, is the idea of giving up the thing that allows them to function...It is like asking a fish to give up water, or you to give up oxygen...they can't imagine living without it....
He is probably fighting that alcoholic voice that whispers to him 24/7.....that tells him to keep drinking....
The more he worries about it...the more the voice tells him to drink.....
When faced with life's difficulties...most non addicted people will think to try to deal with it...the alcoholic thinks..."I will have a drink and I will feel better".....
A question---If he does say that he notices you behavior changes....what do you think that will mean? What do you anticipate will happen...?
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Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 497
Originally Posted by Wheelsup 
Hello everyone. Just checking in on this journey somewhere (still figuring out where).
I find myself going back and forth between - "Am I crazy?" and "This is the right thing to do." I keep having to remind myself this is the right thing to do.
My husband appears to not be drinking, or didn't appear to this weekend. I've been avoiding him as much as possible -and he's noticed - so (as a friend of mine put it) he is on his best behavior. The weird thing is ... he hasn't asked about my behavior at all. Just given me grumpy looks or said some snotty comments. That's it. It makes me think that he's afraid of what I know - and I wonder if there isn't another affair there somewhere. Wouldn't surprise me.
Anyhow ... that's all to report for now.
I find myself going back and forth between - "Am I crazy?" and "This is the right thing to do." I keep having to remind myself this is the right thing to do.
My husband appears to not be drinking, or didn't appear to this weekend. I've been avoiding him as much as possible -and he's noticed - so (as a friend of mine put it) he is on his best behavior. The weird thing is ... he hasn't asked about my behavior at all. Just given me grumpy looks or said some snotty comments. That's it. It makes me think that he's afraid of what I know - and I wonder if there isn't another affair there somewhere. Wouldn't surprise me.
Anyhow ... that's all to report for now.
Mine doesn't ask, and I don't discuss it anymore. We live parallel lives basically - talk about the kids and work and not much more. I see him glance over at me from time to time in the evenings and sometimes it seems like a nasty look. If only I knew what he was thinking. Maybe I don't want to know. I'm probabky in no position to say, but it sounds to me like you are doing well. Take care of the kids AND yourself.
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,618
Originally Posted by Wheelsup
I should say the one thing I struggle with is the feeling I am ruining my children's lives. My addiction therapist says that the kids often end up mad at the sober parent because they didn't do anything to help the addicted one. Essentially, I am damned if I do and damned if I don't.
My alcoholic ex is himself a child of alcoholics - and because I've known him since early teenage years, I got a ringside seat for the dysfunction and craziness that results when no one is acknowledging, let alone addressing, the rampant abuse of alcohol and the lies, deception, blaming, and emotional extremes that go along with it. Ex is now an alcoholic himself and is turning into his mother in an absolutely creepy way.
Would things have come out differently - would he have been able to remake himself - if his parents had separated and his father, who was marginally saner than his mother, had taken him and his siblings? I don't know, but I have seen firsthand how alcoholic thinking and behavior gets passed down the generations, and that experience was a powerful motivator for me to end the marriage and create a single-parent home for Kid that wasn't driven by alcohol.
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,618
Originally Posted by Wheelsup
Sasha - I know.
It has been one of the strangest things ... to be waiting for him to ask about why I'm so distant and barely communicating. He says absolutely nothing at all. I got one question - once in early November - that was basically "are we okay?" He asked after having six beers when we went out to dinner with another couple (and I was driving home).
I said: "I don't like how much you are drinking." He said: "I can tell." And, when we got home, he had another 9 beers. And ... that was the only time he asked since I've changed my behavior toward him. Hence, I am quite suspicious.
(
It has been one of the strangest things ... to be waiting for him to ask about why I'm so distant and barely communicating. He says absolutely nothing at all. I got one question - once in early November - that was basically "are we okay?" He asked after having six beers when we went out to dinner with another couple (and I was driving home).
I said: "I don't like how much you are drinking." He said: "I can tell." And, when we got home, he had another 9 beers. And ... that was the only time he asked since I've changed my behavior toward him. Hence, I am quite suspicious.
(
Sasha: This is hard to say, but I'm really worried about how much you're drinking.
Ex: I know I'm drinking too much and I don't care how you feel about it.
Then we went out to lunch with my visiting parents and ex ordered a bottle of wine (with my parents, who are of the school that says any alcohol before sundown is a sign of weakness). Then we went home and he drank another bottle of wine all by himself.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 70
Happy New Year Everyone!
I am moving forward (albeit slowly) in this process. With the New Year rolling in, I definitely plan to 'resolve' things as much as I can this year so my life - and my children's lives - are a bit more peaceful - and alcohol-free.
With that said ...
A question.
What types of things did you do for yourself to recover from being married to an alcoholic and/or the co-dependency that goes along with it?
I've already given up drinking myself completely, as I had been drinking far too much myself and had been using it to 'self-medicate' instead of dealing with issues. I am also seeing an addiction therapist to deal with I need to deal with and to learn more about my husband's issues. I've hired a lawyer to start all of that stuff as well.
But, I am curious if there is more? I want to work on my health, as that has fallen by the wayside. Is there other things you've done?
I am moving forward (albeit slowly) in this process. With the New Year rolling in, I definitely plan to 'resolve' things as much as I can this year so my life - and my children's lives - are a bit more peaceful - and alcohol-free.
With that said ...
A question.
What types of things did you do for yourself to recover from being married to an alcoholic and/or the co-dependency that goes along with it?
I've already given up drinking myself completely, as I had been drinking far too much myself and had been using it to 'self-medicate' instead of dealing with issues. I am also seeing an addiction therapist to deal with I need to deal with and to learn more about my husband's issues. I've hired a lawyer to start all of that stuff as well.
But, I am curious if there is more? I want to work on my health, as that has fallen by the wayside. Is there other things you've done?
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
Alanon is always an excellent source of support and healing.
Coda meetings, harder to find.
Celebrate Recovery.
Therapy.
Reading the book Codependent No More - there is a companion workbook as well.
Coda meetings, harder to find.
Celebrate Recovery.
Therapy.
Reading the book Codependent No More - there is a companion workbook as well.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
You can get a lot of great ideas from our library of excellent articles...in addition to the above recommendations, of course...
I am giving you a link to those articles...there are dozens and dozens of them....I hope you will take the time to read through them.....
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...c-reading.html (Classic Reading)
I am giving you a link to those articles...there are dozens and dozens of them....I hope you will take the time to read through them.....
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...c-reading.html (Classic Reading)
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Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Wareham, Mass
Posts: 7,067
Been following your thread, Wheelsup.
Sounds like you are doing the very best you can.
And that is more than enough.
About the kids.
Teenagers especially just want things to be “normal” at home.
So, as your son did, they minimize the problem.
What your spouse and sil did was wrong on a million different levels.
To me, it just demonstrates the bone deep selfishness of the addict.
“Oh boy. Airport bar. I am so there.”
“Wait. What about driving? I know. Kid can drive.”
Yikes.
And yeah, they can be-conflicted, and life isn’t always peachy.
But..I am an ACOA.
I made some crappy decisions when I was younger.
Not to get all blame-y, but i know some of my thinking was the result of having a drinking, distant, angry parent.
Keep doing what you are doing.
It will all come right in the end.
I have never heard anyone on this site say, “I wish I had stayed with my alcohol addicted partner. “
Sounds like you are doing the very best you can.
And that is more than enough.
About the kids.
Teenagers especially just want things to be “normal” at home.
So, as your son did, they minimize the problem.
What your spouse and sil did was wrong on a million different levels.
To me, it just demonstrates the bone deep selfishness of the addict.
“Oh boy. Airport bar. I am so there.”
“Wait. What about driving? I know. Kid can drive.”
Yikes.
And yeah, they can be-conflicted, and life isn’t always peachy.
But..I am an ACOA.
I made some crappy decisions when I was younger.
Not to get all blame-y, but i know some of my thinking was the result of having a drinking, distant, angry parent.
Keep doing what you are doing.
It will all come right in the end.
I have never heard anyone on this site say, “I wish I had stayed with my alcohol addicted partner. “
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 70
I just dropped my older two off at New Year's Eve parties. (My husband had gone out earlier to 'pick things up at the grocery store' and clearly stopped at a bar for a few drinks.) Interestingly, I had not seen him drink any alcohol all evening, but I know he's had some already so I didn't him driving.
Anyhow, I was driving home -- and my husband passed me driving quickly! I guess he ran out to pick up a few more drinks and didn't want me knowing.
I just laughed. Can't believe this is my life.
Happy New Year.
Anyhow, I was driving home -- and my husband passed me driving quickly! I guess he ran out to pick up a few more drinks and didn't want me knowing.
I just laughed. Can't believe this is my life.
Happy New Year.
Sober since 10th April 2012
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 6,047
Originally Posted by Wheelsup
Interestingly, I had not seen him drink any alcohol all evening, but I know he's had some already so I didn't him driving.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Oh gosh yes!
To care of myself I learned some meditation to help me concentrate and relax. I make sure I actually schedule outings w/friends and family. I have animals I love, they really help.
Just anything that makes you feel good about YOU!
To care of myself I learned some meditation to help me concentrate and relax. I make sure I actually schedule outings w/friends and family. I have animals I love, they really help.
Just anything that makes you feel good about YOU!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 70
So, I am struggling a lot emotionally with all of this and with basically realizing that I've done a good job denying everything that I'm really feel. Now, I'm feeling all of that and, ugh, it is really, really hard. 
Right now, I'm just angry all the time. Why do I have to do all the hard work here? How can he even think that I am remotely okay given all the crap he's put me through? What the hell was wrong with me that I just sorta went along to go along? How can expect me to ever trust him? All he does is lie to me about big things and little things and every damn thing in between. He can't even be honest with himself. And, geez. Just get a damn job because there's no way in hell I'm okay with him not working.
And, I'm tired. Just so tired of all of it.
I'm re-reading this and goodness I'm having a pity party for myself, huh? I go see the therapist next week so that's a good thing. Whew.
Right now, I'm just angry all the time. Why do I have to do all the hard work here? How can he even think that I am remotely okay given all the crap he's put me through? What the hell was wrong with me that I just sorta went along to go along? How can expect me to ever trust him? All he does is lie to me about big things and little things and every damn thing in between. He can't even be honest with himself. And, geez. Just get a damn job because there's no way in hell I'm okay with him not working.
And, I'm tired. Just so tired of all of it.
I'm re-reading this and goodness I'm having a pity party for myself, huh? I go see the therapist next week so that's a good thing. Whew.
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Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 415
It is okay to have a pity party now (and again and there is no better place to have it than this site); as long as you pull yourself out of it.
I too went through the anger and betrayal and the unfairness of all of this; and I will most likely have that anger again.
But I am now more focused on moving forward with my life and accepting that my (recovering) AH is going to do what he is going to do. I am still angry at myself for letting myself get in this position.
I just keep my eye on MY future and what I want that to look like, no matter what AH is or isn’t doing. What he does still impacts and hurts me but I just keep telling myself that I have no control over his actions just as he has no control over mine.
You are doing great and hugs to you.
I too went through the anger and betrayal and the unfairness of all of this; and I will most likely have that anger again.
But I am now more focused on moving forward with my life and accepting that my (recovering) AH is going to do what he is going to do. I am still angry at myself for letting myself get in this position.
I just keep my eye on MY future and what I want that to look like, no matter what AH is or isn’t doing. What he does still impacts and hurts me but I just keep telling myself that I have no control over his actions just as he has no control over mine.
You are doing great and hugs to you.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 70
My husband gave up drinking for the New Year! That lasted a day, I think? Yesterday he disappeared all afternoon at a 'work-lunch.' And, I swear, he came home and looked like he'd been drinking. I was certain of it, but not really, you know?
Then, he disappeared into the basement with an empty glass and came back with it full. I KNEW it was vodka. There's no reason to go downstairs for water. But I have zero idea where the vodka was hidden. So, this morning I was trying to figure it out. The bottle of what I thought was super old tonic water in our downstairs fridge - is vodka and tonic. Silly me for thinking there'd just be a vodka bottle somewhere.
It is the lying that is so terrible; I realized that that is what is really is the deal-breaking for me. The affairs were all about lying; the alcohol addiction is all about lying. Just lies everywhere. A marriage sucks when can't trust the one person you are supposed to trust - your spouse.
I had been feeling really guilty this week; guilty about wanting to separate and re-thinking my decision. I may delay a week or two to let my feelings on that peter out a bit more ... but I realized that I am not wrong. I guess I don't know how much more I really need before I have enough gumption to officially pull the trigger ... but I know I'm not wrong. I just don't want to upend everything.
Sigh.
I am doing okay now though. I wanted to thank everyone for being supportive. The last couple weeks/months have been rough emotionally as I've started to sort my emotions out. This roller coaster ride is no fun - but I determined not to keep hiding from it all.
Now, I'm going to do my best today to not think about all this stuff and instead focus on my kids, some work things, and a class I'm taking that will bolster my skills.
Then, he disappeared into the basement with an empty glass and came back with it full. I KNEW it was vodka. There's no reason to go downstairs for water. But I have zero idea where the vodka was hidden. So, this morning I was trying to figure it out. The bottle of what I thought was super old tonic water in our downstairs fridge - is vodka and tonic. Silly me for thinking there'd just be a vodka bottle somewhere.
It is the lying that is so terrible; I realized that that is what is really is the deal-breaking for me. The affairs were all about lying; the alcohol addiction is all about lying. Just lies everywhere. A marriage sucks when can't trust the one person you are supposed to trust - your spouse.
I had been feeling really guilty this week; guilty about wanting to separate and re-thinking my decision. I may delay a week or two to let my feelings on that peter out a bit more ... but I realized that I am not wrong. I guess I don't know how much more I really need before I have enough gumption to officially pull the trigger ... but I know I'm not wrong. I just don't want to upend everything.
Sigh.
I am doing okay now though. I wanted to thank everyone for being supportive. The last couple weeks/months have been rough emotionally as I've started to sort my emotions out. This roller coaster ride is no fun - but I determined not to keep hiding from it all.
Now, I'm going to do my best today to not think about all this stuff and instead focus on my kids, some work things, and a class I'm taking that will bolster my skills.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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Wheelsup...I agree with you, that your energy is better spent where it will do some good...on you and the kids....
It is unrealistic to expect a practicing alcoholic not to lie. It is a part of the disease and is closely tied to denial....Alcoholism has often been called the disease of denial. Sleuthing around after him and getting offended by nhis lies is just spinning your wheels.....Like a car that is stuck in a ditch and just keeps spinning the tires...until the rubber is worn off and they are smoking.....
I highly suggest that you read the following article...."Addiction, Lies, and Relationships"....by Floyd P. Garrett, M.D. (psychiatrist). It is on the following website....
www.psychiatryandwellness.com
Alcoholics are not lying to you....deliberately and calculatedly....they are just doing what alcoholics do....It is not personal or deliberately intended to hurt you (although it DOES)........
I recall the story of the two women who were sitting on a bench on the park. Above them, was an electric wire, where the birds often sat. The birds discharged poo...which landed on the ladies....The ladies were so irate that the birds were doing that. "Those awful birds", they said.
From the birds' point of view....they had no animosity toward the l adies, at all...
They were just doing what birds do......and, they were never, ever going to change. The only thing the ladies could do was to move from under the birds...
It is unrealistic to expect a practicing alcoholic not to lie. It is a part of the disease and is closely tied to denial....Alcoholism has often been called the disease of denial. Sleuthing around after him and getting offended by nhis lies is just spinning your wheels.....Like a car that is stuck in a ditch and just keeps spinning the tires...until the rubber is worn off and they are smoking.....
I highly suggest that you read the following article...."Addiction, Lies, and Relationships"....by Floyd P. Garrett, M.D. (psychiatrist). It is on the following website....
www.psychiatryandwellness.com
Alcoholics are not lying to you....deliberately and calculatedly....they are just doing what alcoholics do....It is not personal or deliberately intended to hurt you (although it DOES)........
I recall the story of the two women who were sitting on a bench on the park. Above them, was an electric wire, where the birds often sat. The birds discharged poo...which landed on the ladies....The ladies were so irate that the birds were doing that. "Those awful birds", they said.
From the birds' point of view....they had no animosity toward the l adies, at all...
They were just doing what birds do......and, they were never, ever going to change. The only thing the ladies could do was to move from under the birds...
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,618
You know you're not wrong, and that is important.
As for your husband seeming to get off lightly while you do all the heavy lifting of a separation, I don't think there is such a thing as a happy or contented alcoholic. With my ex, I sometimes took comfort in the thought (which is not a very nice thought) that as miserable as I was, he was probably more miserable. I could see a way out - because I was not an active addict and therefore could (sometimes) see things clearly - but he couldn't or wouldn't see anything beyond the next bottle. I had the capacity for a better life, he didn't.
As for your husband seeming to get off lightly while you do all the heavy lifting of a separation, I don't think there is such a thing as a happy or contented alcoholic. With my ex, I sometimes took comfort in the thought (which is not a very nice thought) that as miserable as I was, he was probably more miserable. I could see a way out - because I was not an active addict and therefore could (sometimes) see things clearly - but he couldn't or wouldn't see anything beyond the next bottle. I had the capacity for a better life, he didn't.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 70
Howdy everyone. Its been a bit so an update. I told my husband I wanted to separate about a week ago - which is what is required in our state. And ... nothing really changed?
I'm a bit flabbergasted to be honest. I haven't pushed it because he did make an appointment with an addiction therapist - and went yesterday. I guess I expected to hear something about it and was really really hoping (more than I want to admit) that I'd see or hear something positive. I didn't want to be 'harder' because I really want him to go and get help.
The exact opposite happened. I started to realize two days ago that he thinks he's just going to stop drinking and keep going about his business and things will just get better. I think? I don't know. Buts its utterly ridiculous. Your wife tells you she wants to separate and is prepared to divorce you ... and you ... do nothing? Repeat behaviors that you know - that she's told you repeatedly - are a problem for her.
I'm just so upset. I think it is all hitting me today and I am really struggling with all this. I'm realizing that I am going to have to do all the work. All of it. And, he's going to sit on the sidelines and make me out to be this awful terrible person.
I'm a bit flabbergasted to be honest. I haven't pushed it because he did make an appointment with an addiction therapist - and went yesterday. I guess I expected to hear something about it and was really really hoping (more than I want to admit) that I'd see or hear something positive. I didn't want to be 'harder' because I really want him to go and get help.
The exact opposite happened. I started to realize two days ago that he thinks he's just going to stop drinking and keep going about his business and things will just get better. I think? I don't know. Buts its utterly ridiculous. Your wife tells you she wants to separate and is prepared to divorce you ... and you ... do nothing? Repeat behaviors that you know - that she's told you repeatedly - are a problem for her.
I'm just so upset. I think it is all hitting me today and I am really struggling with all this. I'm realizing that I am going to have to do all the work. All of it. And, he's going to sit on the sidelines and make me out to be this awful terrible person.
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