How to handle husband's drinking and possible depression

Old 05-13-2017, 07:45 AM
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How to handle husband's drinking and possible depression

Hi, I am joining this forum to ask for advice on how to handle my husband's alcohol use, which is causing a disconnect in our marriage.

DH drinks nearly every day and the quantities he drinks is definitely high -- he will drink maybe 4 drinks a night, and his portion sizes of a "drink" is large. For example, a glass of straight vodka or a mix of a half tumbler of whiskey with a ice and coke.

While I do not monitor his drinking closely, he drinks nearly every day. The drinking is not causing any problems in his life yet, although it is causing difficulty in our relationship, I find him boring when he drinks and his conversation is one sided. He probably is having some depression because his favorite thing is sitting in front of the TV with a drink, and other than that, he goes to work.

I also believe his attitude is becoming worse and his memory may be affected. But he keeps a job, does very well at work, and takes care of the house. He is involved with our children's activities and is able to be sober at their activities.

I have started to comment on his drinking, which upsets him.

I need to tell him to get help. I have told him recently that he is either on a path to get better or worse, and that his drinking is a high risk, his health will get worse, etc.

I am considering giving him an ultimatum, although I do not want to separate or divorce, I could do it and follow through. I will need to learn about how to do that. I would want to and believe I would be able to keep the house and the kids. I am a stay at home parent, and I would need to find a job, but I believe it could be done and we would manage. It would not be fun or easy.

I am a long term thinker and I do not like where this is headed for the next 10 to 20 years.

I wonder -- can I tell him to stop drinking and will he stop? Can I invite him to a marriage counseling or retreat? Can I encourage him to see someone for depression? Can I just plan our lives to keep him busy enough so he's not on the couch and we have things to do with friends and activities with our kids in the evenings?

6 months ago we got a dog and I was hoping it would help with his depression. Unfortunately it's not enough.

I either want him to stop or dramatically reduce his alcohol consumption.

Up until now, I have been doing my own thing, just not spending much time with him in the evenings when he drinks, but the problem is, it's probably going to get worse and I don't want to grow old with him with his mind messed up and his habit becoming worse and his health in bad shape.

What do I do?
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Old 05-13-2017, 08:02 AM
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No not me, welcome.
You can ask him to do all those things when he is sober and then watch what happens.
Don't give ultimatums unless you are willing to follow through.
You can spend your time planning activities with him. Though he may say no or start going drunk. Better though is planning activities for you and the children and do it without him. Trial alanon even if its irregular try to go to at least six of them.
Stay focused on yourself and children such as finding a job or going back to school if needed. Start writing a journal of what is going on.
All these are suggestions only you can decide how close you are to divorcing even if its just talking to a lawyer to gain some further information. And keep coming back to SR.
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Old 05-13-2017, 08:08 AM
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Hi, and welcome! Well, it's good that you are thinking you CAN manage on your own if it comes to that. You don't have to make any immediate decisions, but you have a lot to learn about alcoholism.

First, it's virtually impossible to diagnose depression in someone who's drinking the way he is. Alcohol is a depressant, so many, many alcoholics are "depressed," and it improves dramatically or disappears entirely with continued recovery and sobriety.

It's also pretty useless to engage in marriage counseling as long as an alcoholic continues to drink. The alcoholism affects every aspect of the alcoholic's personality, and they are (as you've seen) very defensive about it and protective of it. They will blame their drinking on everything but themselves--it will be your fault, the stress of the job, yada yada.

I think the first steps for you are to find an Al-Anon meeting and start attending. Al-Anon is completely separate from AA, which is for alcoholics. Al-Anon is for friends and family of alcoholics or anyone who is affected by someone else's drinking.

Educate yourself about alcoholism. There is a lot of great information in the "sticky" threads at the top of this forum. A couple of good books that will get you off to a good start are "Under the Influence" and AA's "Big Book"--here's an online version if you want to take a look: Big Book online. You might also want to try attending a few "open" AA meetings on your own. It can be a very eye-opening experience.

I've been in two marriages to alcoholics, and I'm eight years sober, myself. I've been around AA and recovery since my first husband got sober 37 years ago. Recovery is possible and real (first husband still sober), but nobody does it until they are ready. It sounds as if, right now, your husband sees nothing wrong with his drinking--YOU are the one who has a problem with it. It could be years or decades before he decides he's ready to be done with it, or he might never get there.

Right now it sounds like things aren't too horrible at home, so there's no emergency, but alcoholism is progressive, so it won't stay that way forever. As far as "cutting back," IF he is an alcoholic, that will not be possible. Not over the long term. And most alcoholics eventually start lying and hiding their drinking once it becomes a contentious issue, so you can't assume he is actually drinking less based only on what you see.

Glad you're here--stick around, this is a great place for support.
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Old 05-13-2017, 10:12 AM
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Thanks. I don't really want to divorce my husband, the idea would be to use it as a wake up call to stop drinking. However, my husband is very independent, and it's possible that he would say -- OK, let's divorce, and then use the divorce as a major source of drama and distraction away from the issue of his drinking.

We are not in a bad place, but drinking 4 oversized drinks a day is unhealthy, and it's not good for our relationship. I can detach to the point of leaving him on the couch to drink by himself, and that's pretty much where we are at right now, but I don't want to let it go like that for the rest of our lives and see him decline. He has recently gone on a sleep apnea machine and I think it's caused by the drinking. He also has high blood pressure. His path right now is not good, and it won't be good for the kids to see him drunk on the couch as they are growing up.

I am not sure how to handle things -- I am not sure whether to talk to his parents, but what can they do? His family has a culture of drinking but his mom and dad drink socially and have control. He drinks every day. I am not sure they would not see me as the bad guy if we split up.

If we go to a family function and he drinks, what do I do? We are gathering for Mother's Day tomorrow, and going to a family wedding soon. Should we just stay a short while? Should I tell him to control his drinking before each event? I don't want to mother him and he does not want to be instructed on how to live.

I could send him links to this web site and other sites about alcoholism. I just don't know what to do.

What are al-anon meetings like? I was reading about a program yesterday about controlling the beast of addiction. (Rational Recovery) - this seems like what I think would be a good fit. I am not willing at this time to say his drinking is not his fault. Also, my life is not in a shambles and I might not fit into the Alanon groups. Most of all, I don't want to hear -- oh, he's only drinking a hafl liter a day -- that's not so bad!
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Old 05-13-2017, 10:23 AM
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You've stated two things already that are red flags. His drinking is not causing any issues in his life and gave several issues they are causing. Go back and read what you wrote.

Second is you stating you're not in a bad place yet... here you are looking to fix HIM. Limit Him. Babysit King Baby.

You're not going to help him unless you stand firm in your decision making, have respect for yourself and your children and expect the best in a partner so you can have a chance at 20+ years. You're not going to get that with an active alcoholic. Ask me how I know.

Welcome. Take the advice given to you. It's good.
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Old 05-13-2017, 10:46 AM
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Also, my life is not in a shambles and I might not fit into the Alanon groups.
So who do you think DOES go to AA and Alanon? Maybe it would be a good idea for you to google up their site and get some facts before you make a statement like that.

I'd also suggest that you go right ahead and send him links to everything you find about alcoholism and recovery. Don't agonize over it, just do it. Pick out the perfect rehab/recovery plan for him. Have long heartfelt discussions w/him about it. Do everything you can think of to control and cure his drinking.

Once you've done all that and seen how well it worked, you may find that you have more in common w/those people in Alanon w/their lives "in shambles" than you know, and you may find that you're now willing to take hold of the hand being extended to you in fellowship.

In the meanwhile, reading around the forum would be helpful, but you'll need to keep an open mind in order to benefit.
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Old 05-13-2017, 11:04 AM
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Nonotme.....yes, I would say that educating yourself about alcoholism and co-dependency would be a good solid first step to getting a handle on your situation.
I have always considered knowledge to be power.
That is part of the standard advice that is given to a newcomer, here....
Most people know very little about the nature of alcoholism...even those who were raised in it....There are a lot of myths and misinformation that is commonly held, though...lol...
Those who do know are usually those w ho have had a compelling reason to have to study about , for some reason...
You are lucky, in this respect, because you have come to a place that has the most collected information and experience that you will find anywhere....
First of all, there are thousands...yes, thousands of real life stories from those who have lived through it, on this forum....I suggest that you read through them....you will see your own experience mirrored there, thousands of times....
You can learn from these others.....

Please, please, do not miss the "stickies" on the front page of this forum....it contains so much concentrated knowledge and information.
***I suggest that you begin with the one called "Classic Reading".....I especially like the one titled "10 ways to know if your addict or alcoholic is full of crap".....

Look around the whole website...there are many other forums relating to alcoholism and drug abuse...as well as general interest groups....
You might look at the ones for the alcoholics, themselves....or the one for Adult Children of Alcoholics....

Like honeypig just said...keep an open mind about alanon.....Lots of people find that t heir preconceived ideas about it are not really accurate....
It is a froup that is exclusively for those who have or are being affected by another's drinking...it is for YOU...not the alcoholic...
Alcoholics already have their own group...lol.....
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Old 05-13-2017, 11:43 AM
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FYI, when I got sober I still "had it all" from an external view. Had a good job, no credit problems, never arrested, never hospitalized, never lost a relationship. Owned my house and a car. But I was falling apart INSIDE and everything would have imploded very shortly had I not stopped. And it took me four years of desperately trying to "control" my drinking before I got to that point. And I doubt I would have reached that point as early as I did but for the fact that I had so much knowledge about alcoholism by that time (which didn't keep me from developing it, but it probably kept me from sliding as far as I might have). It was still extraordinarily difficult for me to admit it about myself.

Al-Anon was an absolute lifeline for me when I was with partners who were actively drinking or in early recovery. My life wasn't in "shambles" but it was certainly unmanageable, because everything revolved around the alcoholic--would he drink/relapse? How would he behave on a particular occasion? How can I make him quit?

Just to be clear, honeypig was NOT suggesting that you drop everything and pick out the perfect rehab for him. That's not the solution, and she was basically saying that it doesn't work, though most of us try to do stuff like that.

I think you DO need to talk to him about how his drinking affects you, and your family. Just don't expect actual recovery to come out of that. You are likely to get, at most, some vague promises to "cut back" which will either be followed by short-lived attempts to do so, or by hiding his drinking.

There is actually relatively little you can do to get him sober. You can speak your truth, but making rules and trying to manage it will be unsuccessful and build resentment on both sides. The best thing you can do is to take care of yourself, and Al-Anon is the best program I've run across for that. Its focus is on taking care of what's within your control and responsibility and allowing others the dignity of living their own lives. Nobody will tell you to leave, or to stay. But you'll be in a much better position to make such decisions if you've got the proper mindset to do so.

Don't EVER make any ultimatums or threats you don't intend to carry out. And don't expect to manage someone else by manipulating them that way. It's one thing to say, "I don't intend to continue to live in a relationship with active alcoholism, with a partner who is checked-out much of the time, and the time may come when I've had enough," and another to say, "If you don't quit drinking right now I'm leaving you," when you have no immediate plans in place to do so.
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Old 05-13-2017, 12:17 PM
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I'm very sorry to hear about your situation. My only advice is that if you issue an ultimatum, make sure it's specific ("If by May 30 you are still having two or more drinks per day on more than half the days in a week, I will go to a lawyer to begin divorce proceedings"). Vague ultimatums (cut back on drinking or I'll leave) have far too much room for interpretation. Also, you have to follow through. If you issue an ultimatum and don't carry through, in the addict's mind you've decided that their drinking isn't really that bad and so they don't have to change anything.

I gave my alcoholic ex 90 days notice. On day 89 he was still drinking and acting strangely. On day 90, I left.

Ultimately you have no control over whether he stops drinking. The only thing you can control is whether you are willing to spend more years in a marriage where one party is drinking in front of the TV every night.
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Old 05-14-2017, 04:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Nonotme View Post
What are al-anon meetings like? I was reading about a program yesterday about controlling the beast of addiction. (Rational Recovery) - this seems like what I think would be a good fit. I am not willing at this time to say his drinking is not his fault. Also, my life is not in a shambles and I might not fit into the Alanon groups. Most of all, I don't want to hear -- oh, he's only drinking a hafl liter a day -- that's not so bad!
You have many misconceptions about Al-Anon. I had them, too, and was I ever wrong, wrong, wrong. The one and only requirement of Al-Anon is that someone's drinking is problematic for you. Nobody tells you what to do or evaluates your life, your spouse or your decisions. Most people who attend do not have a life in shambles. The thing that I find we all have in common is that we are a room full of people who want to live a happy life, no matter what our loved ones are doing. Al-Anon is not about managing an alcoholic, it's about fellowship and about finding more of you because when you are focused on a loved one's drinking, you are missing a great deal of yourself. Al-Anon is about your own health and growth.
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Old 05-14-2017, 06:11 AM
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Thanks, there is an alanon group that meets in the afternoons that I could attend while the kids are in school, although that is only for a few more weeks until summer break starts.

He is yelling too much and getting upset over very small things. We had a problem with this last night.

Right now I think there is no alcohol in the house. He had a bottle of whiskey that is empty and a bottle of vodka that is empty. I had a glass of wine yesterday and he finished the bottle of wine. I feel that I need to tell him today that I would like him to stop drinking and that his drinking is affecting our family and his health.

He told me the other day that he drinks because it feels good. I honestly think he needs to get out and get a real life, things that interest him, etc.

I am afraid to talk to him about it but that sounds stupid, doesn't it?
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Old 05-14-2017, 06:19 AM
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Note, I am not a big drinker. I can and might like to enjoy a glass of wine with dinner a few times a month. I have thought that us sharing a bottle of wine is nice, but I realize that it's not really a shared experience. I suggested a few weekends ago that we have some fun drinks together when the weather was very nice outside, but he ended up getting a mix of something for me and then his own bottles of liquor for him. Not what I suggested. I need to give up the idea that we'll be able to have a simple glass of wine together because he probably can't handle it. That's too bad. We will probably then not be able to go out to restaurants, and not do a lot of things that are near alcohol. How does that happen? Alcohol is everywhere. We are going to his parents' house today for Mothers Day, and he will want to drink there. We have a family wedding coming up too. It's near impossible to imagine him not drinking at these things.
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Old 05-14-2017, 06:21 AM
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First of all, I am sorry for what brings you here. I am not usually one to respond but your story hit home as looking back your story sounds like mine several years ago. The thing is alcoholism is progressive and it will get worse.

To anyone looking in, my life now is in shambles. My AH has been out of the house since Jan, has no job, been lying and drinking the entire separation and I am a financially destroyed single mom to 4 kids while working full time, trying to keep my kids in their school, dealing with the entire community whispering and trying to keep our house in the short term to preserve a little bit of stability for my kids as they have great support near us. His current living situation is coming to an end and he will be homeless in a week. Homeless.

I'm probably not one to give advice and I am not saying your situation will become as bad as mine but if things continue it will get worse. If you would have told me 4 years ago this would be my life, I would have laughed in your face. No way this man that adored his family could ever do the things he has done and currently doing, it's unthinkable.

Nothing I have done or can do will change anything, he has to save himself.

Sending strength to you!
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Old 05-14-2017, 06:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Nonotme View Post
I need to give up the idea that we'll be able to have a simple glass of wine together because he probably can't handle it. That's too bad. We will probably then not be able to go out to restaurants, and not do a lot of things that are near alcohol. How does that happen? Alcohol is everywhere. We are going to his parents' house today for Mothers Day, and he will want to drink there. We have a family wedding coming up too. It's near impossible to imagine him not drinking at these things.
There a lot of things that need to happen before you have to worry about ANY of this, the primary one being he has to stop drinking. He does not seem to share your interest in him doing that, and until he does, this kind of future tripping is moot.
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Old 05-14-2017, 07:45 AM
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Nnm,
Welcome, and you are asking some great questions. I feel in the tone of your "voice" you are getting very over whelmed by reading the comments above. I to highly recommend alanon. In alanon they recommend not doing anything for 6 months. Sit back, try and take some control and figure out what you want in life. When you learn about alanons philosophy, you change, not him. By you changing, he "might" change, you never know.

I agree with lexie, he does not have a problem with his drinking, you do. So it's not his problem to fix, it's yours. So on this forum, in alanon, or with an addiction therapist you will slowly learn how to deal with your problem.

Some spouses do nothing and live with it , some learn to detach with love, some spouses seperate, some spouses divorce. You have time to work on yourself. I would start thinking about how you will support yourself and your kids. This takes time and either way if you stay or leave it will give you more confidence to do what you would need to do to support your family. None of us have walked in your shoes, and will tell you what to do. (If you were being abused, we would highly recommend you to leave, but I don't think that is the case here)

Education is power. Read and learn. It is an upward battle dealing with an addict. I suffered for 34 years with mine. Through the support of these people on this forum and alanon, I finally found the strength to divorce him. It was one of the most painful things I have ever done, but I thank God everyday that I am not living that life anymore, we coexisted for way to long. I am 2 1/2 years post divorce, my life is good, his is still a train wreck, and getting worse.

Take some breaths. Don't make any major decisions, do your homework and you will be ok. Keep asking questions and just ponder the answers. We are all here for you my friend, we all understand.
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Old 05-14-2017, 08:04 AM
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From the sound of it, you already have your answer, he doesn't want to stop drinking and he's already defending it saying it makes him feel good. And he's also getting annoyed with your constant focus on it.

You seem to be caught in "control" mode right now. And I think the more you research and discover more knowledge about alcoholism you will come to understand that you are powerless over his drinking. There are no words, loving gestures, ultimatums, threats etc. that will make an alcoholic stop drinking if they don't want to stop.

Al-anon, posting here, maybe some counseling for yourself will help you accept that you cannot control another human being no matter who they are, spouse, grown child, sibling, parent, best friend. All we can really do is either accept them for exactly who they are, alcoholic/addict and all the behaviors that come with that or make the choice not to and move ourselves away from it.
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Old 05-14-2017, 09:02 AM
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I agree with all the others who have posted.

One thing I want to clarify. IF he gets sober, you will not have to avoid places that serve alcohol for the rest of your life. That's for people who are white-knuckling or those in very early sobriety. For people who have JUST quit drinking, it's smart to avoid places with easy access to booze, but within a few months to a year, most of us find our comfort zone. I've been sober eight years and here's my own experience: I am fine going to a restaurant that serves alcohol. I don't mind parties, though I prefer those that don't take place in bars, and if everyone starts getting drunk/buzzed I get very bored. I prefer no alcohol in my home. If for some reason people brought it for dinner or something, I'd have them take any leftovers home with them. That's me. Other people have no problem even having it in their home. Some people avoid bars. It's very individual, and every sober alcoholic is responsible for managing his/her sobriety. I always tell people if the situation makes you uncomfortable, leave.

I would, however, at this time, not drink around him if I were you. If you're out with friends on your own, no reason for you not to have a drink. But drinking with him/in front of him is a form of enabling, IMO. You can't control what he does, but you don't have to condone it by doing it in front of him or with him.
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Old 05-14-2017, 10:25 AM
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You can not drink with him. It doesn't work that way. There is no relaxation in it for either party.
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Old 05-14-2017, 10:36 AM
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This is my exact situation except it has gotten worse. I've made the mistake of making ultimatums and it has backfired on me. He knows I get upset with the amount he drinks so he hides it from me. I have found bottles in strange places most of the time accidentally. Even when I do find them it doesn't stop. I don't have any advice for you at this point except to let you know you are not alone. I have two small children myself (one is a newborn) so it is very hard for me to go to an al-anon meeting since they are during the evenings near me.

I understand where you are coming from with respect to your marriage. I have been feeling very alone for the last 5 years. I hope you can nip this in the butt a lot faster than me. In my experiences, by turning a blind eye has only made my situation worse in that he thinks he gets away with things which have become more dangerous as time has gone on (i.e. Driving while intoxicated.). I think his drinking got worse since his panic attacks but it's his drinking that's causing them. It's such a vicious cycle and he's dug himself such a deep hole. I hope you guys find the help he needs. I've realized because of all this I will probably need to go through therapy myself. Have you considered speaking to a counselor/psychologist?
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Old 05-15-2017, 05:10 AM
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Good morning,

I'm going to wait and watch for now. Yesterday my husband drank one glass of alcohol, I'm going to estimate it at about 3-4 oz., at his parents' house and sandwiched it with some sodas out of the can. Today he went to the gym to work out.

I had actually talked to him about the alcohol and made some comments last week, so I have already made my views known. And I don't need to repeat myself, right? So we will see how he does. Can he manage to cut back? Will he arrive home with fresh bottles after a "hard" work day? I don't know.
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