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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
You claim to love this guy but it appears all you really are doing is stringing him alone, and that’s unkind and unloving. Are you trying to get even with him for all the hurt he’s caused you? With ever phone call and every get together you are giving him false hope especially when your gut is screaming at you to walk away.
He’s not free to fully invest in a healthy relationship with you because he’s already married to someone else and then comes his alcohol and that will always come first. Whether he’s drinking or working on not drinking it’s first.
You are not free to fully invest in a healthy relationship with someone you have to hide away from family and friends. Someone you feel the need to lie about and for with those closest to you.
It’s like neither one of you are having any kind of a real relationship except with your own selfish issues which drag the other along into them.
You tell yourself that you are being kind and loving and supportive but in reality you really aren’t. It’s all about your issues and your inability and fear. You tell yourself you love him yet your instincts and your actions say otherwise. And you know this because everyone who loves you has told you it over and over again, that’s why you need to hide him away. See, it stopped being about him and alcohol issues a long time ago and it’s really about your own issues.
I do hope you look at the person looking back at you in the mirror and ask, is this who I really want to be? Keep going to counseling work on whatever fear is keeping you so stuck in this dysfunction that is now taking over your happiness in life and eroding your relationship with your family.
I know you want kudos for kicking him out of your apartment and so far sticking to not allowing him to move back in but then you mention talking to your sister while he goes down stairs to smoke. So he’s back, just not sleeping there, is that right? And the going downstairs to smoke, isn’t the bar he liked to frequent down there?
He’s not free to fully invest in a healthy relationship with you because he’s already married to someone else and then comes his alcohol and that will always come first. Whether he’s drinking or working on not drinking it’s first.
You are not free to fully invest in a healthy relationship with someone you have to hide away from family and friends. Someone you feel the need to lie about and for with those closest to you.
It’s like neither one of you are having any kind of a real relationship except with your own selfish issues which drag the other along into them.
You tell yourself that you are being kind and loving and supportive but in reality you really aren’t. It’s all about your issues and your inability and fear. You tell yourself you love him yet your instincts and your actions say otherwise. And you know this because everyone who loves you has told you it over and over again, that’s why you need to hide him away. See, it stopped being about him and alcohol issues a long time ago and it’s really about your own issues.
I do hope you look at the person looking back at you in the mirror and ask, is this who I really want to be? Keep going to counseling work on whatever fear is keeping you so stuck in this dysfunction that is now taking over your happiness in life and eroding your relationship with your family.
I know you want kudos for kicking him out of your apartment and so far sticking to not allowing him to move back in but then you mention talking to your sister while he goes down stairs to smoke. So he’s back, just not sleeping there, is that right? And the going downstairs to smoke, isn’t the bar he liked to frequent down there?
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Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Anywhere, USA
Posts: 869
Sound advice. As always. btw....I don't and never have had a drinking problem. I am simply trying to make everything work that is unworkable (like trying to physically be two places at once...you simply can't have it both). You must understand that I live a lot of lies to protect people my crazy mind thinks I need to protect. I hide when I am at my parents house that I am talking to him so I go somewhere they can't hear me. I am trying to enjoy a glass of wine on a Saturday evening with dinner but can't because I am with him so I have to hide that too. I don't hide liquor because I am abusing it. I hide it because I use to enjoy it on occasion very responsibly before he came into my life. My hiding is not the problem of what I am hiding, it's the problem of me trying to hide and protect everything...hide and protect....rinse, repeat.
I don't want anyone to think I am coming here completely unaware or complaining and don't know what to do because I am beyond aware of what is happening here and what must happen to have the pot of gold at the end. I know that when I read this back it is pure insanity. It just helps me to read your words because I get re-energized when I think I am sinking in too deep to get out.
Also, another funny thing is that my parents are purely able bodied both running a successful family business living in a beautiful home and loving life. Sure they are sad that we are all grown and out of the house and always ask us to come over and seem sad when we say we can't. But it's not like they throw themeselves on the floor or pout. In fact every day my mom says "I hope you are making a life in the city...as much as I love when you are here, nothing would make me happier than to see you busy living a happy life not stuck and home or in your apartment with your old parents or a bad relationship". This is all my doing.
I don't want anyone to think I am coming here completely unaware or complaining and don't know what to do because I am beyond aware of what is happening here and what must happen to have the pot of gold at the end. I know that when I read this back it is pure insanity. It just helps me to read your words because I get re-energized when I think I am sinking in too deep to get out.
Also, another funny thing is that my parents are purely able bodied both running a successful family business living in a beautiful home and loving life. Sure they are sad that we are all grown and out of the house and always ask us to come over and seem sad when we say we can't. But it's not like they throw themeselves on the floor or pout. In fact every day my mom says "I hope you are making a life in the city...as much as I love when you are here, nothing would make me happier than to see you busy living a happy life not stuck and home or in your apartment with your old parents or a bad relationship". This is all my doing.
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Join Date: Sep 2016
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Posts: 869
Originally Posted by atalose 
You claim to love this guy but it appears all you really are doing is stringing him alone, and that’s unkind and unloving. Are you trying to get even with him for all the hurt he’s caused you? With ever phone call and every get together you are giving him false hope especially when your gut is screaming at you to walk away.
He has given me plenty of "outs" and I always say...no...even when it was very obvious I was trying to say it needed to end he would say "are you breaking up with me?"...and I was, but I simply could not mutter the words. Instead I said "no im not breaking up with you!"...but I wanted to...I just cowered. Half because I really don't want to leave him, and half because I am afraid to leave him. I physically could not say the words - my sister says I am waiting for him to make the decision to leave because I am not brave enough to.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Western US
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Hi Smarie, I'm so glad you came back and posted. You seem to start great threads probably because you have the codie thing so very bad . . . . hmmm, sorry about the complisult thing here.
As I remember you decided against no-contact which could be considered the codie equivalent of an alcoholic trying to drink in moderation. If you check out the newcomers' forum, there are semi-regular posts from folks who want to moderate; it doesn't work for them either.
As much as every single one of us would love to see you get far, far from this guy, you may not have hit your own bottom yet. Your way forward may include some further progression down. I hope not.
Big hug am keep posting!
As I remember you decided against no-contact which could be considered the codie equivalent of an alcoholic trying to drink in moderation. If you check out the newcomers' forum, there are semi-regular posts from folks who want to moderate; it doesn't work for them either.
As much as every single one of us would love to see you get far, far from this guy, you may not have hit your own bottom yet. Your way forward may include some further progression down. I hope not.
Big hug am keep posting!
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Join Date: Sep 2016
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Posts: 869
Originally Posted by atalose
And what exactly is it you are attempting to protect?
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Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Blue Ridge Mountains
Posts: 816
"Calling the police on someone you love, learning they cheated on you, lied, having to go scoop them up in their own urine, vomit, and feces after they holed up in a hell hole for a week drinking themselves to death, destroying your apartment, verbally abusing you, and then doing it on a regular basis for the last year, all while married to another woman with a child he never sees (separated) and unable to divorce and face responsibility, the addict still becomes frustrated that I am not OK post- binge."
"I love this man immensely and really am struggling at the idea of giving us up."
I think reading this several times a day would be helpful, and
reflecting on what love is.
"I love this man immensely and really am struggling at the idea of giving us up."
I think reading this several times a day would be helpful, and
reflecting on what love is.
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,699
I'm glad you see the insanity of this all....when we see....we eventually have to face it.
It seems like you somewhat know you deserve a better life than this, but just can't make the move to get it for yourself. I get it. I wanted XABF to fix his life so I would have a good one. I wanted my RA boss to fix her life, so she could fix the business, so I could have a good life. I wanted 7 addict boyfriends before that to fix their lives so I could have a good one. I wanted my mom to fix our relationship so I could have a good life.
They didn't fix their stuff for themselves because it is VERY DIFFICULT....and WHOA...they couldn't fix their stuff FOR ME?! lol.
I didn't fix my stuff because when I focus on everyone else's stuff, it feels like I don't have any stuff to fix.
You have to get to the root of that guilt and shame. Your family can get mad, they can berate you, and YOU can change that dynamic, and refuse to accept guilt. But I have a feeling way deep down you feel like you deserve this life - that you SHOULD feel guilt and shame over bad decisions rather than simply owning the bad ones, or making the more difficult better ones.
I get the family stuff - believe me - the trying to be perfect because you don't want your parents to think they raised a failure....parents with high expectations raise kids with an incredible sense of guilt and shame. YOU can change this - every day is a new chance to make it different. <3
It seems like you somewhat know you deserve a better life than this, but just can't make the move to get it for yourself. I get it. I wanted XABF to fix his life so I would have a good one. I wanted my RA boss to fix her life, so she could fix the business, so I could have a good life. I wanted 7 addict boyfriends before that to fix their lives so I could have a good one. I wanted my mom to fix our relationship so I could have a good life.
They didn't fix their stuff for themselves because it is VERY DIFFICULT....and WHOA...they couldn't fix their stuff FOR ME?! lol.
I didn't fix my stuff because when I focus on everyone else's stuff, it feels like I don't have any stuff to fix.
You have to get to the root of that guilt and shame. Your family can get mad, they can berate you, and YOU can change that dynamic, and refuse to accept guilt. But I have a feeling way deep down you feel like you deserve this life - that you SHOULD feel guilt and shame over bad decisions rather than simply owning the bad ones, or making the more difficult better ones.
I get the family stuff - believe me - the trying to be perfect because you don't want your parents to think they raised a failure....parents with high expectations raise kids with an incredible sense of guilt and shame. YOU can change this - every day is a new chance to make it different. <3
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
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I will get up to use the washroom and sneak my own sip of wine from a hidden bottle because while I don't have a drinking problem, I cannot in good conscious drink in front of him even though I enjoy a glass of wine with dinner.
I don't and never have had a drinking problem.
and yet the alcohol is important enough for you to find reasons to go have a swig of in the bathroom, while you have a guest in your home. the reasonable alternative would be to JUST NOT DRINK.
I don't and never have had a drinking problem.
and yet the alcohol is important enough for you to find reasons to go have a swig of in the bathroom, while you have a guest in your home. the reasonable alternative would be to JUST NOT DRINK.
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
It seems to me you look at "love" as some kind of zero-sum game. If you do something good/healthy for yourself, you are taking something away from someone else.
I walked away from my alcoholic without hating him. I prayed for him, but I didn't let him back into my life because it would not have done anything good for either one of us. He was, quite simply, on a path that I couldn't walk with him. It would have harmed me, without helping him.
Just because you care for somebody doesn't mean you can't let him go. I think you should consider what atalose wrote. In what way is your relationship HELPING him?
I walked away from my alcoholic without hating him. I prayed for him, but I didn't let him back into my life because it would not have done anything good for either one of us. He was, quite simply, on a path that I couldn't walk with him. It would have harmed me, without helping him.
Just because you care for somebody doesn't mean you can't let him go. I think you should consider what atalose wrote. In what way is your relationship HELPING him?
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
We don’t create a “fantasy” world to escape reality, we often create it to be able to stay.
You love him and your mom and dad, sister and brother………now it’s time to begin to love yourself.
I think slowly that process has begun and the more you begin self-love, self-worth, self-respect you’ll let go of him, not because you stop caring about him but because you finally start caring about yourself.
You love him and your mom and dad, sister and brother………now it’s time to begin to love yourself.
I think slowly that process has begun and the more you begin self-love, self-worth, self-respect you’ll let go of him, not because you stop caring about him but because you finally start caring about yourself.
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,426
Unfortunately, from own experience I learned that staying enmeshed with someone
with these kinds of problems is a lose-lose for both parties.
For the addict, you keep them from hitting a low enough low to really want to change,
and for the enabler, you siphon off your life energy and resources to someone
who uses you as a distraction and crash pad, even if they do "love you".
In the end, you block yourself from finding a real partner who can meet your needs,
and the addict can't move on either, as you are the path of least resistance.
Respect him enough to step back and let him find his way,
Learning to love yourself as much or more than others isn't easy for us,
but it is essential if we are ever to have a healthy relationship with anyone.
with these kinds of problems is a lose-lose for both parties.
For the addict, you keep them from hitting a low enough low to really want to change,
and for the enabler, you siphon off your life energy and resources to someone
who uses you as a distraction and crash pad, even if they do "love you".
In the end, you block yourself from finding a real partner who can meet your needs,
and the addict can't move on either, as you are the path of least resistance.
Respect him enough to step back and let him find his way,
Learning to love yourself as much or more than others isn't easy for us,
but it is essential if we are ever to have a healthy relationship with anyone.
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: East Coast
Posts: 1,235
I will scroll through Facebook at all the baby pictures and photos of friends with their couple friends at dinner or out on the town laughing and smiling and I will seethe with longing that this is not my life.
There is something that compels you not to let go. What makes you stay?
If you want to move forward, I'm all for vacations. Maybe a vacation is a temporary bandaid, but I've always gone on one after major breakups. It makes it so much easier to create a no-contact pattern without the triggers there. Even if the first days were somewhat uncomfortable and involved crying jags of some sort, I usually ended up having a great time and remembered that I could live a life of happiness without said ex. I had great fun becoming "the mysterious woman", as opposed to "the lonely woman" during vacations.
There are places with little cell phone reception or internet access. It's great! When I went to Yellowstone National Park recently, I told my co-workers and family not to even bother to try reaching me - it just wasn't going to happen. I'm sure there were spots in the park where I could talk - I just wasn't going to drive three hours at a time to find them.
I went through some massively crappy relationships before I met my husband. And they didn't even involve drugs or alcohol. My ex-fiance smiled at me when he told me he had kissed another woman, and he told me THAT because he wanted to make sure that I knew that I wasn't smart enough to pick that up. And still I stayed with that jerk for two years, until he did the heave-ho.
I'm still angry at myself for staying for so long, even though I'm now in a fulfilling marriage with a tween boy. Your heart can recover from this - you just need to make the leap.
PS. There's this subbreddit for people going NoContact that you may want to look into... https://www.reddit.com/r/ExNoContact/
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 468
I relate to this. So much.
Originally Posted by Smarie78
A day in the life of my head; on Sundays when I go to sleep, I think about what my week will look like to make everyone ok (...if I go visit mom and dad on Tuesday they will expect I spend the night so I can do that so they aren't lonely and don't have to deal with empty nest syndrome since my brothers and sisters moved out, and oh if I go there I should stay for two or 3 days because I use to do that a long time ago but I don't want to anymore, then Wednesday I can go visit my sister and pick the boys from school and spend time with her, and then if I see Abf Monday he will still feel like I am around eventhough he had to move out, and oh he will expect to see me again during the week so Thursday I can do that then he won't feel alone...oh, and while I am doing this, on the days I am with Abf I will feel badly I am not at parents home, and the days I am at parents I will feel guilty for not being with him or seeing my sister).
Then the weekend comes....I will need to make an excuse up for why I am not available on Friday night or Saturday because nobody can know I am with Abf. Sister will call ready to watch a movie because the boys are finally in bed. I will take the call when Abf goes downstairs to have a cigarette. During this call I will say something I wouldn't say in front of him to she thinks I am alone. But I will lie and tell her I have plans with the girl from work eventhough she knows I am lying and now this is awkward. Abf comes over. What will we do tonight? probably what we always do. Run some errands, go to the movies, sit on the sofa and watch a movie and I will dodge calls from my family and my stomach will sink when I see someone calling 'because I will have to pretend I am not with him. I will get up to use the washroom and sneak my own sip of wine from a hidden bottle because while I don't have a drinking problem, I cannot in good conscious drink in front of him eventhough I enjoy a glass of wine with dinner. I will scroll through Facebook at all the baby pictures and photos of friends with their couple friends at dinner or out on the town laughing and smiling and I will seethe with longing that this is not my life.
And I keep doing it, because to do otherwise feels bad. Like I am taking out the jenga piece of the tower everyone built and it will come crashing down and everyone will look at me in anger. So I will keep doing it and hoping I can make it all work. And in the meantime I will not start my workout routine and join the gym like I always say I will because when would I go?. I will not go on to plan a family with children and I near my fertility expiration....but I WILL resent deeply, and I will go to sleep at night to do it all over again tomorrow.
Therapy much?
By the way - I am fully aware that this is no way to live. I am working on small ways to start getting away from this. I have said no a couple of times this week and have made an appointment already to join an organization that will need my time and I will be forced to commit regardless of others "schedules". Not because I need to but because I WANT to. I miss my life so much I forgot what it looks like.
Then the weekend comes....I will need to make an excuse up for why I am not available on Friday night or Saturday because nobody can know I am with Abf. Sister will call ready to watch a movie because the boys are finally in bed. I will take the call when Abf goes downstairs to have a cigarette. During this call I will say something I wouldn't say in front of him to she thinks I am alone. But I will lie and tell her I have plans with the girl from work eventhough she knows I am lying and now this is awkward. Abf comes over. What will we do tonight? probably what we always do. Run some errands, go to the movies, sit on the sofa and watch a movie and I will dodge calls from my family and my stomach will sink when I see someone calling 'because I will have to pretend I am not with him. I will get up to use the washroom and sneak my own sip of wine from a hidden bottle because while I don't have a drinking problem, I cannot in good conscious drink in front of him eventhough I enjoy a glass of wine with dinner. I will scroll through Facebook at all the baby pictures and photos of friends with their couple friends at dinner or out on the town laughing and smiling and I will seethe with longing that this is not my life.
And I keep doing it, because to do otherwise feels bad. Like I am taking out the jenga piece of the tower everyone built and it will come crashing down and everyone will look at me in anger. So I will keep doing it and hoping I can make it all work. And in the meantime I will not start my workout routine and join the gym like I always say I will because when would I go?. I will not go on to plan a family with children and I near my fertility expiration....but I WILL resent deeply, and I will go to sleep at night to do it all over again tomorrow.
Therapy much?
By the way - I am fully aware that this is no way to live. I am working on small ways to start getting away from this. I have said no a couple of times this week and have made an appointment already to join an organization that will need my time and I will be forced to commit regardless of others "schedules". Not because I need to but because I WANT to. I miss my life so much I forgot what it looks like.
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Join Date: Nov 2015
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I'm completely mortified at my lack of punctuation, but touched by the fact that you all feel free enough to rake me across the grammar coals.
[Eats, shoots and leaves.]
[Eats, shoots and leaves.]
Last edited by PuzzledHeart; 12-16-2016 at 08:27 AM. Reason: Found another stupid grammatical error...
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