Peaches04

Hi everyone. I need some advise, or at least a sanity check. A little background - I asked my AH to leave because I was tired of living this life - we've fought about drinking a ton, and his position has always been that he doesn't have a problem. When I asked him to leave, he made me a proposition to quit drinking for 30 days to see if he could do it. I agreed - not sure why I did - I really didn't think he would do it..so, I thought it was the least I could do. So, now he has been sober for 9 days - no AA or counseling - just not drinking. It's been great and I've seen wonderful improvements in his attitude, etc.. BUT, then the other day he came home and told me he quit his job to start a company with another guy. Well, since we've been married, he's been through probably 6 different careers..I've supported him (us - 2 children) financially through all of it. He finally latched on to something he really liked, got a job making good money, and everything was looking great... and then he decided he could do it better with this guy. UGH! I was so pissed...but, went with the train of thought that I can't control him and he's going to do what he's going to do... so, I let it go. Now the guy he went into business with is spending all the money before he pays my husband - my husband knows it's not working, but is hanging on the 'hope' it's going to work out. (sounds familiar?) Now, he's saying things like "well, if it doesn't work out in a few weeks, I'll just do this on my own"...HOLD ON~!! HOW MANY TIMES HAVE I HEARD THIS!!! So, I've been trying to 'let go', but it wont go. I'm just think it is the most selfish thing he could do - it's always about him and what makes him happy. And to top it all off, he gets angry and resentful when I buy something - he thinks we don't have enough in savings and on and on... Give me a break! I have listenend to this sh** for years now and somehow felt guilty...all this "we are working for the family"...what he means is that I am working for the family, while he gets to do whatever the hell he wants. (Sorry, once I started typing I am getting madder and madder). I always wanted to be a stay home mom - that's it. Does that mean I get to decide to quit my job? Anyway, as my sister puts it - it seems like I've traded in one huge problem for another. So, I guess my question is....what do I do? I am so proud and grateful that he's quit drinking, but isn't this just another example of the immature and selfish behavior of an alcholic? Should I see if he makes the 30 days before I bring it up? And no - I have no idea what happens in 30 days - I just thought I'd cross that bridge when I get to it. Any advise is sooo welcome. I've thought through this so many times, I don't know what is normal or healthy any more.! Thanks everyone!

Aquiana

I think you should just go ahead and tell him if it's bothering you so much. I wouldn't wait the 30 days. For one thing, you don't know if he'll make it that long anyway and for another, he's going to have to learn to deal with other issues besides the drinking anyway. Life still goes on. I think you have every right to be upset. Quitting a job can bring financial stress to everybody involved and so I think you both should play a part in the decision. It's ultimately your decision whether you want to say anything yet but I would. Good luck!

DesertEyes

Hi Peaches,

I'm sorry you're going thru such hardships.

No problem, you're entitled to your feelings. Just don't get so angry you take it out on the 'puter ;-)

Well yeah, that's what us addicts do. The disease of addiction is in the _brain_, so it doesn't matter _what_ the addict is addicted to. Whether it's booze, dope, gambling, sex, or whatever. You hit the nail on the head when you said it's all about him. That's one of the symptoms of the disease.

BTW, I've started several businesses. First we save up the momey, and we get other people to contribute and sign contracts. We have specific targets and deadlines and financial limits. I didn't start my first one until I was about 6 years sober. A very important principle of the AA program is not to make any major changes in your life the first few years of sobriety.

Well yeah, and I would love to be Donald Trump ;-) A symptom of _sanity_ is that we deal with life on life's terms. Avoiding the responsibilities of daily life is what addicts do.

I'm not an expert, so I can' give you any advice. What I can do is give you a litte experience, strength and hope. Here's a few ideas that might be helpful to you.

Do you have a real life sponsor that you can call on the phone on days like this? If you don't, then you might want to get one.

Do you have a list of people in the program that you can call on the phone on days like this? If you don't, then you might want to get one.

Do you have regular meetings where you can go and vent your feelings and talk to people face to face. The more meetings you can manage the better.

Remind yourself that _you_ are on the road to recovery, even if he is not. _You_ are taking care of your life by posting on this forum and getting involved in a program of recovery. Today you are upset by his behavior, and who wouldn't be, but you are learning how to deal with the roller-coaster of life with an addict. Tomorrow you will handle this situation better, and the day after tomorrow even better yet.

Today you can focus on what you can do today. You vented on the forum, which is really good. Got all that anger out of you. Now you can focus on what you can do for _you_, today. Does meditation help you? Prayer? Do you have recovery books you can read? Do you go on walks?

Whatever it is that works for you and helps you regain your serenity. Do it.

Just for today. Once you get your serenity back you can decide if there's anything else you need to do for today. Everything else you can worry about tomorrow.

Whadya think?

Mike :-)

Peaches04

Thanks Aquiana...and thanks DesertEyes for the very thought out reply. I don't have a sponsor, but I have a great support system of people I trust. I talked to my sister for a long time today about this, which is what made me decide to post it. And yes, I read alanon literature and codependency literature nightly. This is something that has bothered me for a long time.. before, I was easily manipulated into feeling guilty, like I was not being supportive in letting him find something to make him happy. Ofcourse, now I realize that nothing is going to make him happy, until he makes the choice to be happy. Since I have started my own path to recovery, I'm realizing all the wants that I've given up, so that he could pursue whatever it is he was doing. I've also been honest with myself in owning my wants and accepting them, instead of feeling selfish or unreasonable. This is one of the last issues that I have not yet dealt with, with him and myself. I keep pushing thinking about it off until 'tomorrow', but then as soon as I get my serenity back, something seems to come up - like that he isn't getting paid yet...or he'll complain to me... then it triggers my thoughts again and makes me wonder why I haven't addressed this yet. Writing about it actually helps me to crystalize my thoughts on this. I'm just not 100% comfortable with the timing...but, I'm afraid if I don't address it soon - how can I bring it up in 3 months when I haven't said anything until that point? or is that okay? I dunno...ugh!!! so aggravated! But, not to worry - it's not ruining my day or anything - it's just something that will have to be addressed at some point by me.

minnie

Hang on, are you saying that your husband came home and just announced that he was leaving his job? Without consulting with you? Does he not realise that a marriage is a partnership?

Hon, you are doing soooooo well with your recovery. Please, don't let this overgrown child push you off that path.

We're all here for you.

Love

Minnie

p.s. you do realise that most alcoholics can stop drinking for a time to "prove a point"? He's not in recovery, he's just stopped drinking.

p.p.s. apologies for the lack of tact - it's 10.30pm here and I'm exhausted, so my filters aren't working very well!

Peaches04

Oh Minnie...believe me, I'm at the point where I can appreciate lack of tact...although, I don't think you demonstrated a lack of tact! And yes, his M.O. is to start a job or career, few days or weeks later he comes home complaining about how 'screwed up his boss or the company is' - this goes on for a while...then he starts with the "I think there is an opportunity...blah, blah" which means "Get ready honey, I'm about to quit". So, with this one - same M.O. - although I did ask him about it and he said "no, I'm not going to quit..I'm just going to do this on the side" and then when I had the flu last week and was barely able to move - he came in and told me he had quit. and no - he does not consult me. We fight, I cry, I use every form of logic available to man kind...and it goes in one ear, and out the other. The truth is that he knows he doesn't HAVE to work becuase I'll pay for everything, not for him, but for my kids. He knows that my family is the most important thing and that UNTIL NOW I would have lived in absolute misery thinking that was best for my kids. I'm changing... and I wont do that anymore. So, as I said before - this is one of the last BIG issues I've yet to address with him. I just don't know how to do it... aren't I pathetic. My sister always tells me "what do you think a normal person would do?" and we talk about that. And when she says "normal" - she doesn't mean it bad...she's on the same path I am, just with different issues.

Petunia

Peaches,

I recall a post not too long ago where the issue of REACTING became a theme. One thing I don't see is you reacting. You are contemplating but not using the old autopilot reactions that are right there on the shelf in front of you - BRAVO!

What is the worst thing that will happen if you say something? And is saying something really causing this to occur? Would it have occured anyway due to other factors in the equation? What will occur if you don't say anything? I guess the real boiled down question is - what is the next right thing for your to do regarding this issue?

My AH related a story to me that I draw on frequently. Early in his path to sobriety, he had a relationship that he knew he had to end. But he kept avoiding it. Another week would go by, until one day he picked up the phone for what was probably the 100th time then set it back down when he heard a quiet voice - he really heard this voice, that said "T, it's never going to get easier." He knew what the message related to, so he did what he had to do, rang the number, spoke to the person he needed to, ended the relationship and felt more relief than he had felt in a long time. Because he acted. The message came through loud and clear for him, from a very small voice in his head and he acted on it.

I have to remind myself that what is important in my program is that I follow the most basic process - with life, problems, decisions, desires, wants, needs - Admittance, Acceptance, and Action.

Bottom line is that there is something which is bothering you and it is part of life and needs to be dealt with - later is not going to make it any easier. Wha will be the Action that you take for yourself? What is the next right thing to do?

The quote from the other day sticks with me - When someone says life is hard, I ask compared to what? Responsibilities are not wants. They are things that have to be addressed in order for there to be food on the table, a roof over head, clothes on the kids, etcetera. Responsibilities are things growups accept and act on.

You're doing great. Not sure what you will take away from this - but I wanted you to know I am truly thrilled to see how much you have grown over these past weeks. Progress not perfection, my dear heart.

Peace for tonight -
Petunia

minnie

Ok, going to be blunt again, because I've warned you! Also, I'm getting stronger everyday (and no thanks to you) and hate to see people going through pain by not looking at the bigger picture.

You admit that he knows he doesn't have to work because you'll stump up for the kids' sake. So therefore he doesn't have to take any responsibility for his family. You have another child on your hands, not a partner. If you have a problem with his actions, you have a right to voice your opinion. Not by yelling, but calmly and clearly. If he continually disregards your feelings, you know where you satnd.

The question I ask you (and I know you're probably asking yourself) is: if you have to support you and your kids on your own at the moment anyway, why not actually do that without him? It is NOT your job to be his safety net all the time.

Please know that I say this with huge hugs.

Minnie
((((HUGS))))

Peaches04

((((Petunia))))) - thanks so much! That's just what I needed to hear! I couldn't have explained it better myself in terms of it's just something that is not going to 'go away'. I think it's more codependent of me "to pretend to accept something that is not acceptable to me" - which is what I'm afraid I will be doing if I wait another week or so. Plus, how do you back track and say...well, I've 'pretended' to support you all this time, but today - I changed my mind. I don't think that is fair to him either...it's kind of tricking him into a false sense of security. It's like treading near a volcano that's about to erupt...because that's what I feel like will happen if I put it off much longer. I think he really did a number on me and brainwashing me with the "I'm doing this for us and the family..I can't be successful if I'm not happy"... made sense to me. But, the actions never fit the words.. and I do think he thinks that to be true, but he just doesn't 'see' the problem. I just NOW have got rid of all the old resentment...and I don't want to build up a new batch. So, thanks Petunia... your words have given me some strength to figure out the way to approach this... I just wish somebody could pretend to be me and come over have this conversation... any volunteers?

minnie

I'll do it!! Maybe not best tonight, though.

I think you're on the right track about it being more co-dep to pretend. That's not doing either of you any favours - it's not reality and that's what you need to deal in right now. Not promises and whatever the future MIGHT hold, but what is happening now.

Blimey, I think I might just take some of my own advice one of these days!!

Love

Minnie

DesertEyes

We can't be there in person, but we will be there in spirit :-) You are in our prayers.

Mike :-)

Star Gazer

Hi Peaches,

Your situation sounds very familiar to me. My ex boyfriend is 20 years sober. I didn't know him when he drank. Heck, I was only 3 when he quit! Anyway, I discovered a few months ago that he had quit drinking but he never recovered.

I was in your situation about 3 years ago. My BF went to work for his best friend when his friend cut his finger. Well, it was supposed to be temporary. He ended up staying with him and being taken advantage of constantly. He always came home complaining but would never do anything about it. He always had these huge ideas and plans. Meanwhile, his house is falling apart, he has no money for bills and I felt obligated to cover for him. We didn't even live together at the time. I grew totally resentful that I had covered his bills, let him shower at my apartment, and did many other things I shouldn't have. I was so angry but he didn't care. I was going to school, working full time, and taking care of us financially! I was too co-dependant to confront the issue.

He finally got away from his friend. It actually took a threat of me leaving him to do it. I didn't make the threat, it was actually my family confronting me about the problems. He then moved into the house I just bought and didn't have a job for 3 months. Things didn't get any better. I still took care of everything. Of course, he tended the house well. His job pays poorly and he never gave me money consistently. I could not depend on him at all. We discussed the problems and came up with a plan but it didn't work. This went on until about 3 weeks ago. I began really working the ACA program and I broke up with him.

He needs to get his life together on his own. I am tired of taking care of everyone but me. I told him when I broke up with him that he needs to deal with his demons before he will become successful. He needed AA. He did go and it seems to be helping. Or, it could be that I am forcing him to take care of himself. It is amazing what he will do when it is up to him to survive!

You have every right to be angry. I know what it feels like. For me, it was a constant feeling in the pit of my stomach. I got by day to day but I always harbored this secret resentment for him. I can't believe how well I know how you feel!! I'm getting frustrated for you!!

I'm not sure if this helps at all. I just felt like I should share my story because it is similar. The best thing for me was realizing that there was a problem and that I could do something about it. For me, it was breaking up with him. It is very hard, but I feel like I made the right decision.

Good luck!!! We'll be here after your talk!!

tootiefish

Hi Peaches, I hate to read that you're having problems, but glad to see that you're thinking them through pretty clearly. I think you've got some good advice here and I have nothing further to offer, but know that you'll be in my thoughts and prayers. Big hugs to you!

cwohio

peaches - i ditto tootiefish's post. you are still dealing with your situations in a healthier way than you would have months ago so bravo to you!

good luck and our spirits are beside you always! cwohio

Peaches04

I'm so mad at myself!!!! I didn't talk to him last night about this becuase I worked with my son all night and quite frankly, just didn't have the energy. As part of his 'going into business with this guy' - he GAVE (didn't ask me) the guy his cell phone, becuase he had another one from the job he worked for that he quit. So now, he quit and doesn't have a cell phone. so, he asked me Monday if he could borrow mine and I said "you can today, but that's it..". so long story short I get my cell phone this morning and he says "I could really use that today" while I was walking in the other room. Then my 5 year old son laughs and I hear him say jokingly "you know the answer to that is going to be no"...and my husband says "I know son, your mom is not very helpful sometimes"... I tried to keep my cool and walked back in and said "AH, I don't think it's a good example to insult me in front of (son) just because you might not get your way"...and he blows up.. Calls me a flake, on and on...and I just looked at him and said "Stop it! Stop it!"...I was shaking I was so furious! I could care less what he calls me or thinks of me - but, now that I am starting to understand the BIG picture, i will not tolerate the character assasination in front of our children. I am still shaking! But - the maybe kind of good news is that I've decided I'm going to tell him that the quitting driking is great, but it's just a symptom of his real issues. And that I want him to leave and go figure out what he wants to do, and that if he decides he is willing to change his behavior, quit drinking, go to counseling, stop the child-like behavior (name calling), be stable with a job, and get serious about growing up and being a father, then I might be willing to try again. But, I will only be looking at actions, not words. And I will be honest and tell him too, that I may decide I don't want him back even if he does all that... I don't think I love him anymore...or maybe I love me and my kids more. I don't know...

minnie

You didn't slip, hon. If you didn't have the energy, you wouldn't have been able to handle a difficult conversation. That's OK. It's allowed.

You are doing the right thing - just don't feel you have to do it all at once. Remember - baby steps.

]
We're all here for you

Love

Minnie
xxx

justired

Hi Peaches,

I'm sorry you are going through this. Your AH sounds so much like mine, except mine got fired from his good job (missed too much work due to drinking). He has supposedly been sober for three months, but unfortunately I don't believe it. He still takes off, says he'll be back and does not come home til the next morning). He is very childish and selfish and exhibits nearly all the behaviors you write about your AH having. Like you, I'd do anything to take care of my kids (3 and one on the way), but I've also learned to take care of myself both physically and mentally. If I'm not okay, how can I take care of them cause I sure can't count on him to do jack. Since he lost his job, he got another one which is part time and low paying and he does not contribute one dime to the household. I've asked him to help out, but he will not (and we may end up losing our beautiful house). He just complains about how bad he feels and how bad it is for him and says he is really trying to get a better job. I love the cell phone issue you brought up. I've been paying for "his" (it is in my name of course) cell phone for a while and when he stopped contributing to the bills I told him he would need to pay for it or I would take it back. Well, he didn't pay for it and I took it like I said I would which was a big thing for a codie like me to do. I also do not think I love him anymore - he has just drug me and the kids through too much. Not sure what step will come next (I'm leaning towards ending the marriage cause this really isn't a marriage anymore), but I know everything will work out somehow.

Don't beat yourself up for your "slip." Remember - baby steps. Also, just because an alcoholic abstains from a period of time, it does not mean they are in recovery. IMHO -Recovery takes a lot of time, effort and commitment. Peace.

justired

Petunia

Peaches,

I agree with Minnie - you took care of yourself - remember HALT (hungry, angry, lonenly, tired) tell us what we need to do. If we are tired, we need to rest then do the next right thing.

What a great way of handling the situation with you H. It set a great example for your children that you can tell people in a non-attacking way that their behavior is unacceptable. You nailed it - just because H doesn't get what he wants doesn't make you anything other than honest.

Your HP gave you the clarity to see the situation as it was last night and address it right then and there - you didn't wait until later - HURRAH!

You are making huge progress. Please continue to share with us so we can cheer you on.

Petunia

Peaches04

Hi everyone! Thanks so much for the encouragement and support! I am just sitting here trying to figure out what just happened and about to cry tears of joy... I typed my AH a long letter explaining what I had posted about above, was just about to send it..and he called to apologize for this morning. I told him I was about to send an email and he said "about what"... I started on and he kept getting defensive and doing the blame thing...the he said "you keep saying I'm an alcholic and I haven't drinken in 10 days, so I don't understand what you mean"... So, I explained that drinking is just a symptom of the disease, and that other symptoms include behavior patterns. And he said "like what"? And I said for example, your job pattern..and he started to defend himself, so I said just listen. So, I explained (to the best of my ability) characteristics and patterns of volatility, frequent job changes, selfishness, rash decision making, lashing out, not being accountable and how each in and of itself, could be explained away - but, when you put them all together and add the amount of beer he drinks AND the impact it's had on my behaviors... we are functioning in an alcholic marriage. There was a very long moment of silence - and then he started talking, and he 'got it'!! I think for the first time ever we talked about how he was confused and didn't know what to do and everything seemed out of control! It was the most meaningful conversation we've ever had...ever! It wasn't me preaching, screaming, or nagging - I was explaining how I was coping and what my recovery had done for me.. and he 'got it'. He is going to buy the AA book and we are going to find a counselor for him. I could tell you so much more..but, I know this has been too much already! Pray for me girls...and him.

Petunia

Prayers said and gratitudes spoken, Peaches. This is one for the gratitude list for sure.

Peace,
Petunia