Please help. Don't know what to do.
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
SeekingClarity......abuse is not about the alcoholism, as much as it is about entitlement and control......
The cycle of Abuse, typically, includes a period of "niceness" before the tension begins to build again, leading to another outburst.
I pray that you will listen to Lexie's words...she has worked in this field, day in-day out--for many years. She knows what she is talking about. While it is common to have self doubt, even when you KNOW the best thing to do...you can trust Lexie.
I also echo the advice to talk to ONLY those who have an understanding of these matters...mot people don't unless they have actually walked in your shoes!
Keep up what you are doing. seek the legal advice, by all means. Be ready to leave at a moment's notice.
Keep a low profile about your plans and try to act as "normal" as you possibly can.....
I hope you will keep posting and let us know how you are doing....
The cycle of Abuse, typically, includes a period of "niceness" before the tension begins to build again, leading to another outburst.
I pray that you will listen to Lexie's words...she has worked in this field, day in-day out--for many years. She knows what she is talking about. While it is common to have self doubt, even when you KNOW the best thing to do...you can trust Lexie.
I also echo the advice to talk to ONLY those who have an understanding of these matters...mot people don't unless they have actually walked in your shoes!
Keep up what you are doing. seek the legal advice, by all means. Be ready to leave at a moment's notice.
Keep a low profile about your plans and try to act as "normal" as you possibly can.....
I hope you will keep posting and let us know how you are doing....
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
I asked him if he would be willing to take some kind of anger management course or go to counseling but he said no.
bingo, there you go.
please know you haven't TALKED him down, or convinced him to change. he may act chagrined RIGHT NOW, but that WILL change. it's part of the Cycle of Abuse.and it's likely to escalate since he sees you getting stronger and him losing control of the situation.
i also agree no more "sharing" so openly with neighbors and the like. while well meaning, they are not professionals in the field of Domestic Violence and Alcohol Abuse, your neighbor believes all you need is a nice chat with the old man and all will be well. and after talking to her, you began to backtrack on your clarity. and let wishful thinking slip back in.
bingo, there you go.
please know you haven't TALKED him down, or convinced him to change. he may act chagrined RIGHT NOW, but that WILL change. it's part of the Cycle of Abuse.and it's likely to escalate since he sees you getting stronger and him losing control of the situation.
i also agree no more "sharing" so openly with neighbors and the like. while well meaning, they are not professionals in the field of Domestic Violence and Alcohol Abuse, your neighbor believes all you need is a nice chat with the old man and all will be well. and after talking to her, you began to backtrack on your clarity. and let wishful thinking slip back in.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,792
SC,
I am glad you feel like your conversation was good with your husband. But hon, nothing has changed. You have threatened to leave and he is not going to let you leave as that means he is losing the power over you and nobody is going to have his wife.
Women and children are hurt and killed daily by their spouse/parents. I fear for your safety. If at any time you smell alcohol on his breath would you please take the kids and leave, get out of the house. Do NOT take any chances, you have shown him your deck of cards and now and he is going to be watching every move you make. I know you are hoping that he will be a "good" boy, but he is an addict. Addicts have no choice but to drink. They need alcohol to survive like we need oxygen. He will get drunk and he will use what you said to him as fuel for his anger.
Please just go to the attorney and get out of the house. If its not for your safety it is for the children, he could hurt them just to get back at you. It is just not safe now that he knows what you are planning. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE pack your stuff and all of you need to get out.
I am glad you feel like your conversation was good with your husband. But hon, nothing has changed. You have threatened to leave and he is not going to let you leave as that means he is losing the power over you and nobody is going to have his wife.
Women and children are hurt and killed daily by their spouse/parents. I fear for your safety. If at any time you smell alcohol on his breath would you please take the kids and leave, get out of the house. Do NOT take any chances, you have shown him your deck of cards and now and he is going to be watching every move you make. I know you are hoping that he will be a "good" boy, but he is an addict. Addicts have no choice but to drink. They need alcohol to survive like we need oxygen. He will get drunk and he will use what you said to him as fuel for his anger.
Please just go to the attorney and get out of the house. If its not for your safety it is for the children, he could hurt them just to get back at you. It is just not safe now that he knows what you are planning. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE pack your stuff and all of you need to get out.
Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: east coast
Posts: 530
Keep in touch with the domestic abuse counselor and let them be your sounding board. Let them keep your confidences. I did trust in some good friends but I see now that wasn't the best idea. Be very careful what you pack. Only pack what he will not notice. Store what you pack elsewhere. I had a friend go through the house with me and help me. She said don't take books off the bookshelf - something will look wrong. We made a list of everything room by room and the big day, we used the list to move out what I needed while he was at work. As far as him refusing help, my STBXAH did too and only started seeing a counselor when I refused to have sex with him, then wouldn't let me talk to the counselor. He gave me this little CRUMB and expected me to come back to bed with him. He is still not taking responsibility, having remorse, or repairing. He just would toss me a crumb every now and then. I think you deserve to be happy safe and secure in your own home. we are here for you.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: East Coast
Posts: 1,235
Expecting Zen Buddhism to help him control his anger is like asking the Hoover Dam to hold back the Indian Ocean tsunami.
If he really wanted to figure out a way to address his abusive nature he would be doing anything and everything to do it. If he really wanted to prove to you that he wanted to be a safe partner for you, he would have listened to your request to go to anger management and counseling. But to me it sounds like he's hoping that a couple vague promises here and there will keep you in line.
I'm sure you've already done this, but I do hope that you changed your passwords on your email and SR accounts at the library or at the DV place.
And yes to Wisconsin's advice about the neighbor. When you wrote what she offered, my jaw literally dropped.
Rooting for you.
If he really wanted to figure out a way to address his abusive nature he would be doing anything and everything to do it. If he really wanted to prove to you that he wanted to be a safe partner for you, he would have listened to your request to go to anger management and counseling. But to me it sounds like he's hoping that a couple vague promises here and there will keep you in line.
I'm sure you've already done this, but I do hope that you changed your passwords on your email and SR accounts at the library or at the DV place.
And yes to Wisconsin's advice about the neighbor. When you wrote what she offered, my jaw literally dropped.
Rooting for you.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pa
Posts: 4,872
SC, I read this earlier in the day, and I have to tell you I did kind of freak out. I was feeling that knot in my stomach where I didn't want to eat. I think I was feeling the things that you were feeling the last few days.
ummm, I heard so many times that he was sorry and didn't want to scare me and didn't want to act like that. Mine actually did call a counselor and went, then invited me to go with him. I did meet this counselor alone, and I brought a tape recording of how he talked to me. The counselor told me, that is not the person that comes to see me, she also told me that he needed more help then just her..............and I can go on and on here but I won't.
I'll just talk about how happy I used to feel, when he said he was sorry, and he was "hoovering", and we had the honeymoon period.
I would finally be able to sleep for the night.
It didn't last long. I only felt OK for that day only. Next day I was anxiously awaiting the next outburst. I was walking on eggshells again..
I can also remember the times when the silent treatment would stop, and he would stop raging, and I don't know, I think most times, I didn't care about my life anymore. I was relaxed, and I told him everything that I thought, and I didn't care what he thought about it, because, I was so bad, I really didn't care if he killed me. That was how much I was hurting. To me, death was preferable then living like I was living.
I lived with it for over 26 years. It doesn't get better, it only gets worse.
The progression for me were the "I'm sorry", I don't know why you are still upset, I said I won't do it again.
then,
The presents started. Waterford Crystal along with the apology.
then,
He would say "I'm not going to even say I'm sorry, because you don't believe me anyway", while I was saying, I can't listen to your words anymore, I am watching your actions.
I really am asking you to really look at the posts here, reread them a lot, also reread your own posts.
I once read somewhere that only 2% of people who are abusive can change. Now I look at that percent and I don't know what to make of it. I think 2%. Then I think where did they do this study? Was it people that were seeking help for their abusive behaviors? How couldn't it be that. So, I am going to think that it is 2% of people who actually sought out treatment, that were able to stop.
I'm just really wishing you and your children well. I'm glad that you are taking the actions that you are taking.
(((((((((((hugs))))))))))
amy
ummm, I heard so many times that he was sorry and didn't want to scare me and didn't want to act like that. Mine actually did call a counselor and went, then invited me to go with him. I did meet this counselor alone, and I brought a tape recording of how he talked to me. The counselor told me, that is not the person that comes to see me, she also told me that he needed more help then just her..............and I can go on and on here but I won't.
I'll just talk about how happy I used to feel, when he said he was sorry, and he was "hoovering", and we had the honeymoon period.
I would finally be able to sleep for the night.
It didn't last long. I only felt OK for that day only. Next day I was anxiously awaiting the next outburst. I was walking on eggshells again..
I can also remember the times when the silent treatment would stop, and he would stop raging, and I don't know, I think most times, I didn't care about my life anymore. I was relaxed, and I told him everything that I thought, and I didn't care what he thought about it, because, I was so bad, I really didn't care if he killed me. That was how much I was hurting. To me, death was preferable then living like I was living.
I lived with it for over 26 years. It doesn't get better, it only gets worse.
The progression for me were the "I'm sorry", I don't know why you are still upset, I said I won't do it again.
then,
The presents started. Waterford Crystal along with the apology.
then,
He would say "I'm not going to even say I'm sorry, because you don't believe me anyway", while I was saying, I can't listen to your words anymore, I am watching your actions.
I really am asking you to really look at the posts here, reread them a lot, also reread your own posts.
I once read somewhere that only 2% of people who are abusive can change. Now I look at that percent and I don't know what to make of it. I think 2%. Then I think where did they do this study? Was it people that were seeking help for their abusive behaviors? How couldn't it be that. So, I am going to think that it is 2% of people who actually sought out treatment, that were able to stop.
I'm just really wishing you and your children well. I'm glad that you are taking the actions that you are taking.
(((((((((((hugs))))))))))
amy
Member
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 83
You already know what to do
Him not being able to recall what happened that night a year ago, doesn't nullify your experience. You were made to feel unsafe in your home with the one person in the whole world who you should ALWAYS feel safe with. He used the threat of waking up the kids to manipulate you. He knows you well and knows what to say to get you to do what he wants.
Another point I have to make, he loves you and from his view can't figure out for he life of him Why he would threaten you that way. I'm sure he doesn't remember it and I'm thinking this is why he is internally ending up at the conclusion that you MUST have done SOMETHING to upset him to be that angry. What he is forgetting, is that heavily drunk people have huge MOOD SWINGS and do not react proportionately.
My story. My father was abusive. Sober but abusive. Mostly to my mother but also to myself and my older sister and brother. I remember vividly like it was last night...The terror I felt the first time I saw my father in a rage. He was shouting and breaking a few things in the house. He threw an apple at the wall and the way it broke and spilled all the juice on the wall and dripped down. It was still there the next day. I think this might have been one time when my mother started to stop pleading with him and stop cleaning up things he broke. Because up until then I hadn't seen much. Fast forward to today. My mom tells me little bits here and there about how bad it really was. And it was bad. I never felt at ease around my dad and I rarely felt loved. In my mind I knew he loved me, but in my heart there was a lot of sadness surrounding my relationship with him. Even as a child. (My mother left him when I was 10yrs, my sister and brother 15&14years)
Without even have experienced the worst of it, I still feel a huge gratitude towards her for leaving him and taking us with her when she did. I recently told her this. She left him 17 years ago. She replied by telling me, wholeheartedly, that it meant a lot to hear that because she still sometimes wondered if it was the right thing to do...and if she maybe didn't deprive us of our father. I told her no way! I was so surprised this was on her mind. I see it more as she released us from a unpredictable man who had us living in fear and submission.
Normal is relative. My family was bad. Some families are much more harmonious. The main thing is....is it healthy? The relationships that form in a family will shape the people in that family and have a huge effect on everyone. He says it's normal to fight like this, maybe he grew up with this type of turmoil. But it isnt healthy. It took it's toll on him. My father's ways took their toll on me too. I think he needs professional help to work through some of that pain he may be carrying from the past. And from your posts, you seem to see this too. but there's nothing you or I or anyone else outside of him can do. Sounds like he is in denial about how much he needs/wants to drink. He's probably upset that he can't to drink at home anymore. And I think he will be internally in denial about that too, because to admit it bothers him, he has to admit to himself that he needs/wants alcohol that badly. And I totally think you made the right decision to tell him he can't drink in the house. It takes a lot of guts to stand up to someone who has made you feel so scared and you did it! :-) that is so rare and so amazing! You're strong!!!
Another point I have to make, he loves you and from his view can't figure out for he life of him Why he would threaten you that way. I'm sure he doesn't remember it and I'm thinking this is why he is internally ending up at the conclusion that you MUST have done SOMETHING to upset him to be that angry. What he is forgetting, is that heavily drunk people have huge MOOD SWINGS and do not react proportionately.
My story. My father was abusive. Sober but abusive. Mostly to my mother but also to myself and my older sister and brother. I remember vividly like it was last night...The terror I felt the first time I saw my father in a rage. He was shouting and breaking a few things in the house. He threw an apple at the wall and the way it broke and spilled all the juice on the wall and dripped down. It was still there the next day. I think this might have been one time when my mother started to stop pleading with him and stop cleaning up things he broke. Because up until then I hadn't seen much. Fast forward to today. My mom tells me little bits here and there about how bad it really was. And it was bad. I never felt at ease around my dad and I rarely felt loved. In my mind I knew he loved me, but in my heart there was a lot of sadness surrounding my relationship with him. Even as a child. (My mother left him when I was 10yrs, my sister and brother 15&14years)
Without even have experienced the worst of it, I still feel a huge gratitude towards her for leaving him and taking us with her when she did. I recently told her this. She left him 17 years ago. She replied by telling me, wholeheartedly, that it meant a lot to hear that because she still sometimes wondered if it was the right thing to do...and if she maybe didn't deprive us of our father. I told her no way! I was so surprised this was on her mind. I see it more as she released us from a unpredictable man who had us living in fear and submission.
Normal is relative. My family was bad. Some families are much more harmonious. The main thing is....is it healthy? The relationships that form in a family will shape the people in that family and have a huge effect on everyone. He says it's normal to fight like this, maybe he grew up with this type of turmoil. But it isnt healthy. It took it's toll on him. My father's ways took their toll on me too. I think he needs professional help to work through some of that pain he may be carrying from the past. And from your posts, you seem to see this too. but there's nothing you or I or anyone else outside of him can do. Sounds like he is in denial about how much he needs/wants to drink. He's probably upset that he can't to drink at home anymore. And I think he will be internally in denial about that too, because to admit it bothers him, he has to admit to himself that he needs/wants alcohol that badly. And I totally think you made the right decision to tell him he can't drink in the house. It takes a lot of guts to stand up to someone who has made you feel so scared and you did it! :-) that is so rare and so amazing! You're strong!!!
Member
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 83
You already know CONT.
By the sounds of it, you have questions about how you would go about leaving him, but not whether to leave him. The thing is, if you do leave, there are going to be services in your area that will help you, whether its a new job or any of the other things that will come up they will help you take it one step at a time. My mother got some help from Yellow Brick House. Family help wasn't an option. You shouldn't forget that your family will be the most loving place for you and your children to go to and be supported. If they seem unsure or hesitant, it's only because they just don't know what is going on in your home. But remember, you do!!!!
My mother told me about how in counselling she learned about abusive partners and techniques. And telling the victim that they're overreacting or remembering things wrong or that it wasn't as bad as they're making it out to be, are all classics. Please don't let him make you doubt yourself. You are way too smart for that!
You asking if you're unreasonabley scared? This kind of fear is different. If you and your 3 year old were out in a forest and a wild animal appeared, you might go into fight mode and want to do anything to fight the animal to protect your child. But the fear with a lover turned abusive is so different. There is an emotional layer of and love and if he were to hit you, it would betray all of that. And I am living with that anxiety right now. And you have much more history and foundation with your husband than I do with my boyfriend of a few years. So I can only imagine what you're going through. Much love and many hugs to you in this difficult situation!!!
When I told my older sister about how I thanked my mother for leaving my father... and how my mother had reacted, my sister said the only thing she could have done more right was to leave sooner. My father had targeted her much of her childhood. Lots of verbal and emotional abuse. She still has a TON of self-esteem and confidence issues. My brother got off a bit easier for being a boy, I guess, and I got off the easiest because I was the youngest, I think he felt guilty. But I as not left alone by any means. My father just had no control over his temper. He would snap so easily.
The fact that your husband drags the children in to accusations of you having a boyfriend is so horrible. In My Opinion, It's totally unacceptable from a parent.
I read all your posts but not necessarily all the replies. Sorry if I'm repeating anything that already been said. I'm so glad you are in contact with the domestic abuse hotline. I hope you are able o get to the library often and read on here. There is a lot to learn about how abuse works. Whether its the supplements, alcohol or nothing at all like in the case of my father.
Please take care. Hugs!!
We all care about what happens to someone with a soul as beautiful as yours!
My mother told me about how in counselling she learned about abusive partners and techniques. And telling the victim that they're overreacting or remembering things wrong or that it wasn't as bad as they're making it out to be, are all classics. Please don't let him make you doubt yourself. You are way too smart for that!
You asking if you're unreasonabley scared? This kind of fear is different. If you and your 3 year old were out in a forest and a wild animal appeared, you might go into fight mode and want to do anything to fight the animal to protect your child. But the fear with a lover turned abusive is so different. There is an emotional layer of and love and if he were to hit you, it would betray all of that. And I am living with that anxiety right now. And you have much more history and foundation with your husband than I do with my boyfriend of a few years. So I can only imagine what you're going through. Much love and many hugs to you in this difficult situation!!!
When I told my older sister about how I thanked my mother for leaving my father... and how my mother had reacted, my sister said the only thing she could have done more right was to leave sooner. My father had targeted her much of her childhood. Lots of verbal and emotional abuse. She still has a TON of self-esteem and confidence issues. My brother got off a bit easier for being a boy, I guess, and I got off the easiest because I was the youngest, I think he felt guilty. But I as not left alone by any means. My father just had no control over his temper. He would snap so easily.
The fact that your husband drags the children in to accusations of you having a boyfriend is so horrible. In My Opinion, It's totally unacceptable from a parent.
I read all your posts but not necessarily all the replies. Sorry if I'm repeating anything that already been said. I'm so glad you are in contact with the domestic abuse hotline. I hope you are able o get to the library often and read on here. There is a lot to learn about how abuse works. Whether its the supplements, alcohol or nothing at all like in the case of my father.
Please take care. Hugs!!
We all care about what happens to someone with a soul as beautiful as yours!
Member
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 83
P.s.
I agree with all the others about leaving your neighbors out of it. As much as there is a potential for benefit of having someone to talk out loud to.....there is a huge risk. Good intentions could end up meaning they try to "help" you and your husband work things out by feeding him details on how you feel. It could be totally good intentions and go totally wrong.
One LAST note. I have written too much....when you said you were getting in contact act with some help and we're glad to be able to finally say everything out loud. I can totally empathize with that, it's a huge weight off to say it out loud. Yay!
One LAST note. I have written too much....when you said you were getting in contact act with some help and we're glad to be able to finally say everything out loud. I can totally empathize with that, it's a huge weight off to say it out loud. Yay!
Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 612
SC,
Your story is earily similar to mine, down to the garbage can.
I have also been sucked back in after attempting to leave or make a stand. I even managed to get out with my three kids. Secretly got an apartment, slowly moved valuables and personal items over. Lived off of 1000 a month and food stamps. It was rough but not in a bad way. But I came back, and here I am on this forum again trying to figure out how to get out. Also dealing with the guilt of uprooting the kids' lives and hurting people.
If you have made it out, stay out. Don't get hoovered back in. It is a million times worse to tackle this round two. I'm rooting for you.
Your story is earily similar to mine, down to the garbage can.
I have also been sucked back in after attempting to leave or make a stand. I even managed to get out with my three kids. Secretly got an apartment, slowly moved valuables and personal items over. Lived off of 1000 a month and food stamps. It was rough but not in a bad way. But I came back, and here I am on this forum again trying to figure out how to get out. Also dealing with the guilt of uprooting the kids' lives and hurting people.
If you have made it out, stay out. Don't get hoovered back in. It is a million times worse to tackle this round two. I'm rooting for you.
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