The A who wonders, "What's YOUR problem??"

Old 09-27-2016, 07:53 PM
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The A who wonders, "What's YOUR problem??"

I have an Abf that disappears out of the blue, for about a week at a time, on binges where he drinks alone in his bedroom until he is near death. He does this repeatedly and I typically fall apart during this time; lose sleep, appetite, work suffers, depression and anxiety are the norm 24/7 for me while he is binging. The thing is, once he is back and detoxed, cleaned up with life pieced back together again like a cat with 100 billion lives and in the "whew! Can't do THAT again! what a wake up call!, I will never hurt you again!" phase, he struggles to allow me time to heal. In fact, he doesn't at all. He instead bounces back from his wagon fall and I am still hurting from picking up the pieces.

He came off the last binge one week ago. He is back to old promises and expecting me to be the same happy camper that I usually am when he comes back. For the first time I am not. Or I should say, for the first time I am not pretending to be. While I am not choosing to end the relationship at this time, I am choosing to care more about myself and allow myself to heal from the trauma that has accumulated in the last year. This means that I am not sending him sweet texts or pretending things are great and we are in love and doing awesome. It is not to punish by any means, but instead to slow down. My body is no longer letting me physically return to 'the way it was'. My body is saying - THIS IS A PROBLEM THAT WE CANNOT KEEP REPEATING OR YOU WILL DIE NEXT TIME AND I WILL BE ADMITTED TO A LOONY BIN. This simply means that I am showing him my real feelings by saying - I love you, but I cannot bounce back like you because I hurt and that is okay to show. I am healing, and that is ok too. I am taking my time in letting you earn back my trust and respect - you have to work for it now. Not as punishment, but because it's left me. You don't just get it when you come back like you always have and like I always gave it to you. For the first time I'm putting my feelings first.

Has anyone else experienced this with their A? I have to remember that they tend to be a selfish bunch. But instead of your A viewing you as cold and cruel for dialing down the affection while you heal, do they ever just accept what they have done and actually acknowledge that they need to work to get that love back? Actually, I think that's one of the 12 Steps and signal that my A is not ready to change.

Seems he has became so use to my doors being open with a smile he is a bit shell shocked this time.
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Old 09-27-2016, 07:57 PM
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Most do not-unless they enter real recovery. My ex used to berate me for not being more affectionate-I was before the awful actions started to bury me and like you, I no longer bounced back. Then I was berated and made fun of for Hurting. It is not a life-or love-it's survival of abuse. Please keep coming back and realize there is nothing YOU can do to make him see. He is what he is.
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Old 09-27-2016, 08:05 PM
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Thank you @thephoenixrises. Calling the police on someone you love, learning they cheated on you, lied, having to go scoop them up in their own urine, vomit, and feces after they holed up in a hell hole for a week drinking themselves to death, destroying your apartment, verbally abusing you, and then doing it on a regular basis for the last year, all while married to another woman with a child he never sees (separated) and unable to divorce and face responsibility, the addict still becomes frustrated that I am not OK post- binge.

We are so emeshed in what he always professes is the greatest love he's ever known, yet the damage he brings me makes it hard to see the forest for the trees. More so, this sadness in me that he still doesn't understand what he has done. How many opportunities we give the one we love who is incapable of loving us maturely in the way we deserve.
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Old 09-27-2016, 08:08 PM
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Hey Smarie, this is pretty typical behavior of alcoholics. In a way, they are mentally ill and can't see/understand the hurt they do.

I haven't read any other of your posts so pardon me if you have already done this but have you been to alanon? The most revolutionary thing you can do here is take care of yourself, learn about codependency/alcoholism and change the things you can.
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Old 09-27-2016, 08:15 PM
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Thanks Bekindalways - I am in the Alanon program and have an excellent therapist. In fact, part of my showing him my true feelings after this last relapse is largely due to being involved in Alanon and finding the strength to detach and lose the fear that kept me pretending everything was okay for so long. I guess it being the first time I am not hiding between a smile, I was taken a back by his selfish reaction.

Look forward to sharing in my Thursday meeting. thank you so much!
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Old 09-28-2016, 03:27 AM
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Hi Smarie, I'm glad you're no longer pretending everything is fine. I'm wondering whether he knows specifically why you're acting this way? You might be coming across as passive aggressive.
Have you spelt it out to him? Men in general prefer direct statements, and with an alcoholic you might have to be even more blunt.
Even better than withdrawing, next time he goes on a binge don't rescue him. The message will be loud and clear.
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Old 09-28-2016, 04:14 AM
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It takes time to recover from traumatic events, and while in his head, he feels fine and wants things to be "normal", it's only natural for you to be more cautious - after all, this sounds like a recurring theme. I don't know much about true recovery, but I would think that it would involve some measure of understanding that the other party went thru while the A was checked out. I'm afraid I don't know if there's any way to convince your partner that you're not punishing him by being distant, but protecting yourself from future disappointment :-(
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Old 09-28-2016, 05:11 AM
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Hello smarie,

I am just so sorry for all that you have lived through!! It sounds like a nightmare and one that you are finally acknowledging for yourself.

I hope and pray that you will really know that you deserve a much better life! Please take good care!!
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Old 09-28-2016, 05:17 AM
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Hey, Smarie. Welcome. Glad you are going to Al-Anon and are in therapy. Both will be integral to your life going forward. sadly, my experience has been that Alcohol-dependent people don't change as long as they don't have to change. That is, until they recognize the consequences of their actions and want, somehow, to stop drinking. As you know, enabling is an insidious thing. Tough to know when to stop. It sounds to me like you are getting there. His behavior is not normal. That you have become unhappy with it is. Keep going to meetings and therapy sessions. It will likely get worse before it gets better. Put yourself first. Peace.
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Old 09-28-2016, 06:55 AM
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Thank you @thephoenixrises. Calling the police on someone you love, learning they cheated on you, lied, having to go scoop them up in their own urine, vomit, and feces after they holed up in a hell hole for a week drinking themselves to death, destroying your apartment, verbally abusing you, and then doing it on a regular basis for the last year, all while married to another woman with a child he never sees (separated) and unable to divorce and face responsibility, the addict still becomes frustrated that I am not OK post- binge.
At some point it stops being all about them and their behaviors and it becomes all about us and ours.

I'm glad you are in therapy and attending al-anon and posting here.
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Old 09-28-2016, 07:13 AM
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Part of learning how to set boundaries for me was to understand that I had no control over how someone reacted to my boundaries. They are about me and what type of behavior I will accept in my life and relationships.

I think in this case your boundary of no more enabling is also the kindest, most loving thing you can do for this man. It's finally giving him the opportunity to take action to fix his own life and stand on his own, if he chooses it. We can learn a lot by stepping away from the chaos and watching those choices from a distance.

I learned that despite my ex's words about love and devotion to me and our son, his actions proved that continuing to drink uninterrupted and without consequences was actually his first priority. He was devoted to the bottle, above all things, and of course while I was running around fixing things for him and taking care of him I was his "soul mate." That changed when I started enforcing boundaries, in a very rapid and unpleasant way.

It was extremely hurtful at the time. I was sad and angry- with him and with myself. But it ended up being the best thing that could have happened to me. Today I've rebuilt my life, I'm applying to grad school, the kids and I live in a peaceful home, I'm in a relationship with a caring, respectful, responsible man. None of that would happened if I had stayed stuck believing my ex's words when his actions proved over and over that what he said meant nothing.

Glad you're starting to take care of yourself. It will give you benefits beyond anything you can imagine right now. Keep coming back.
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Old 09-28-2016, 07:36 AM
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Thank you @thephoenixrises. Calling the police on someone you love, learning they cheated on you, lied, having to go scoop them up in their own urine, vomit, and feces after they holed up in a hell hole for a week drinking themselves to death, destroying your apartment, verbally abusing you, and then doing it on a regular basis for the last year, all while married to another woman with a child he never sees (separated) and unable to divorce and face responsibility, the addict still becomes frustrated that I am not OK post- binge.

So, what is it that you love about him? If all of the above is true, what is he doing for you? What does he bring to the table other than that ^^^? What would you tell your best friend or sister if they came to you with this?
It's exhausting, isn't it? Step away and look in. How do you see your life in a year from now?
There will come a day when you will be just sooooo mentally drained from all this chaos. Thankfully it sounds like it's going to be sooner than later. Know this, there is NOTHING you can do or say that is going to make him " see the light " until HE is ready. NOTHING. Think about these questions I posed to you. You don't have to answer them on this forum but please just think about them.
There is so much more to life than cleaning up someone else's mess. I know you deserve better, you don't know but I know. Keep posting. We are here for you!
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Oh and P.S. Cheating is a whole other issue. Don't mix the two.
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Old 09-28-2016, 08:41 AM
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your abf is quite deep in his addiction......and to date, you have enabled that process......i doubt that you simply not being as "emotionally involved" is going to serve as his wake up call.

kicking his @ss to the curb probably wouldn't do it either.....but it would sure help YOU out. and see that is where the shift in your thinking needs to continue to progress...........about what is best for YOU. and NOTHING you have shared about this "relationship" sounds good or healthy for you. he is not a fixer up or a home improvement project.

he has shown you repeatedly and quite demonstrably what HE is about.

honey, HE IS MARRIED. he has a child. you can't really accuse him of cheating ON you, as he is cheating WITH you.

what do you hope to happen here???
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Old 09-28-2016, 08:54 AM
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Yeah, I think boundaries and stopping pulling the wool over everyone's eyes, including our own often ramp things up with them.

Their only level of realization there, is that their old tactics don't work, and they need to try harder to get things back to where they used to be, so they can keep living their lives the way they want to.

If you are detaching and taking care of you in hopes that he will wake up, you are probably in for as much disappointment as you would be if he quit drinking, just to save your relationship.

It just doesn't work that way.

The most honest I think I ever was in my 5 year relationship with an alcoholic came at the end - 'I have to leave because your drinking combined with my personality turns us both into crazy people.'

That was when I finally admitted TO ME that I needed to take care of myself - and I finally meant it.

And he was shocked.
And he quit drinking!
For maybe 50 something days.
And then I went no contact, because I was finally serious, and desperate enough to change it.
And he moved someone else into his place a few weeks later. THAT is how serious he was about quitting drinking, for us.

Be careful if you are hoping that taking care of you will lead him to change.
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Old 09-28-2016, 09:51 AM
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Awesome and truly inspiring words. Yes, beyond the drinking there are so many other terrible behaviors. He has been separated from his wife and child for nearly 3 years and just finances their expenses (she is just starting to work). I knew that getting involved with a separated man was not a smart thing, but I was naïve and assumed the divorce was around the corner (dumb girl 101!)

His life is comfortable only because of me. He finances them so he doesn't have to deal with it (something I find inner resentment with because he does not see his son, another thing I blame on his addiction but then say to myself, why does he seem to have so much time to spend with me??) and then cuddles up to me, someone who is close to the brink of not dealing with it any longer. Even if he didn't have the addiction, this would be grounds to walk away. This I know, and I am moving in that direction, albeit slowly.

Cheating on me hurt very much and somehow I became manipulated into thinking it was his disease that caused it or because he was so insecure he did it, which is what he told me...or the classic "I cheated because I thought you were cheating". The first time I found out, I was traveling out of state to a wedding with my sister. Days leading up to it he was terrified I would cheat while I was out there, despite the fact that I have no history of cheating nor ever had a temptation. Coming home to him passed out with a bottle and an explicit text message from her was like a knife to the tummy.

I have to keep reminding myself that while Alcoholism is a disease, these are still accountable adults capable of making choices to get better. I often times find myself putting all his actions on "disease" which makes it much easier to forgive. But as my sister likes to say, if you found out he was a child abuser because he was abused as a boy, would you stay with him? There are a myriad of reasons why people do what they do, but at the end of the day, these are actions they choose to carry out.

I'm getting close....
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Old 09-28-2016, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Smarie78 View Post
Has anyone else experienced this with their A? I have to remember that they tend to be a selfish bunch. But instead of your A viewing you as cold and cruel for dialing down the affection while you heal, do they ever just accept what they have done and actually acknowledge that they need to work to get that love back? Actually, I think that's one of the 12 Steps and signal that my A is not ready to change.

Seems he has became so use to my doors being open with a smile he is a bit shell shocked this time.
It's been many moons here. Still no acknowledgement, just sanity created through distance and no contact. I wouldn't have it any other way.
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Old 09-28-2016, 02:06 PM
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This behaviour is not only typical, it seems to be a mandatory of any "respectable" A.

I went through this for years with XAH, and now going through it again. To the point of him pointing out error of my ways and how I contributed to divorce. I responded that yes, I filed it because he drank, drove out son drunk, cheated, and I no longer could have him for my life partner. He responded with tirade of how I abused him for years. Example of abuse was me reminding him to deal with his student loans was considered abuse. Because "I was so negative". I did not hug him enough. I made him drink. I did not respond much just said ok.

The whole dialogue ended up with him in tears.

Oh and his debt collectors are still calling me, and I was called a "cold awful B@ch" for giving them his new number.

It is a long hard road.

Step far far away from this married messed up man, he has nothing he can give you. Stay away for a while - you will gain a whole new perspective.

You deserve much more than this!
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Old 09-28-2016, 02:19 PM
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i think you can really judge a person's character in how they treat children and pets.
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Old 09-28-2016, 05:24 PM
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Oh Anvil Girl. You hit the nail right on the head!
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Old 09-28-2016, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Smarie78 View Post
Has anyone else experienced this with their A? I have to remember that they tend to be a selfish bunch. But instead of your A viewing you as cold and cruel for dialing down the affection while you heal, do they ever just accept what they have done and actually acknowledge that they need to work to get that love back? Actually, I think that's one of the 12 Steps and signal that my A is not ready to change.
I used to experience it as well. My AXW often made a point of telling me that I shouldn't take what she did or said while drunk seriously - that I should just forget it the next morning and everything would be peachy between us. I'd get the drunken rants/arguments, you know the ones where they follow you through the house from room to room when you try to get away, and won't leave you alone at 3am because they have something 'urgent' to discuss. And then I'd get blamed for being too emotionally distant in the aftermath, because I wasn't supposed to let it bother me. I was doing something wrong by being hurt by inappropriate/hurtful behavior.

Yes, it seems insane, but it happens. Addiction breeds chaos.

But you know what? While losing our marriage was the single most heartbreaking moment in my life, staying together would have ended up much worse for me. I don't know about your A, but mine was one of the ones that would get upset if I didn't drink with her. She'd claim that I must not be having fun if I didn't have a drink in my hand, which would get her going and lead to some kind of rant later on in the evening. So while it's already tough enough staying calm and detached and dealing with stress when in a relationship with an A, adding in alcohol to the mix on my side of the equation just makes things that much harder to deal with. Had we stayed together, it's very possible that I could have ended up becoming an alcoholic as well!

The point I'm trying to get to is that misery loves company. Someone who is allowing their addiction to control their life and doesn't want to change, doesn't see the need for change, and shows no signs of changing, will drag the people around them down without even meaning to - whether or not they acknowledge that their actions hurt the important people in their life. My ex wife certainly acknowledged that she hurt me and didn't want to. Many times! Almost a weekly event. But willing to do work to regain those feelings of love? Not a snowball's chance in a bonfire. To her, it was my job to suck it up and look past the abuse, my problem that I couldn't flip a switch and be her prince charming 24/7.
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