Misguided

Something else?

I'm so confused reading different articles (and sometimes forum threads).

So how are we supposed to treat the A in our lives?

Do we give "tough love" only to have to deal with anger either from the A or within us?

Do we try to be empathetic (without enabling) to that it is something the A has not yet realized what it's doing to them and the people that love them?

Do we continue to try to suggest they need help in the nicest way possible?

Do we just cut them off because every conversation seems pointless, full of lies (that the A thinks we can't see through) or they won't remember what was said anyway?

I have been on the A side of the fence. It doesn't help me at all in this situation because I'm not in this particular A's head, but I don't want to leave them with no hope. I think my rock bottom would have been a lot worse if it weren't for the few ppl that stayed on my tail about getting my act together.

How do you find the right choice or balance from the above without becoming co-dependent, an enabler or feeling guilty if you have to cut off someone you love?????

PuzzledHeart

I've been REALLY struggling with this idea with my sister. I'm at the edge of cutting her off. I've never been on the A side of the fence, but I come from a family of enablers and rugsweepers, so if anything I tend to swing too hard the other way, and harden my heart because I'm afraid that if I leave myself vulnerable I'll get hurt once again.

I've been really thinking about the idea of compassion lately - if true compassion comes from respect, an acknowledgment that you see spunk/moxie/grit in somebody, as opposed to pity. I'm beginning to think that the unrepentant addict relies on your pity, as opposed to your respect, to obtain the "help" he/she needs.

It's hard to tell, especially if the addiction has been going on for a while, if a person TRULY wants to get better, or if they're BSing you just to shut you up. Sometimes I think you just get to the point where you're just way too tired to fight your addict anymore, and you need to have somebody else who is fresh, who doesn't have that history, take your place.

maia1234

So how are we supposed to treat the A in our lives? An Alcoholic is a child of God. Everyone deserves respect

Do we give "tough love" only to have to deal with anger either from the A or within us? Depending about what your tough love is. Punishing them and hurting them some how is not tough love. Tough love is like setting up boundaries (I will not call you in if you don't go to work. I will not drive you to got get alochol if you are drunk)

Do we try to be empathetic (without enabling) to that it is something the A has not yet realized what it's doing to them and the people that love them? You treat him as an adult and with respect. He will not realize his disease till he hits rock bottom and that rock bottom has to be a really bad thing. A's some how can hit a lower and lowerbottom .

Do we continue to try to suggest they need help in the nicest way possible? IMO, no. Has it worked the other 10,000 times that you have mentioned it? Its probably not going to work this time either. I tried for 34 years, never worked for my AXH.

Do we just cut them off because every conversation seems pointless, full of lies (that the A thinks we can't see through) or they won't remember what was said anyway? I learned never to engage with an A when he was drinking. You are speaking 2 different languages. You don't understand them, they don't understand you. Walk a way, leave the room, house, town or state. Don't waste your breath. I wouldn't waste it in the am either because they are hung over and are very crabby.


I have been on the A side of the fence. It doesn't help me at all in this situation because I'm not in this particular A's head, but I don't want to leave them with no hope. I think my rock bottom would have been a lot worse if it weren't for the few ppl that stayed on my tail about getting my act together. He knows what he needs to do, he is an adult. Treat him with respect and dignity. You need to help yourself. His alcoholism has consumed way to much of your time. Hit an alanon meeting or an open AA meeting. Educate yourself about addiction. I have not meet one person on the A forum that said my significant other nagged me enough that I wanted to be sober. I wish it worked that way, but it doesn't. If you are concerned about having hope for him, tell him you love him but will not watch him slowly kill himself. You will always be there if he needs help.

How do you find the right choice or balance from the above without becoming co-dependent, an enabler or feeling guilty if you have to cut off someone you love????? You start taking care of yourself and leave him to figure this out on his own. Education, Education, Education!!

Hugs my friend, great questions and good luck on Your recovery!! This is a horrible disease that make us crazy and we don't have the disease. You are very concerned about your addict, but enabling him has helped him get where he is today. Step back, work on you and it will all fall into place the way God a planned it too!!

Misguided

@Puzzledheart -- For me cutting this person off would be virtually impossible since it is my DH's mom. He would have to do so first and the way we handle things are completely different from each other. He is very much a rug sweeper and people pleaser. I guess that's what makes this harder for me. The more she sends me messages, the worse I feel if I don't respond. At the same time, I'm nervous to respond with something not so nice.

DH has said I can say whatever I want to her, but the other night he was on the phone with her (she was drunk) and asked to speak with me bc she didn't want to hear his lecturing. He looked at me and said he'd rather me not talk to her. I'm not entirely sure of his reason. He did know I wouldn't have been nice on that particular night.

@maia1234 Thanks for all of your advice. This is not my husband and I am already in my own weekly therapy that I've decided Al-Anon is not something I need to add right now. I believe my DH and his grandmother should look into meetings because of the parts they play in this. I also think I'd have a better chance at winning the lottery over that happening. :-\

From the little I can see, hear or otherwise regarding this situation, they are all rugsweepers (to a degree) while complaining about how much drama is going on. I cannot stand for someone to lie to me so responding to her made up stories without telling her I know she's lying is getting harder by the day.

AnvilheadII

your husband does not need to cut his mother off just because YOU wish to no longer engage...........this is about you and her. if YOU don't want to speak with her, you don't HAVE to. you are not obligated to respond to emails. if she's anything like my mom was in her later stages of the disease, it's all incoherent rambling anyways.

Misguided

That is not at all what I'm saying or even suggesting!!!

However his indecisiveness in how he wants to handle it while he keeps relaying information to me keeps me involved. I'm also involved by default since I am married to him. I can tell him I don't want to hear it until I'm blue in the face...that doesn't stop it.

Also this isn't just emails. It includes texts and phone calls and when he doesn't answer his phone, then mine starts blowing up. (Not just from her but also from his grandmother)

The reason why this is affecting me so badly is bc her and I were close. She just got like this over the past couple years. We aren't talking about her being belligerent since the day I met her.

AnvilheadII

ok, i'm sorry - i guess i'm not quite getting what it is you are asking....

you can detach from HER and you can also detach from your husband's relationship WITH his mother. it's about YOUR boundaries.

i know how awful it is to watch alcoholism take somebody down. and how you just want to shake them and say dammit, STOP!!!!

does your husband get any counseling or attend Alanon? Do you?

LexieCat

Anvil's exactly right. Your husband is responsible for navigating his own relationship with his mother. Al-Anon would be great for both of you, but the only one you can take to a meeting is YOU. You can invite him along, and tell him how it's helping you (assuming it does), but that's it. The ball is squarely in HIS court as far as his relationship with her goes. You can reassure him that he isn't a bad son to step AWAY from the insanity, but that's as far as I'd go. You're also well within your rights to say you don't care to hear about the drama anymore--there are ways he can set his own boundaries, but he has to be willing to do that.

Misguided

or this:

I know the above won't work but I go round and round in my head on how I should react to her.

My question really is to find out how people handled someone that wasn't exactly that easy to cut off. My goal isn't to cut anyone off (even though it can be warranted). This seems to be some horrible part of life that you get thrown into with no control over.

My "problem" isn't my husband and my goal isn't to create marital problems by detaching from his family and/or him because of how he chooses to handle it or that his mom has managed to slip into this addiction. He dealt with my addiction and recovery roller coaster for 5 years so I don't plan on detaching and having him think I don't care.

We have to see her in less than a month for a weekend family gathering. I'm anxious about how this is going to go (ON MY REACTION PART) because while I can delay answering the phone and messages, I have no clue how I'm going to react if she pulls one of her drunken & aggressive nights while we are there. We haven't seen her act this way in person as of yet, but everyone else's stories confirm this happens often.

To answer you about Al-Anon, etc -- getting him to any kind of therapy is virtually impossible with his view on therapy. I am in my own therapy right now, but it's a specific for PTSD and veering off prolongs my healing. I don't know if I can add al-anon in as my therapist didn't confirm that it would be ok to add to the amount of work/time this current therapy requires.

It really is horrible that one person's problems can cause so much turmoil in the lives and homes of others.

SparkleKitty

I'm not clear on how detaching MUST equal you not caring. If your husband cannot understand that people are allowed to protect themselves from the consequences of another's behavior, then the issue is between you and your husband.

You have gotten a lot of response on how to handle someone who isn't easy to cut off, but it seems that none of them are what you are looking for. Beyond detachment, no one can give you the tools to change her behavior. Or your husband's.

Yes, it is horrible that one person's problems can cause so much turmoil in the lives and homes of others but only to the degree that others allow it.

LexieCat

Al-Anon isn't "therapy"--it's a way to exchange experience, strength and hope with others who have dealt with the same issues. It's like taking golf lessons if you're learning to golf so you don't keep making the same mistakes. Being in a group of people who can help you learn the skills can be very helpful and also make you feel less like you're the only one coping with this kind of thing.

Oh, and detaching does not equal "not caring"--it's simply REMOVING yourself from the chaos, which is very easy to get sucked into if you are enmeshed with it. It's not taking things personally, sometimes walking away. "Sorry, I have to go now," is a perfectly legitimate statement. You can realize you're not OBLIGATED to listen to someone insult you or trample on your rights. That's what detachment is.

Misguided

I realize this forum is "take what you need and leave the rest" but really, it shouldn't apply to reading and responding.

I'm not turning down helpful information, however, my initial post was more along the lines of how do people here handle things with their addict when the above is basically what we have to work with.

One response referred to it as my husband that is the addict. Some of that doesn't apply in my situation, but I'm not upset about it. I still understood where they were going with it. (Possibly I was confused with someone else on the forum - no biggie)

Then it was said I expect my husband to cut his mother off - which is not what I said nor do I think my 1st post implied that. The post that mentioned it was in response to someone cutting off their relative.

No, Al-Anon isn't a true medical therapy, but for all intents and purposes, the definition of therapy is close enough that it is a form of it.

I, personally, can't do the Al-anon meeting thing right now (expressed above) and I'm well aware I can't make anyone else attend them so I've looked here for experiences and support FOR ME.

The only thing I was "looking for" is engaged conversation from the 100's of people that hang around here. For me, right now, this forum is what I have decided to use as a resource because it's what I CAN do, but I feel like I'm now getting beat up over my follow up post that was just a response to other's.

Maybe no one has experience with how to find the balance between those things above which is fine, but I find that hard to believe. I didn't realize I HAD to have one question and pick one answer to be my absolute solution so the thread can just die. My apologies...

Moderators can do what they want with this thread at this point.

LexieCat

If I were a guest in someone's home and they became "drunk and aggressive" toward me, I would LEAVE. I can't think of any reason to subject myself to that.

You asked for suggestions about how to deal with it. That's mine.

There will be other family members there, you said. You could ask to stay with one of them, or stay at a hotel and show up for the gathering. There's no way to make it not socially awkward if your MIL treats you like dirt. If you choose to go, knowing what you might experience, I'd have a good "Plan B" in place just in case.

hopeful4

The qualifier in my life is my X. He also had some very unhealthy and mentally ill family members. I handled my X when we were together in that I tried to detatch as much as possible. Do things w/my kids w/out him if he had been drinking. Don't engage in fighting, as it was pointless and only upset everyone, including my kids. When he was present and not drinking, I did engage with him at that point. I did realize that having conversation after conversation about his issues was a waste. I had one conversation with him in the end, saying, if this continues, I am done. Then, when it continued, I was done. Made him leave.

As far as his mentally ill family, I sort of did the same. I did not engage w/them if I could see she was in the throes of it. If not, I did engage as pleasantly as possible. I did at one point tell her she needed help, and offered to help her find it. She was not responsive, so we never talked about it again. Eventually, I had to cut her out of our lives. Her behavior became so toxic and damaging to everyone that we all sort of decided at once to just not have any contact w/her any longer. She still tries with me sometimes, I just ignore the phone calls.

Is it possible to reach out to other family/friends who will be there and let them know your fears? Sometimes just reaching out and having that support system will make you feel better about things. And ultimately, just take it one day at a time. One thing I have learned is that I have spent a lot more time dreading what was coming than the actual trauma of the event itself. I am REALLY bad about this and am getting ready to go back to therapy myself.

I have been trying to listen to some TedTalks on anxiety/stress, and am reading Overload by Joyce Meyer. These things are helping me cope.

Hugs to you. I am so sorry you are put in this situation, but glad you are here at SR and hope any of this helps you!