jenniferlynne76

Thank you for the recommendation, dandylion. I will definitely be checking that out!

jenniferlynne76

Bluelily,
So much of what you've written resonates with me. I *wish* he'd just end things. It would make my life so much easier. But I am wise enough to realize that will never happen. He's too busy using and manipulating me to simply let me go.

A friend of mine is staying in Paris for a few months and invited me for a visit. I'm working with my employer now to see if I can arrange to take a week off to take her up on it. I have a number of unused airmiles and as long as I can arrange for my flight soon it will cost me a "whopping" $88! A once in a lifetime opportunity to be sure! As long as I can find someone to watch the boys (my kitties) I'm definitely going to do it! When I mentioned it to him last weekend he about went apesh$& on me. Like it was a horrible thing to request some time off of work for me to go enjoy some culture, spend some time with a friend and take a much needed and long overdue break. Honestly, I don't care what he thinks. Unless my boss says I can't go, I'll be going! Let's be honest about why he's REALLY ticked about me doing this though: I won't be around for a week for him to use and abuse.

Tonight I realized: I want him out of my life. I shared stories with a woman at a salon I go to who shared with me that her brother died of a heroin overdose. It was a sad story, but all too familiar, and she told me "Honestly, given the way he lived his life, he's better off where he is now." I could relate.

He called me after work. The conversation started nicely enough. But then I felt/heard the shift. We went from him telling me about his day to him ignoring me as I told him about mine. The snide comments began to creep in, and I realized: he was cleaning up his place as he was talking to me ... and he was drinking. I excused myself from the call and said goodnight.

Then my cats curled up on my lap as I pet them contentedly and watched a TV program I'd recorded. They were at peace. I was at peace in this new home I've created for us. And I was reminded of honeypig's "out of the briar patch" post. It's time for me to crawl out of mine. It's going to take a bit of time to figure out the best way for me to do that. But it's time. I'm tired of this rude, condescending jerk ruining my peace.

Thank you for letting me ramble and for your continued support...all of you.

Berrybean

Okay, how does this sound.
" Hi. It's me. Look I'm going to keep this short because I really don't want an argument, and this isn't something that's up for discussion. I've been thinking about how our relationship is going, and to be completely honest, it isn't something that is makes me feel any kind of happiness or security any more. I do still care about you as a friend, and wish you well, but it would be irresponsible of me to carry on being in contact with you because I have to look after myself. Just like you have to look after yourself. After all we are adults. "

And no. He won't like it. But there is no real happy way to end a relationship. As long as it's done in an honest way, and with as little mud-slinging as possible, that's all you can do.

Obviously if he has stuff round at your place, maybe drop it round before you make the call, or make arrangements for it to be held somewhere away from you. And be ready to block his number and Facebook etc.

redatlanta

He called me after work. The conversation started nicely enough. But then I felt/heard the shift. We went from him telling me about his day to him ignoring me as I told him about mine. The snide comments began to creep in, and I realized: he was cleaning up his place as he was talking to me ... and he was drinking. I excused myself from the call and said goodnight.

Its important to recognize that alcohol is not solely at the core of his issues. Alcoholism doesn't make someone disinterested in speaking about another life, sharing things, being interested in things other than themselves (if they are a deep level alcoholic that is drunk 24/7 that's a different situation). You might also be dealing with a personality disorder, or mental issues. If so these won't change easily, if ever. If you get tired of him talking about himself all the time, being disinterested in your life, and making snide comments to you about you, or things you want to do that's not alcohol, that's all him. "Its all about me" seems to be a theme here. YAWN.

jenniferlynne76

While I don't believe he's always all that interested in what I have to say, it's one of his tells. It just starts with him getting quiet (while he's drinking) and then if the alcohol has kicked in, one of two things happens. Either he'll say "Am I talking, or are you talking?!" Especially if I share in any part of a conversation where I've asked him a question. Or he'll just completely ignore me until we change topics. And then he starts talking like...well, like a drunk. Some of this can be chalked up to him being a jerk. And I do believe the alcohol has affected his mind. But what I experienced last night was normal behavior for him about an hour after pint glass full of vodka. (His standard definition of "one drink.")

jenniferlynne76

It sounds good. It sounds almost too easy. LOL Could it really be *that* simple?!

bluelily

This was a theme with my XABf too, I thought it was all part of alcoholism. I noticed quite soon in the relationship that he had no interest whatsoever in me as a person, only in the part of my life that had to do with him. He was perfectly comfortable talking about himself all the time, and on the few ocassions I wanted to tell him about some (minor) problems I had had he basically told me he wouldn´t solve them so he didn´t want anything to hear about it. Another thing that got on my nerves was that whenever I expressed interest in him, asking him something about his day, he would answer "I don´t respond to questions", like it was some sort of interrogation. I really thought this was part of some alcoholic mentality, now I´m thinking he´s just a jerk.

jenniferlynne76

I'm thinking so too! LOL I can honestly say ABF has never told me that he doesn't answer questions or anything of that nature. It sucks that he treated you that way. And it seems like narcissism plays a role in this for many...

Yurt

I remember those days...The only times that my XAH tolerated me talking about issues that concerned me, or about my day, were when he could turn the conversations into mini self-improvement courses. "Do you see why I hate when you do that?" It was if I was one of his restoration projects.

jenniferlynne76

Ooh Yurt... I've heard that one when he's drinking (or wants to be drinking and is looking for an excuse to leave my place or have me leave his) for sure!!!

Ariesagain

Beccybean's post as usual is spot on...the only thing you might want to reconsider is, "I still care about you as a friend," because to an addict that's a loophole they can drive a truck through to continue as usual, and second...is it true? Do you really want this guy around as a friend or anything else?

Maybe you'll need that to sugar coat things, you know him...

Berrybean

Yeah. I wondered about that as well - even with the bit after saying no contact, he might just latch onto that friend bit. Maybe it should have been more, although in an ideal world I WOULD have liked to continue to be friends. ..??

honeypig

JL, one of the things that happened regularly w/XAH and I was that I'd tell him about something. Not something necessarily of earth-shaking importance, but just the kind of day-to-day exchanges you have with friends and family. When I'd make reference to this thing later (an hour, a day, a week), he'd stare at me blankly. I'd say "I told you about this, remember?" and immediately he'd get defensive and snide. The go-to response from him was "well, I guess it just wasn't important enough for me to commit to memory." The alternate excuse was "well, you talk so much, how am I supposed to know what's important and what's not?" The latter one sometimes resulted in me not talking for a day or two (yes, passive/aggressive) until he then complained that I was too quiet. And we'd start another twirl around the merry-go-round....

This happened over the course of years, JL. Years. And never once did I think "gee, I wouldn't accept that kind of treatment from other people--why is it OK if my husband does it?"

At this point, I'm sure you're not shocked to see that you're not the only one who's been treated this way. And, related to alcohol or not, it is NOT an acceptable way for one person to treat another, as I've finally learned to see.

jenniferlynne76

It would be unlike me to not say I still care about him. Because I do. Just not enough to give up my standards, my morals, my dreams, etc. so maybe just leave the friend part out and say I still care?

hopeful4

Maybe just leave it off and say that this has come to a place that it's just not good for YOU. Take the focus off of him and put it on you and your own feelings b/c that is what you are going to have to work through.

Honestly, once he realizes what you are saying he is going to be a jerk and stop listening anyways. He will instead be thinking of what he is going to say to manipulate you. What will you do about it?

jenniferlynne76

Ugh. Yeah. That's awful. He usually saves the mean/degrading stuff for when he's drunk or would prefer to be drinking versus with me. That said, and this goes back to our earlier conversation about what is A behavior and what is simply jerk behavior, when he's sober and talking with me and it's my turn (and I admit, I'm a talker! Guessing you all picked up on that, as well! ;-) ). Anyway, a lot of times when I'm talking I can tell he's not really listening. Sometimes he'll wander out of the room (real subtle) other times I can tell he's just not focused/paying any real attention to me.

And you're right. It's unacceptable. Anyone in a relationship, friends, lovers, whatever...should give a damn enough about the other person to listen and share and show they care. We are all entitled to that at a *bare* minimum!

jenniferlynne76

I have begun thinking about this hopeful... The first thing I thought was "I really need to make this about ME. I cannot make it about him or what he does that's unacceptable to me or anything else. Because it isn't. This is about my health and wellbeing and what I need to do to recover from this hell I've been living for almost a year."

As far as how I'm going to react to his reaction? Good question. I'm not sure how he'll react. I'm hoping that he'll just be pissed and won't say anything. It would be a lot easier on me that way, truth be told. If he tries to start an argument, I'm thinking my best bet is just to say that I've said what I had to say and there's nothing more to discuss and shut him down (which seems cruel...but I'm not sure I have any other option). I'm open to others' thoughts and ideas here I'd rather be "over prepped" for the situation than under when it rolls around ...

FireSprite

I just had to learn to hear the cues that the convo was going off-track. It was surprising to hear myself sharing my feelings & hear it turn into a conversation about his opinions. He never "heard" me because while I spoke, he used that time to think through his defense/blameshift/next manipulation tactic/focusing on "winning" the conversation (that one blew my mind)/ etc. He listened to my words & translated it all to how it impacted him, how he felt about it, what it all meant for him.

All those distractions would draw me in to defend myself & then he'd walk away declaring ME crazy. I learned that this was really just engaging with him. He'd needle & I would stop & say something like "Are you trying to tell me how *I* feel?... because this is about ME not YOU" or "We're not talking about YOU right now." or something to that effect. But that's only something that works since we've both been in recovery & since he's been developing patience & new ears.

Good luck. My best advice is be prepared for him to hear absolutely none of what you have to say, honestly. Know that you're doing it FOR YOU to be able to say that you "tried everything" (or whatever) & have zero expectations attached to the outcome.

jenniferlynne76

I think you nailed it, FireSprite. I just need to be able to say that I did everything I could for *ME* to find the peace that *I* deserve.

Wisconsin

As always, FS gives great advice. In the 96442654 conversations my STBXAH and I have had about me preparing to leave, me leaving, and the fact that I actually left, he almost always asks me why I left. I tell him, honestly, why. He always responds with "well, you did this and this and this and that, and you are horrible, too." And I shut it down with "but we are not talking about why YOU left ME. We are talking about why I left YOU."